Make it Official! Twins 7, Brewers 3: Kirilloff, Jeffers Provide Comeback Clout

[USAFChief]

Just now, nicksaviking said:

It also means you built an inefficient roster when your #2 catcher is the last available hitter come the 7th inning.

To be fair, they had Martin left.

 

[Jocko87]

2 minutes ago, RpR said:

Kirilloff earned a chance and was given it; the other two are handi-caps and Baldelli rarely gambles.

Its a gamble to play 5 innings with no bench.

[USAFChief]

On the plus side, hard to argue with bullpen performance to date. 

[nicksaviking]

38 minutes ago, jkcarew said:

Many of us may think that Julien is a potential all-star level hitter. But, Rocco gives every indication he thinks Julien’s ceiling is Randy Bush. He might be right and he might be wrong…but how will we ever know if he’s wrong?

In Max Kepler's first season under Falvey (2017), he had a .433 OPS against lefties and started 129 games, playing in 147 games and having 568 plate appearances, 137 against lefties. 

After struggling through that season, Kepler has had pretty even splits. They need to give Julien the same opportunity. Otherwise they should have traded him this past winter and just kept Polanco with Lee waiting in the wings. 

And if Rocco can't get on board, they need to tell Rocco to get on board.

[bean5302]

I'm all for sponsors like Official Fried Chicken. I might even try them again (maybe) after boycotting them last year. I found their chicken good, but their service to be abysmal. Frequently missing items from orders, unable to use sweet spot except through an extremely buggy and tedious mobile app. When items are missing, you have to get into the long line and wait to get to the front to tell them "hey, can you give me my drink I ordered now?" or "I'm missing this part of my order" etc.

[nicksaviking]

10 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

To be fair, they had Martin left.

 

Ha true, until the 8th when he was inserted as a meaningless pinch runner. Again.

[stringer bell]

18 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Ha true, until the 8th when he was inserted as a meaningless pinch runner. Again.

He was going to be a defensive replacement anyway. No problem with the better base runner pinch running there.

[bean5302]

4 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

In Max Kepler's first season under Falvey (2017), he had a .433 OPS against lefties and started 129 games, playing in 147 games and having 568 plate appearances, 137 against lefties. 

After struggling through that season, Kepler has had pretty even splits. They need to give Julien the same opportunity. Otherwise they should have traded him this past winter and just kept Polanco with Lee waiting in the wings. 

And if Rocco can't get on board, they need to tell Rocco to get on board.

Kepler hit LHP pretty well in AA. He still hit for power vs. lefties so his splits weren't so brutal. Wallner and Kirilloff have had success at generating respectable power vs. LHP in the upper minors as well.
2015 = .319/.391/.473 OPS .863 (.072 OPS less than RHP)
2014 = .273/.301/.390 OPS .691 (.044 OPS less than RHP)

Julien hasn't been able to drive the ball against lefties at all, even in the high minors. I don't think it would be absolutely out of the question Julien could ever kind of hold his own at the MLB level against LHP, but I'd be shocked if he was ever more than serviceable vs. them. If there's a player on the Twins roster who should probably be protected from starting against LHP, it's Julien. Just my opinion.

[bean5302]

21 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Ha true, until the 8th when he was inserted as a meaningless pinch runner. Again.

I get the feeling Martin is viewed like Gordon was in 2021.

[Schmoeman5]

42 minutes ago, RpR said:

Kirilloff earned a chance and was given it; the other two are handi-caps and Baldelli rarely gambles.

You continue on this narrative.  What has Margot done to earn this chance? And in the 4th inning. And Margot was so confident in his ability that he bunts.  And then he gets 2 more opportunities where you know that Julien would be a better option. And don't talk about defense because Margot was moved to left and Martin to CF. That's when I was scratching my head. We saw how good he was out there vs KC. I wouldn't mind that ph move later in the game. But today? No way. Stop ranting about the minor league players. You were stoked about Stephenson last year. My 90 year old mom can hit harder than he did.

[Eephus]

Overly specific small sample size (OSSSS), but Buxton with 4 Ks in 19 I really like. He's not trying to do too much. 

[RpR]

5 minutes ago, Schmoeman5 said:

You continue on this narrative.  What has Margot done to earn this chance? And in the 4th inning. And Margot was so confident in his ability that he bunts.  And then he gets 2 more opportunities where you know that Julien would be a better option. And don't talk about defense because Margot was moved to left and Martin to CF. That's when I was scratching my head. We saw how good he was out there vs KC. I wouldn't mind that ph move later in the game. But today? No way. Stop ranting about the minor league players. You were stoked about Stephenson last year. My 90 year old mom can hit harder than he did.

Rant - 😏

Defense: Margot's history shows he is good in Right, and Left, not so good in Center.

Stephenson is history, get over it.

Ranting, LOL,   those who had snit-fits that Julien was pulled, are ranting.  Twins won the game and the rants continue.

I do not have an infatuation with the rookies so many here have;  I am just as concerned about Kepler's, Farmer's and Castro's funk right as any thing .

Que Sera, Sera.

 

[Jocko87]

Quote

“I’m going to trust our players’ decisions on the field, but bunting with the bases loaded, generally speaking, is not something we’re going to do very much,” Baldelli said. “I wasn’t really expecting that. He’s up there to hit a double against a left-handed pitcher. He almost pulled it out and drove in a run for us, but we are going to swing with the bases loaded almost all the time.”

Someone make sure Manny knows this is seething, flaming ticked off Rocco, to say this in public.  

[stringer bell]

Yeah, with these small sample sizes, I'd guess I'd defer to the staff as to who can do what. I didn't see the Easter Sunday game, but that Martin went to center today probably means the staff trusts him in center no matter what happened that day. Margot has been unimpressive so far, but he's been a pretty good player for seven years.

I don't agree with every evaluation and managerial decision, but Baldelli and the coaching staff see them a lot more than any of us do. 

I do think "the poorly constructed roster" could be fixed by trust in one more lefty bat. Yeah, Kirilloff's not going to hit .400, but if only two guys are platooned, there's an extra guy for a late-inning move, be it a pinch runner or pinch hitting or defensive replacement. 

[Schmoeman5]

Just now, RpR said:

Rant - 😏

Defense: Margot's history shows he is good in Right, and Left, not so good in Center.

Stephenson is history, get over it.

Ranting, LOL,   those who had snit-fits that Julien was pulled, are ranting.  Twins won the game and the rants continue.

I do not have an infatuation with the rookies so many here have;  I am just as concerned about Kepler's, Farmer's and Castro's funk right as any thing .

Que Sera, Sera.

 

I get it. I didn't say anything about the substitution.  But you still say that ph was the right move. I'd agree 100% if it were the 7th inning or later. And Martin is a better option than Margot in CF? I'm not convinced.  And I'm not rooting against Santana. I think he can still be productive. Just not for 500 PA. It looks to me that Rocco is going to go with Kirilloff in LF and Santana at 1st. For right now that looks about right. I hope they're up to the task. It's a long season. And you're absolutely right. That Margot ph situation had no bearing on the outcome. Still, not the right move to me.

[Althebum82]

Geez, for all of the whining and complaining about strikeouts the last few years, a guy tries something other than swing from his heels and not strike out and instead use the element of surprise and his speed and gets vilified for it.  I think the bunt attempt, while perhaps somewhat risky, was rooted in a desire to not leave three men stranded on base as has happened many other times the past few years.  I'm really not understanding the vitriol.

[stringer bell]

6 minutes ago, Althebum82 said:

Geez, for all of the whining and complaining about strikeouts the last few years, a guy tries something other than swing from his heels and not strike out and instead use the element of surprise and his speed and gets vilified for it.  I think the bunt attempt, while perhaps somewhat risky, was rooted in a desire to not leave three men stranded on base as has happened many other times the past few years.  I'm really not understanding the vitriol.

On balance, bunting with two outs and down a run isn't a great move. Even if successful, the score is tied and the team would have been faced with a lefty-lefty matchup or totally depleting the bench in the fourth inning. 

 

[Old Twins Hat]

2 hours ago, USAFChief said:

On the plus side, hard to argue with bullpen performance to date. 

Yeah, I think the analytics, when you have a shutdown bullpen, show how getting a lead in the middle innings is pretty much the ballgame.

Thus, pinch-hitting for Julien.  Baldelli also knows the value of getting Margot some confidence.

It's early.  We can allow the manager a chance to get his team all pulling in the same direction.

[BH67]

Brock and Griffin and Steven

No way that you're pulling even

[TwinsDr2021]

Once again I was a fan of the way Rocco used the pen, even after giving up a lead off homer Duarte was allowed to finish the inning and the next, I just don't believe this is something Rocco would have done in the past. Maybe he can continue to learn on the pinch hitting side of things next. He makes it super easy for the other teams to set a game plan.

[jmlease1]

Good to see the bats break out and bunch up some runs. Kirilloff had a terrific game at the plate. He's always hit when he's been healthy; as soon as he got dinged up with the wrist or the shoulder his power fell off and his performance at the plate really fell off, but it was always an issue with injuries not ability. If he can stay healthy (and it's a big if with his history until he actually does it) he'll be a weapon at the plate.

Nice to see Jeffers get off the schnide too. You could see the relief in him as he ran the bases, and hopefully this gets him settled in. His power production at the bottom of the lineup can be impactful.

Bullpen did well again. Paddack is going to need to be less hittable and hand out fewer walks to be successful this season, but it's early. Bullpen picked him up, but 4 inning starts from Paddack and Varland won't work.

[Karbo]

15 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

I didn't like the pinch hit move at all, but I'd guess Margot bunted on his own. But the fact that you're putting in a guy who feels like he needs to bunt with 2 outs and the bases loaded says enough about the decision to use him as a pinch hitter. In the 4th inning no less. A guy who feels their best chance there is to lay one down is not a guy I want in my lineup for the rest of the game. Or ever, really.

Would you change your mind if he was safe? Very close play and the 3rd baseman made a great play.

[chpettit19]

38 minutes ago, Karbo said:

Would you change your mind if he was safe? Very close play and the 3rd baseman made a great play.

No. I'm judging the process by Baldelli and the decision to put Margot in in the 4th simply because he was right handed. I would've been happier with the results if he'd been safe, but it wouldn't have changed my mind that putting in a guy who thought his best chance to succeed there was to bunt is a bad decision. 

If it were the 7th or 8th I may have felt different, but the 4th inning of a game that is by no means out of reach is too early to take one of your best hitters out for your worst hitter who then lays down a 2 out bunt. I'm sure somebody asked Rocco about the decision and I'll have to see if I can find what he said. Would love to hear the thought process. 

[Karbo]

3 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

No. I'm judging the process by Baldelli and the decision to put Margot in in the 4th simply because he was right handed. I would've been happier with the results if he'd been safe, but it wouldn't have changed my mind that putting in a guy who thought his best chance to succeed there was to bunt is a bad decision. 

If it were the 7th or 8th I may have felt different, but the 4th inning of a game that is by no means out of reach is too early to take one of your best hitters out for your worst hitter who then lays down a 2 out bunt. I'm sure somebody asked Rocco about the decision and I'll have to see if I can find what he said. Would love to hear the thought process. 

I agree about PH in the early innings. Leaves somewhat weaker hitters to face the best relievers.

[DJL44]

One thing about hitting - the coaches will see the progress the players are making in practice. Julien should have had a lot of reps against lefties on the back fields in Fort Myers. If he wasn't hitting lefties there, I can understand why Rocco won't let him bat in the big leagues.

[jmlease1]

30 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

No. I'm judging the process by Baldelli and the decision to put Margot in in the 4th simply because he was right handed. I would've been happier with the results if he'd been safe, but it wouldn't have changed my mind that putting in a guy who thought his best chance to succeed there was to bunt is a bad decision. 

If it were the 7th or 8th I may have felt different, but the 4th inning of a game that is by no means out of reach is too early to take one of your best hitters out for your worst hitter who then lays down a 2 out bunt. I'm sure somebody asked Rocco about the decision and I'll have to see if I can find what he said. Would love to hear the thought process. 

I get the idea of trying to take advantage of the opportunity to break open a game, seize the lead, etc, but I agree that the 4th inning is probably too early to make that kind of move, especially when you have such a small bench. It might be different if they were carrying 15 hitters, but that's not how we roll. I don't like the risk-reward on pulling a player like Julien, who is a superior hitter against RHP so early just to get the platoon advantage.

I do think it's a little funny the face of the people complaining about Rocco "throwing away games" and "not trying to win" though, because this is the sort of playoff baseball move managers make when they absolutely need a win...

[DJL44]

12 hours ago, Althebum82 said:

Geez, for all of the whining and complaining about strikeouts the last few years, a guy tries something other than swing from his heels and not strike out and instead use the element of surprise and his speed and gets vilified for it.  I think the bunt attempt, while perhaps somewhat risky, was rooted in a desire to not leave three men stranded on base as has happened many other times the past few years.  I'm really not understanding the vitriol.

Two outs and bases loaded. There is an easy force out at home if he bunts it back to the pitcher. The success rate on that is quite low. The bunt has to be perfect or the inning is over. Plus, the manager didn't call a squeeze so the runner at 3B is not prepared.

[chpettit19]

13 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

I get the idea of trying to take advantage of the opportunity to break open a game, seize the lead, etc, but I agree that the 4th inning is probably too early to make that kind of move, especially when you have such a small bench. It might be different if they were carrying 15 hitters, but that's not how we roll. I don't like the risk-reward on pulling a player like Julien, who is a superior hitter against RHP so early just to get the platoon advantage.

I do think it's a little funny the face of the people complaining about Rocco "throwing away games" and "not trying to win" though, because this is the sort of playoff baseball move managers make when they absolutely need a win...

I'd be less upset with taking the chance in the 4th if it were a better hitter than Margot who wasn't going to lay down a bunt. That's not a "break the game open" move, it's a "play for 1 run in the 4th while hurting your lineup for the 5th inning on" move.

[DJL44]

3 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

I'd be less upset with taking the chance in the 4th if it were a better hitter than Margot who wasn't going to lay down a bunt. That's not a "break the game open" move, it's a "play for 1 run in the 4th while hurting your lineup for the 5th inning on" move.

It's certainly not a move I'd burn a pinch hitter to make in the 4th inning. What's the reduced run expectancy of not having Julien in the lineup for the rest of the game? It has to be higher than the run expectancy of a bases loaded bunt in that situation.

It would be a more defensible move if they had Julien bunt there. He's not a great hitter against lefties, he's in the lefthanded batter's box (two steps closer to 1B for the throw) and they don't lose him for the rest of the game.

I am glad Rocco wasn't happy with that decision.

[jorgenswest]

I guess he did have Wallner to pinch hit for Margot later in the game but I don’t get the Julien move. Would it be better to put those left handed bats 1,3,5,7 in the order to make it a little less rewarding for a manager to put in the left handed reliever?

I did appreciate that Jax was used to get the heart of the order in the 8th. I am looking forward to Duran joining Jax and Stewart in this bullpen.