Does This Future Hall of Famer Fit Into Minnesota’s First Base Plans?

[Joe A. Preusser]

Ok, fair enough on the timeline.  I read your post as bargain bin shopping and late season acquisitions together.  I see you were more talking about WHEN things happen and not indicating we ONLY bargain shop.  

They do tend to wait out the market.  They do like a good deal, and those usually happen at the later stages of the offseason.  Other posters have indicated that's ALL they do.  That's just not true.

[notoriousgod71]

2 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

On the contrary, if your hole is DH you are in a good spot. Easiest spot to fill.

Course, it kinda requires production at the other spots which is a much bigger issue than who gets the DH ABs.

You can never sign a full time DH due to Buxton.

They will always need a legitimate center fielder to cover the other half of the season, not to mention second base, third base, catcher, shortstop for half the year, and seven pitching spots.

[DJL44]

4 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

No DH is the last problem to solve around here.  Hiring a DH only player would be a tough fit, although if Goldy was just a DH he could probably be pretty decent for one more season.

No fit.

Agreed. Find a player with a good glove and put one of the others at DH. The defense needs an upgrade.

[D.C Twins]

I think you missed the memo that the Twins will not be increasing payroll this year. With lots-o-current-players that will cost more....zero chance for big outside signings. 

[Brandon]

Santana is the prototypical Twins hitter.  20 HRs 70-80 RBIs good defense.  Terry Ryan would be proud.  Those type of hitters are a fraction of the cost of 100 RBI guys and the Twins run up the score by having a superior bench and deeper lineup.  I’m fine with bringing Santana back for 5-6 million again.  He is still good defensively and can be sent to the bench and still be valuable at that price.  We do have Killeroff, Larnarch, and Miranda on hand for 1B and Severino in AAA.  So we’ll see.  When ERod comes up next year Larnarch will need a spot too.  I almost forgot Julien for 1B.  So much mediocrity I hope someone pulls it out.

[S Bart]

I don't know this player, but the current options of Miranda, Julian, and Kiroloff (doubt that he will even make the roster) are not decent ones. THE first two have no experience at the position and Julian constantly bobbled the ball at 2nd. Yes, hitting is important BUT so is catching the ball. 1ST base is a key fielding position, obviously. At least Santana had the fielding skills....

[Mark G]

To me this feels like a live version of Who's on First with the in house prospects.  Should we move an inconsistent 3rd baseman to first, an even more inconsistent 2nd baseman, or a perennially injured corner outfielder?  But wait......we could always sign a 39 year old or a 37 year old past their prime and hope for one more good year, right? 

Where have you gone Joe DiMaggio?  Our........oh, you know the rest.  😉

[Karbo]

15 hours ago, High heat said:

Did you watch the last 2 months?  No power and very week contact Not to mention the defense at 1B.

That will happen when a guy gets hit in the head by a 90 some MPH pitch. It took most of the year for Farmer to bounce back. Some guys never do, but I'm betting Miranda will come back strong.

[stringer bell]

It seems that the consensus is that Goldschmidt isn't a realistic option for the question of "who plays first?" for the Twins in 2025. 

The Twins in-house options for the job are ...........underwhelming. 1) Miranda has played little first base and has been inconsistent as a hitter. He doesn't provide a lot of power and he doesn't draw a lot of walks. He needs to have a high batting average to be a real asset. 2) Kirilloff hasn't managed to have close to a healthy season and he turns 27 soon. His defensive metrics are poor. He's a former top prospect with one option (and last chance) remaining. 3) Julien is inexperienced at first base and doesn't seem to be a natural defender anywhere. His hitting fell off a cliff in 2024, despite being healthy. 4) Severino didn't make it out of AAA last year. He is also seen as a substandard defender wherever he plays and his AAA numbers don't scream promotion to the majors.

The Twins might go with the in-house guys because supposedly there is no money in the budget to go outside the organization. This is a risk they shouldn't take IMHO, but is something that might be repeated for other weak spots on the roster.

 

[Trov]

So let me get this straight, the writer wants to sign Paul Goldschmidt because he is better at offense than Santana, and about equal at defense?  That would make sense if it were true, NOW, but it is not.  Yes, a few years ago you take Goldschmidt, with money being similar, over Santana.  However, just looking back at last year Santana was better on defense and offense.  Goldschmidt is only 1 year younger than Santana.  The writer believes that last year was just a down year for Goldschmidt and he will bounce back, and there is some evidence that might happen, being his second half was much better than his first. 

I am not saying we should go Santana over Goldschmidt, I would actually advocate for using someone on our roster to fill it.  Goldschmidt did hit lefties very well so maybe as a platoon guy, but most likely he will be seeking, and most likely will get more than Twins will be willing to pay. If he falls down to us and we feel no one out there is better option I would take flier on him to bounce back. 

[Finlander]

Weak hitting first baseman Santana managed to lead the team in HRs and RBIs last year. That seems to speak to the need for improvement throughout the whole lineup, does it not?

[Otaknam]

14 hours ago, FargoFanMan said:

If you have an open mind and do the math this makes sense. You trade Vazquez for whatever and eat $5M of his contract. You trade Paddack for whatever and eat $3M. You trade Castro at his peak since this isn’t a video game and you get a decent prospect and maybe a BP arm. That saves you roughly $6M. All of a sudden you’ve got about $15M to work with. You need an anchor at 1B and let’s be honest, You don’t want Miranda as your everyday 1B. Can you get Goldy for 2 years and 12-14M with an option in year 2? He’s the perfect fit. No he’s not an MVP candidate anymore but he provides leadership and stability like Santana did. They’ve got other guys to be backups. Castro was great but he’s starting to cost some money and let’s flip him while he’s worth something. Goldy is what this team needs in more ways than one. 

I am for trading Vasquez, but doubt that some team will pay even half of his $10 million contract for a part time catcher on the downside of his career. A more likely option for Paddock is they try him as a starter and move him to the bullpen if starting doesn’t work. He could be electric in the bullpen, like he was at the end of 2023. As for Castro, I doubt he would bring a decent prospect and bullpen arm in a trade. But I could see them not extending him to save money. 

 

14 hours ago, FargoFanMan said:

If you have an open mind and do the math this makes sense. You trade Vazquez for whatever and eat $5M of his contract. You trade Paddack for whatever and eat $3M. You trade Castro at his peak since this isn’t a video game and you get a decent prospect and maybe a BP arm. That saves you roughly $6M. All of a sudden you’ve got about $15M to work with. You need an anchor at 1B and let’s be honest, You don’t want Miranda as your everyday 1B. Can you get Goldy for 2 years and 12-14M with an option in year 2? He’s the perfect fit. No he’s not an MVP candidate anymore but he provides leadership and stability like Santana did. They’ve got other guys to be backups. Castro was great but he’s starting to cost some money and let’s flip him while he’s worth something. Goldy is what this team needs in more ways than one. 

 

[David Maro]

Gold Glove and lead the team in HR and RBI.Maybe it is time for tryouts at all the other positions.

[DJL44]

11 hours ago, Joe A. Preusser said:

It was very good, and that's before you look at clubhouse presence and other intangibles.

I hear great things about many of the Twins players and their clubhouse intangibles but those intangibles didn't keep them from choking away a playoff spot at the end of the season.

[Rod Carews Birthday]

First of all, Santana had a better year last year at 38 than Goldschmidt had at 36.  What next year holds for either of them is almost anyone's guess.  They could both be better or both fall off a cliff in production.  My money at this point is probably on Santana to have a better year based on the most recent track record.  I also think that both of them probably would benefit from being 120 game players than 150 game players. 

Second of all, I hate headlines like this "Future Hall of Famer" stuff.  That is false hope if I've ever heard it.  Aside from the fact that he is a borderline HOF candidate (I'd call him a poor man's Fred McGriff, but he could get in), it portrays a player at his peak, not at the bottom of his production.  And quotes about his production over a 30 game period are what Twins fans have hung their hats on about Kepler for years, and we know how that usually turned out.  Someone will likely overpay for Goldschmidt's production next year.  I don't want it to be the Twins. 

[jmlease1]

Goldschmidt is a Hall of Famer, but it usually ends with a whimper even for the greats. And right now, it looks like age is catching up to Goldy and the 2022 MVP season sure seems like it's the "one last great year" rather than a sign he's going to keep hitting until he's 40.

The power is slipping: the last 2 seasons have been 2 of the 3 worst ISO in his career, and all of his 3 worst have been in the last 5. And we're not talking just a little slippage, this is a huge drop off from where he's been, down much closer to MLB average. he's also substantially worse as a defender now too.

Goldschmidt has been the much better player over his career, but Carlos Santana was much better in 2024, even with a horrific start. But the bigger issue is a Hall of Fame caliber player like Goldschmidt isn't going to take a massive pay cut to come to a new team that isn't necessarily a title contender. Much more likely that StL signs him to a 2-year deal for $25-30M, or AZ comes a-calling if they can't work out terms with Christian Walker to bring him back to the desert, etc.

It'll take $10M+ for sure to sign Goldschmidt, and very possibly 2 years on the deal. twins don't have the money form their self-imposed payroll limitations and Falvey seems pretty adverse (correctly, IMHO) to multi-year deals for aging veterans.

I'd say Pass, except I doubt it'll ever really be an option, unless things go very sideways with StL and he's sitting without a team in late Feb. but even then, I doubt we have the money available. I suppose it's possible that he becomes one of the test cases for the new economics of baseball without the sweet sweet RSN money. Aging veterans are definitely the most likely to find their markets drying up first. But it still seems like a fools errand to try and dance with Goldy.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

17 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

Why not post articles saying they should trade for ohtani? Seriously. They aren't signing expensive free agents while for sale. Seriously. 

Unfortunately I have a feeling we are going to see a run of articles on players the Twins "should" sign,  even though EVERYONE knows there is zero chance these players will be signed due to financial constraints...

If the Twins re-sign Santana on a 1y/$5-6m deal, that will probably constitute the bulk of offseason spending this winter.

[LambchoP]

Twins have needed a real everyday first baseman who can hit for a few years now. Sure, Goldy would be a nice pickup for a year, but my guess is he'll want more than a year and he'll be too expensive for the Twins. Remember, we still need a backup CF, bullpen arms, and a catcher if we can find a taker for Vasquez. My guess is they roll with Miranda AK and maybe give Severino a shot when the first two don't produce. A power hitting first baseman would be a huge boost to this lineup and might even propel us to AL central favorites. Alas, we won't have the payroll to pull the trigger. IF we did sign someone it'd probably be a one year deal for Santana or someone like Solano.

[umterp23]

52 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

I hear great things about many of the Twins players and their clubhouse intangibles but those intangibles didn't keep them from choking away a playoff spot at the end of the season.

A great clubhouse guy, intangibles can't be defined and I agree has no merit on what a player brings to the table for the team.  Performance on the field speaks volumes.  Great clubhouse guy mantra is tiresome.

Plus what Twins teammate in today's world in public is going to say anything negative about a teammate.  

So and so called a great game today, always has.  Pitcher never bashes his catchers in public.  Guess the catcher is a great leader and clubhouse guy for instance.  Just an example not picking on our catchers.

A great clubhouse guy, doesn't super slow jog to 1st base on ground balls or think they have jacked one out of the ball park and only get singles instead of a doubles off the wall.  That is lead by example and we have too many slow joggers look at me types of guys on this team.  

One of the best moments this year was Lindor blasting a Grand slam for Mets to get to the next round of games.  He didn't pound his chest, showboat up the 1st base line.  Just ran the bases, low five a teammate   or two and walked back to the dugout.  Post game interview as about the team and not his moment.  Leadership at its best.

[SF Twins Fan]

If the front office is going to spend any money this offseason, which I doubt because of the Pohlads, it needs to be on pitching.  Ideally, they would trade Paddack and bring in another Lopez type pitcher who is on a cheap deal and sign or trade for another legit bullpen arm.

[mrcharlie]

Santana was near the top in many offense areas for the Twins. He was far and away their best defensive player.  How this article makes an argument for Goldy based on Santana's performance is plain insulting to anyone knowledgeable of baseball and the Twins 2024 season!  If you want to simply make a case for Goldy...fine, but no need to mischaractorize Santana's value to the Twins.

[Fred]

I believe Severino will take the job in Spring Training. Two years ago he led all of MiLB in HRs between A and AA. He's hit everywhere he's played except for a slow start at AAA which he made up for with a decent 2nd half. He's got above average power and he's a switch hitter. He wouldn't be the first poor fielder/good hitter that a team tried to hide at 1st base. At least, that's what I'm hoping for. I have given up on Kirilloff, and, although I wouldn't mind them re-signing Santana, he's kind of the inverse of what you need at 1st base (average bat, slick fielder).

[bean5302]

18 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

On the contrary, if your hole is DH you are in a good spot. Easiest spot to fill.

Course, it kinda requires production at the other spots which is a much bigger issue than who gets the DH ABs.

You're about to take a 1,000 mile road trip, your car is missing all its wheels, and you have no expendable savings. Your point appears to be you're in good shape because wheels are easy to find?

I still think it's a problem...

[Major League Ready]

2 hours ago, bean5302 said:

You're about to take a 1,000 mile road trip, your car is missing all its wheels, and you have no expendable savings. Your point appears to be you're in good shape because wheels are easy to find?

I still think it's a problem...

What if Rodriguez is here by May 15th and Wallner becomes the primary DH?

[Jocko87]

4 hours ago, bean5302 said:

You're about to take a 1,000 mile road trip, your car is missing all its wheels, and you have no expendable savings. Your point appears to be you're in good shape because wheels are easy to find?

I still think it's a problem...

Wut?

[joefish]

On 10/13/2024 at 12:35 PM, CRF said:

To tell you the truth...I don't want Santana back, or signing Goldy. 

I had Santana as our MVP. 

[Joe A. Preusser]

11 hours ago, DJL44 said:

I hear great things about many of the Twins players and their clubhouse intangibles but those intangibles didn't keep them from choking away a playoff spot at the end of the season.

I get it, but that was literally the least of all my points.

[RpR]

12 hours ago, LambchoP said:

Twins have needed a real everyday first baseman who can hit for a few years now. Sure, Goldy would be a nice pickup for a year, but my guess is he'll want more than a year and he'll be too expensive for the Twins. Remember, we still need a backup CF, bullpen arms, and a catcher if we can find a taker for Vasquez. My guess is they roll with Miranda AK and maybe give Severino a shot when the first two don't produce. A power hitting first baseman would be a huge boost to this lineup and might even propel us to AL central favorites. Alas, we won't have the payroll to pull the trigger. IF we did sign someone it'd probably be a one year deal for Santana or someone like Solano.

Think again, Sanatana was not brought in for his bat and unless they want another gaping hole in the infield they will keep Santan or bring a glove as good as his in.

[bean5302]

12 hours ago, RpR said:

Think again, Sanatana was not brought in for his bat and unless they want another gaping hole in the infield they will keep Santan or bring a glove as good as his in.

Santana is an average fielder. He's lazy and hurts our other infielders because he won't move off the bag to catch a ball. Instead of a rightfully scored infield hit, it always winds up as a throwing error and half the time the runner advances.

UZR had him at +2.3 last year, he's varied from -2.0 to +2.1 for the prior 5 years. The metric is stable.
For fans of OAA he's been at +1 to +3 defensively for 5 previous years. He's +14 this year. The metric is broken.
For fans of DRS, he's also varied from -1 to +11 defensively over the last 5 years. It's a terribly unstable metric. He's +8 this year.

[RpR]

59 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

Santana is an average fielder. He's lazy and hurts our other infielders because he won't move off the bag to catch a ball. Instead of a rightfully scored infield hit, it always winds up as a throwing error and half the time the runner advances.

If that is true, that  makes most of the rest of the infielder just plain lousy.

His defense numbers for last and this year are the best he ever had, and while all we spew out here are our opinions, that fact is probably why he was picked up.