Nick Nelson Site Manager Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 Thursday marked the deadline for teams and players to exchange arbitration salary figures. It's a pivot point that usually leads to numerous contract agreements. For the Twins and their sizable class of arb-eligible players, a few intriguing developments emerged. Image courtesy of Jesse Johnson-USA TODAY Sports The short recap of events is pretty boring: Minnesota agreed to terms with six of their seven arbitration-eligible players, locking in their 2024 salaries and in some cases building options into their contracts. The lone player whose camp did not reach agreement with the Twins is Nick Gordon. He and the team are now likely headed toward a hearing–an outcome this front office hasn't necessary shied away from. Meanwhile, these six players are now under contract for 2024 at the following rates: Kyle Farmer: $6.05M Willi Castro: $3.3M Caleb Thielbar: $3.23M Ryan Jeffers: $2.43M Alex Kirilloff: $1.35M Jorge Alcala: $790K Beyond the straight-up payroll numbers for this year, which are mostly in line with expectations, some interesting details were reported around contract and negotiation specifics. Let's touch on a few of the most noteworthy takeaways from tonight's news: Farmer Gets a Mutual Option for 2025 The Twins included a mutual option for 2025 in Kyle Farmer's contract, which is interesting. If both sides agree to it, the club can retain him next year for $6.25 million. If the Twins are the ones to decline it, Farmer gets a $250,000 buyout. It should be noted that mutual options are almost never picked up. In nearly all cases, it's going to make sense for either the player or the team to move on. But this arrangement gives Farmer a little walkaway cash in that scenario. I will say, here it's a bit easier than usual to squint and see a scenario where both sides are on board with running it back in '25 for that number. Farmer being a veteran glue clubhouse guy, and all. But it's even easier to see that being a moot point, because he remains a prime trade candidate, at least unless/until the Twins choose to trade Jorge Polanco instead. Twins Add 2025 Club Option for Alcala Coming off two straight seasons lost to injury, Jorge Alcala will make barely over the minimum in 2024, but his contract does include a $1.5 million team option for 2025, with a $55,000 buyout. This deal offers a lot of upside for the Twins, because if Alcala can stay healthy and pitch like he did in 2020-21 (3.55 ERA, 3.92 FIP in 84 IP) he'll be a very nice middle relief asset at those prices. There might still be untapped upside for more. For the team, there's almost no financial risk, with a total commitment of less than $850K, but this speaks to Alcala's lack of leverage. For all his obvious ability, he hasn't been able to stay on the field. If he can finally pull it together this year it would be a massive development for the bullpen's outlook. Seemingly, he's finally healthy and on track. Good for Caleb Thielbar! He'll make a career-high $3.23 million, and it's well deserved following another season where he was one of the team's most reliably dominant relievers. Thielbar missed a bunch of time last year with an injured oblique, but was nails when on the mound, delivering a 3.23 ERA and 36-to-6 K/BB ratio in 31 innings. His one weakness was the long ball–seven homers allowed–and it's one that bit him in the playoffs. But nonetheless, Minnesota's glad to have him in the mix, especially given his local roots and amazing backstory. With no other Twins reliever currently slated to make even $1 million in 2024, Thielbar is by far the highest-paid member of the bullpen as it currently stands. He'll be counted on as a veteran leader and hopefully a stable force in a unit with several wild-cards. Gordon Unable to Reach Agreement If you asked me to guess which arbitration-eligible player was going to fail to reach agreement today, Nick Gordon would've been one of the last names I'd have guessed. This seemed like a fairly straightforward case. Like Alcala, Gordon unfortunately had little leverage–he missed most of last year and was horrible when he played. All the 28-year-old has to fall back on is an altogether average run of production from 2021-22, during which he put up a 100 OPS+ and 1.5 fWAR in 209 games. The two sides are separated by $350,000, with Gordon's side requesting $1.25 million and the Twins offering $900,000. In the grand scheme, it's a frivolous gap, but so these things go. What are your thoughts on the arbitration numbers and contract news? Sound off in the comments please, because we need SOMETHING to talk about! View full article
Jocko87 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 Not sure what the Gordon side will present. He’s probably lucky to even be offered arbitration. I wonder if the option year adds a little value to Farmer at the deadline. Even if they are usually declined he might be interested in a team giving him one last year at shortstop. The mutual option is funny, I guess it saves time if nobody sees a reason to negotiate. Heiny, Karbo and nclahammer 3
stringer bell Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 Thanks for the information. Sounds like the Twins made a shrewd move with Alcalá. Brandon, DocBauer, Scott51104 and 9 others 12
DJL44 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 A little disappointed they didn't give Jeffers a long-term contract to buy out arbitration. JDubs, nclahammer, IndyTwinsFan and 2 others 5
1985Fan Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 With these arb players signed, what is the payroll at now? Any room to left to add to the payroll? Seems strange the TV deal hasn’t been worked out yet. Karbo 1
AceWrigley Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 54 minutes ago, DJL44 said: A little disappointed they didn't give Jeffers a long-term contract to buy out arbitration. I think the TV revenue limbo the Twins are in make it hard to fill out the future player salary projection spreadsheets. Karbo and DJL44 1 1
DocBauer Old-Timey Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 Honestly surprised about Gordon. I believe the predicted amount was $1M? So the Twins were almost there. And the FO has been pretty good about getting a good, agreeable number and just getting it done. Did they not want to go $1.1 or $1.5 and just find a good compromise? Or does Gordon's side just think they have good leverage? No issue with a player getting all the $ he can. I'm just not sure a good half season in 2022, a horrendous start to 2023 and then missing the rest of the season gives him a good leg to stand on, pun only partially intended. D.C Twins, IndyTwinsFan, Heiny and 3 others 6
Brandon Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 Isn’t Gordon repped by ROC Nation? They may be the ones advising their client on the value they think he is worth. But 1.25 million is a loser as the projection model has him at 1 million so the 900k is going to win and Gordon’s pride is going to get busted if he doesn’t settle. Also like the two options for Farmer with Farmer the Twins can either have him back for next year at a predetermined price or save 250,000 if Farmer opts out and if they decide to get rid of him they pay that 250,000. and Alcala. It’s going to help keep costs down next year. I love the nickel and diming.
High heat Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 If the Twins settle a contract with Gordon pre arbitration hearing is he guaranteed that $. If Twins decide to not add him to the 26 man roster after ST and he is outright with no options what is guaranteed and does that change is they settle or if they go through the arb process? With the current Twins roster or if they add a CF I’m 50/50 on Gordon making the team. I don’t see his value unless he is platooning with Castro or Buxtonin CF.
Parfigliano Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 This uncertainty regarding the value of TV rights really puts teams like the Twins with payroll constraints/concerns behind the 8-ball in trying to sign free agents. Karbo and DJL44 1 1
sampleSizeOfOne Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 I am curious how mutual options get exercised. Is there a required order: does the team have to decide first to bring them back? Or does the player? (I keep trying to decide which way it should go, but between describing a base salary assuming player decides no to come back, a team buy out, they kinda imply differing order, and in the case neither wants the second year, without and order it'd feel like a weird staring contest over that buy out money. And how does that work if the player gets traded?
Fatbat Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 1 hour ago, sampleSizeOfOne said: I am curious how mutual options get exercised. Is there a required order: does the team have to decide first to bring them back? Or does the player? (I keep trying to decide which way it should go, but between describing a base salary assuming player decides no to come back, a team buy out, they kinda imply differing order, and in the case neither wants the second year, without and order it'd feel like a weird staring contest over that buy out money. And how does that work if the player gets traded? I believe its club first/player 2nd. Contract terms don’t change if a trade occurs. sampleSizeOfOne 1
Riverbrian Old-Timey Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 2 hours ago, sampleSizeOfOne said: I am curious how mutual options get exercised. Is there a required order: does the team have to decide first to bring them back? Or does the player? We utilize mutual options at my house to decide what ends up on our walls. Pictures, paintings, Metal flower art, things like that. My wife always goes first and I agree. TiberTwins, RpR, Tiantwindup and 11 others 1 13
DJL44 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 8 hours ago, AceWrigley said: I think the TV revenue limbo the Twins are in make it hard to fill out the future player salary projection spreadsheets. Jeffers is not going to break the bank. MLB makes over $10.5B in revenue. 48% of local revenue and 100% of national revenue is shared among all 30 teams. There is shared revenue of at least $200M into the foreseeable future. Target Field has never drawn less than 1.8M fans outside of a pandemic year. The Twins will have revenues over $250M even if they decide to make TV broadcasts free on their website. I am really tired of the local TV contract becoming the excuse for everything. weneedneshek and Woof Bronzer 2
ziggy Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 1 hour ago, Riverbrian said: My wife always goes first and I agree. We keep our accounts separate. Her money is her money and my money is her money. Me thinks Gordon should be taking the $900,000 before he ends up with a minor league deal with the Oakland A's. If Buxton is for real going to man center Gordon will probably be the utility guy out of a job. Heiny, wabene, Swing Batter-Batter and 6 others 7 2
nclahammer Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 9 hours ago, DJL44 said: A little disappointed they didn't give Jeffers a long-term contract to buy out arbitration. I hope this is an area they work on during the season, I really like Jeffers. gman 1
Dman Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 The Farmer mutual option was curious to me as well. I agree with Nick that they almost never work out as one side seems to always feel differently about the value. My thinking is Farmers side wanted a little more in arb and the Twins didn't want to budge so the compromise was they keep the Twins number and if the Twins (or another team) don't keep him around next year he at least got the Arb number he wanted for this year. If he is kept past this year 6M seems like a generous number given what Farmer provides. stringer bell, wabene and Blyleven2011 3
LewFordLives Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 I can't believe they'd go to arbitration with Gordon over such a small amount. I gotta think they'll work something out. As far as Alcala, I don't understand why he'd agree to that. He's basically getting league minimum and giving away any leverage for next year. Wouldn't he have been better off just going to arbitration and letting the chips fall where they may? wabene and Otwins 2
saviking Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 In the grand scheme, it's a frivolous gap, but so these things go. Yes, for the team but I bet 350k isn't frivolous to Gordon or me 🙃How about you guys .. D.C Twins and DocBauer 2
August J Gloop Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 33 minutes ago, LewFordLives said: I can't believe they'd go to arbitration with Gordon over such a small amount. I gotta think they'll work something out. As far as Alcala, I don't understand why he'd agree to that. He's basically getting league minimum and giving away any leverage for next year. Wouldn't he have been better off just going to arbitration and letting the chips fall where they may? it's 50% of a league minimum player, and Last year Gordon was -100% a league minimum player, so I kinda see the Twins side. I wouldn't go to Arb over it, but I also wouldn't have tendered a contract to Gordon and instead tried for a MiLB deal with him. I'm guessing his representation is saying go to a hearing rather than settle at the midpoint.
Whitey333 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 The lack of a TV deal does hurt. However, many other teams are signing players and free agents. The Twins, I realize, are one of the few teams that don't have a deal and this bankruptcy thing with Diamond sports keeps getting postponed. But it gives the Twins a crutch for not spending money.
DJL44 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 One silver lining, Nick Gordon is more likely to pass through waivers at $1.25M than at $900k. It would make him easier to stash in St. Paul. wabene, D.C Twins, RpR and 1 other 4
ValleySpringsFan Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 I like Gordon but Castro had a good year and the Twins just signed Goodrum. They won't need three utility guys (or four if you count Farmer, too). IndyTwinsFan and RpR 2
KBJ1 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 With Castro and Martin also ready to make a splash (and bat leadoff, hit 285 with 25 SB, play CF, I predict) Gordon is redundant and may not even make the roster. Farmer - yay! Finally a smart move. Alcala is just a reminder of Ryan Pressley's record breaking run and 2 WS with Houston. So far a terrible trade. If they are so worried about payroll, even though it sounds like they will still have plenty of revenue, then dump Polanco & Kepler -for at least some bullpen help or a RH bat in LF. They are also redundant and cost $18M more than Wall er, Julien & Lee combined. MMMordabito 1
RpR Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 10 minutes ago, KBJ1 said: With Castro and Martin also ready to make a splash (and bat leadoff, hit 285 with 25 SB, play CF, I predict) Stevenson was excellent in the AAA League also.
DJL44 Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 23 minutes ago, KBJ1 said: Alcala is just a reminder of Ryan Pressley's record breaking run and 2 WS with Houston. So far a terrible trade. The Twins weren't going to give Pressly a high dollar contract extension. wabene 1
sampleSizeOfOne Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 7 hours ago, Riverbrian said: We utilize mutual options at my house to decide what ends up on our walls. Pictures, paintings, Metal flower art, things like that. My wife always goes first and I agree. What's the buy-out on metal flower art? If it's showing its rust, probably a prime candidate for regression... or tetanus. MMMordabito and IndyTwinsFan 2
sampleSizeOfOne Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 1 hour ago, DJL44 said: The Twins weren't going to give Pressly a high dollar contract extension. I think he also said in some interview that he really thrived in Houston analytic heavy environment. wabene 1
Riverbrian Old-Timey Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 29 minutes ago, sampleSizeOfOne said: What's the buy-out on metal flower art? If it's showing its rust, probably a prime candidate for regression... or tetanus. I'm not sure but it isn't high enough on the wall to avoid contact with my head.
Rosterman Verified Member Posted January 12, 2024 Posted January 12, 2024 I'm hoping the Twins talk more with Jeffers in spring training. Gordon, like Alcala, are lucky they aren't seeking minor league split contracts. I'm not sure how badly any team would wish to carry them on the 40-man if requried to open the season with them. Like Farmer, Alcala having the lower option that what he "might" get in arbitration is a plus if either become valuable enough to be a trade piece. So the Twins get four arbitation trips with Kirilloff, right? Will it be the same when Lewis enters arbitration next year?
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