Astros 3, Twins 2: The Season is Over

[MABB1959]

10 hours ago, Baumer67 said:

The Twins need a new hitting coach! You can't keep striking out 13-14 times and hope you are going to win!

I was thinking that the whole game, Rocco was so focused on pitching seems he forgot about scoring runs.  

[MABB1959]

10 minutes ago, wabene said:

The last pitch was much closer, on the line. I don't think that one was a bad call. Max has to swing there. The first one was egregious. 

It was too close to just stand there and do nothing.  He should have been fighting off pitches until he got one he liked.  I think that is by far the most embarrassing out of the season. Last at bat and strike out looking.  

[MABB1959]

24 minutes ago, wabene said:

TBar has been really good for this team for a few years now. He did allow some runs in the playoffs and had he been perfect, who knows what would have happened. He did not completely melt down. 

Jax seemed almost unusable what with the 10 losses. He had some bounce back outings towards the end of the year, but was inconsistent. Many were calling for him not to be used in the playoffs, then he comes through with flying colors. In some big spots. 

When you are the manager, in the end you just have to rely on your guys and hope for the best. Pretty tough to take a series when all the other team needs is 3 runs. 

Did the FO miss Pressley's talent?  Did we get someone better?  Who is TBar?

[MABB1959]

10 hours ago, Aggies7 said:

As bad as the offense has been, I’m stunned they couldn’t do more against urquidy after that first inning. I mean, the guy was on cruise control. 

Except this last 6 weeks and the last 2 games many even bad pitchers look like a Cy Young candidate.

[terrydactyls]

Why did Houston win?  In my opinion, it was because they had Dusty Baker and the Twins had Rocco Baldelli.  Baldelli's pre-game explanation of how he was going to pull Ryan early and use his bullpen was a stark contrast to Baker.  When Baker was asked if he would have an inning count or a pitch count on Urquidy, he said that he was putting Urquidy on a "performance" count.  As long as he's pitching well, he stays in the game.  Instinct, intuition, or gut feel, whatever you want to call it, that puts Baker in the Hall of Fame.  And Baldelli will be remembered as a guy who had a great career shortened by injury.

[Riverbrian]

9 hours ago, Rosterman said:

My biggest worry, suddenly an extra inning game and who pitches for the Twins.

Varland

[Riverbrian]

7 hours ago, Aerodeliria said:

t was an exciting game, but I confess that I was irritated that Baldelli pulled Ryan after two. He made one bad pitch. I am not a fan of the bullpen game--I never was and will never be I guess.

I wasn't sure about the move, the plan but... regardless of my opinion. Houston only produced 3 runs. 

If given the option of choosing 3 runs for Houston before the game. I would have taken it. 

The bullpen game worked in my opinion. 

 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

10 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

As a non-baseball move, huge

Sure, but Rocco should really be focusing on baseball moves at that point. 

Sending Buxton up to bat was the equivalent of a Hail Mary pass, when all that was needed was just one run, or even just a baserunner. Buxton would have been better used as a pinch runner at some point, in that sense. Leaving Taylor to bat would have been a much better option. Only Kepler hit more home runs than Taylor this season. Or if this was all about removing Taylor, then use Wallner as the pinch hitter. 

I really hope there is room for disagreement about this! 

[D.C Twins]

Dusty Baker is an absolute managerial stud.

He uses analytics but he does not get used by analytics. 

Confident and in control at times just like his team. 

[Riverbrian]

This is how it ends. 11 teams will end their season this way. 29 teams will have to wait until next year. It's not going to damper my overall feeling.  

Every season... I ask for baseball to mean something in September. I got that. 

Every Season... I hope for a good result in September in those meaningful games in order to qualify for the playoffs. I got that. 

I have been asking for many years for depth and competition for playing time... 26 players who can play who can play at all times on the roster. I came pretty dang close to getting that. The team certainly had sufficient depth.  

I have been asking for many years for a superstar to rise from our farm. Royce Lewis gave me that, Superstar is lofty for Julien but he's a major league hitter in my opinion.  

I have been asking for many years for capable young pitchers to fill the rotation and bullpen so we don't have to fill the slots with Bundy types. I got that. 

I've had my criticisms over the course of the season and those criticisms remain but I fully support this front office.  

[wabene]

39 minutes ago, MABB1959 said:

Did the FO miss Pressley's talent?  Did we get someone better?  Who is TBar?

Yes, we all miss him (the front office knew his talent if that's what you mean), but he wasn't signing here. 

Yes, Duran

Thielbar

[wabene]

28 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

Varland

And, c'mon say it, Pagan! 😂

[Twins_Fan_in_NJ]

11 hours ago, Aggies7 said:

The better team won for sure.

But I take little solace when I look at what the rangers did and what the dbacks are about to do. Arizona is 15 outs away from their 3rd NLCS appearance in 26 seasons of existence. No one would argue Arizona is a better overall team when they finished 16 games behind LA in the regular season. But they’ve gotten red hot and have largely embarrassed the dodgers.

But here we are, now at 64 seasons of championship-less ball between the twins and Vikings (who will make it 65 in a few weeks). 
 

Happy to have reset the streak(s), but when will it be our turn to win it all?

This series, like the ones before it, came down to the Twins' inability to get a big hit. Until they either change their approach or improve the line-up, I'm not sure when it will be our turn. Long, long overdue.

[terrydactyls]

11 hours ago, umterp23 said:

Popping out to right was very generous description of buxton popping up to 1st. 

What are you talking about???  Buxton hit that ball at least 95 feet!  😇

[USAFChief]

2 minutes ago, wabene said:

Yes, we all miss him (the front office knew his talent if that's what you mean), but he wasn't signing here. 

Yes, Duran

Thielbar

1. Pressly had 1.5 years of control when traded. 

Not to mention, there's zero reason the Twins couldn't have signed him. Contract status has little to nothing to do with trading Pressly.

2. What does Duran have to.do with Pressly?

[MisstheBomba]

Houston enjoying the American League…..they also employ some loyal umpires. Can the Twins get rid of Buxton and that big contract? “Best” employee who’s never there, is not value. Ryan should have stayed in the game but at least relievers were pretty good in all series. Fire our hitting coach and hire a big name to help us! I enjoyed watching Lewis, Julien and Taylor is good in CF. I really miss a guy like Arraez who could get that hit when needed! New Coaches, a team Psychologist for the yips/strikeouts and that’s about it. Who would be a great Hitting Coach??

[Twins_Fan_in_NJ]

The front office for better or worse typically pulls surprises in the off-season. In 2019, it was Nelson Cruz. In 2020, it was Josh Donaldson and the Maeda trade. In 2022, it was Carlos Correa and Sonny Gray. In 2023, it was Correa again and Pablo. I suspect we'll see something similar this winter - something unexpected and something that causes a lot of angst for some and lot of optimism for others - much like the Arraez trade was loved and hated at the same time.

 

[Whitey333]

The better team won obviously.  Putting Buxton in to ph for MAT was nothing but a slap in the face to Taylor.  MAT was a big time player this tear filling in for Buxton.  Plus he played great defense.  People will miss him next season when Buxton is ok n the il for half the season again. When the going gets tough our offense dissappears again.  Keep in mind that we only scored 5 total runs in sweeping Toronto.  We struck out 52 times in 4 games against the Astros.  Totally unacceptable.  That's 52 times we had nothing at bats that produced nothing.  The team has a lot of important decisions to make on players.  They Twins played like the mediocre team they have been all year.  That's just who they are.  And blaming the terrible home plate umpiring is true minnesota fan.  If we can't win, blame the officials.  I do agree however that the home plate umpiring has been bad for a while and is getting much worse.  They are awful.  But if we had professional hitters it wouldn't be an issue.  I do like some of our younger players.  But we have s long way to go to be a great team like Houston.  I believe our team is teetering between being good and regressing again.  Good solid  additions are needed.  Some of the veteran leadership guys deserve to go.  Like always Twins fans are left with nothing but a half empty or half full glass.  We will be told all off season what a great job our manager and FO did.  It will work.  We are supposed to be content with just getting into playoffs or being competitive.  Winning a championship is simply not in the Twins model. 

[wabene]

9 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

1. Pressly had 1.5 years of control when traded. 

Not to mention, there's zero reason the Twins couldn't have signed him. Contract status has little to nothing to do with trading Pressly.

2. What does Duran have to.do with Pressly?

Oops my bad on Pressly, thanks. My foggy recollection was they moved him as an impending free agent. I would disagree with your zero reason they couldn't have signed him assertion. All things being equal, it is clear he would have preferred to play in Texas. He said as much. 

I was doing my best to interpret and answer the questions posed by MABB1959. He asked if we got someone better. I would take Duran over Pressly, but yes they don't have anything to do with each other. 

[USAFChief]

2 minutes ago, wabene said:

 All things being equal, it is clear he would have preferred to play in Texas. He said as much. 

 

Gonna need to see some verification of that claim.

Also, nitpic, but it's "Pressly."

[Aggies7]

 

Now up to 118 seasons without a championship 

[wabene]

10 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

Gonna need to see some verification of that claim.

Can't find a quote so maybe it's a false claim. Reading the following I gotta doubt that an offer by a team in Texas wouldn't have carried some extra weight;

"He was born in Dallas and grew up in nearby Irving, then the home of the Cowboys, in the days of Aikman, Irvin and Smith. His late maternal grandfather, Tito Nicholas, was a personal friend of legendary coach Tom Landry from their shared time in flight school during World War II. His mother, Jan, went to school with and was friends with Landry’s daughter, Lisa. Landry even attended Pressly’s parents’ wedding.

 

If he didn’t have enough familial connections to his favorite football team, Pressly’s fiancée, Kat Rogers, is a former Cowboys cheerleader. They will be married Dec. 31 in Houston, her hometown. “We’re definitely ingrained with the Cowboy blue and silver,” Pressly said. They live in the offseason north of Fort Worth in the small town of Argyle."

[CRF]

To split the 2 games down there, and then come back here and lose both games while only scoring 3 runs and getting only 6 hits for both games, is just disgusting and incredibly disappointing. It's beyond belief. How is that even possible? Is Houston a better team? Of course they are. Should we, could we, have won that series? Hell, yeah! At least won a game and send it back down there for a game 5. Somehow, we have to get back to playing fundamental baseball and start doing the little things to score runs. Trying to hit home runs and striking out 12-14 times every damn game just isn't cutting it. 

[dogsday]

We got Alcala and Celestino in the Pressly trade, so no, it hasn't worked out for the Twins. But would the Twins have extended/resigned Pressly? Have to leave that answer to the contra-historians.

[Linus]

As I stated in a different thread my worry going into the playoffs was our feast or famine offense would lay an egg and give us no chance to win. And it happened. Multiple times. I like many things the FO has done. I so appreciated not having to watch Archer Bundy etc this year. But I just have this bad feeling that their philosophy for lineup and bullpen construction is flawed and we all know they ain’t changing which means more of the same next year. 

[twinzcynic]

11 hours ago, rv78 said:

Really? Now we Know? You didn't see that before? Which Twins team have you been watching all season? The all or nothing approach didn't work in 2019, last year, this year, and it never will. Why are they still trying to make it happen? The philosphy of this FO and Manager to swing for the fences will never win a Championship. They got past Toronto due to pitching, not hitting. It takes BOTH to win Championships. Urquidy had an ERA over 5 and the Twins got 1 hit today against him in 5 2/3 innings that wasn't a HR. That "all or nothing" has been "nothing" almost all the time. The great Rocco managed his team into the playoffs and Yes they ended the losing streak, only to be embarrassed at home by striking out 28 times in the last 2 games scoring a grand total of 3 runs on 6 hits against the other teams #3 and #4 pitchers. Even in Game 3 when Rocco had 7 walks to go with the 3 hits he managed to sacrifice zero times, steal zero bases, and manufacture zero runs. Thats great managing there folks. And then he pulls his Game 4 starter after 2 innings and 26 pitches where 18 of them were strikes. Hardly a vote of confidence there going forward. It's no wonder these young players play with their tails between their legs. Even their Manager doesn't believe in them. 

 

According to the reactions to this: "They hated him because he spoke the truth"

[DJL44]

33 minutes ago, Aggies7 said:

Now up to 118 seasons without a championship 

The Lynx won four (2011, 2013, 2015, and 2017). Gopher men's hockey won in 2002 and 2003 and the women have 7 championships in the last 25 years. They're equally as relevant to the Twins as the Vikings, Wild and Timberwolves are to the Twins.

[JoeyMPLS]

I know things aren't created equal here, but they decide to pitch Maeda, Ober and Thielbar 9 2/3 innings, allowing 12 earned runs, whereas they pitch Duran, Paddack, Pagan, and Jax, a combined 8 1/3 innings and are virtually untouchable (only 2 hits between all four). There were multiple overarching issues in this series (namely Twins batters striking out and horrible AVG with RISP), but one thing completely in your control is who you run out on the mound.  I realize they didn't plan for those three pitchers to get shelled, otherwise they wouldn't have put them out there.

[jmlease1]

1 hour ago, D.C Twins said:

Dusty Baker is an absolute managerial stud.

He uses analytics but he does not get used by analytics. 

Confident and in control at times just like his team. 

Cubs fans might disagree with you.

Dusty does great when he has great players, like most managers. (check out the Houston side of the world some time, they're pretty convinced that Dusty insisting on playing Maldonaldo every game in the playoffs is going to kill them) Dusty Baker didn't hit any of the HRs that sank the Twins, and I really can't think of a significant managerial move that he made in this series, and certainly not one that was decisive.

[Swing Batter-Batter]

11 hours ago, D.C Twins said:

On a positive note, watching Paddack pitch made me VERY excited to see him as a SP next year... if he can stay healthy.

He could slide in nicely behind Lopez in the rotation when Gray leaves (and leaves us a nice draft pick from our QO)

I agree completely. During the 2nd inning, I was thinking, give Ryan one more inning and then bring in Paddack to pitch 3 innings. Stewart, Jax and Duran after that.