Austin Martin

[stringer bell]

I think Martin will be headed back to St. Paul after the Yankee series, barring a disabling injury for a current Twins player and I think the demotion is fair, if not deserved.

At the plate, Martin has performed pretty much as expected—good contact skills, little power. The batting average and OBP are low, but for essentially a maiden voyage in the majors, he’s done okay.

Defensively, Martin has divided his time between left and center field, with just a cameo at second base. From what I’ve seen, the results are disappointing and I missed seeing the game last night and the one on Easter Sunday—two games where Martin’s play in the OF was panned.

Teams have taken extra bases on Martin’s arm and he’s made that problem worse by throwing to the wrong base. His route running has been at best adequate.

Austin has good speed and has been able to easily swipe bases, but from my observation that good speed hasn’t converted to great range in the outfield.

Martin has played about twice as many minor league innings in the infield, but it does seem like opportunity with the Twins is in the outfield. If he wants to thrive, he needs to be a much better defensive outfielder and perhaps he will make better decisions with more experience, but it doesn’t make his arm an asset.

So far, Martin looks like a marginal player with minimal upside. Unless his assets (base running, OBP) become elite or he improves his outfield defense significantly, his role in the majors will remain limited (IMHO obviously). 
 

[USAFChief]

Martin has been among the worst outfielders I've seen in 60+ years of Twins baseball. Absolutely awful. He's been directly responsible for multiple runs already and that is tough to do in a few weeks.

And that's on top of a mid-.600s OPS with zero power.

Get him back to St Paul, ASAP.

[Twins_Fan_in_NJ]

Martin goes to show that it takes more than a good athlete to play the outfield.

[4twinsJA]

I agree with most of what has been said so far. Martin not a lost cause, needs to work on OF play, not surprising given inexperience. And if going to be low power hitter needs to get BA and OBP up. Hopefully Martin has learned what he needs to work on and gets to work on it at AAA.

[ashbury]

Martin just needs to learn a few things. How to throw, how to hit with power, how to make good decisions on defense, how to feast on left-handed pitching.  A couple of weeks in St Paul to smooth off some rough edges should have him good to go!

[Rod Carews Birthday]

I think bringing up Martin and putting him in the lineup, both offensively and defensively, are have been very positive things.  He hasn't lit the world on fire offensively, but he has shown the ability to take decent at bats and his speed will play on the bases.  That will likely improve after he has some time to play/reflect/work on things in Saint Paul.  Defensively, he doesn't look overmatched as much as inexperienced.  He's not taking great routes and certainly is struggling with throwing the ball.  Playing lots of outfield in Saint Paul should be very beneficial.  Sending Martin back to AAA is definitely the right thing to do, but I'm also not down on the player or his potential at all.  He's not going to be an all-star, but I think he's a useful future (and emergency) piece. 

We often forget that many players (IDK maybe most?) are sent back down after their first taste of the majors, and the smart ones use the experience to adjust and improve their game. Current Twins Buxton, Kiriloff, Larnach, Wallner,  etc. all had to re-visit AAA and were able to take some appropriate steps.  I'm hoping that Martin can follow suit. 

[Mike Sixel]

This is why some of us wanted him off SS and in the OF much sooner in the minors....

He's been ok, but I agree, he should go back down when Buxton is ready. 

And, put Emma in AAA

[FlyingFinn]

11 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

This is why some of us wanted him off SS and in the OF much sooner in the minors...

Exactly my reaction. Again, we waste all that time at SS when everyone knew he wasn't going to play there in the future. He gets so little time in the OF that it's almost lucky that he didn't get injured like Royce Lewis. The Twins need to change their philosophy in the minors so athletes like Martin are ready to play well in the majors (it was obvious, that there wasn't an infield opening for him with the Twins the past two years).

Love his hustle but don't like his decisions on throws from the outfield. He really has narrowed his possible roles in MLB to LF and 2B and Utility (not super Utility like Castro). Castro isn't great in CF but he is appropriately ahead of Martin there (what does it say about Margot that Martin is ahead of him in CF!). I believe the 2nd best defensive CF in the Twins organization is Keirsey with the Saints.

I do think I heard on the Twins radio broadcast that Martin's barrel % is the best on the Twins team (someone correct me if I'm wrong). 

[Doctor Gast]

Just like the sausage has made a big positive difference in a couple of players, it seems that it has a negative effect on good hitters like Martin & Kiriloff. Like most good Twins prospects they had spotty showing at their debut. But given more time they settle in, Martin has a lot of value for Twins & like those prospects, Martin can impact the Twins in the 2nd half.

[RpR]

5 minutes ago, Doctor Gast said:

Just like the sausage has made a big positive difference in a couple of players, it seems that it has a negative effect on good hitters like Martin & Kiriloff. Like most good Twins prospects they had spotty showing at their debut. But given more time they settle in, Martin has a lot of value for Twins & like those prospects, Martin can impact the Twins in the 2nd half.

To dream the impossible dream....

[bean5302]

This is an effect of the "positional flexibility" system the Twins operate. Our prospects seem like they almost always come up to the MLB level with little awareness of their position defensively and have to learn on the job. When they get consistent reps at the same position day in and day out, they improve.

Martin or Kirilloff (probably Martin) gets the demotion when Buxton returns in a few days.
Kirilloff probably gets the boot when Lewis returns in a couple weeks.
Margot probably gets cut when Falvey and Baldelli manage to buy back that picture of them at Vladimir Putin's Christmas party.

[Craig Arko]

I’m sure most would rather see Margot out when Buxton returns. I think Martin would benefit from playing every day in St. Paul, and that’s what I expect to happen.

[Rod Carews Birthday]

14 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

Margot probably gets cut when Falvey and Baldelli manage to buy back that picture of them at Vladimir Putin's Christmas party.

Putin definitely strikes me as more of a Yankee fan. 😂

[bean5302]

Just now, Rod Carews Birthday said:

Putin definitely strikes me as more of a Yankee fan. 😂

I sold my tickets to todays game to fans of the Evil Empire, LOL. 

[Rod Carews Birthday]

16 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

This is an effect of the "positional flexibility" system the Twins operate. Our prospects seem like they almost always come up to the MLB level with little awareness of their position defensively and have to learn on the job. When they get consistent reps at the same position day in and day out, they improve.

In an ideal world, “positional flexibility” leads to everyone being able to play anywhere, but alas, the world is not ideal.  A few guys can have that utility, but as you mentioned, some of them seem more lost at the MLB level than they probably should be.  It surprises me that those determinations aren’t made at the A or A+ level and not left for AAA and the majors.  

[bean5302]

Just now, Rod Carews Birthday said:

In an ideal world, “positional flexibility” leads to everyone being able to play anywhere, but alas, the world is not ideal.  A few guys can have that utility, but as you mentioned, some of them seem more lost at the MLB level than they probably should be.  It surprises me that those determinations aren’t made at the A or A+ level and not left for AAA and the majors.  

Nobody can have that utility. Utility guys, even in the old days, were generally guys who could cover multiple positions "adequately" while the starters were out for a few days with an injury. The Nick Punto's of the world are extremely rare.

[jmlease1]

25 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

This is an effect of the "positional flexibility" system the Twins operate. Our prospects seem like they almost always come up to the MLB level with little awareness of their position defensively and have to learn on the job. When they get consistent reps at the same position day in and day out, they improve.

Martin or Kirilloff (probably Martin) gets the demotion when Buxton returns in a few days.
Kirilloff probably gets the boot when Lewis returns in a couple weeks.
Margot probably gets cut when Falvey and Baldelli manage to buy back that picture of them at Vladimir Putin's Christmas party.

Not sure this is really true; Wallner and Larnach both came up as corner OF and have played about to expectations defensively. Lewis was a SS in the minors and slotted in just fine at 3B. Miranda has needed to learn 3B on the job, but there's also about where the opportunity was for him as he came up in the minors: his preferred position was 2B, but we had a bunch of guys there. Julien had been playing 2B in the minors, but barely had more than 2 years in the minors before coming up to MLB. The missed minor league year in 2020 messed up development for a lot of guys.

It's just not that unusual for prospects to move around defensively as teams always want to try and keep them at the more demanding defensive position as long as they reasonably can.

I think Martin will be fine in the OF, and I'm ok with him going back down when Buxton comes back. (and props to the Twins for having Buck do a rehab stint in Saint Paul, regardless of whether he likes it or not) Hopefully he'll play CF-LF in Saint Paul to get more comfortable there. I'd have given him more time in CF over LF (he's played it a lot more in the minors and done well there) but that's the way it goes. He's far from a lost cause

[Rod Carews Birthday]

5 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

(and props to the Twins for having Buck do a rehab stint in Saint Paul, regardless of whether he likes it or not)

YES!  Absolutely.  It's not like he was tearing it up before the injury. He was "OK", but that's about it.  Maybe he can find his hitting stroke a little bit in St. Paul while rehabbing.

[jmlease1]

7 minutes ago, Rod Carews Birthday said:

YES!  Absolutely.  It's not like he was tearing it up before the injury. He was "OK", but that's about it.  Maybe he can find his hitting stroke a little bit in St. Paul while rehabbing.

they used to defer to veterans preference on this, and now they're being more directive, and it's hard to believe that spending a few games in AAA (or even Ft. Myers) so you can get your timing tested in game situations and show you can actually run in a game environment is a bad idea for almost any of them.

[stringer bell]

I was encouraged about Martin this spring by a positive article by Patrick Reusse (hardly a starry-eyed optimist) and later the decision by Rocco (a former CF)  to put Martin in center over either Castro or Margot. My hope was that Martin could win near-regular playing time in left field and as an alternate when Buxton was rested or injured. It hasn't panned out that way.

Martin is 25. It's hard to expect big leaps in the areas where he is lacking. Perhaps he can become an elite OBP guy who wreaks some havoc on the bases.

[MABB1959]

Seems to me that Martin should have learned all he can in AAA.  He was drafted in the first round in 2020.  If he isn't ready by now, will he ever be? Quotes from 2020 draft site

"This is a nice get for the Blue Jays, landing the best pure hitter in the Draft at No. 5 after most of us thought he would go second overall. There is no question in my mind that he is going to hit. In addition, he has some deceptive power and is a quality athlete with the versatility to play a lot of positions. There were some questions about his throwing this spring, so announcing him as shortstop is interesting, but it’s worth seeing if he can play there. At worst, he should be able to play a solid second base and center field.

[Mike Sixel]

This wasn't about Martin, but I found it instructive for him (and others)......Those here that think there is no development left in MLB (and there are some of you here)....this is for you:

Keith Law

1:39

Don't think he has anything to learn in AAA. The gap between that level and the majors is enormous. Teams have to adjust and be willing to let hitters come up and struggle for a few months as they adjust to better pitching. 

[Shaitan]

Before the season, I expected him to be Gordon-like. It seems that he is.

He's a serviceable MLB backup right now. I hope he gets better with experience. 

[tony&rodney]

Martin sure could use some regular at bats and playing time at the same position. It looks like that might be for St. Paul starting this weekend. It is harder for young players with limited experience to get comfortable in limited playing scenarios. Seems the Twins didn't have too much confidence in Austin.

While it is true that Martin has not looked good in the outfield for the Twins, he isn't even the worst outfielder on the current team much less among the random outfield statues employed by our local squad over time. 

All these inexperienced players need to get it together because their jobs are tied to performance. Hopefully Austin Martin can become a decent major league ball player.

[Schmoeman5]

17 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Martin sure could use some regular at bats and playing time at the same position. It looks like that might be for St. Paul starting this weekend. It is harder for young players with limited experience to get comfortable in limited playing scenarios. Seems the Twins didn't have too much confidence in Austin.

While it is true that Martin has not looked good in the outfield for the Twins, he isn't even the worst outfielder on the current team much less among the random outfield statues employed by our local squad over time. 

All these inexperienced players need to get it together because their jobs are tied to performance. Hopefully Austin Martin can become a decent major league ball player.

So who is that worst outfielder on this current team? 

[mickster]

30 minutes ago, Schmoeman5 said:

So who is that worst outfielder on this current team? 

Margot

 

30 minutes ago, Schmoeman5 said:

So who is that worst outfielder on this current team? 

 

[Road trip]

6 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Martin has been among the worst outfielders I've seen in 60+ years of Twins baseball. Absolutely awful. He's been directly responsible for multiple runs already and that is tough to do in a few weeks.

And that's on top of a mid-.600s OPS with zero power.

Get him back to St Paul, ASAP.

Ouch, I mean, yes, he has thrown to the wrong base multiple times (lack of experience in LF) and doesn't seem to get a great jump on balls.  But worst?  Worse than Sano in RF?  Worse than Delmon Young?  Robbie Grossman?  Worse than Ben Revere 4-hop throws to the cutoff man?  And that's just in the past twenty or so years.

Back to St Paul, yes, Martin's the logical person to send down at this point, but it is too early to lose hope for further development.  He will have to hit much better to be a contributor.  He may still get there, or he may not.

[RpR]

2 hours ago, Schmoeman5 said:

So who is that worst outfielder on this current team? 

Martin or Castro

[Jocko87]

6 hours ago, FlyingFinn said:

Exactly my reaction. Again, we waste all that time at SS when everyone knew he wasn't going to play there in the future. He gets so little time in the OF that it's almost lucky that he didn't get injured like Royce Lewis. 

I haven't been so much worried about him getting injured as him injuring someone else.  He almost took out Julien and has had several other close communication related calls.  Last thing we need is Keplers knee introduced to misplaced hustle.  Tough to learn a position in the big leagues.

He (and Castro) are the epitome of "can play centerfield", not "is a centerfielder."

[ashbury]

2 hours ago, Schmoeman5 said:

So who is that worst outfielder on this current team?