How Good Has Twins First Baseman Ty France Been So Far?

[Major League Ready]

What if Kody Clemens has an 775 OPS between now and the trade deadline and France continues his pace at an OPS of 675?  Do you cut France for trade him for a dozen golf balls and go with Clemens at 1B?  Stranger things have happened.

[AceWrigley]

1 hour ago, Road trip said:

France is my old '79 Dodge Omni.  Not fast, not powerful, not safe, and most certainly not sexy.  But it was cheap, it was reasonably dependable, and for several years it was all I could afford.  There was value there, if you accepted all the limitations.  I replaced the Omni when I could afford something better.  I don't know when or if the Twins will reach that point for 1B.

If it gets you to the beach and back it's a winner.

[Sjoski]

24 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

It might not have been in a style that you approve of,

Point well made...as you inferred...it depends on the type of baseball you prefer to watch.

Sano career K rate is 2x more than France...almost exactly. 

Personally,  especially later in his career, I'd stop watching a game when Sano came up to "hit"...because the odds were so low that he actually would.  Plus...he was just as bad in the field. 

Career Numbers Sano vs France

Miguel Sanó ~36.5%   ~42.4% (2024)

Ty France ~18.2%   14.2% ( 2025)

[laloesch]

14 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

Sano is an easy target for some people, but the reality is when Sano was healthy he hit, and produced on offense. It might not have been in a style that you approve of, but the production was there and the contract he signed wasn't a terrible one...he just couldn't stay healthy. Was some of that maybe his own fault, due to less than elite conditioning? Maybe, but no one can prove it one way or the other. (there's no questions about Buxton or Correa's conditioning, or Joe Mauer's, but they've struggled to stay healthy too)

BTW? through 7 seasons Sano was worth 8.9 bWAR. Ty France is currently at 8.3 in his 7th season, with basically the same number of games, PA, etc.

Ummm, his last 3 seasons, WAR stats before he got cut (I don't have access to bWar) in 2020, 2021, and 2022 was 0.1, 0.9, and -0.8.  And he was just as bad in the 28 games he played for the Angels in 2024 at -0.8 war. 

To be perfectly honest, he WAS an "easy target" as you put it, because his production flat out sucked post 2019.  He was terrible in almost every offensive statistical category those final three years.  His career pattern beginning in 2015 was good season, bad season, good season, bad season through 2019, and then he just dropped off the deep end into mediocrity completely. 

Sano was never in the same league as Joe Mauer, Buxton, Correa, and certainly did not have Joe Mauer's eye at the plate or discipline in the batters box.  Outside of 2015, 2017, and 2019, his other seasons were at or well below replacement level.     

Not exactly a productive player in my eyes but a mediocre one if you ask me.  Beyond the homeruns, what were the positives?  Abysmal strikeout numbers?  He wasn't exactly the most mobile defensive player either, especially after he ballooned up to 298 pounds in the 2019 offseason.

[GNess]

This is a question of frame of reference - France is a good signing for the price paid.  To me that just tacitly supports a culture of frugality in a sport where more aggressive spending is the more likely path to success. 

I prefer a frame of reference where the signing of Correa is embraced as a franchise serious about competing. 

The Twins have signed both players obviously, but France's signing is more indicative of the Twins approach to roster building and management.

[Linus]

I think this is a false question. France is meeting what is reasonably expected of him at a low price. So good for Ty France - I’m not going to be critical of him. However it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t expect much more from this position. I know they aren’t signing Pete Alonzo but they can make a trade or develop one a first baseman that can hit. I reject the premise that “good value” from France is anything we should celebrate or even accept. 

[RpR]

17 minutes ago, Linus said:

I think this is a false question. France is meeting what is reasonably expected of him at a low price. So good for Ty France - I’m not going to be critical of him. However it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t expect much more from this position. I know they aren’t signing Pete Alonzo but they can make a trade or develop one a first baseman that can hit. I reject the premise that “good value” from France is anything we should celebrate or even accept. 

You just do not like the guy

[Linus]

28 minutes ago, Linus said:

France is meeting what is reasonably expected of him at a low price. So good for Ty France - I’m not going to be critical of him. 

 

9 minutes ago, RpR said:

You just do not like the guy

Hmmm apparently you didn’t read this part of my post. 

[Fire Dan Gladden]

1 hour ago, GNess said:

This is a question of frame of reference - France is a good signing for the price paid.  To me that just tacitly supports a culture of frugality in a sport where more aggressive spending is the more likely path to success. 

I prefer a frame of reference where the signing of Correa is embraced as a franchise serious about competing. 

The Twins have signed both players obviously, but France's signing is more indicative of the Twins approach to roster building and management.

Welcome to Minnesota!

[DJL44]

Looking at Fangraphs - he's 24th in offense among 1B and 10th in defense for an overall ranking of 21. Similar 1B include Luis Arraez, Carlos Santana, Nathaniel Lowe, Jake Burger and Rowdy Tellez.

[KirbyDome89]

39 minutes ago, Linus said:

I think this is a false question. France is meeting what is reasonably expected of him at a low price. So good for Ty France - I’m not going to be critical of him. However it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t expect much more from this position. I know they aren’t signing Pete Alonzo but they can make a trade or develop one a first baseman that can hit. I reject the premise that “good value” from France is anything we should celebrate or even accept. 

This. People need to stop conflating "value," with actual production. France is a below average bat, with near zero power, and he provides nothing defensively.  

[Linus]

13 minutes ago, KirbyDome89 said:

This. People need to stop conflating "value," with actual production. France is a below average bat, with near zero power, and he provides nothing defensively.  

Maybe they will start giving out a trophy at the end of the year for most WAR per payroll dollar spent. 

[DJL44]

France isn't much worse in his positional rankings than other Twins are at their positions. 2B and 3B rank worse. SS and DH are about the same as France. The outfield (Buxton, Bader, Wallner) looks good and Jeffers is a good catcher.

[Riverbrian]

On 5/22/2025 at 10:43 AM, Rod Carews Birthday said:

All of this is mostly true, but where is that replacement supposed to come from?

See... I was standing next to you the whole time. You didn't lose me. You were just looking the other direction momentarily. 

That's the question... Where is the replacement? 1B of all positions? This is where the hitters that you draft settle in as they move down the defensive spectrum. 

Other clubs are finding them... that's why Ty France was only getting minor league offers and took our non-gaurentee near major league minimum offer.  

We can talk about who is on the farm... but the discussion is bigger than that. Who was on the farm a year ago, the year before that and the year before that. What young player could we have traded for and developed into something. What veteren player could we have traded for for that matter. 

The A's have 22 year old Kurtz who just replaced 23 year old Soderstrom, the Orioles brought Mountcastle through the system, Casas is 25 hurt but 25, Vaughn is 27 and came through the White Sox system, lumpy arrival but through the system, with hope for future even if it didn't happen the way Keith Law thought it would. Cleveland may have taken the money they saved on pre-arb players on Santana but Manzardo is a big bopper age 24, Torkelson really struggled but he seems to have arrived at age 25 and they had plans for 23 year old Keith if Torkelson was still struggling. Pasquatch is 27 in Kansas City with the next big thing 22 years old in Omaha. There is a 23 year old with the Angels, Even the Yankees found room for a 27 year old Ben Rice. Diaz and Aranda came to the Rays cheaply and fairly young and worked out. Toronto of course has brought Vlad Jr along and still produced Horwitz in addition who is now playing 1B in Pittsburgh at age 27. The Cubs have a young kid from Minnesota age 27 in Michael Busch that they picked from the Dodgers in a deal. The Reds have two young options that came from us that we traded away to fill a hole in the pitching staff. Toglia is 27 years old in Colorado, The Marlins went got 27 year old Mervis,  The Padres have Arraez and we know his story... but still only 28 years old and before that it was Cronenworth who the Padres produced from their farm system.    

To be fair... on the other side of the coin... Houston had a development hole at 1B but they spent real money on Walker to fill it. Seattle has just plain failed at the position and even with that noticeable failure, they DFA'd our guy and they are giving Rowdy Tellez a spin currently. The Rangers have Burger that they had to bring in but Burger had other offers. The D-Backs had a hole but they filled it with Josh Naylor via Trade. The Braves traded for a young Matt Olson which was necessary after the big bopper they developed took the big contract with the Dodgers. The Brewers paid real money to bring in Hoskins, it's ok they can afford it because the rest of the team is nearly all players making the minimum. The Mets developed Alonso. The Twins gave away Lamonte Wade to the Giants. The Cardinals are alot like the Mariners and the Twins but they had Goldy holding fort for many years. They solved by moving the catcher they paid alot of money for to the position and the Nats went got Lowe. 

The Dodgers and the Phillies... well forget about them but they both obviously addressed the position with superstars. The Phillies filled the 1B hole by moving Harper from the OF which showed a certain creativity. 

I just went through every major league team and you can see why Ty France had to sign for next to nothing. And here he is in Minnesota... playing OK... I'm not trying to tear Ty apart. I'm tearing the need for Ty apart. 

In my opinion, there is only one team in baseball that compares to the Twins in this regard at the 1B position and that is the Mariners who are rolling with Tallez at 1.5 million. And it was the Mariners who DFA'd our guy so to be honest... we are basically a step below them because we got the guy who isn't as highly thought of as Tallez.  

I totally get what you are saying and what you are saying is basically what I'm saying. You are saying that France is necessary because we don't have other options. I agree... I'm just adding the question... Why are their not other options.

And I'm adding to that and this is probably the most important point of all.

France, Santana, Solano, Miranda, Sano, Cron, Morrison and the train just keeps a rolling. Meanwhile, I keep hearing about this highly ranked farm system. Wave after Wave crashing on the beach. Kirilloff, Blankenhorn, Diaz, Rooker, Wade Jr, Severino, Miranda, Raley, Sabato. Steer, Strand. 

I get that we may have needed France... it's the fact that we needed France that's the problem. It's the fact that he has to be in the lineup or our chances to win plummet. 

Anyway... I don't want to hate on France. I wish him well, I'm cheering really hard for him but we are talking about a performance thus far that is almost exactly the performance that got him DFA'd. 

 

[Riverbrian]

3 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

While everybody wants to be the Dodgers, very few teams have rockstars at every position. Finding cheap, serviceable players at positions of need is very important. You can argue how "serviceable" France is, but I don't think he is the biggest problem the Twins have at the moment, especially looking at the injuries and sub-par play this team has seen from players expected to contribute.

I do think Keaschall might have an opportunity to take some AB from France at some point this season (again... injuries), but there is nobody France is blocking in MiLB. Considering the cost/benefit, I am having a hard time finding an argument against France at the moment.

I'm not a money guy... Not at all. I'm the guy who is counting the pre-arb players on other teams and counting ours and saying Oh Oh... we got a problem because I know that we can't be the Dodgers. 

France is not the biggest problem... I'm not going to even call him a problem specifically as he stands there all by himself. Ty France has the right to compete for major league employment just like Ryan Fitzgerald or Walker Jenkins has a right to compete for major league employment.  

I'm not making an argument against France... I'm making an argument over needing someone like France. I'm augmenting the scope of that argument by saying that France is playing EVERY DAY and is needed to play EVERY DAY and his numbers are average at best, most likely below average and he looks above average in comparison to what we have surrounding him.

I have high hopes for Keaschall, he looked great when he arrived and but then again so did Julien.

Ultimately... the Twins need to fix this because the bill will come due and we will be standing here with a room full of France type players that no one will take at the deadline when we are selling as our cross checkers are wondering who to draft 2nd overall in the 1st round of the following years draft. 

That's the bill that comes due. 

  

[Bad News TC Bears]

Good article.... His value isn't all in the numbers. Getting clutch hits and being reliable has value for his salary. 

After losing Carlos Santana from last season the loss isn't what you might expect. Santana is batting .231 with 6 hrs and probably playing gold glove first base.... France is .253 with 3 hrs and solid so far at first. He is also much younger and hopefully will hold up physically.

Glad the Twins got him in the mix this year!

[Doctor Gast]

On 5/22/2025 at 7:22 AM, Riverbrian said:

He's been fine for someone who cost one million. 

In total... His 88 OPS+ says below average. 

For somebody who has 188 plate appearances, plays every day at 1b, hits in the 4th spot in the lineup. He has been way below average. 

For somebody who won't be back next year. This isn't a success story so far. 

The goal after the '23 postseason success should have been to put together a group that could improve the team to be better for '24 & beyond. They spent relatively a lot of money on DeSclavani, Margot & Santana. To evaluate these moves, we need to look at whether they meet those goals or not. Did we improve on our '23 postseason success? No, we didn't, we dropped down to 4th place & missed the postseason. Did it benefit our team this year? No, it didn't. It only helped Santana's pay day. Miranda, & Kiriloff practically got no experience at 1B to better our team & hurt their arms while playing 3B & OF while recovering. Keirsey could have vastly improved our OF in '24 & could have adapted to the MLB pitching going into '25. 

I was in favor of signing France as a backup 1Bman & get plenty of time to focus on his hitting at DH. Miranda was passed up 2x as the starting 1Bman, when it was expected that he would start there. Miranda is a great hitter as he demonstrated when healthy. His poor performance, IMO, is because he's physically & or his feelings are hurting. Yes, he's a professional but anyone of us who'd be passed up on a promotion when it was expected that you'd get it, not once but twice & have to suck it up & not have it affect you? How many years has it been since we haven't had a steady 1Bman? We drafted plenty of 1Bmen, but we haven't developed any. We'll never get better at 1B & LF if we keep on bringing in 1 yr. rentals. & our in-house players' trade value plummets.

France has many years at 1B, he's not getting any better, while Miranda has a lot of room for improvement. In '23 if we'd kept Urshela & have Miranda at 1B. Miranda would have been a healthy, pretty decent 1Bman by now. I'm not criticizing France (he's worth what we paid for him), I'm criticizing Baldelli's judgement.

[RpR]

3 hours ago, Linus said:

 

Hmmm apparently you didn’t read this part of my post. 

I did - including all the negative:

" - I’m not going to be critical of him. ---- However it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t expect much more from this position. I know they aren’t signing Pete Alonzo but they can make a trade or develop one a first baseman that can hit. I reject the premise that “good value” from France is anything we should celebrate or even accept.  "

Man speaks with forked tongue.

[jmlease1]

4 hours ago, laloesch said:

Ummm, his last 3 seasons, WAR stats before he got cut (I don't have access to bWar) in 2020, 2021, and 2022 was 0.1, 0.9, and -0.8.  And he was just as bad in the 28 games he played for the Angels in 2024 at -0.8 war. 

To be perfectly honest, he WAS an "easy target" as you put it, because his production flat out sucked post 2019.  He was terrible in almost every offensive statistical category those final three years.  His career pattern beginning in 2015 was good season, bad season, good season, bad season through 2019, and then he just dropped off the deep end into mediocrity completely. 

Sano was never in the same league as Joe Mauer, Buxton, Correa, and certainly did not have Joe Mauer's eye at the plate or discipline in the batters box.  Outside of 2015, 2017, and 2019, his other seasons were at or well below replacement level.     

Not exactly a productive player in my eyes but a mediocre one if you ask me.  Beyond the homeruns, what were the positives?  Abysmal strikeout numbers?  He wasn't exactly the most mobile defensive player either, especially after he ballooned up to 298 pounds in the 2019 offseason.

bWAR isn't hard to find: https://www.baseball-reference.com/ I usually use it for that fact: it's not pay-walled.

You are correct: Sano was not particularly good after 2019. Almost all of his value was in his first 5 seasons. Who does that also look like right now? Ty France. By the way, 2020 Sano played roughly about as much as France has to date this season...and provided about the same value. (Sano hit quite a bit better and provided no defensive value. France has been a below average hitter and ok at 1B)

My point isn't that Sano was some kind of great player (he was a dangerous hitter who stunk on defense and had injury problems). It's that he produced overall value not dissimilar from Ty France, but in a way that was less well-received. Healthy, he was a feared hitter at the plate. Ty France isn't feared by anyone right now. He's barely above replacement level. The idea that Ty France has "saved" us from someone like Sano just doesn't really work.

It's great that Ty France isn't costing the Twins much, but it's not great that he's producing relatively little. His contact skills make him useful with runners in scoring position, but his lack of power makes it hard for him to help put a crooked number on the board. He's been fine defensively, but is slow and adds little on the bases. He needs to find more pop in his bat, but this has been the problem with him for what's now the 3rd season in a row. Not good.

[Linus]

17 minutes ago, RpR said:

I did - including all the negative:

" - I’m not going to be critical of him. ---- However it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t expect much more from this position. I know they aren’t signing Pete Alonzo but they can make a trade or develop one a first baseman that can hit. I reject the premise that “good value” from France is anything we should celebrate or even accept.  "

Man speaks with forked tongue.

I think your reading comprehension is lacking. You don’t need to tell me how I feel about France so see you later. 

[Jocko87]

6 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

While everybody wants to be the Dodgers, very few teams have rockstars at every position. Finding cheap, serviceable players at positions of need is very important. You can argue how "serviceable" France is, but I don't think he is the biggest problem the Twins have at the moment, especially looking at the injuries and sub-par play this team has seen from players expected to contribute.

I do think Keaschall might have an opportunity to take some AB from France at some point this season (again... injuries), but there is nobody France is blocking in MiLB. Considering the cost/benefit, I am having a hard time finding an argument against France at the moment.

Exactly this.  Reading through these comments a lot of folks are melding league average with replacement level when they are two distinctly different things.  

The Fangraphs definition for replacement level is 0 WAR over 600PA.  It’s a little early to be discussing this in WAR terms.  In his injury season, he was worse than that. Other seasons, much better.  In other words, a solid major league player.

Half the league, approximately, are solid major leaguers.  He is one of them.  

[Major League Ready]

4 hours ago, Linus said:

Maybe they will start giving out a trophy at the end of the year for most WAR per payroll dollar spent. 

Given there are many teams that can spend 1.5 - 2.5X what the Minnesota Twins can spend, the Twins must produce 1.5 - 2.5X WAR per payroll dollar spent.  I don't know why anyone would debate the need for a below average revenue team to produce more per dollar spent..  You make it sound like it's silly when it's an absolute certainty that teams like the Twins have to produce far more per dollar spent if they are to be successful

[Mrs. Baseball]

10 hours ago, tarheeltwinsfan said:

France is a professional major league player. He has been a good addition at a great price. 

The Twins underpaid for France. And despite the events of yesterday Cleveland overpaid for Santana.

[KirbyDome89]

4 minutes ago, Jocko87 said:

Exactly this.  Reading through these comments a lot of folks are melding league average with replacement level when they are two distinctly different things.  

The Fangraphs definition for replacement level is 0 WAR over 600PA.  It’s a little early to be discussing this in WAR terms.  In his injury season, he was worse than that. Other seasons, much better.  In other words, a solid major league player.

Half the league, approximately, are solid major leaguers.  He is one of them.  

He's posted .1 WAR and we're essentially 1/3 of the way through the season. You can call it early, but barring some massive turnaround, he's the same offensive player he was last season, which another poster already noted, was enough for Seattle to DFA him mid season. If France was viewed as a solid MLB player he wasn't signing a non-guaranteed deal with MN...

[KirbyDome89]

14 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Given there are many teams that can spend 1.5 - 2.5X what the Minnesota Twins can spend, the Twins must produce 1.5 - 2.5X per payroll dollar spent.  I don't know why anyone would debate the need for a below average revenue team to produce more per dollar spent.

Does locking Ty France into 1B create this WAR surplus? The results thus far are a resounding no. 

[TheLeviathan]

His production would be a lot easier to swallow if he was good at 1B.  At this point....I really hope that's a spot we can upgrade this summer if we stay in it.

That said....the league is not strong at 1B.  It's a shockingly weak position in the modern game.

[Major League Ready]

1 hour ago, KirbyDome89 said:

Does locking Ty France into 1B create this WAR surplus? The results thus far are a resounding no. 

Absolutely not but that also has absolutely nothing to do with the point of my post.  I have often seen people make snide remarks like " Maybe they will start giving out a trophy at the end of the year for most WAR per payroll dollar spent."  as if it's irrelevant when in fact it's essential.

[Linus]

19 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Absolutely not but that also has absolutely nothing to do with the point of my post.  I have often seen people make snide remarks like " Maybe they will start giving out a trophy at the end of the year for most WAR per payroll dollar spent."  as if it's irrelevant when in fact it's essential.

The point of my post is a mediocre player on a good contract doesn’t get you closer to winning. Good players get you closer to winning especially at a position where offensive production is important. These good players can be obtained in a variety of ways so you can skip your lecture about how mid market teams acquire players. 

[bean5302]

Anyway... Ty France is making $1MM / yr. He's producing fine for that amount of money. France was brought in on a MiLB contract with an invite, and he made the team in part because the organization doesn't have any faith in Miranda. France's offer was practically the same as Mike Ford got. With all the injuries, it could be worse, I suppose.

The Twins have $80MM tied up in Correa, Buxton, Vazquez, Bader, Castro and Jeffers. That's plenty of cash for a mid-market team.

[Western SD Fan]

It appears that we are having two separate conversations in one thread.  First conversation is whether France is meeting expectations.  I'll say it again that, when you consider everything involved (salary, where he was supposed to hit in the lineup, defense, and internal options), he is probably meeting expectations.  

The second conversation is whether we should be accepting these expectations.  Unfortunately, as a Twins fan, these are typically the conversations we get to have since we are not spending or trading to get better at the position.  Checking Sportrac, I was actually surprised that the adjusted payroll is up to a tick more than $146 million, which is about $10 million more than I was expecting for some reason at this point in the season.  Even listening to Skor North today, they were surmising on who gets DFA'd as players come back from the IL and France was not mentioned.  Although, I would say that many of the commenters on this thread have made the case that he should be in the DFA conversation, and I agree with that as we currently have Clemens, Bride, and Castro that can play 1B provided they can still produce at a similar level until Buxton and Wallner come back.  They sent Fitzgerald back down so my anticipation is that we should see Correa tomorrow.  My suspicion on why they will hold onto France longer than they probably should (see Gallo, Margot) and because internal replacements in the minors either need to be added to the 40-man (Ford) or only have one option left (Julien and Miranda).  If you still have hope for those players, you can't burn their option until you're convinced that they can stick.  For what it's worth, Miranda is playing 1B at St. Paul tonight so maybe they are working a path for him back to the ML club.