Astros 6, Twins 4: Verlander Outpitches Ober, Twins Late Rally Falls Short in ALDS Loss

[Blyleven2011]

The good ...

Twins are in the ALDS PLAYOFFS ...

the bad ...

They lost GAME 1 ...

MORE GOOD  , they are still playing ...

Go Twins ...

[Linus]

I kind of feel like playoff experience showed in this game. Verlander didn’t panic made some pitches and then got on a roll. Twins played a bit of a nervous game with some mistakes thrown in all around. Maybe they will be more comfortable tonight. 

[JD-TWINS]

10 hours ago, glunn said:

It seemed to me that the home plate ump made some mistakes calling strikes that hurt the Twins.

Happens 162 games per year - tough/bad calls when linked to certain situations magnify their disappointment!

I agree with your statement but same thing may happen again today - gotta play better.

[Blyleven2011]

2 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

Happens 162 games per year - tough/bad calls when linked to certain situations magnify their disappointment!

I agree with your statement but same thing may happen again today - gotta play better.

Gotta play with that killer instinct  they showed in the wild card series ...

Those were the 2 best games they played all year  ...

Determination and patience ....

They didn't show that in game 1 of ALDS ...

[saviking]

20 minutes ago, Blyleven2011 said:

The good ...

Twins are in the ALDS PLAYOFFS ...

the bad ...

They lost GAME 1 ...

MORE GOOD  , they are still playing ...

Go Twins ...

Thanks for keeping it real Burt. That's the sum of it. 

I really hated to see the Stros get Verlander (The twins killer)back. Could be the difference in the series. But got to give the Twins credit for trying to fight back.

All it takes is a win today and the advantage moves to Minnesota.. 

 

[Blyleven2011]

1 minute ago, saviking said:

Thanks for keeping it real Burt. That's the sum of it. 

I really hated to see the Stros get Verlander (The twins killer)back. Could be the difference in the series. But got to give the Twins credit for trying to fight back.

All it takes is a win today and the advantage moves to Minnesota.. 

 

Yes , game 2 is a must win ...

Split the games in Houston and that's a win for the Twins with momentum  ....

[Hashim]

1 hour ago, akmanak said:

No one believed the Twins would sweep their way into the World Series. Doesn't work like that. I hate that we lost but we didn't get blown out and we didn't even have our best pitcher on the mound. 

 

Many posters mentioned that the Ober/Maeda combo was a great idea, but now are lambasting Rocco.  I liked the attempt by Rocco on this one to attempt to keep a potent lineup at bay. 

 

Let's take the next one and win this series at home. 

I liked the combo too but they didn’t bring their best when we need it. It sucks but we’re not out of it yet. Their bullpen is terrible besides Abreu and their closer. It should get easier from here but we can’t let Altuve and Alvarez beat us. 

[JD-TWINS]

Just now, Blyleven2011 said:

Gotta play with that killer instinct  they showed in the wild card series ...

Those were the 2 best games they played all year  ...

Determination and patience ....

They didn't show that in game 1 of ALDS ...

Looks like Eddie J. needs a sports psychologist……..base running issues in 3rd, lack of awareness. Then in ninth, most patient guy in the game (3-1 count) chases an up & away 95MPH fastball? Very surprising when we need baserunners in front of the two guys that already hit homers……… Maybe he just needs some coach in his ear once in a while?

[JD-TWINS]

3 minutes ago, Hashim said:

I liked the combo too but they didn’t bring their best when we need it. It sucks but we’re not out of it yet. Their bullpen is terrible besides Abreu and their closer. It should get easier from here but we can’t let Altuve and Alvarez beat us. 

Bregman, Tucker, & Brantley are ominous as well!

Getting 29 pitches out of Abreu helps a bunch for today - lighting up Neris was. if as well.

Valdez is still very good - hope the RH line-up is ready to go today. We need to get into their Pen by the 6th.

Tucker is excellent - still might pitch around Alvarez to get to Tucker……..tough combo!!

[Blyleven2011]

5 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

Looks like Eddie J. needs a sports psychologist……..base running issues in 3rd, lack of awareness. Then in ninth, most patient guy in the game (3-1 count) chases an up & away 95MPH fastball? Very surprising when we need baserunners in front of the two guys that already hit homers……… Maybe he just needs some coach in his ear once in a while?

There young and need experience  ...

Don't know why Julien thought of running with the play right in front of him , did he think that there was 2 outs ( i don't know where his head was ) ...

Can't believe  we didn't capitalize against Verlander  , we beat Toronto's gausman in wild card game 1  , our 2 best pitchers held them to 1 run in 2 games , Lopez the artist needs to be on his game and paint the pitches ...

Get the win today and momentum will turn towards the Twins  at home for games 3 and 4  ...

If the twins can Settle their nerves and play a flawless game they can win , game 1 was not flawless ...

Go Twins , the fans are behind you ...

[David Maro]

Wallner and Kirilloff look like they are in a hurry to get back to the dugout. They swing at every pitch thrown. Time to give them a seat. Can't have these bad at bats in the playoffs. Correa starts inning with a double and can only make third base on a wild pitch. I don't know what game Rocco is watching,how about a bunt a hit and run. This is baseball and you need to score runs to win. Scoring only 9 runs in 3 playoff games won't get it done.

[DJL44]

It always fascinates me how a player has a bad game and all of a sudden they aren't trying, or lack mental toughness or don't have the desire. I wish commenters could just say "I was disappointed in the outcome" instead of trying to find blame with a player who didn't succeed.

Baseball is hard and the most likely outcome of any at-bat is an out. If these guys weren't trying or didn't have the desire they wouldn't be in the big leagues. A single game is not a bellwether for a player's determination.

[ashbury]

I was disappointed in the outcome.

[Whitey333]

A few observations.  The Twins lost 6-4.  There's no rewards for losing.  A loss is a loss...it doesn't matter if they played great for 3 innings.  Blown opportunities early in the game cost us.  I had a bad feeling even after 2 innings.  You can't let a great pitcher like Verlander off the hook when you have a chance to get an early lead.  Throwing a first pitch fastball to a notoriously first ball hitter deserves a fine for whoever called that pitch.  It landed in the bleachers.  I have no problems with them starting Ober.  He's earned it.  Without his good performances throughout the year we wouldn't be in playoffs.  Boneheaded baserunning play by Julien should never happen In the bug leagues.  They teach you that base running in high school.  Maybe he was sick that day.  It was not a bad game but not a great one either.  Sunday is another day. We are deservedly underdogs anyway.  Go Twins!

BTW does anyone know why the national league teams have an extra day off in this round and thr American league doesn't? No national league games today but American league teams are playing.  Seems like it would be a big advantage for your pitching staffs.

[USAFChief]

9 minutes ago, ashbury said:

I was disappointed in the outcome.

That's because you lack mental toughness.

[Vanimal46]

It’s too bad we couldn’t get any base runners in while Verlander was on the mound. He was not sharp, and the missed opportunities early in the game cost us. 

[DJL44]

10 minutes ago, Whitey333 said:

Boneheaded baserunning play by Julien should never happen In the big leagues.  They teach you that base running in high school.  Maybe he was sick that day.

Julien went to high school in Canada. They were probably teaching something about maple syrup or polar bears that day.

[Whitey333]

The home plate umpiring has been bad all year for a lot of teams.  They should be embarrassed. Also strikeouts ARE boring.  Yes double plays are bad too.  But at least the ball was hit.  That means they have to make a play on it and could blow it.  Plus strikeouts produce nothing.  If the team averages over 10 strikeouts per game there is no way they would ground into double plays 10 times.  The old(I guess new line) of at least he didn't hit into a double play is so flawed and ironically plus makes no common.sense.  last night for example late in the game. Correa was at third with one out and Twins trailing 6-4.  Our catcher Jeffers was up.  The Astros infield was back.  They were going to give us a run for an out.  All Jeffers had to do was put the ball in play on the ground anywhere except for the pitcher and its a one run game at 6-5. But no.  Like all of our Twins do, he swung for the fences and struck out.  Totally wasting the chance to score a run by not employing a Profesional approach to hitting.  This swing for a Homer mentality is ok but you have to have situational hitting as well.  This Twins team hasn't shown much of that this season.

[JD-TWINS]

39 minutes ago, David Maro said:

Wallner and Kirilloff look like they are in a hurry to get back to the dugout. They swing at every pitch thrown. Time to give them a seat. Can't have these bad at bats in the playoffs. Correa starts inning with a double and can only make third base on a wild pitch. I don't know what game Rocco is watching,how about a bunt a hit and run. This is baseball and you need to score runs to win. Scoring only 9 runs in 3 playoff games won't get it done.

Wallner could choke up an inch or make some 2 strike adjustment……….might want to watch some tape on how pitchers have been getting you to chase all through the count! Kirilloff is just like most players ……couple collars & then a 2 hit game. He’s due! Can’t be juggling line-up after 2-3 games.

TODAY v. Valdez:

Solano at 1st - Farmer at 2B or 3rd (seems Polanco stays at 3rd for continuity?) - CC - Polanco - Vazquez (Houston familiarity) - Lewis at DH - Castro in LF - Mr. Taylor………Max in RF & lone LH bat.

With an off day tomorrow & after 2 hits Saturday, Jeffers may get his 4th straight start? My guy tells me he gets a break & enters later in the game.

[dxpavelka]

The whole "analytics say start Ober instead of Ryan" thing is cute but Ryan is the better pitcher and and the end of the day analytics don't get hitters out, pitchers do.  Playoffs are a different animal that I think Ryan is better suited for than Ober at this point.

[Aggies7]

What’s that old saying? “If you have 3 number 3 starters, you don’t have one?” Or something like that?

[ashbury]

55 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

That's because you lack mental toughness.

Posting is hard and the most likely outcome of any post is a clunker.

[joefish]

15 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

Can't do that with RISP against a great team.....

Or against a bad team. Gotta capitalize.

[jorgenswest]

2 hours ago, dxpavelka said:

The whole "analytics say start Ober instead of Ryan" thing is cute but Ryan is the better pitcher and and the end of the day analytics don't get hitters out, pitchers do.  Playoffs are a different animal that I think Ryan is better suited for than Ober at this point.

What analytics were used? 

[JD-TWINS]

27 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

What analytics were used? 

Ryan’s splits shows he sucks on the road v. at home……….he’ll be throwing Game 4, assuming we get there. Sound move IMO.

[jorgenswest]

29 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

Ryan’s splits shows he sucks on the road v. at home……….he’ll be throwing Game 4, assuming we get there. Sound move IMO.

I didn’t realize splits were analytics. I thought they were just a subset the same data that has been around forever. I thought analytic measures were things like xERA and xFIP where data was analyzed and an ERA estimate is generated. The measures have been shown to be better predictors of future ERA than actual ERA.

In this case Ryan shows up better in these measures as his ERA predictors xFIP and xERA were lower than Ober’s. If anything the Twins failed to use analytics in selecting the starter and instead chose the pitcher with the better actual statistics.

I thought the Twins made the correct choice in Ober. He had been preparing for starting this day all week. He didn’t execute his pitches well and didn’t locate the ball as well as he usually does. I hope Ryan get’s a chance in a critical game 4.

[DJL44]

5 hours ago, Whitey333 said:

last night for example late in the game. Correa was at third with one out and Twins trailing 6-4.  Our catcher Jeffers was up.  The Astros infield was back.  They were going to give us a run for an out.  All Jeffers had to do was put the ball in play on the ground anywhere except for the pitcher and its a one run game at 6-5. But no. 

He fouled one off before the swing and miss. It's really goddamned hard to hit a ball traveling at 98 MPH.

[RpR]

2 hours ago, DJL44 said:

He fouled one off before the swing and miss. It's really goddamned hard to hit a ball traveling at 98 MPH.

They are well paid to hit 98 mph pitches.

[Schmoeman5]

5 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

What analytics were used? 

You know. The ones they used. Those analytics.

[DJL44]

3 hours ago, RpR said:

They are well paid to hit 98 mph pitches.

And yet they all still suck at it. The whole damned league.