Twins 5, Royals 8 (10 innings): Heartbreaking Bobby Witt Jr. Walk-Off Grand Slam Ends See-Saw Loss

[USAFChief]

Yeah, dismal loss. Three in a row now.

A couple notes: 

1. I don't like PHing for Julien or Kirilloff, unless it's the 9th inning or later. I know Rocco didn't PH for Julien last night, but he PH Solano for Kirilloff in the 7th. There's just too much chance Kirilloff bats again. Perhaps Kirilloff's shoulder still hurts, then don't play him. 

2. The bullpen...yeesh. I know there's nothing to be done about Duran, but the rest of the pen is really weak. And hoping 36 year old Thielbar and waiver wire pickup Stewart are magic bullets is ... hope at best. Hope isn't a good strategy. 

3. Notice they planned on 7 relievers being enough for this series...and 5 got used last night? Heh. Can they limp through the weekend?

 

[Nashvilletwin]

Sell vs. buy? Ah, the eternal question of the day.

There is no reason to quit on this season. Zero.  But that also doesn’t mean that this is the team for which we should mortgage the future.  So decisions over the next three days need to keep those two somewhat conflicting considerations in mind and find some sort of balance.

So let’s start with the following: any player who realistically is looked at as being a key cog in ‘24 and beyond does not get moved (unless we are blown away, because everything has a price, right?). So, IMHO, no one on the top ten or so of our prospect list gets moved.

Anyone not being viewed as part of the ‘24 and beyond Twins is fully on the block - but moving any such player has to be viewed by potential value gained this year and beyond vs. potential value lost the rest of this season. This can be a tough call and it’s not easy to necessarily get right (see the trade of the supposedly blocked Steer and CES for Mahle, for example). It’s not clear who is on this list - possibilities/certainties include (from biggest potential return):  Gray, Maeda, Polanco, Kepler, Solano, Castro, Taylor, Gordon, Larnach, Windner, and Gallo. Beyond the first three or four names, there’s not much value to get back.

Conclusion: it will be a quiet deadline.

Also, as an aside, last night was the 2nd time in a week Gallo was PHed for late in the game with A RHer ON THE MOUND.  That speaks volumes IMHO.

[David Maro]

Can't win games striking out 14 times,this has become a every game problem. Moran needs to go to St.Paul,can't find the plate. Needed 5 pitchers because he couldn't get it done for 1 inning. Duran looked tired and took numerous pitches to get to 100. He couldn't locate his off speed,can't walk anyone with a runner already on. The only good thing that happened tonight was Cleveland lost as well.

[rwilfong86]

Losing to the Royals is inexcusable but they still have a chance to win the series

[madtowntwin]

Turning point of the game was Perez's play at first fielding Wallner's smash and preventing a much bigger inning. Subsequent to that - Sonny suffers his "Difficult Inning" where he seemingly instantly loses  his previously demonstrated pinpoint control. Everything that evolved after that can be traced back to the above....

[terrydactyls]

10 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Witt Jr. is a really exciting young and talented player. He was better than Duran tonight. He shortened up his swing and still drove the ball.

Witt, Jr. should be suspended for the rest of the season.  He cheated.  He did not lean back, shut his eyes, swing from his heals, and strike out.  The Twins always follow this unwritten rule.  They had double-digit strikeouts for the billionth time this season.

[Whitey333]

Not sure of the official stats but I don't think our starting pitching, other than Ober, has been very good since the all star break.  Twins have given up 25 runs the past three games.  I want so much to wrap myself into this team but I just can't.  Everytime you think the are ready to turn the corner they falter.  I've had the same problems with the Twins the past couple of seasons.  They are proving to be frauds.  Yes they may very well win the division which is also fraudulent.  This team is so full of holes.  Addition by subtraction?  Dump Gallo.  Just DFA him he's terrible.

[darwin22]

3 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

14 Ks the record is ours for the taking! 

Time to move on.  The only concern is whether we are starting to get to a point where our BP is exhausted - especially in the heat and Sonny Gray is not showing that he is more than a 5 inning pitcher like he and the rest of us wished.

Rising whiff number is up to 1088 after last night.  Average of 10.36 whiff per game puts Twins on pace to shatter the Cubs record (1596/set in 2021) with a total of 1679.  Brutal.

[John Belinski]

7 hours ago, SwainZag said:

Twins were in position to win with their best player on the mound.  He just got beat.  That should be no indication to tip any scale to sell. 

No way is Duran their best player.  Just look at his record. He has long way to go before becoming a good closer. Good closers do not walk 2 weak hitters.

[umterp23]

9 hours ago, glunn said:

Sell who? And can we please get a great young catcher?

https://www.ballysports.com/north/news/statuesday-breakout-minnesota-twins-catcher-ryan-jeffers-flying-under-the-radar

I think we are good hands with Jeffers.  

[John Belinski]

7 hours ago, SwainZag said:

Twins were in position to win with their best player on the mound.  He just got beat.  That should be no indication to tip any scale to sell. 

 No way Duran is their best player. No good closer walks 2 weak hitters and then pitches to good hitter. Those 2 walks should have been outs and game over.

[wabene]

12 minutes ago, John Belinski said:

 No way Duran is their best player. No good closer walks 2 weak hitters and then pitches to good hitter. Those 2 walks should have been outs and game over.

Maybe a robot closer, but all others get taken down now and then. Wasn't it Kepler who walked off Hader earlier in the season? I will agree that Duran has not been at his best recently. The stretch where we used Duran and Jax 3 days in a row seem to have proceeded this downturn. 

If you expect perfection, you will be forever disappointed. 

[chinmusic]

3 hours ago, LastOnePicked said:

The Twins are on the exact same trajectory as last year.

Don't understand why you'd say that. I mean, did they reacquire Bundy and Archer overnight?

Royce Lewis is the very definition of spark plug, and his return is imminent. Polanco solidifies any lineup.

But as you say in your post, we'll just have to see how it plays out.

With nine weeks left in the regular season, there could easily be a shift of 10 or 15 games between the Twins and Guardians.. This is not the time to blink.

I am confident they won't sell. Just makes no sense to do so.

[HoskenPowell]

5 relievers.        Hmmmmmmm   wonder if its possible that not all FIVE will be on that night????

 

How about a reliever  be allowed to throw more than 18 pitches?????  Hell 3 of them threw 10 or less..............

[HoskenPowell]

2nd worst team in all of baseball.............Twinkies must be so proud of their lead in this total crap division.

 

 

Why is Gallo on team yet???  Oh , that' right..........see Pagan...............dream team cannot admit failure.

[Danchat]

40 minutes ago, chinmusic said:

Royce Lewis is the very definition of spark plug, and his return is imminent. Polanco solidifies any lineup.

Lewis is coming back late August at earliest, so I wouldn't call that imminent.

2 hours ago, USAFChief said:

3. Notice they planned on 7 relievers being enough for this series...and 5 got used last night? Heh. Can they limp through the weekend?

Perhaps their insatiable desire for 8 relievers will be what it takes to force them to DFA Gallo to get Ortega or the like up.

[sftwinsfan]

1 hour ago, Whitey333 said:

Not sure of the official stats but I don't think our starting pitching, other than Ober, has been very good since the all star break.  Twins have given up 25 runs the past three games.  I want so much to wrap myself into this team but I just can't.  Everytime you think the are ready to turn the corner they falter.  I've had the same problems with the Twins the past couple of seasons.  They are proving to be frauds.  Yes they may very well win the division which is also fraudulent.  This team is so full of holes.  Addition by subtraction?  Dump Gallo.  Just DFA him he's terrible.

Agree, seems like the wheels are getting a little wobbly and in danger of falling off with the pitching. Gray really seems to struggle once he gets past the 5th inning or so and Ryan has been terrible lately. Maybe Duran has focused too much on velocity to the point he's lost some command? As for Gallo-look up his splits the last 3 months (so the vast majority of the season). He's hitting .156 with a .628 OPS and striking out in over 45% of his plate appearances. Indefensible that he's still on the team let alone still getting playing time at this point. 

[joefish]

6 hours ago, William K Johnson said:

A couple of quick questions:

When did Alex Kiriloff turn into Joey Gallo?

and

When did Johan Duran turn into Emillo Pagan?

Last night in our dreams.

[Swing Batter-Batter]

13 hours ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

If 5 runs in 10 innings is a positive offensive night to you, then selling is definitely the right course.

Especially, considering the opponent was KC.

 

[Larry Janisewski]

14 hours ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

If 5 runs in 10 innings is a positive offensive night to you, then selling is definitely the right course.

Not to mention 10 strike outs in the first 5 innings vs a pitcher with an  ERA approaching 6.00 and 14 total strike outs.

[Larry Janisewski]

14 hours ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

If 5 runs in 10 innings is a positive offensive night to you, then selling is definitely the right course.

Not to mention 10 strike outs in the first 5 innings vs a pitcher with an  ERA approaching 6.00 and 14 total strike outs.

[PDX Twin]

Is Matt Capps still alive? Maybe we could get him for, say, Walker Jenkins.

[Jocko87]

In exchange for the highlight of their season, The KC Royals have sent relief pitcher Scott Barlow to the Minnesota Twins.

Who says no?

[jkcarew]

15 hours ago, gunnarthor said:

Honestly, Witt Jr is a good young player. Every now and then, that'll happen. Nice to see the Twins score some runs.

True. It’s more the recent lack of command that is concerning rather than the one HR.

[jkcarew]

12 hours ago, SwainZag said:

Twins were in position to win with their best player on the mound.  He just got beat.  That should be no indication to tip any scale to sell. 

But now is the time to decide, right?

I agree that one loss to a bad team doesn’t mean much. But there’s a pretty substantial body of work out there that would say sell. The only thing that's saying buy is the lousy competition in this division.

I say sell, anyway.

[jkcarew]

1 hour ago, PDX Twin said:

Is Matt Capps still alive? Maybe we could get him for, say, Walker Jenkins.

Currently combing the wire for the next Sam Dyson.

[DJL44]

26 minutes ago, jkcarew said:

But now is the time to decide, right?

I agree that one loss to a bad team doesn’t mean much. But there’s a pretty substantial body of work out there that would say sell. The only thing that's saying buy is the lousy competition in this division.

I say sell, anyway.

If there's one thing sports fans really rally around it is a bunch of quitters. That's why Oakland is leading the league in attendance.

[jkcarew]

11 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

If there's one thing sports fans really rally around it is a bunch of quitters. That's why Oakland is leading the league in attendance.

Nice comment.

Are you worried about the Poland’s 2023 income? And why do you equate selling some veterans and clearing playing time for the younger players with quitting? Have you given up on the young guys?

[LastOnePicked]

5 hours ago, chinmusic said:

Don't understand why you'd say that.

Easy. I've been a Twins fan for awhile now. As they say, when faced with an uncertain outcome, "the trend is your friend."

Besides, same captain and same boat and same navigational philosophy. Typically yields the same result. But, as I say, we'll see.

[LastOnePicked]

8 hours ago, DJL44 said:

Yeah, trying is probably a bad idea. Better to quit when you're ahead. Quitting is best way to build a fanbase.

You're right, of course. Whatever has this proud organization - and this all-star squad - done over the last few years to lead me to such unwarranted skepticism? No worries - pay me no mind.