White Sox 11, Twins 8: I Guess Justin Ishbia was Right

[mbuehrer68]

There is no defense of dismantling the bullpen to get pennies on the dollar. Obviously, it was a salary dump. There's no justifying giving up every good bullpen arm for a couple potential number 4 starters, when we have plenty of those. Blowing all of these leads late makes total sense. Losing them to the White Sox just drives the point home. This is the most embarrassed I've been for a Twins team in a while, which stinks because they still have some really good players who deserve better.

[Nshore]

10 minutes ago, whosafraidofluigirussolo said:

Getting swept four games at home by the White Sox—after leading two of the four games into late innings—really feels like the low point of the year.

The one minor silver lining I can see: one of the pitchers who fueled the implosion last night is getting sent out to make room for López today.

I think Lopez is just being showcased to be traded.  Otherwise it makes no sense to bring him back in what's left of this sorry season.  The light at the end of the tunnel is a freight train.

[Doctor Gast]

59 minutes ago, CRF said:

I honestly didn't expect anything other than what we've seen since the deadline, after what Falvey did to this team. The bullpen has been abysmal. 

Even before the deadline, the way that CWS is operating (putting importance on promising young catchers; obtaining Cory Lee, especially later Quero & Teel, developing promising young SPs with other promising young players) & the way this Falvey Co.'s lackadaisical weak attempt to put together & manage a competitive team. I stated that we'd be competing with CWS for the cellar. But after the deadline it's been unbearable.

[TNtwins85]

What was Justin Ishbia right about? I’m still trying to figure it out. Was he right about buying the team based on the fact he knew his new team would sweep the Twins? Was he pitching the 9th and threw the right pitch at the right time to get the big out? Did he make a bunch of great trades at the deadline to lift the White Sox talent level to ultimately sweep the Twins? I’m wondering how he figured into the win last night.

[Doctor Gast]

Even with the line-up Baldelli put out there, they did pretty well. The problem again is the pitching, especially the BP. 

[TNtwins85]

4 minutes ago, Nshore said:

I think Lopez is just being showcased to be traded.  Otherwise it makes no sense to bring him back in what's left of this sorry season.  The light at the end of the tunnel is a freight train.

Maybe in the course of the season when you go down with an injury it’s a serious goal in the spirit of competition and proving to oneself that you are back and can still compete. Oooorrrr… all of these guys are just automatons to the GM and owners bidding in order to get them the most money in the off-season. We all know Pablo Lopez’s mentality so with that in mind I wonder which of those options is true. 

[LakesPibble]

Biggest bummer for me is we're wasting what may be Buxton's pinnacle season.

[tony&rodney]

Plenty of work for the Twins to do. The pitching staff was once decent but is now a mess. 

Nobody should have surprised that the White Sox mauled the Twins. The White Sox roster better position players at DH, C, 1B, 3B, SS, LF, and RF and they are going to improve. 

Without substantial change and good fortune, next year could be a total loss for the Twins. The Pohlads don't care and Falvey has struggled in his job. 

I'm wondering how the team plans on selling season tickets after the "Total System Failure" of the last two years and the debacle of the ongoing ownership fiasco.

[Patzky]

39 minutes ago, whosafraidofluigirussolo said:

Getting swept four games at home by the White Sox—after leading two of the four games into late innings—really feels like the low point of the year.

The one minor silver lining I can see: one of the pitchers who fueled the implosion last night is getting sent out to make room for López today.

I want to please please plead for Miller but really is there anything to separate him from Genesis or Krieske ? Ah send all three. Well play short handed (likely will anyway if Jeffers will miss 'a few' days.)

[Rigby]

36 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Falvey has struggled in his job. 

 

You are being quite generous.....

[GNess]

The Theory that Bull Pens matter little to non-contending teams is being challenged as the Twins transform into the worst team in MLB led to the bottom by an utterly dysfunctional BP.

The team looks far from a contending team. What are all these failures doing to the culture of the team especially given it's youth?

Success in Sports is in part a mindset - so is failure.

[David Maro]

Look at it this way they could still lose 100 games. And with the BP they have it is looking good.

[tony&rodney]

Just now, GNess said:

The Theory that Bull Pens matter little to non-contending teams is being challenged as the Twins transform into the worst team in MLB led to the bottom by an utterly dysfunctional BP.

The team looks far from a contending team. What are all these failures doing to the culture of the team especially given it's youth?

Success in Sports is in part a mindset - so is failure.

This why I was so opposed to the massive purge. Of course one may say we should wait several years to evaluate the trades, but it easier to build up from a 80 win team than a 60 win team. The chaos within the organization seems headed for 100 losses next year without creative changes and a couple of miracles.

[JD-TWINS]

41 minutes ago, mbuehrer68 said:

There is no defense of dismantling the bullpen to get pennies on the dollar. Obviously, it was a salary dump. There's no justifying giving up every good bullpen arm for a couple potential number 4 starters, when we have plenty of those. Blowing all of these leads late makes total sense. Losing them to the White Sox just drives the point home. This is the most embarrassed I've been for a Twins team in a while, which stinks because they still have some really good players who deserve better.

Things were going to get worse after July 31st, that was pretty obvious.

I do not like the Team looking non-competitive any more than anyone else……that said, the guys they moved from the PEN do not denote a Salary Dump. They weren’t going anywhere this year so they looked at getting better starter depth, assuming they could put together a new PEN in ‘26. Certainly remains to be seen! (Coulombe - Paddack - Dobnack) these were salary moves and they made perfect sense!

The PEN is terrible now & arguably only has 2-3 MLB level guys in the 8/9 player mix. It sucks and is tough to watch.

Today’s reality:

Coulombe is on IL …… Stewart is on IL ……. as much as I love Louie’s story/path, he has not been good in Toronto (6.91 ERA in 15 appearances)…….. Jax is 0-2 in Tampa with a 7.20 ERA (8 earned in 10 innings with 6 walks) One can argue that Varland & Jax would be better if they remained in MN - it’s supposition.

DURAN has been very good & yes, they were probably shying away from paying him $7-8M per year via arbitration.

I am hopeful for the ‘26 PEN

#7 & #8 slots (currently 2 & 3) in ‘26 are Topa & Funderburk …… #4 slot is Sands. Everyone else is new. Adams could be #8 (one inning at a time!!)?

Prielipp - Raya - Morris - Lewis - Abel/Bradley - Festa/SWR ………between these 8 guys and the 3 mentioned previously, there should be 6-7 reasonable MLB options. 2 FA signings (guys with quality upside based on track record) & the Pen is reconstructed. NEED to figure out (probably not easy) the closer role!

I don't like the losing either but it was the path forward after moving 10-11 guys in one week.

Martin looks like a probable MLB contributor - Keaschall is a solid guy every day - Lewis will be better - assuming Wallner will be better.

Fitzgerald - Gasper/Vazquez - Julien - Kiersey - Outman - Roden ………. (Clemens?) will all be freed from the 26 man roster so there are spots for Gonzalez/Rodriguez, new FA Catcher,  new FA 1B, etc.

[AKTwinsFan]

Problem is inconsistencies and sporadic lineups and pitching substitutions. I'm surprised fans haven't been chanting for the firing of Rocco once again as they were at the end of a brutal collapse last season due to the formentioned issues with his style of managing. 

[Doctor Gast]

I like Gasper as a person but he's no catcher. With his time with BOS, who was hurting a lot for catching, never once used Gasper at catcher. We have desperately needed a promising young catcher as a 3rd catcher to be mentored to be a viable catcher for next season for years but especially this year. Why have we wasted this time on Gasper, who should be gone next season? 

[Nshore]

1 hour ago, Doctor Gast said:

I like Gasper as a person but he's no catcher. With his time with BOS, who was hurting a lot for catching, never once used Gasper at catcher. We have desperately needed a promising young catcher as a 3rd catcher to be mentored to be a viable catcher for next season for years but especially this year. Why have we wasted this time on Gasper, who should be gone next season? 

Tanking. 

Tank you very much Gasper!

[DJL44]

3 hours ago, GNess said:

The Theory that Bull Pens matter little to non-contending teams is being challenged as the Twins transform into the worst team in MLB led to the bottom by an utterly dysfunctional BP.

The team looks far from a contending team. What are all these failures doing to the culture of the team especially given it's youth?

Success in Sports is in part a mindset - so is failure.

It's not all the bullpen. They also have a terrible defense and no hitting.

[rv78]

4 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

Even with the line-up Baldelli put out there, they did pretty well. The problem again is the pitching, especially the BP. 

Irony. Wasn't too long ago, hitting and scoring runs was the problem. Now when they score the pitching is the problem. I guess you can say Falvey is making progress, (albeit in the wrong direction), because instead of 1 problem now they have 2.

[Cory Engelhardt]

5 hours ago, Old Crow said:

I never saw the movie Ground hog Day.  Does it ever end?

One of the better jokes I've heard is that they should market a Groundhog's Day sequel to come to theatres, but then just release the same movie again.

I'd still laugh through it though.

Also, don't have "I got you babe" by Sonny and Cher saved as your alarm clock. You'll never get past it :)

[Larry Janisewski]

7 hours ago, insagt1 said:

Totally embarrassing series. Twins blowing leads late with a bullpen that probably couldn't get beer league hitters out. While Twins are simply mailing it in Sox are having fun winning games and trying not to lose 100.

Bright spot is Keaschall who has only failed to get a hit in 5 games and whose BA has never dipped below .300 . He's a keeper. Bit he's kinda lost in the sea of mediocrity that surrounds him. For 2nd straight year a miserable finish to a sorry season.

Just what I would expect when you pitch 3 pitchers with ERA's above 6.50 and use 5 "hitters" (and I use that term loosely) batting under .210.

[Larry Janisewski]

5 hours ago, terrydactyls said:

P	Team	W	L	PCT	GB
1	Chicago White Sox	53	88	0.376	-
2	Minnesota Twins	62	78	0.443	9.5
3	Atlanta Braves	63	77	0.450	10.5
4	Pittsburgh Pirates	64	77	0.454	11.0
5	Whatever Athletics	64	77	0.454	11.0
6	Baltimore Orioles	64	76	0.457	11.5
8	Miami Marlins	65	75	0.464	12.5
7	Los Angeles Angels	66	74	0.471	13.5
11	Cleveland Guardians	69	70	0.496	17.0
10	St. Louis Cardinals	70	71	0.496	17.0
9	Arizona Diamondbacks	70	71	0.496	17.0
13	Tampa Bay Rays	71	69	0.507	18.5
12	San Francisco Giants	71	69	0.507	18.5
14	Texas Rangers	72	69	0.511	19.0

2 weeks ago I didn't think it was possible to "catch" the White Sox. Now I am not so sure.

[old nurse]

7 hours ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

But hey, according to tankathon the Twins have a full 1 game lead for the #2 pick odds in the MLB lottery now. So there's that.

When. The Twins had options of developing relievers and position players in what amounts to fall instructional league they picked up every bad reliever they could. Erasmo and Urena were not bad enough so hey we’re DFA. Of course it is. A tank 

[Cory Engelhardt]

16 minutes ago, old nurse said:

When. The Twins had options of developing relievers and position players in what amounts to fall instructional league they picked up every bad reliever they could. Erasmo and Urena were not bad enough so hey we’re DFA. Of course it is. A tank 

I mean, if I'm being honest, I'd much rather be either really good or really bad (with young and interesting pieces that are close) instead of stuck in the middle. Absolutely nothing gained from winning anywhere from 77-83 games right? Plus, if you KNOW you aren't making the playoffs, wouldn't you rather lose games? Or do you see it differently?

[DJL44]

17 minutes ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

I mean, if I'm being honest, I'd much rather be either really good or really bad (with young and interesting pieces that are close) instead of stuck in the middle. Absolutely nothing gained from winning anywhere from 77-83 games right? Plus, if you KNOW you aren't making the playoffs, wouldn't you rather lose games? Or do you see it differently?

Not if you want hope for next season. If you want to believe they can turn it around, you don't want to see them playing like the worst team in baseball (which they have been since the ASB). 

[OvertheHill]

Good luck, FO, on next year’s marketing plan for this mess. I’ve been around since the 1960’s and I struggle to remember being more disappointed in this franchise. I’m sure there’s been lower points in their history but I’ve never been more disinclined to pay up to watch the Twins. 

[Cory Engelhardt]

18 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

Not if you want hope for next season. If you want to believe they can turn it around, you don't want to see them playing like the worst team in baseball (which they have been since the ASB). 

Do I love how they are playing right now? Of course not.

But Pablo is back now, and he is certainly better than Jose Urena no?

And Keaschall and Buxton are looking great. Jenkins too.

So for 2026, there are pieces that should be solid. I guess I have a hard time getting all that upset after a younger starter has mostly pitched ok, they’ve scored a few runs, and then lose because some reliever who won’t be here next year is bad. 

[USAFChief]

44 minutes ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

Do I love how they are playing right now? Of course not.

But Pablo is back now, and he is certainly better than Jose Urena no?

And Keaschall and Buxton are looking great. Jenkins too.

So for 2026, there are pieces that should be solid. I guess I have a hard time getting all that upset after a younger starter has mostly pitched ok, they’ve scored a few runs, and then lose because some reliever who won’t be here next year is bad. 

Which reliever(s) will be the replacements next year?

We don't know what the roster will look like next year, but if it's similar to this team, they're a solid contender for worst team in MLB. Undoubtedly bottom 5.

I truly don't understand the "we should celebrate the tanking" mindset. 

First of all, they're not tanking. They're just that bad.

Secondly. Say they get a top 2 or 3  pick next summer. Who cares? Honestly? How does that do anyone any good in the next 3 years minimum?

"Prospects" are what you sell when you're a losing organization, 

 

[purplesoldier4u]

11 hours ago, insagt1 said:

Bright spot is Keaschall who has only failed to get a hit in 5 games and whose BA has never dipped below .300 .

Let's not forget Buxton and Joe Ryan, who, along with Pablo Lopez, are the only legitimate players on this team. Keaschall is good, as is Martin, Jeffers, and (half the time) Wallner, Lee, Larnach, and Lewis. Sadly, the bullpen is Cole Sands and nobody else.

Despite Gasper's clutch hit, he's among a chosen few that belong nowhere near an MLB roster. He is actively competing for that title with Outman, Julien, Fitzgerald, Clemens, Keirsey, and the remaining bullpen members not named Sands, but especially the completely worthless Noah Davis!

[Cory Engelhardt]

3 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Which reliever(s) will be the replacements next year?

We don't know what the roster will look like next year, but if it's similar to this team, they're a solid contender for worst team in MLB. Undoubtedly bottom 5.

I truly don't understand the "we should celebrate the tanking" mindset. 

First of all, they're not tanking. They're just that bad.

Secondly. Say they get a top 2 or 3  pick next summer. Who cares? Honestly? How does that do anyone any good in the next 3 years minimum?

"Prospects" are what you sell when you're a losing organization, 

 

1) I don’t know what relievers will be on the team next year. I’m glad they are using this time to see if any of them should be.

2) I don’t at all agree that the level of player in the lineup points to bottom 5 talent level when everyone is healthy:

3) I think it’s ok to be excited about the draft. I’m sorry you are missing out. It’s a fun time.

4)I am not ok with tanking generally. But if you had a bad year, I’d rather have a bottom 5 record when being bad than I would a bottom 15 record. That might be a minority opinion.

Now, if they truly go and trade Pablo and Joe Ryan this offseason (something as of now they are saying they won’t do, and also something I don’t see happening) then maybe the season will be worse next year. I just don’t subscribe to being so pessimistic is all before something happens. They need some additions no doubt (a few relievers, a 1b and another catcher) but there are a lot of young guys in the lineup who could take the next step, to me that’s interesting if nothing else