Royce Lewis is Back, James Outman Designated for Assignment

[Wedman13]

50 minutes ago, GopherMike said:

I had the exact same thought about Fedko. Even if the Twins brass doesn't believe in him at the MLB level....at this point he deserves the opportunity to prove them wrong. 

Wallner will be back before Fedko

[Jacksson]

Overdue move on Outman.

Too soon to bring back Lewis.  His AAA short term success is no based upon a change in approach, but rather performing against AAA pitching.  Knee jerk front office reaction based upon Lewis getting hot in AAA and trying to put bodies in the seats.

[Linus]

I guess we are going to find out if Royce is fixed. I do like that they seem to be trying to assemble an optimal infield. 

[Mike Sixel]

1 hour ago, darin617 said:

Does it make sense for the Twins to keep Outman in St Paul if he goes unclaimed? Unless he's banished to the bench and pretty much just a pinch runner.

The Saints have too many in the outfield already and will get worse once everyone is healthy. No reason for Outman to steal any AB's from the prospects.

This. 

[Mike Sixel]

1 hour ago, GopherMike said:

We said the same thing about starting pitching this year.

Things can change really fast with a few injuries. 

Which prospects should sit while Outman plays in AAA? 

[Wedman13]

8 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Which prospects should sit while Outman plays in AAA? 

As mentioned, congrats to some for turning this into an outman thread, once again. Can't be enough of that!

You'd think the guy should just go back to being the 2nd gunman on the grassy knoll, hiding D.B. Cooper and continuing to frame OJ while being the real killer on Bundy vs playing baseball.  Long live the awesomeness of Brock Stewart....

[Mike Sixel]

4 minutes ago, Wedman13 said:

As mentioned, congrats to some for turning this into an outman thread, once again. Can't be enough of that!

You'd think the guy should just go back to being the 2nd gunman on the grassy knoll, hiding D.B. Cooper and continuing to frame OJ while being the real killer on Bundy vs playing baseball.  Long live the awesomeness of Brock Stewart....

I literally replied to an Outman post. What's the issue? I'm unsure why you're commenting if not interested. He is part of this thread, since he was released. 

[AceWrigley]

1 hour ago, TJSweens said:

The writing was on the wall when the Twins used Cody Clemens in CF instead of Outman against RHP when Buxton was nursing his sore hip.

The Buxton was on the wall.

[Wedman13]

12 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I literally replied to an Outman post. What's the issue? I'm unsure why you're commenting if not interested. He is part of this thread, since he was released. 

Because Outman sucks.  Despite a decent looking swing, quite possibly the worst MLB hitter I've ever seen.  My 8 yr old daughter can see it.  Yet it takes experts here to feel the need to point him out in every thread (sorry, yours was the last post so I replied but I did not say you).  Just gets laughable.

 

[mikelink45]

Outman being off the roster is a good thing - it is not a personal attack - I don't know him.  But at this level every roster spot is precious and there is no reason not to have the best option all the time. 

[GopherMike]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

Which prospects should sit while Outman plays in AAA? 

Who says he has to play a ton? 

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

Which prospects should sit while Outman plays in AAA? 

They can send Outman to Wichita

[RpR]

46 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

They can send Outman to Wichita

Along with Lewis.

[ashbury]

4 hours ago, Wedman13 said:

 I'm really excited about Royce.  Go get em young fella.

Lewis is hard to predict.  But a strikeout looking, to end today's game with a runner in scoring position, probably held a prominent location on everyone's bingo card.

[RpR]

He is not stealing any thing; he is a paid professional ball player.  

They play whom they choose to play.

[weitz41]

Eventually if you keep forcing that square peg into a round hole. It will fit...

[DocBauer]

3 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

Outman being off the roster is a good thing - it is not a personal attack - I don't know him.  But at this level every roster spot is precious and there is no reason not to have the best option all the time. 

THIS is a VERY IMPORTANT comment!

In the history of baseball, it really wasn't THAT long ago when teams still had 10 and 11 man staffs. That meant 14 and even 15 man position rosters. The AL would usually fill 1 of those spots with a DH. The NL teams often had a PH specialist, and occasionally a PR specialist. But the point is BOTH leagues USED their 14 and 15 man player rosters.

If you recall, from 1986-1989, MLB had a 24 man roster as a "cost saving move" that was really a shot toward the union. 

But my point ultimately is, ML teams had player rosters from 12-15 for DECADES. And they always found ways to USE all of their position player rosters in different ways. I know players on Kelly's teams and Gardy's teams always got to play, and for the same reason. As Kelly used to say, paraphrasing only slightly: "How can I expect someone to contribute when needed when he hasn't been playing".

So TODAY, the way the game is played, why in the hell has the FO, with ONLY a 13 man position player roster decided the last couple of years that it's OK to play with a 12 man roster and just have a GUY who can be a late inning defensive player, and maybe an occasional PR??

It makes ZERO sense in roster construction with Keirsey last year and Outman this year. NOT attempting another "Free Fedko" debate, but wouldn't Fedko as a RH bat who could help platoon for Larnach and Wallner have made more sense than Outman sitting on his behind, gathering splinters, to ONLY play LF INSTEAD of CF which he was SUPPOSED to do?

This is massive roster mismanagement, no matter how good or bad Fedko might actually be. Opportunity is lost based on the FO. Now is this TP not wanting the trade for Outman to reflect poorly? (Let's not forget the better player in Roden was also traded for). Or is this Zole being a Falvey clone, or too afraid to stand on his own.

It sounds so simple, right? Giving a final chance to a one time prospect who had a single good season. But it's also even easier to look at how poor that player has been, the other players you have, the future of the organization, how important EVERY position player spot is, and not realize your GM is either scared or incompetent. 

OK, MAYBE I'm over reacting. And I KNOW Roden, Rodriguez, and Jenkins have been injured. I even accept Mendez being promoted so soon.

But my "bitch" remains in regard to roster usage. IDC if Outman signed back for St Paul. What I CARE about is FINALLY having a 13 man player roster that makes SENSE.

Love him or not Lewis is back to prove to everyone that he's SOMEHOW got his **** together. We'll see what happens. We hope for the best.

But I'm also thankful we're beyond the 13th man being a NOTHING contributor. 

IDK if Lewis makes an error here or there. He HAS actually worked out at 2B before 2025, but was then told not to worry about it.  So 2B is kinda new, but not totally.  He should be fine with a little time at 2B and especially 1B. 

 To Lewis, you CAN be a really good ML ballplayer. It's really ALWAYS been up to YOU to get your **** together. 

To Zole, be your own man or get out of the way. You could have easily had Roden make the roster over Outman. You could have easily added a RH OF in Fedko instead to see if he could be AT LEAST a RH bat to help platoon splits and some offensive potential vs holding on to a nothing player like Outman.  

Either be your OWN MAN, or get out of the way.

 

 

[mrtwinsfan]

5 hours ago, Wedman13 said:

Wallner will be back before Fedko

Hope your wrong,  Fedko deserves it ,   Wallner just made a 1st inning error -again  while Fedko banged a Homer

[Western SD Fan]

It became clear that Outman had lost all confidence in Shelton.  That was made clear by having Clemens attempt to play CF in recent games.  The open 40-man spot could be for a pitcher that needs to be signed.  As mentioned in other threads, it is not likely that a decision on Buxton will be made until the travel day on Monday and won't be made official until Tuesday.   This extra 40-man roster spot allows them to put Buxton on the IL and promote someone such as Fedko to take the 40-man spot without having to send anyone down or DFA anybody.  Culpepper likely stays down until either 1) Kreidler, Arcia, or Gray are so bad that they need to be off the roster, or 2) they get Keaschall and Lewis back up to scratch before introducing another player into the mix.

As for Lewis, I had hoped for another few games under his belt at the new positions prior to getting the call back up the majors.  If you factor in the reports that Lewis worked with Morneau yesterday at first base, it may have come down to his assessment of Lewis's play at 1st that made the final decision to bring him back up.  Lewis's assessment at second base today was ok but will still need work.  He made one nice play and botched a throw on a double play ball allowing the runner to go to second.  Not all that uncommon from a second basemen.  It does show that he is unsure about his footwork and that additional reps will be needed.  As someone else has suggested, it may give them the clearance to move Keaschall back down to St Paul for a mini reset if Lewis can prove he can hold the position at the major league level.

[karcherd]

29 minutes ago, Western SD Fan said:

Culpepper likely stays down until either 1) Kreidler, Arcia, or Gray are so bad that they need to be off the roster

I think that point has arrived with Gray and Kreidler.

[mluebker]

Too soon, in my estimation, but people want to see him play and that can put butts in seats, at least until the next slump starts. Trying to be cautiously optimistic, but also don’t want to be that guy who keeps doing the same thing over and over and is surprised when he keeps getting the same results. 

[mluebker]

1 hour ago, DocBauer said:

This is massive roster mismanagement… 

Also known as the 21st century version of “The Twins Way.”

[Eris]

22 minutes ago, DocBauer said:

So TODAY, the way the game is played, why in the hell has the FO, with ONLY a 13 man position player roster decided the last couple of years that it's OK to play with a 12 man roster and just have a GUY who can be a late inning defensive player, and maybe an occasional PR??

Hmm!  If your comment is just about Outman okay I will concede your point immediately as Outman was maybe barely an average defensive CF who could not hit. Teams generally need backup defensive players at CF, SS, and C. The Twins have had many players who were on the roster as a defensive 4th outfielder. Shaun Anderson, Michael Taylor, Harrison Bader. Fans were spoiled because Bader and Taylor had career years with the Twins. I think the issue is one of economics. A MLB CF who can hit and field at or above league average is worth at least $10 million (e.g., Bader signed for 2 years at 20.5 million). Therefore most fourth outfielders capable of playing CF are defensive specialists who don’t command a high salary (I.e., they can’t hit). (exceptions occur, Manuel Margot was an offensive specialist who could not hit or play defensive with his stint with the Twins).  Jake Cave was also below average defensively. 
 

Having someone like Clemens or Kreidler who can play other positions as well as a serviceable CF is a good solution. (Jury is still out on how well Kreidler and Clemens can fill in at CF). Early in his career Max Kepler was a slightly above average CF. Cody Bellinger was league average at 1B and above average in CF during his time with the Dodgers. 
 

Are there any teams that have two above average CF capable players in their everyday lineup. Last year’s Twins with Buxton and Bader were close. (Bader’s production has fallen off a cliff this year). 

[soyouresayingtheresachance]

Cant keep Outman on a ML roster with his production, or lack of. Long overdue, really. 

Was Lewis ready to return? I doubt it. It would have been nice to see him get more work in at 2B & 1B at AAA. 

[Parfigliano]

10 hours ago, rdehring said:

Am surprised he is coming back this soon.  But none of us, or the Twins, expected he would be hitting like he has over in St. Paul.  Could the injury limiting Buxton's availability the next X number of games be a reason he's back so soon?  Considering Outman can play center, unlikely. 

Will agree with the above comments that it is going to be interesting seeing who is playing where the next couple weeks, or longer.  Lord, please let this young man finally be the player we all know he can be.

 

He is what he is.  Wildly overrated.

[Fatbat]

Anyone goes onto the Il from the infield, KC better be the next guy up and in the MLB!

[Fatbat]

3 hours ago, karcherd said:

I think that point has arrived with Gray and Kreidler.

Agreed!  The only other thing keeping KC from the everyday SS duties on varsity is Arcia actually hitting a baseball on a regular basis. 

[Bangkok Twins Fan]

17 hours ago, Wedman13 said:

Wallner will be back before Fedko

I think you are right. 

[Riverbrian]

Outman doesnt matter to me. He wasn’t playing anyway. He was wasting a 26 man spot on a roster with multiple below average performers that are providing low bats to clear. If the manager thinks he can’t clear the low bats being set by those above him. He is a waste of that 26 man spot.
 

Just a couple of things that strike me as odd about the timing.

1. After rostering him all season and not utilizing him with Buxton healthy. They finally make the move immediately after Buxton gets hurt. The timing of this inevitable move couldn’t be stranger. 
 

2. So you have a decent defensive player (Outman) who couldn’t hit and you replace him with a defensive player who isn’t a hitter either (Kriedler). 
 

The timing is strange… the DFA in itself is not strange at all. 

[Fatbat]

49 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

Outman doesnt matter to me. He wasn’t playing anyway. He was wasting a 26 man spot on a roster with multiple below average performers that are providing low bats to clear. If the manager thinks he can’t clear the low bats being set by those above him. He is a waste of that 26 man spot.
 

Just a couple of things that strike me as odd about the timing.

1. After rostering him all season and not utilizing him with Buxton healthy. They finally make the move immediately after Buxton gets hurt. The timing of this inevitable move couldn’t be stranger. 
 

2. So you have a decent defensive player (Outman) who couldn’t hit and you replace him with a defensive player who isn’t a hitter either (Kriedler). 
 

The timing is strange… the DFA in itself is not strange at all. 

Great points. Seems like whoever is pulling the strings, has shorter strings attached to every badly performing player than years past.