Hayes: "The [Minnesota] Twins Have Expressed Interest In adding A Veteran Shortstop"

[USAFChief]

2 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

What I'm telling you, now more plainly, is that you are effecting my and others ability to participate in meaningful discussions by hijacking every thread you engage in with unrelated material.

One offhanded mention on a left handed hitter is not license to mainline platoon talk 101.  Spoiler-there will be one of those in almost every article.

What I read in your response is that you aren't too worried about others enjoyment of the discussion. As sure as you are that some find it entertaining I can be just as sure a greater number scroll on by, looking for backup shortstop talk.  That's a shame.

I'm not arrogant enough to think I speak for others. But as for myself, neither CH nor RB lesson my enjoyment of TD. 

As for platooning, in the days of 13 position player rosters and Rocco’s management preferences, there can be no discussion of potential moves without considering it.

[Doctor Wu]

More shortstops? No no no. And suggesting these two guys? I like the idea of thinking outside the box, but it's still a big no for me. 

[Riverbrian]

10 hours ago, Vanimal46 said:

The top stories according to TD are Randballs Stu’s articles so I highly doubt that. If you wanna post jokes post jokes. Who cares? But I’ve been here long enough to know you get fixated on a certain topic then leave for an extended period and return. Don’t repeat the cycle. I think you’ve got a little more gas left in the tank. 

I left once for 2 years in 2020. Your experiences may be different but the place changed. When Mayberry grows, it isn't just Andy, Opie and Aunt Bea moving to town. It's a whole bunch of Otis's and that is how things grow naturally and not much can be done about it.. Since returning, I have been equal parts, desperately clinging because I need the outlet and barely hanging on because there is very few left to play with and my TD aftertaste is often times anger and if anyone knows me... anger is something that I go out of my way to avoid.

I've actually started blocking people. That isn't what I come to TD for. If you would asked me fifteen years ago if I would block posters... I would have told you... no chance. I'm blocking people, I'm being blocked. It's the way it has to be I guess. To offend with a clean joke, to lesson Jocko's experience on TD is the last thing I want to do but Jocko's right, It's all I got right now. You are right... I'm fixated on it because it permeates nearly every facet of our roster construction. Dejong? Urias? Of Course... because it permeates nearly every facet of our roster construction. Someone will need to replace Farmer in the template. 

Randball Stu is a genius and a treasure. He's smart enough to stay out of the forums.  

 

[Dave Borton]

mess

1 of 2

noun

mess 

 

Synonyms of mess.

Definitions:
a.a disordered, untidy, offensive, or unpleasant state or condition

your room is in a mess

b. the Twins 2024 offseason.

[TwinsDr2021]

14 hours ago, whosafraidofluigirussolo said:

Regarding Lee, this report tells me that the Twins must not like the prospect of him playing shortstop.

A lot of speculation and forecasting about the 2025 Twins (here and elsewhere) seems to presume that Lee has a spot on the roster from opening day. 

It's not that he won't be a good and useful player, but he wasn't great in his first MLB experience last year, and he hasn't spent so long in the high minors to cause serious concern about him stagnating there. Maybe the org is considering more time at AAA for Lee as much as they're doubting his ability at SS.

Brooks Lee turns 24 on Valentines day, he is either a major league player or not. If he goes to the minors he is just the next in line of mid 20 year old players that nobody has any idea of if they are worthy of a starting spot.

[Riverbrian]

9 hours ago, randy_moist said:

I'm sorry if this has already been addressed, but comparing Gunnar Henderson to Matt Wallner, to try and suggest the Twins would protect the SS from lefties, if he were with them, is ridiculous. Henderson mashes lefties, his OPS against them last year would have been respectable as a RH split for him. He was worth 9 WAR last year. The Orioles use platoons too. 

Larnach proved he couldn't hit lefites in the minors. Most left-handed hitters learn it then. Some, like Wallner, learn it in the majors. It's not a refusal to let players do it, it's a failure of players to prove they can do it. You think they're not getting opportunities, but in reality, they're doing what's best for them and the team. How much better than his current .510 OPS do you think Wallner will get against lefties? You think he's going to break .700?

Consider if Walker Jenkins is serviceable against LHPs. Then he'll play against them. Yet we aren't even sure he'll hit RHP in the majors yet (just very confident), so you shouldn't be that surprised if Jenkins is one day a platoon bat, because that exists in his range of possible outcomes. We hope that's not the case, but what makes you think that's what the Twins would prefer? They want him to be good from both sides.

 

Not sure if I'm allowed to talk about it. 

If I were allowed... It wasn't I who brought up Henderson as a comparison but the poster isn't ridiculous because we won't sign Gunner Henderson. We have to grow a Gunner Henderson.

I'd ask you to please go back and check Gunnar's 2022 splits, his 2023 splits and his 2024 splits and take note of the progression. Splits will bounce around typically so a progression like this isn't normal but what you see is a left handed hitter that was never platooned and progressed to what you say he is. 

All teams platoon. The Orioles consistently kept Ryan O' Hearn away from left handed pitching and that was really about the extent of their consistent platooning.

Next you have to count how many left handed hitters are on the Orioles roster. Henderson, O'Hearn, Cowser, Mullins, Holliday, Kjerstad. Only O'Hearn was consistently kept away from left handed pitchers despite all teams having the capability of consistently platooning 3 left handers every day.  

As for the Wallner and Larnach failing to prove it. If you are right... the Twins have failed to develop left handed hitting because... yes... all teams platoon but no other team has shut down their entire left handed hitting department. The Twins stand alone. 

The Twins will need to fix this development hole quickly because the result is a farm system that can only produce a left handed hitter that requires a Paul DeJong (topic relevance) to attach and shadow it. 

Sorry Jocko

Hey... My wife told me she saw a bear on the way to work. 

I was surprised by that so I asked her how she knew it was on it's way to work. 

[Riverbrian]

6 hours ago, USAFChief said:

 

As for platooning, in the days of 13 position player rosters and Rocco’s management preferences, there can be no discussion of potential moves without considering it.

[chpettit19]

9 hours ago, randy_moist said:

I'm sorry if this has already been addressed, but comparing Gunnar Henderson to Matt Wallner, to try and suggest the Twins would protect the SS from lefties, if he were with them, is ridiculous. Henderson mashes lefties, his OPS against them last year would have been respectable as a RH split for him. He was worth 9 WAR last year. The Orioles use platoons too. 

Larnach proved he couldn't hit lefites in the minors. Most left-handed hitters learn it then. Some, like Wallner, learn it in the majors. It's not a refusal to let players do it, it's a failure of players to prove they can do it. You think they're not getting opportunities, but in reality, they're doing what's best for them and the team. How much better than his current .510 OPS do you think Wallner will get against lefties? You think he's going to break .700?

Consider if Walker Jenkins is serviceable against LHPs. Then he'll play against them. Yet we aren't even sure he'll hit RHP in the majors yet (just very confident), so you shouldn't be that surprised if Jenkins is one day a platoon bat, because that exists in his range of possible outcomes. We hope that's not the case, but what makes you think that's what the Twins would prefer? They want him to be good from both sides.

 

Go look at Wallner's splits against lefties in the minors. Especially the upper minors. His OPS starts with a 9. Then go look at Gunnar's splits against them in the upper minors. His OPS starts with a 6. You have them backwards. Gunnar didn't prove he could hit them in the minors and then he was terrible in his first major league season against them (.448 OPS) while not being shielded from them because "it's what's best for him and the team." Then he got a little better in his 2nd MLB season while still not being shielded from them at all and putting up a .618 OPS against them. Then his 3rd season while still not being shielded from them at all he put up the .829 OPS against them. A number he never approached in the minors.

That's our point. You have Gunnar and Wallner backwards. One proved it in the minors and then got shut down in the majors while the other didn't prove it in the minors but was given the chance to learn in the majors. Gunnar went from a .448 to an .829 OPS against lefties. So how much better can Wallner get from his .510? I'll say about 300 points if they actually just let him learn. But instead this article suggests we have to trade one of our 2 left-handed hitters to bring in a washed up vet as a backup in fielder. You're proving our point about the nonsense of this strategy.

[chpettit19]

44 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

Brooks Lee turns 24 on Valentines day, he is either a major league player or not. If he goes to the minors he is just the next in line of mid 20 year old players that nobody has any idea of if they are worthy of a starting spot.

I agree. I think he's at the turning point. He needs to show he can play at this level. Doesn't have to be a star from the jump this season, but he needs to play well enough to keep these kinds of signings far from the Twins minds. Them even considering these things is a rough look for Lee. Hopefully this kind of signing would be a minor league deal as Lee insurance, but even that feeling necessary is not great. It may be that they trust his skill but not his health, but, especially with this team, that's still bad.

[HrbieFan]

18 hours ago, thelanges5 said:

Larnach looks like a first baseman. That’s his future home. 

Agree, just doesnt have enough power IMO. 

If we sign one of the 2 SS mentioned, Castro has to be on the move 

[Riverbrian]

9 hours ago, ashbury said:

I'm away from a proper keyboard, and trying to type on my phone using one index finger instead of two thumbs like a civilized individual, so I will say just this: I hope you don't do that.

Thanks Ash

All these years... You are consistently one of the brightest lights on this website. You are one of the reasons to hang around. 

[Original_JB]

Guess it's time to hire the Amazing Alexander to 'adjust' some mindsets......

 

[Riverbrian]

57 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

I agree. I think he's at the turning point. He needs to show he can play at this level. Doesn't have to be a star from the jump this season, but he needs to play well enough to keep these kinds of signings far from the Twins minds. Them even considering these things is a rough look for Lee. Hopefully this kind of signing would be a minor league deal as Lee insurance, but even that feeling necessary is not great. It may be that they trust his skill but not his health, but, especially with this team, that's still bad.

Lee still has options so I'm not convinced he's at a turning point this young in his career.

However... the problem (waving at the topic of this article). Signing Article Guy for another 4 to 6 million is going to knock someone off the 26 man.

That person just might be Lee. That's OK because we need players to come up when the need comes and the need will come but Lee will be back in that same prove it right now now role that he faced last year when that call comes.  

Miranda at 1B, Julien/Article Guy platoon at 2B, Lewis at 3B and Correa at SS.

I'd guess that Buxton DH's against lefties. While Bader plays CF against the LH. With Castro and Martin taking up the corners OF spots with Cole Ragans on the mound. 

Against the Right Handers... Castro and Larnach will handle left field with Larnach handling the lions share of DH work but still playing in left when Castro is filling in for maintenance days elsewhere at other positions. Buxton in CF (Bader on Maintenance Days) with Wallner in RF. 

Full time 5: Correa, Buxton, Lewis, Miranda and Castro

Left Handed Platoon Guys: Wallner, Larnach and Julien

Right Handed Platoon Guys: Bader, Martin and Article Guy

2 Catchers for a total of 13. 

Then the season will come... players will get injured... some players with options will struggle and need to be sent down and the Twins will desperately try to keep the integrity of the system together.  

In the meantime, We will have spent over 10 million that we don't have on Bader and Article guy, Development will be compromised again for another year and we will have to spend 10 million that we don't have next year to replace article guy because we didn't develop a pre-arb cheaper option.

When Lee was the key all along to kicking the dependence on article guy all along to freeing up that 10 million to be able to afford Pete Alonso.   

Sorry Chia Pet... I'm fixated again. It's all I can see. The system permeates every thing.  

  

[chpettit19]

1 minute ago, Riverbrian said:

Lee still has options so I'm not convinced he's at a turning point this young in his career.

However... the problem (waving at the topic of this article). Signing Article Guy for another 4 to 6 million is going to knock someone off the 26 man.

That person just might be Lee. That's OK because we need players to come up when the need comes and the need will come but Lee will be back in that same prove it right now now role that he faced last year when that call comes.  

Miranda at 1B, Julien/Article Guy platoon at 2B, Lewis at 3B and Correa at SS.

I'd guess that Buxton DH's against lefties. While Bader plays CF against the LH. With Castro and Martin taking up the corners OF spots with Ragans on the mound. 

Against the Right Handers... Castro and Larnach will handle left field with Larnach handling the lions share of DH work back in left when Castro is filling in at other positions. Buxton in CF (Bader on Maintenance Days) with Wallner in RF. 

Full time 5: Correa, Buxton, Lewis, Miranda and Castro

Left Handed Platoon Guys: Wallner, Larnach and Julien

Right Handed Platoon Guys: Bader, Martin and Article Guy

Then the season will come... players will get injured... some players will get hurt and the Twins will desperately try to keep the integrity of the system together.  

  

I certainly don't mean turning point as in "he's completely doomed if he fails this year," but if he can't find his footing this season do we want them saving a spot for him in 2026? I've always been on the low end for what I see in Lee, but if he's going to be the star, or close to star, many people hope or expect him to be I think he very much needs to claim a spot with both hands and not let go this year. He can start in AAA and still accomplish that goal, but if he's still a question mark after this year his chances of being a fixture in the infield go way down. 

And I agree the Twins themselves may force that question mark and you know I'll huff and puff and annoy other posters with my endless rants about it. I just think this is an important year for Lee to push that 2B platoon out of the way. Even if the Twins make it harder than they need to on him.

[LambchoP]

Big NO to either of these guys. They can't hit or play a solid SS. Why is Lee all of a sudden not an option for backup to Correa? He was drafted and played short in the minors. Even Castro would do in a pinch. I'm guessing they want Lee at 2nd and Castro in the OF. I understand wanting a solid SS to backup Correa, but there's got to be better options. Eeles? Helman would have been ok short term, I can't believe they let him go for cash considerations only...

Hopefully a trade is coming for Cease or a first baseman.

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, chpettit19 said:

That's our point. You have Gunnar and Wallner backwards. One proved it in the minors and then got shut down in the majors while the other didn't prove it in the minors but was given the chance to learn in the majors. Gunnar went from a .448 to an .829 OPS against lefties. So how much better can Wallner get from his .510? I'll say about 300 points if they actually just let him learn. But instead this article suggests we have to trade one of our 2 left-handed hitters to bring in a washed up vet as a backup in fielder. You're proving our point about the nonsense of this strategy.

I am pretty confident Wallner could get to a "normal" platoon split. So could Larnach. For Wallner that means instead of the 950/600 split he showed last season he could have a 950/750 OPS split. If he needs an off day against Blake Snell, that's fine (and he can pinch-hit later). I don't see any reason to pull him from the game for a random bullpen lefty in the 5th inning.

[Riverbrian]

27 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

I certainly don't mean turning point as in "he's completely doomed if he fails this year," but if he can't find his footing this season do we want them saving a spot for him in 2026? I've always been on the low end for what I see in Lee, but if he's going to be the star, or close to star, many people hope or expect him to be I think he very much needs to claim a spot with both hands and not let go this year. He can start in AAA and still accomplish that goal, but if he's still a question mark after this year his chances of being a fixture in the infield go way down. 

And I agree the Twins themselves may force that question mark and you know I'll huff and puff and annoy other posters with my endless rants about it. I just think this is an important year for Lee to push that 2B platoon out of the way. Even if the Twins make it harder than they need to on him.

I read Keith Law for fun... I just don't read him and think to myself... Lee is a can't miss dude. I'd rather find out in real time. Julien was a can't miss guy after his amazing 2023 enough of a can't miss guy that Polanco could be split into 4 smaller pieces and Julien missed in 2024. I'm not going to predict his 2025 for Julien... Let's find out. Baseball careers are a ping pong ball. I'm not going to say that Kiersay has no chance... I can only guarantee that Kiersay has no chance when they pay a defensive specialist like Bader 6 million dollars. I can't say if Emma needs more seasoning but I can say that Emma will get more seasoning when they pay Bader 6 million dollars. I'm not even going to say that Bader or Article guy has no chance... I'll be cheering real hard for them because it's in my best interest to do so. 

However, you and I can both guarantee that the money spent on Bader and article guy will not be available to throw your hat in the ring for that guy that WAS DEVELOPED BY ANOTHER ORGANIZATION that doesn't need to be platooned and everyone needs to understand that we are not developing that guy who doesn't need to be platooned. That has been put on hold for two years running and article guy is going to make it three years. 

I believe front offices have the power to give certain players chance after chance (Kepler, Buxton, Sano) and certain players get one shot (Rooker) and some get no shot. The front office job has to be tough.. I understand the near impossibility of getting it right all the time under the constraints of the CBA timelines, the limitations of 40 man roster protection and 26 man opportunity. They have to make tough decisions based on the best information that they have.

If I can quote Paul Simons 50 ways to leave your lover.

Lee is the Key to getting yourself Free.

Article guy is the key to needing another article guy next year and not having the money again to sign that guy that was developed by another organization that doesn't need to be platooned.

You and I see this. It's hard not to see anything else when the virtues of DeJong and Urias are being discussed... because really... Quoting Metallica. Nothing Else Matters. 

 

 

[JD-TWINS]

Not sure about the 2-3 premises that were raised in the article regarding sale & payroll:

1) Team put a FLOOR of $130M in play……..”this means they need to cut salary to get to that number” - why?………Obviously, they can spend more than the FLOOR if ownership is on board …..seems that another $6M for DeJong to have a SS/3B back-up with some pop (24 HR in ‘24) and decent defensive skills is possible…….my assumption is that Lee is not ready in FO view ……..Castro could be part of trade talks?

…………a comment earlier, “where are the $$$ for a FA coming from….?” Why would a fan be concerned with this?

2) No reason to think that they may trade CC or Lopez to somehow “…look better for potential buyers”.  Seems like a negative move to attract a buyer.

Another thought is that Castro may be slated for more OF time & another depth IF is needed………doesn’t seem to make sense with the recent signing of Bader. Not trading Larnach & certainly not Wallner to be able to play Castro more in OF!

My thoughts are Eddie is on his last leg and does not exude confidence in the FO. Lee isn’t ready and there needs to be other options considered for short term. Keaschall isn’t ready until at least June/July. Lewis is still a fair injury risk. CC is still a fair injury risk. DeJong is a potential insurance policy for the first 3-4 months of the season. Urias brings no value over internal youth options.

 

[NYCTK]

23 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

…………a comment earlier, “where are the $$$ for a FA coming from….?” Why would a fan be concerned with this?

This is the funniest thing. The Twins have spent less than $10 M  on FA this offseason, and only $45 M in player investment total, 24th in baseball and last in the AL Central. Yet many fans here are working out napkin math in order to save the billionaires a few dollars on the margins. All based on vague comments about payroll.  

I can't imagine fretting this much about money in another entertainment industry. 

'Denis Villenueve cast Anya Taylor Joy for a cameo?! What does this mean for the sound department?! WB have to fire Austin Butler, they can't afford his fee now.'

[mikelink45]

So much about nothing - rumors keep the hot stove warm, but if this one is real I am sickened by it.  Reducing payroll in one thing, reducing the roster quality is even worse.

[tony&rodney]

Opening FWIW, Falvey and his idea of roster construction, talent evaluation, and offseason moves as part of a plan completely escapes me. I can't make any sense out of what he is doing. I suspect his career in baseball is tied to the outcome of the 2025 season if the Pohlads have indeed sold the team by July.

It is interesting to me that Luis Urias would be a person of interest as reported by Hayes. Urias is pretty much beyond a player signed before a season begins. Seattle ditched him because his skills are in the past. Paul DeYong still can hit the long ball against poor pitching and he is still ok as a shortstop. I'm more concerned about what this says about all of Correa, Lee, Lewis, Eeles, Martin, and Julien if the Twins brain trust feels a necessity to add one of the above. Either of these guys could be added during the season in an emergency.

The offseason is closing soon and the Twins are still looking for their big bat. A fair amount of money is tied up in Vazquez, Castro, Bader, and Paddack ($30M+). I hope these players plus Urias or DeJong if added lift the team from its expected 84-86 win window. It has been a confusing offseason and the Twins are still several trades away from where it seems they need to be.

Closing FWIW ...  once upon a time I joined TD (in its first week or month) and participated. Previously I had contributed to a friend's site for another team and wrote regular articles. I read all of the Twins sites that proliferated about 25 years ago along with others about baseball. Sickels was my favorite. I used a totally different name, email, and byline than now. For a host of reasons, I stepped away as many others have. I joined again about five plus years ago as tony&rodney. I try to be rational but am off the wall at times. The writers do a good job given the challenges of putting out content for what is now a much bigger product  and the difficulties of creating for a site about the Twins. Despite frustrations that all might have for each other, differences remain important in a world that is trying to crush exactly that. Enjoy the entertainment of baseball and the obscure community of this online conversational site. While breaks are needed from time to time, participation is necessary or the site dies.

[Connor Gould]

Assuming that our starters are 1B-Miranda, 2B-one of Julien or Lee, 3B-Lewis, and SS-Correa, that would mean that Castro is locked in as the INF5, and with Bader signed as OF4, Castro will be much more of an infielder than outfielder. All that being said, there aren't that many reps to be had for that INF6 guy which isn't good for a young guy, so it'd check out that one of Lee or Julien starts in the minors and a veteran that can play some SS holds down that last spot. Once an inevitable injury hits, Lee/Julien would get called up and jump said veteran anyways.

That being said, if they have enough money to bring in another free agent, that seems like not that worthwhile of a roster spot to invest money. Personally, I'd put that money into a 1B/DH, since there's currently a Santana/Kiriloff sized hole in the depth chart, and I'd like a free agent to keep that spot warm until E-Rod is ready to take it.

Obviously, there's also the potential that this is a SP trade thing. Castro, Julien, or Larnach could very well be part of a package for one, in which case the idea would check out but the money wouldn't.

[bean5302]

Brooks Lee doesn't have the tools to be effective as a shortstop, and he didn't hit well enough to play the position as a starter even if he did have the tools. How much of Lee's struggles were related to the back and arm issues... at age 23 is pretty unknown. What is known at this point is the Twins don't think he's a SS at the MLB level.

Willi Castro has been a very poor shortstop with mixed fielding metrics last year. He has the tools necessary to play the position, but I don't know as he'll be on the opening day roster. The Twins' plan just seems so unpredictable. It feels as if Falvey thinks they have a 36-man active roster every offseason only to be reminded it's a 26-man roster before the start of the season.

Royce Lewis is the only player on the Twins with multiple years of team control who isn't a burden on the payroll with the physical tools to play SS at the MLB level. The Twins coaches have been unable to help him address his throwing accuracy problems. Lewis was viewed as the 2023 primary SS by the organization after Correa opted out, but before Correa was brought back. Seems the Twins have written him off as a potential SS.

The Twins tried hard to make Austin Martin into a shortstop, but his arm and fielding errors made him into a defensive liability. Martin did make a major leap forward at 2B in 2023 grading out very well compared to his peers in the International League so the Twins, not wanting to promote quality defense, promptly moved him to a utility outfield position. Martin has the physical tools to succeed at 2B, but his instincts really seem poor. He's not a viable SS.

Jose Miranda and Edouard Julien are non-starters in the SS discussion.

Payton Eeles will be 25, and had an amazing storybook year, but like DaShawn Keirsey, Jr., there are reasons to doubt the sustainability of Eeles' plate production. While Eeles acquitted himself well during limited playing time at SS in St. Paul, scouting reports do not like his arm strength for the position. Then again, scouts didn't like anything in his game and he's proven to be better than the vast majority of prospects.

Will Holland is a slick fielding shortstop and utility player who looked good last year, but he broke his leg in late June. The Twins wound up transferring him to the 60 day IL after a month when it became apparent the injury wouldn't see Holland return quickly. It wound up ending his season. He was drafted in the 5th round as an older Junior (a21 season) out of Auburn in 2019, and the bat hasn't historically been there with very high K rates through AA, and he's now entering his age 27 season. His K rate dropped two consecutive years even with promotions, and it was fair at 21.4% in AAA, but it could just be a function of experience and polish. The power showed up last year in a SSS out of nowhere. He's probably viewed as the replacement for Michael Helman this year. Untrusted emergency depth, but with a hint of potential.

The top SS's in St. Paul (nothing worth noting in Wichita) last year were
Rylan Bannon 274 innings (MiLB free agent)
Michael Helman 264 innings (traded to Cardinals for cash)
Diego #2 Castillo 188.1 innings (MiLB free agent)
Payton Eeles 184.1 innings
Will Holland 170.0 innings

The Twins adding a veteran guy like a Diego Castillo or Luis Urias is possibly just a move for some high floor AAA depth IMHO. I can't see them signing a definite MLB caliber player unless they move Castro.

[mikelink45]

1 hour ago, bean5302 said:

Brooks Lee doesn't have the tools to be effective as a shortstop, and he didn't hit well enough to play the position as a starter even if he did have the tools. How much of Lee's struggles were related to the back and arm issues... at age 23 is pretty unknown. What is known at this point is the Twins don't think he's a SS at the MLB level.

Willi Castro has been a very poor shortstop with mixed fielding metrics last year. He has the tools necessary to play the position, but I don't know as he'll be on the opening day roster. The Twins' plan just seems so unpredictable. It feels as if Falvey thinks they have a 36-man active roster every offseason only to be reminded it's a 26-man roster before the start of the season.

Royce Lewis is the only player on the Twins with multiple years of team control who isn't a burden on the payroll with the physical tools to play SS at the MLB level. The Twins coaches have been unable to help him address his throwing accuracy problems. Lewis was viewed as the 2023 primary SS by the organization after Correa opted out, but before Correa was brought back. Seems the Twins have written him off as a potential SS.

The Twins tried hard to make Austin Martin into a shortstop, but his arm and fielding errors made him into a defensive liability. Martin did make a major leap forward at 2B in 2023 grading out very well compared to his peers in the International League so the Twins, not wanting to promote quality defense, promptly moved him to a utility outfield position. Martin has the physical tools to succeed at 2B, but his instincts really seem poor. He's not a viable SS.

Jose Miranda and Edouard Julien are non-starters in the SS discussion.

Payton Eeles will be 25, and had an amazing storybook year, but like DaShawn Keirsey, Jr., there are reasons to doubt the sustainability of Eeles' plate production. While Eeles acquitted himself well during limited playing time at SS in St. Paul, scouting reports do not like his arm strength for the position. Then again, scouts didn't like anything in his game and he's proven to be better than the vast majority of prospects.

Will Holland is a slick fielding shortstop and utility player who looked good last year, but he broke his leg in late June. The Twins wound up transferring him to the 60 day IL after a month when it became apparent the injury wouldn't see Holland return quickly. It wound up ending his season. He was drafted in the 5th round as an older Junior (a21 season) out of Auburn in 2019, and the bat hasn't historically been there with very high K rates through AA, and he's now entering his age 27 season. His K rate dropped two consecutive years even with promotions, and it was fair at 21.4% in AAA, but it could just be a function of experience and polish. The power showed up last year in a SSS out of nowhere. He's probably viewed as the replacement for Michael Helman this year. Untrusted emergency depth, but with a hint of potential.

The top SS's in St. Paul (nothing worth noting in Wichita) last year were
Rylan Bannon 274 innings (MiLB free agent)
Michael Helman 264 innings (traded to Cardinals for cash)
Diego #2 Castillo 188.1 innings (MiLB free agent)
Payton Eeles 184.1 innings
Will Holland 170.0 innings

The Twins adding a veteran guy like a Diego Castillo or Luis Urias is possibly just a move for some high floor AAA depth IMHO. I can't see them signing a definite MLB caliber player unless they move Castro.

Urias reminds me of Baez - ask Detroit how happy they are with him.

[bean5302]

1 hour ago, mikelink45 said:

Urias reminds me of Baez - ask Detroit how happy they are with him.

Detroit would have been over the moon if Baez would have been available at league minimum on a one year contract.

[jorgenswest]

Urias doesn’t have options. He has hit below .200 the last two seasons. He also appears to have a passable but borderline glove to play SS. He probably needs to be a better defender at SS to get a major league contract in a utility role. He probably needs to show a better bat to get a major league contract as a starting 2B or 3B.

His best option is to look for a minor league deal with a team that has infielders with an injury history in front of him. The Twins fit that description. I would rather add him on a minor league deal than a veteran back up SS in the decline phase of their career on a major league contract. No to Paul DeJong type. Yes to a minor league deal to 28 year old with some major league success 

[ddubbl1]

DeJong would be ok. At least he can hit homeruns and has experience. Sorry Lee and julienn. go back to St Paul and work on hitting and fundamentals another year.. DeJong can probably platoon with Castro at 2nd and give Carlos a day off at Short on occasion. I agree about Larnach at 1st. As long as Larnach and Wallner are driving in runs just keep em. Now that we have Bader we dont have to keep bopping Castro all over the field. 

my preferred lineup assuming we dont add any more infield: not necessarily in this order 

Castro 2B

Correa SS

Lewis 3B

Moranda 1B

Larnach DH 

Bader RF

Buxton CF

Wallner LF

Jeffers C.  

sure would look nicer if we had kept Santana!!!! Maybe Mike Ford (1 st base) makes the team?

buck. bader, wallner, correa, larnich, moranda can all DH well

Keep Austin Martin for pinch running- 

[JesusisLord7]

If you want a solid defensive SS to back up Correa why not deal with the Dodgers to get Noah Miller back. He is a 65 grade defensively and played at 2A last year. He is already better than most MLB shortstops and albeit the bat would not be great his arm grades at 60 and he runs at 50. Let's bring the kid back home. We could find something the Dodgers need if we make a minor league trade. 

[JesusisLord7]

Better defensively that is.......

[Doctor Gast]

On 2/7/2025 at 8:32 AM, Riverbrian said:

Lee still has options so I'm not convinced he's at a turning point this young in his career.

However... the problem (waving at the topic of this article). Signing Article Guy for another 4 to 6 million is going to knock someone off the 26 man.

That person just might be Lee. That's OK because we need players to come up when the need comes and the need will come but Lee will be back in that same prove it right now now role that he faced last year when that call comes.  

Miranda at 1B, Julien/Article Guy platoon at 2B, Lewis at 3B and Correa at SS.

I'd guess that Buxton DH's against lefties. While Bader plays CF against the LH. With Castro and Martin taking up the corners OF spots with Cole Ragans on the mound. 

Against the Right Handers... Castro and Larnach will handle left field with Larnach handling the lions share of DH work but still playing in left when Castro is filling in for maintenance days elsewhere at other positions. Buxton in CF (Bader on Maintenance Days) with Wallner in RF. 

Full time 5: Correa, Buxton, Lewis, Miranda and Castro

Left Handed Platoon Guys: Wallner, Larnach and Julien

Right Handed Platoon Guys: Bader, Martin and Article Guy

2 Catchers for a total of 13. 

Then the season will come... players will get injured... some players with options will struggle and need to be sent down and the Twins will desperately try to keep the integrity of the system together.  

In the meantime, We will have spent over 10 million that we don't have on Bader and Article guy, Development will be compromised again for another year and we will have to spend 10 million that we don't have next year to replace article guy because we didn't develop a pre-arb cheaper option.

When Lee was the key all along to kicking the dependence on article guy all along to freeing up that 10 million to be able to afford Pete Alonso.   

Sorry Chia Pet... I'm fixated again. It's all I can see. The system permeates every thing.  

  

I remember when Garlic was the big thing. His big RH bat to use against LHPs. I thought what a waste of a roster spot, an all-rounded OFer would have been better. But year after year, the Twins way start to seep into our psyche & we start to accept totally the idea of platooning over developing a more complete hitter. I have yielded to the platooning idea. We need people like you to keep the rest us in line. I agree with you, especially in theory but it might take some time for me to totally agree with you but keep up the good work. You might not get this text if I'm one of those you blocked.