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Posted

Veteran outfielder Max Kepler has led the Twins at starts in the cleanup spot in each of the past three seasons. Who should take over the mantle as Minnesota's primary cleanup hitter in 2025?

Image courtesy of © Matt Krohn-Imagn Images

In a dread-inducing development for suburban mothers across Minnesota, veteran outfielder Max Kepler has officially parted ways with the Twins, signing a one-year, $10-million contract with the Philadelphia Phillies. The long-time Twin joins what is arguably the deepest and most formidable lineup in MLB, alongside Kyle Schwarber, Trea Turner, Bryce Harper, and others. Kepler's departure will mostly be felt in the field. He was consistently one of MLB's best defensive right fielders, evidenced by the now-31-year-old netting 66 Outs Above Average (OAA) over 10 seasons with Minnesota. That said, his presence will also be missed at the plate, as (despite his shortcomings) he hit .237/.318/.429 with a marginally above-average 102 OPS+ over 3,761 plate appearances during his Twins career

Where Kepler will particularly be missed is having his bat in the lineup against right-handed pitchers. Over 3,170 plate appearances against opposite-handed pitchers, he hit .243/.326/.452, with 679 hits, 134 home runs, and a 108 tOPS+ (which compares a player's OPS for splits relative to their total OPS). Operating as a cog in the lineup against right-handed pitching, Kepler generated above-average numbers over his career, often operating out of the same spot in the lineup.

Over the past three seasons, Kepler netted 126 starts in the cleanup spot, the most on the team during that stretch. He also functioned as the team's primary cleanup hitter last season, generating 43 starts in 89 total games played. Manager Rocco Baldelli would slot Kepler into the cleanup spot in the lineup exclusively against right-handed pitchers. The likely rationale was for the wily veteran to balance the lineup and utilize his contact-skilled profile to move high on-base percentage hitters like Carlos Correa and Royce Lewis over from one base to another and capitalize on opportunities where they were in scoring position.  

Despite not fitting the mold of traditional cleanup hitters of the past like David Ortiz and Edwin Encarnacion, Kepler performed well in the role (particularly early in the season) and will be a missed offensive contributor. Entering the 2025 season, the Twins will need to find a new bat to absorb most of the opportunities in the cleanup spot. Luckily, the club has numerous options who could fulfill the role.

Kepler's final game started at cleanup occurred on Jul. 24, (fittingly) against the Phillies. Here is who received opportunities at the four-hole from Jul. 25 through Sept. 29:

Wallner, Lewis, and Miranda each started double-digit games at the four-hole, with the amalgamation of Santana, Larnach, Jeffers, Buxton, and Julien sprinkled in on occasion. Looking at this collection of players, two could seamlessly take over Kepler's role: Wallner and Larnach. At first glance, Wallner is the perfect candidate to receive the majority of starts out of the cleanup spot. Being a daunting, power-skilled bat, Wallner fits the archetype. That said, Wallner fitting that bill could work against him. Baldelli seemingly slotted Kepler into the cleanup spot because he could balance the lineup and put the ball into play as a contact-skilled left-handed bat, not because he had game-changing power.

Assuming Baldelli still values that type of contributor, there is reason to believe Larnach (who more closely fits Kepler's player mold) could receive more opportunity out of the four-hole than Wallner to begin the season. Twins second-ranked prospect Emmanuel Rodriguez could eventually take on Kepler's role in a more lasting fashion by midsummer. Still, slotting the 21-year-old into that role is merely wishcasting, until he can prove to be a sustainably productive contributor at the major-league level.  

With Santana no longer an option, there is reason to suspect Miranda (slated to become the team's primary first baseman after Santana's departure), Lewis, Jeffers, and Buxton will also receive more starts at the cleanup spot. Nevertheless, the four-hole will be a revolving door of players, with Wallner and Larnach likely receiving the bulk of opportunities against right-handed hitters and Miranda, Lewis, Jeffers, and Buxton welcoming the occasional start against left-handed starting pitchers to begin next season.


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Posted

Cleanup hitter is an unfilled hole on the current roster. Wallner nor Larnach can handle the pressure of being relied on to drive in runs. Both, along with Lewis, change their approach and swing for the fences, instead piling up  strike outs. The four spot should go to a veteran that is comfortable with the pressure that comes with the role. Miranda was doing well but was derailed by his back injury. Buxton could fit if he is able to play consistently and get in a rhythm at the plate, but that never happens. It would be great to have someone that can hit for power and limit strikeouts, but that player doesn’t exist on the roster. Putting ERod in that role would be a shame and probably damage his development. Expecting a rookie to immediately be a run producer in a critical spot on a contending team (supposedly) would do more harm than good. I vote for a trade to bring in Diaz to fill the role. I know his stats were down last year, but he could bounce back to previous levels. I don’t think he would cost much, if the Rays are even willing to trade. 

Posted

If there's anything the years of Rocco-Ball have taught us, is that there is no set lineup. It's a daily dose of lineup roulette. It all depends on what the spreadsheet crystal ball tells him. A guy could hit cleanup one day, lead off the next, and bat 8th the day after that. It's a constant guessing game to try and figure it out. 

Posted
12 minutes ago, CRF said:

If there's anything the years of Rocco-Ball have taught us, is that there is no set lineup. It's a daily dose of lineup roulette. It all depends on what the spreadsheet crystal ball tells him. A guy could hit cleanup one day, lead off the next, and bat 8th the day after that. It's a constant guessing game to try and figure it out. 

Hyperbole much? Looks like Santana, Jeffers and Lee are the only three guys who started at least one game in each of those three spots over the course of the year, let alone three days in a row.

Lee is only included because he led off once and hit cleanup twice, all three in a 10-day span soon after he came up, when they're trying to figure out how to use him.  Santana hit eighth three times after mid-June, a time by which they'd figured out he was one of their most consistent players. Jeffers hit leadoff once after May 20, a time by which they'd figured the leadoff experiment didn't work.

Posted

Miranda had the second most appearances batting in the clean-up position, followed by Wallner. 

Wallner (19 games)- .299/.390/.537 (.927 OPS) 3HR, 11 RBI, 25/5 K/BB 

Miranda (35 games) - .339/.362/.515 (.877 OPS) 2 HR, 23 RBI, 21/5 K/BB

Lewis (17 games) - .167/.247/.379 (.626 OPS) 4 HR, 9 RBI, 20/7 K/BB

Posted

I've been sitting back reading posts about who's gonna hit cleanup. Who's gonna play third. Who's gonna play first. Who will backup Buxton.  On a real team, Buxton would be the backup. Names being thrown out like Lee, Larnach, Wallner, Martin, Julien, Miranda etc., etc., etc., just solidify how inept this team and front office are. Free agents are flying off the board, and we just sit back, because we are smarter than everyone else. We are set! It is so discouraging and demoralizing that it is very hard to get excited for the upcoming season. The greatest sport in the world, and most exciting preseason in sport, and it leaves me not caring. Hopefully we get new owners soon that can bring back the excitement to greatest game on earth. Until then, there is no excitement in Twinkytown.

Posted
39 minutes ago, Hubie29 said:

I've been sitting back reading posts about who's gonna hit cleanup. Who's gonna play third. Who's gonna play first. Who will backup Buxton.  On a real team, Buxton would be the backup. Names being thrown out like Lee, Larnach, Wallner, Martin, Julien, Miranda etc., etc., etc., just solidify how inept this team and front office are. Free agents are flying off the board, and we just sit back, because we are smarter than everyone else. We are set! It is so discouraging and demoralizing that it is very hard to get excited for the upcoming season. The greatest sport in the world, and most exciting preseason in sport, and it leaves me not caring. Hopefully we get new owners soon that can bring back the excitement to greatest game on earth. Until then, there is no excitement in Twinkytown.

Free agents are flying off the board while we sit back because the ownership hamstrung the front office by cutting $30M+ from the payroll. If ownership is setting the payroll at $130 when it should be at $150-160 because the billionaires need more cash to prop up their other businesses, that ain't the fault of the front office.

And the idea that Buxton would be a backup on anything but a handful of teams is a contender for the Preposterous Statement of the Year Award. I'll give you Judge & Duran, but Rodriguez and Merrill were healthier, not better. I'll hear arguments on Varsho, but Buxton hits a heck of lot better. Doyle? healthier, not better. It's incredibly hard to find a player who can defend in CF and hit like Byron Buxton. Want to claim Buxton is a "backup"? name names that would start over him on a "real" team.

Posted
57 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

Free agents are flying off the board while we sit back because the ownership hamstrung the front office by cutting $30M+ from the payroll. If ownership is setting the payroll at $130 when it should be at $150-160 because the billionaires need more cash to prop up their other businesses, that ain't the fault of the front office.

And the idea that Buxton would be a backup on anything but a handful of teams is a contender for the Preposterous Statement of the Year Award. I'll give you Judge & Duran, but Rodriguez and Merrill were healthier, not better. I'll hear arguments on Varsho, but Buxton hits a heck of lot better. Doyle? healthier, not better. It's incredibly hard to find a player who can defend in CF and hit like Byron Buxton. Want to claim Buxton is a "backup"? name names that would start over him on a "real" team.

Career averages..244 avg., 13 HR, 35 rbi per year. Not an exact measurement due to games played, but hugely overrated. I'll give you his defensive prowess, but he should be a backup or utility outfielder due to his inability to stay on the field.  Spot start him about 60-80 games a year to keep him healthy. Get a real ball player. I am not going to list who i would rather have because I would run out of space. There are many LF and RF you could move to center also.  As I stated earlier, if we are counting on Buxton and the like, we are defeated before the season starts. I understand your payroll comment, but that's why I said it's hard to care what this team does until we get new owners. We can't even keep or acquire middle of the road FA's.  It's a pathetic time for this organization. Get ready for another season of complaining and apathy on this site. 

Posted
59 minutes ago, Craig Arko said:

Buxton is my #4 hitter, between Lewis and Wallner.

What would you do for the 70-80 games he won't be available? Either rest or injury?

Posted
1 hour ago, Hubie29 said:

What would you do for the 70-80 games he won't be available? Either rest or injury?

Cross that bridge when you get to it.

Posted
7 hours ago, CRF said:

If there's anything the years of Rocco-Ball have taught us, is that there is no set lineup. It's a daily dose of lineup roulette. It all depends on what the spreadsheet crystal ball tells him. A guy could hit cleanup one day, lead off the next, and bat 8th the day after that. It's a constant guessing game to try and figure it out. 

It's maddening.  Try sticking with an order instead of roulette.  Also drop the platoon BS.

Posted

Just not going in to another arguement how important Castro is to the 2025 Twins and why I'd keep him, potentially extend him, etc. I'm just addressing the current Twins team best I can. I'm also not going to play the "Rocco never has the same lineup anyway" game. Every manager changes their lineup based on guys needing a day off, and changing the lineup at least somewhat depending on the pitcher being faced. Believe it or not, Kelly and Gardenhire did the same.

But as currently constructed, VS the dominate RHP side of things;

1] Castro

2] Correa

3] Lewis

4] Wallner

5] Buxton

6] Larnach

7] Miranda 

8] Lee

9] Jeffers/ Catcher

The best mix against RHP. Hard for the opposition to deploy their pen. Less pressure on the young Lee to hit lower, and expecting some sort of split time at catcher with Jeffers.

Wallner and Buxton offer up a strange mix of K's along with tremendous power and production. You just HAVE to have those dangerous bats to fill the #4 and #5 spots. 6-9 don't exactly suck! 

Obviously Buxton out, and facing a LHP changes the completion of the lineup. But everyone ready to go, that's the optimum lineup daily against RHP.

 

Posted
6 hours ago, GNXman said:

You’re kidding right? When was Kepler ever a cleanup hitter type?

That struck me too. I realize, that based on last year's stats, Kepler WAS the player used the most in that spot, but I also would agree that Kepler didn't fit the mold of the typical cleanup hitter. I think it will be yet another season of juggling various players in the cleanup spot. Nobody on the current roster strikes me as ideal for the spot on a regular basis. 

Posted
23 minutes ago, Doctor Wu said:

Kepler WAS the player used the most in that spot, but I also would agree that Kepler didn't fit the mold of the typical cleanup hitter.

Alex Verdugo spent the most time in the cleanup spot for the Yankees last season. Kyle Schwarber was the lead off guy for Phillies. 

If there is a mold... it's sitting on a shelf... plaster free. 

Posted
10 hours ago, Parfigliano said:

It's maddening.  Try sticking with an order instead of roulette. 

What's the rationale for a static order? What is gained by a static order? What is lost without a static order? 

Is it fact or theory? Are there numbers easily pointed to that show the importance of sticking with an order. 

Posted
54 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

Alex Verdugo spent the most time in the cleanup spot for the Yankees last season. Kyle Schwarber was the lead off guy for Phillies. 

If there is a mold... it's sitting on a shelf... plaster free. 

The bread that sat in the fridge for moths might have a mold 

Posted
11 hours ago, RpR said:

Cross that bridge when you get to it.

Problem is there is no bridge. All the bridges are being constructed on other teams. We complain and complain every year about status quo, then the next year arrives with nothing changing, and all of a sudden everything is OK. I guess that's the magic of a new season, baseball, and spring training.

Posted
8 hours ago, GNXman said:

You’re kidding right? When was Kepler ever a cleanup hitter type?

That's how pathetic the Twins lineups have been for years. Nothing changing either until we get new owners and spend some money. At least go for some mid level tiered free agents, not scraps and players that others gave up on.  $40M gets us in the middle of the pack dollars wise and maybe some hope with better ballplayers.

Posted
46 minutes ago, Hubie29 said:

That's how pathetic the Twins lineups have been for years. Nothing changing either until we get new owners and spend some money. At least go for some mid level tiered free agents, not scraps and players that others gave up on.  $40M gets us in the middle of the pack dollars wise and maybe some hope with better ballplayers.

So the Dodgers signing. Max Muncy and Chris Taylor off the scrap heap as well as the Twins with Castro  were hopeless moves, 

Posted
15 hours ago, Craig Arko said:

Buxton is my #4 hitter, between Lewis and Wallner.

Yep! As it stands now I’d go

Castro

Correa

Lewis

Buxton

Wallner

Jeffers

Larnach

Miranda

Lee

That’s If a mutation of Gardy and Rocco is the manager. With a strictly Rocco lineup it probably changes day to day based on a number of factors. 

Posted

It would sure help if we had a legit first baseman with a big bat. It's sad we can't afford even mid to low level players in FA or in trade. I've got to believe Nathaniel Lowe or Diaz from the Rays would make this team much better. Both are good first baseman which would allow Miranda to be a backup at first and third and use his bat at DH. As it is, there will be no additions to this team and first base will be a Miranda Julien platoon. 

Posted
10 minutes ago, LambchoP said:

It would sure help if we had a legit first baseman with a big bat. It's sad we can't afford even mid to low level players in FA or in trade. I've got to believe Nathaniel Lowe or Diaz from the Rays would make this team much better. Both are good first baseman which would allow Miranda to be a backup at first and third and use his bat at DH. As it is, there will be no additions to this team and first base will be a Miranda Julien platoon. 

I agree that Diaz would help the lineup and lengthen the lineup. I disagree that the Twins cannot afford Diaz or others. It is a choice. There have been and still are options. I believe, until proven wrong, that Falvey has his team exactly as it is currently rostered. Money has nothing to do with it. Falvey has said that on numerous occasions and we have seen how the team has backed its players and let trade opportunities slide away. The Twins like what they have. Nothing wrong with that. Roll it back and expect improvements through experience, etc. This (at this time) looks like the plan. Has anyone heard anything to suggest anything different?

Posted
56 minutes ago, FargoFanMan said:

Yep! As it stands now I’d go

Castro

Correa

Lewis

Buxton

Wallner

Jeffers

Larnach

Miranda

Lee

That’s If a mutation of Gardy and Rocco is the manager. With a strictly Rocco lineup it probably changes day to day based on a number of factors. 

How about….

Lewis

Larnach

Correa

Wallner

Buxton

Miranda

Castro

Lee

Catcher

as the opening day lineup?

No need to platoon much.  

Posted

I'm not a big believer in trying to choreograph the events that will happen during an inning, so I'm in the camp that says just put your best hitters up top and the worst down lower.  The best hitters get the most chances, that way, while Christian Vazquez gets the fewest.  Batting clean up in this scenario amounts to a fluke of whoever happens to be fourth best among the hitters you plan to use that day.  Yeah probably a power hitter who strikes out a lot.  IOW, color me uninterested.  😊

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