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Posted

They've lost their safety net in Carlos Santana. Now the questionable assortment of defenders in Minnesota's infield mix will really be put to the test.

Image courtesy of Jeff Curry-Imagn Images

Last year, Twins first baseman Carlos Santana led all qualified MLB first basemen in Outs Above Average at +14, first out of 40 players, earning him a Gold Glove on his way out the door. He signed a one-year contract with the rival Cleveland Guardians during offseason, and as his heir apparent, the Twins brought in Ty France, who ranked dead last out of those 40 qualified first basemen in OOA at -12. That's a swing of 26 outs, almost a full ballgame. 

Get ready for a shock to the system.

I don't think many would describe the Twins as a good defensive team last year — they ranked 25th in Defensive Runs Saved, per the Fielding Bible — but things would have been a whole lot uglier without Santana making spectacular diving grabs and run-saving scoops at first base. He put forth one of the best defensive performances we've ever seen from a Minnesota first baseman.

 

France signed with the Twins last week on a one-year, $1 million contract that appears to be non-guaranteed in name only. Manager Rocco Baldelli has made it clear that the 30-year-old is in line for plenty of action at first base. In an infield that already could feature plenty of Royce Lewis at third base and Edouard Julien at second, this is an ominous proposition from a defensive perspective.

To be fair, France is (hopefully) not as bad as the metrics from last year portray. Per Twins Daily's John Bonnes, who is on-site in Ft. Myers for spring training, France told reporters he doesn't much trust defensive stats regarding first basemen, which is probably fair to an extent. There's also reason to believe a heel fracture suffered last June took a toll on his performance in the field.

 

But, the great defensive metrics from Santana last year sure matched the eye test. And while France's 2024 was especially bad, he has consistently rated as an awful defender in the past. It's not hard to see why. He's undersized at 5-foot-11 and he's extremely slow-footed. He's also now into his 30s, putting him on the downslope of the defensive aging curve.

The Twins have one clearly very good infielder: Carlos Correa. If healthy, he should make life fairly easy for France on balls hit to short. Elsewhere, it could be an adventure. Lewis is apparently set to return as a regular at third base despite struggling with errant throws repeatedly last year. José Miranda has also been rough defensively at the hot corner. Julien could see significant time at second base, where he's been somewhere between below-average and a butcher. The Twins reportedly flirted with signing a backup shortstop who might have boosted their defensive depth in the infield, but didn't. 

This dynamic is one of the biggest reasons I think Brooks Lee has a major leg up for a roster spot, even if he doesn't win the full-time starting second base job. He can get plenty of playing time all around the infield, as probably the best defensive 2B/3B on the roster and maybe the only player they trust to play shortstop aside from Correa. But when you're counting on a 24-year-old rookie, whose signature strength has always been hitting, to be your defensive savior in the infield ... probably not a great sign. 

Watching infielders kick the ball around and fail to convert makeable plays is extremely vexing as a fan. But I'm sorry to say we are likely in for a fair amount of it from the Twins this year, unless Lewis can rebound, Correa can stay healthy, and Lee can entrench himself. 

Barring those types of favorable twists, there's going to be a lot of pressure on France, who — for all his faults — is the only first baseman the Twins have with any kind of major-league experience at the position. If he can't prove to be significantly better in the field than last year's numbers showed, this defensive infield has the potential makings of an all-out disaster class.


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Posted

Santana will be missed at 1B that's for sure - I don't think anyone expected gold glove caliber defense from him last year. As long as France can be solid at 1B I think we'll be fine. 

And Ryan, Paddack and SWR are more fly ball pitchers than ground ball so as long as our infield defense is around average we'll be fine.

Posted

This is from memory so chime in if I’m wrong but it seemed like Royce’s throwing problems were primarily concentrated mid- August to mid-September or so.  Don’t recall him struggling with the arm before that although the action on his throwing looks forced at times, not athletic.  It’s almost like he is trying to throw like C4 and its not comfortable.

Julien has lots to prove on both sides of the ball.  I’m not giving up on him but not counting on him either.  Start him in St. Paul and see what he can do.  I would also have him playing a lot of first base.

i believe Lee will be fine at second with the glove but has to prove he is a MLB hitter.  He might have to start in St. Paul which means your starting second baseman is Castro which is fine.

I’m on record as saying Miranda should be playing first.  If you are going to be sub-par then give the experience to a guy who will be here next year.

Posted

This article raises some interesting points. I generally don’t get the Ty France signing. I think if Lewis continues to be below average at 3B he needs to be moved to 1B. 
 

The Twins are tracking towards having below average defense at all positions except SS, CF, and possibly C. Where several or fewer preventable losses is the difference between making the playoffs or not, I don’t see how their defensive alignment is going to be a winning formula. 

Posted

Great article.  Great analysis.  To be honest I couldn't agree with you more.  There's still no guarantees that France even makes the team.  After all he signed a contract that is not guaranteed.   That in itself is very strange.  Plus, Lee  Miranda, Julien, and others need to prove they belong in the majors.  This could be one of the worst defenses in the league.  Let's hope not.

Posted

So the guy projected for 3B struggles throwing to first, shortstop is going to be manned by a guy who was on the IL almost as often as he was on the field last year, and there’s a gaggle of utility players who are competing to play 2B and 1B, with no one really a defensive whiz at the latter and none of them offering a whole lot at the plate. It would be nice if the hypothetical new owners would stop signing jacks-of-all-trades who might be adequate at play at two or three positions and get guys who actually are good enough to be starters at one.

Posted

Maybe, but I don’t think it’s that cut and dried.  Correa will obviously be fine.  Lewis has throwing issues but he’s young and athletic and I think will figure it back out.  He looked fine there initially before his problems developed.  Second base is a little messy — but it has been messy for a while.  Castro would be fine for sure.  I think Lee’s glove will play well there, even if his bat isn’t there yet.  The drop off from a gold glover in Santana to France/Miranda/Julien will be noticeable, but again, I think the relatively inexperienced Miranda/Julien and the no longer injured France have the potential to be average.  Julien/Miranda look to me like they will play a lot of DH anyway.   In summary, if everyone plays their worst, they will be terrible.  But, if everyone plays to potential, they will have an approximately average infield defense.  It’s not a slam dunk but it’s not the end of the world either.  If we can live up to potential scoring runs, it won’t be a problem.  If we can’t score runs, the defense won’t matter. 

Posted
10 minutes ago, Bigfork Twins Guy said:

We don't have an up and coming 1B prospect ready to man 1B because they always draft SS's because hey, they have the most athletic ability.  We need to draft other positions in the first round also.

Cuddyer and Sano were drafted/signed as SS's. Joe Nathan also was drafted as a SS. Same with Jacob DeGrom. 

It's not the drafting of SS's that means they don't have a 1B right now that isn't a star. Alex Kirilloff, if healthy, would have been very good at 1B by now. I have no doubt. 

We'll see, but I'm optimistic that new owners will help with payroll more to allow for more aggressive acquisitions for positions of need.

 

Posted

I never watched France play much defense.  To me 1st base defense is broken into 2 major areas.  One is how well can they make their own plays, getting stops and turning them into outs.  The second is how well can they save the other infielders from getting errors and turning them into outs.  This is things like making digs on throws.  I would say Santana was great at the first part and mostly average to maybe just above average at the second part. 

If France can be above average at the second part we can live with average on the first part, unless he hits as bad as he did last year too.  I hope the heel fracture was a big reason for his drop off on both sides, but I do not think so.  Personally, I hope we can find someone that can be either a great hitter or a good defender at first, but right now it is not looking good at first. 

Posted
1 hour ago, Eris said:

This article raises some interesting points. I generally don’t get the Ty France signing. I think if Lewis continues to be below average at 3B he needs to be moved to 1B. 
 

The Twins are tracking towards having below average defense at all positions except SS, CF, and possibly C. Where several or fewer preventable losses is the difference between making the playoffs or not, I don’t see how their defensive alignment is going to be a winning formula. 

I also think Lewis should be moved to 1st. Lee looked good at 3rd last year. Let Castro have 2nd, at least until Keaschall is ready.

Posted

If all of the near rookies play up to their potential instead of their floor, there will be slightly less need for gold glove caliber infield defense. That's what winter is for: slowly forgetting the horrors of the previous year and building up that irrational optimism for the coming season. 

Posted

I also think the best defensive setup would be Lee at 3rd, Correa at SS, Castro at 2nd, and Lewis at 1st. However, with France, Miranda, and Julien being limited defensively, the infield would need to be completely shifted whenever someone needs a rest or when an injury occurs.

Posted

Ty France is the kind of infielder that the front office favors. Look around and count the number of glove challenged types on the roster. The Bader signing was actually a surprise to me except that we had an inkling due to the previous trades for Taylor and Margot. Bader was a decent hopeful addition, depending on how he is used.

Royce Lewis should be a first baseman and this year should determine whether he can progress at third. Brooks Lee projects as a decent third baseman but is too slow for second base. Can Lee hit? Willie Castro has a clear best position - utility player. That leaves Martin, Miranda and Julien who all have demons for gloves. Interestingly and amazingly so, Julien may be the key for the 2025 Twins. This seems impossible but at his best in 2023 and in April of 2024 Julien was more or less fine in the batter's box and at least the equal of the other choices at second base. If Julien cannot be his best self, I'm looking for hope in the fashion of totally unproven guys such as Austin Martin, Payton Eeles, or Luke Keaschall.

To the point of the article, yes this infield could be very difficult to watch and more depressing for the  pitchers. Last October, nearly every consideration of change to the 2025 roster for me was focused on improving the defense and athleticism of the team. It is late February and time to hope for the best. Let us all chant together, "Ty France is a good first baseman." 

Posted

Twins fans have been spoiled with above-average to stellar fielding First Basemen over the past 40 years: Hrbek, Mientkiewicz, Morneau, Mauer, and most recently Santana.  
There will be a fan mutiny if a klutz is playing most of the games at 1B.   Internal options at least had some hope of developing into at least an average fielder at 1B.  Ty France has been around too long to expect him suddenly to transform  himself into something he has never been.   At a million bucks, the Twins can use him at DH or a sub at 1B.  Rocco, however, seems to have already slotted France into the starting role. I see London, I see France … 

Posted

Lewis fields the position pretty well at 3B; his arm is a little scattershot, but I think he'll be ok. he handled the position just fine in 2023, and he's not in the decline phase of his career where you shouldn't expect him to do anything other than get worse. Let's not let recentcy bias infect things too much with Royce at 3B. One thing to watch with him is whether or not he lets struggles at the plate follow him on the field. He's never really had to deal with struggles at the plate until last season, so that something that you'd hope will improve as he gains experience.

Brooks Lee is a fine defender at 2B & 3B and plays a solid enough SS that I'm not expecting to see Castro there much this season. I think there's an excellent chance he wins the every day 2B job, and that will help solidify the defense.

I am a little worried about 1B because one of the things that Santana really helped on was the errant throws, which is a boon when Lewis is a little wild. Santana was also excellent at making the throw to 2B to get the lead runner, going home to stop a run, etc. His range at 1B was dropping; I don't think we'll see a lot of difference in going out to shallow right or long runs into foul territory. 

If Lee and Correa are playing up the middle consistently though it'll minimize the risk at the corners.

Posted

Yup, it could or probably will be a problem.

I do think that the kids, whomever is playing second and third, will be better.  But damn it was enjoyable watching Santana at first last year.

Remember watching the Braves back when I was a lot younger.  They had that big guy, Joe Adcock, at first most of the time.  But his back up, Frank Torre, was an amazing defensive player.  You know, Joe's relatively unknown brother.  Best I have seen of late was Dougie M, you know that name I used to be able to spell.  Thought he was even better than Santana.  But defense at first can be HUGE!

So count me among those who love D and will be cussing at my tv a lot this summer.  

 

Posted

I could see it going either way. And average defense with Miranda/France as passable 1st baseman. A good 2nd baseman in Lee. Correa is elite and Lewis should improve at 3rd. Castro looked good pretty much everywhere 

 

Or it could be a mess if Julien is our second baseman. France is a butcher at first. Correa gets hurt and we have no viable SS.... hopefully it doesn't come to this.

I still think they should have signed a backup SS like Iglesias. Dude hit like .315 last year and would be a better glove than Castro. At least our outfield defense should be elite. Especially if Buck and Vader are healthy and playing. Not many balls are going to land between Bader in left and Buxton in center:)

Posted

When it comes to defense, I like to mainly focus up the middle. CF? Buxton, Bader & Keirsey- Fantastic; SS? Correa, Lee & Castro- pretty darn good; C? If we want to focus on defense, Vazquez has the highest defense rating of any player on the team & should have the most games & Jeffers is great at the other tandem if not extended beyond that. If both continue to be healthy we are fine. 2B is the sticker. Back when the shift was still legal Twins made Julien their future 2Bman even though his glove left much to be desired & with the shift they could hide him & still have his bat. The shift was banned yet the Twins were bound & determined to make Julien their 2Bman. They were able to spin the defensive stats to make him look passable & got Correa & Santana to cover for him. Santana had plenty of opportunities to showcase his glove although his bat was well below what it should be. Playing out of position, the few times I watched the Twins, I saw too many GBs go through between Santana & 1B. When Correa went down we didn't have anyone to cover for Julien so all his warts were seen. If we want to be a better defensive team, which I certainly do, Julien has to be removed from 2B. IMO Martin is the best option, he has the best range. Lee is good but is better suited at 3B, Castro is good but he'll be busy elsewhere. We don't need a GG 1Bman we need a much better 2Bman. 

Less defensive importance. 3B- Lewis, is good but he's there to keep him happy, I'd prefer Lee & sub Lewis at 1B (which I think he could excel) & then Castro; LF- Bader, Larnach, Castro & Martin. pretty well covered. We have gained a lot w/o having to fit Margot in the lineup.

Least defensive importance. RF- Wallner, good enough with a great arm & bat & Larnach. 1B- Miranda, needs the time to improve his defense there. His bat will mash as long as he's healthy which hopefully for the whole season. France hopefully his bat will come alive to where he can stay to sub Miranda & DH. IMO Julien's bat will no longer profile at 1B even if he adjusts offensive & defensively. Gasper is a break glass option. When we take the proper perspective we aren't that bad if we take the proper actions at 2B & catcher then we don't have to worry about 1B so much. 

 

Posted
53 minutes ago, LambchoP said:

I could see it going either way. And average defense with Miranda/France as passable 1st baseman. A good 2nd baseman in Lee. Correa is elite and Lewis should improve at 3rd. Castro looked good pretty much everywhere 

 

Or it could be a mess if Julien is our second baseman. France is a butcher at first. Correa gets hurt and we have no viable SS.... hopefully it doesn't come to this.

I still think they should have signed a backup SS like Iglesias. Dude hit like .315 last year and would be a better glove than Castro. At least our outfield defense should be elite. Especially if Buck and Bader are healthy and playing. Not many balls are going to land between Bader in left and Buxton in center:)

Can Iglesias still play SS, though? (I am a little surprised that after he hit .335 and put up a 137 OPS+ that he's not signed somewhere...what is he asking for, contract-wise?) I suspect he's not a better glove than either Castro or Lee at SS any longer and last year's hitting explosion might have been a fluke year: outside of the small sample COVID season in 2020, he's never been close to that kind of hitting. A little hard to see him repeating it at age 35...

I wasn't impressed with any of the backup SS options that the Twins were linked to before signing France; would much rather let guys like Lee and Castro take those innings.

I really do think that if healthy, Lee will be very good defensively at 2B or 3B (with maybe more upside even). I think if he wins the starting 2B job that's the best bulwark against a bad twins defense.

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