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Posted
1 minute ago, USAFChief said:

"Fanbase irrationality?"

Look in the mirror.

Looks great.

Better than the Twins are playing.

Just because certain fans hate the style of baseball, hate the executives, hate the manager doesn't mean the rest of baseball (including the people that cover the teams) agrees with them. Find me the list of baseball professionals who think that Falvey and Baldelli are bottom 5 in baseball at their jobs. I'll wait.

Rocco still didn't deserve an extension, IMHO. He's not pulling any levers that are making a difference, hasn't done enough to show that he can turn things around (though with as bad as the players are playing, it's not clear that anyone else would either) and he's probably getting stale as a voice. Average managers get fired when their teams stop winning, and their teams usually stop winning when they're not healthy and/or the players aren't performing. 

Faley giving the extension might be a classy move to protect a loyal member of the organization, but it's a bad PR move and unlikely to be a good baseball one. It won't help him keep his job with new ownership, which this franchise badly needs. The pohlads have never been good owners: they've been mediocre at best, and only looked good in comparison to some of the awful ones out there. they've been dreadful at their worst, only saved by mostly avoiding the spotlight and hiring some generally competent baseball executives over the years.

Posted

I think I'm in the minority here based on the comments, but for all the Rocco haters - do you really think ANY manager could lead us to a title when considering:

1 - Payroll limitations/ownership

2 - Injuries

3 - The current make up of the roster.

Rocco has no input on 1 and 2, and only limited impact on #3.

I would venture to guess there are ZERO managers available that could win a championship with the above restrictions/limitations.

Is Rocco perfect - far from it, but just by changing the name on the manager office door doesn't mean they'll be any better because they'll still have the 3 above listed things keeping them from being as successful as they could be.  

Lastly, I really feel that we're simply in a holding pattern on everything - including the manager - until we see if this thing actually gets sold or not.  Hopefully a decision on that will come sooner rather than later.  Until then, on this and every other decision - we wait.

Posted

I’m not going anywhere. 
 

I’ll continue to complain where I feel its appropriate but I’m not going anywhere. 
 

Don’t care about Baldelli extended or kicked to the curb. Falvey is above him… Falvey has the authority to choose his guy. He has chosen… every game of every year. Baldelli is his choice.  
 

If it doesn’t work it’s on Falvey. That is where my eyes are focused. 

Posted

The only thing that makes sense is that Rocco has pictures of Joe and/or Derek doing something illegal. It would be stupid to do a massive sell-off of players when you can dump Derek and Rocco and be rid of the problem by cutting off the head of the snake.

Posted

For those of you thinking about ditching the Twins, it's easier than you might think.  When I left Minnesota (job opportunity), I signed up for the MLB single team option so I could watch my team.  Then MLB dropped the single team option.  I had a choice of shelling out over $400 for the privilege of getting every game in MLB or dropping the MLB package.  I said No Thanks.  So now I'm Twins-less except when on national television.  If they are on, I usually record the game to watch later.  But I've found that by the third inning, I start fast forwarding to find something interesting.  And because the Twins seldom do anything interesting, I can get through an entire game in less than 90 minutes (although I did get through last night's game in about 25 minutes.  So, in short, it ain't that hard to stop watching the Twins.

Posted

They don't care about the Fans in MN. Re-hiring Finch and now Baldelli. We were a contending team until late season managing left us out of even a wild card team. Now players don't even want to fight for him so they play like AAA ball.

Posted
11 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Just for clarification, Jim Pohlad made the acceptance of one year more of Molitor a part of hiring Falvey. After the one year, Falvey could hire his guy. Winning the World Series was not going to allow Molitor more time (that is an exaggeration which is made knowing that 2018 team had no chance especially after the selloff.). Note - the Twins did nothing worth discussing to attempt improvements (apologies to those with Logan Morrison jerseys). In fact the Twins traded away Pressly, Escobar, Lynn, and others. A similar move this year would be trading Duran, Castro, Ober, and those on expiring contracts. Molitor knew when Falvey was hired that 2018 would be his last year as manager and he was ok with that precisely because he knew his preference for athletes would clash with Falvey. The 2018 Twins won 78 games and were more interesting than the current club. Can the team win 78 games this year? Molitor managed the 2015-2018 teams. Three of these teams finished in 2nd place. The Pohlads were much more reticent to add to those teams than we have seen in the last 4 years.

Except Falvey was hired for the 2017 season and was told he had to keep the manager coming off a 59 win season (more stupidity from the ownership: you hire someone to change things in the organization, then tell them they can't pick their own manager?). After making the wild card in 2017, Molitor might have been able to keep his job long-term, but it's been reported plenty why they let him go: it wasn't the record, it was Molitor not being willing to get on board with the plan and actually interfering with it. It's notable that Molitor has not managed again in MLB and hasn't been a serious candidate anywhere either.

what exactly was interesting about the 2018 Twins? they were 6 games under .500 at this time in the season and needed to win 11 of their last 14 in September, beating up on two awful teams in Detroit and CWS that were already on the beach to get to 78 wins. The Twins finished 2nd in an incredibly weak division. (two 100-loss teams and a 98 loss team. that's putrid) It's definitely better now, even if Cleveland and KC have taken a half-step back since last year. 

The revisionist history on Molitor as a manager is weird to me.

Posted

The product they are running out on the field is broken. The last time I looked you can't sell something that is broken. If they want to receive the money they are looking for they are going to have to make changes. At this point the games are unwatchable after 3 or 4 innings. I think by the ASG the attendance will dictate what will happen with the organization.

Posted

Laughable!!!!!!!!!!!  Just like Twins baseball.  Poor pitching, poor hitting, poor defense and poor base running.  Where does it all lead back to?  Poor management.  From ownership to front office to manager.  I don't see how this is arguable.

Posted

stay the course.

believe the process.

preserve continuity.

Giving Rocco another year is accomplishing those statements from the front office. How far up the front office chain remains to be seen.

This team reminds me of the bi-lateral leg weakness year of Mauer. When your superstar isn't giving his all disfunction seems to follow.  Anyone else remember Kevin Slowey refusing to go into a game in long relief after being demoted from starting?

According to Provus, Correa spends hours before every game to get his feet prepared to play, perhaps that's why he only seems to run at 75% to first base. But, it looks like he is dogging it. 

Posted

I've started following the Reds. Following a top-tier team after the ride we've been on the last 30+ years would be too big a jolt to the system. The Reds are fun to watch, at least until the Pohlads are gone and competent ownership (hopefully) takes control.

Posted
1 hour ago, jmlease1 said:

Looks great.

Better than the Twins are playing.

Just because certain fans hate the style of baseball, hate the executives, hate the manager doesn't mean the rest of baseball (including the people that cover the teams) agrees with them. Find me the list of baseball professionals who think that Falvey and Baldelli are bottom 5 in baseball at their jobs. I'll wait.

Rocco still didn't deserve an extension, IMHO. He's not pulling any levers that are making a difference, hasn't done enough to show that he can turn things around (though with as bad as the players are playing, it's not clear that anyone else would either) and he's probably getting stale as a voice. Average managers get fired when their teams stop winning, and their teams usually stop winning when they're not healthy and/or the players aren't performing. 

Faley giving the extension might be a classy move to protect a loyal member of the organization, but it's a bad PR move and unlikely to be a good baseball one. It won't help him keep his job with new ownership, which this franchise badly needs. The pohlads have never been good owners: they've been mediocre at best, and only looked good in comparison to some of the awful ones out there. they've been dreadful at their worst, only saved by mostly avoiding the spotlight and hiring some generally competent baseball executives over the years.

I know when McPhail was in charge other teams were calling him to offer him a job in their organizations.  In the movie Moneyball Boston called Billy Bean to offer him a job.  Do you think anyone has called to offer Falvey a job?? I'm pretty sure good GM's get offered Jobs frequently.  So that's not saying he's in the bottom 5, but pretty sure no one is trying to pry him and Rocco away from the Twins.  

You are correct the Pohlads have been terrible, especially the kids.  But I don't really think Falvey has done a great job.  He's just done a job and a lot of other executives out there could have done just as well as Falvey.  So Falvey isn't terrible, but I don't believe he's been good either, had he someone would have taken him from the Twins organization.  

Posted

I had stated earlier this year that there was no evidence to believe Rocco's seat was getting hot... and unfortunately, I was right. I really wondered the past week if it might finally be time, but nay. Falvey loves Rocco and clearly thinks the product on the field is acceptable - Falvey needs to be canned ASAP, Rocco's incompetence is simply a symptom of a dysfunctional organization.

As long as the Pohlads own this team, there is going to be very little accountability for those in charge. I don't think this news changes anything related to the sale of the team, the timing probably had to do with a deadline in Rocco's contract.

Posted
1 hour ago, farmerguychris said:

I think I'm in the minority here based on the comments, but for all the Rocco haters - do you really think ANY manager could lead us to a title when considering:

1 - Payroll limitations/ownership

2 - Injuries

3 - The current make up of the roster.

I'm pretty practical, but I do think other managers would do better. Particularly managers that embrace the development of young players. I think one of the biggest issues this team has is bringing in Baldelli's preferred type of player, 'The Veteran Leader'. You probably don't need a roster made up of 22 'Veteran Leaders'. Going this route emphasizes bringing in outside players that are less talented on the field simply to put together a professional clubhouse atmosphere.

And yes, I do think this is a big failure of the coaching staff. Sure vets on the team can show the young guys where to lean and squat, but this club has had an unusual amount of high end prospects that almost universally never come close to their potential. Obviously prospects largely fail, but some clubs are way better at avoiding such high bust rates. The coaching staff needed to propel better results from many of these players but never could. And suggesting that is the role of 'Veteran Leaders' Harrison Bader and Ty France is preposterous.

Honestly, this is a lot like the end of Tom Kelly's run. He notoriously had no patience for developing young players at the end, despite his teams being largely uncompetitive. If this organization is no longer going to spend on quality free agents, it needs to once again find a Ron Gardenhire who embraces playing the cheap young players and specializing in getting the most out of them. There are definitely managers out there who are better at this and who don't automatically base decisions on seniority.

Posted

If there was ever any question about the arrogance of Falvey, this clears up any doubt. He is now running the entire operation, so he is responsible for the extension and announcement. He doesn’t have the capacity to admit mistakes, so Baldelli is safe as long as he is in charge. Joe Pohlad is apparently completely under Svengali Falvey influence and is incapable of doing anything other than what Falvey wants or says. 
Ownership should be alarmed at the lopsided losses, incompetent play, attendance, and lack of accountability. Can’t wait for new owners to flush Falvey and Baldelli. It is almost impossible to watch this team play. 

Posted
1 hour ago, farmerguychris said:

I think I'm in the minority here based on the comments, but for all the Rocco haters - do you really think ANY manager could lead us to a title when considering:

1 - Payroll limitations/ownership

2 - Injuries

3 - The current make up of the roster.

Rocco has no input on 1 and 2, and only limited impact on #3.

I would venture to guess there are ZERO managers available that could win a championship with the above restrictions/limitations.

Is Rocco perfect - far from it, but just by changing the name on the manager office door doesn't mean they'll be any better because they'll still have the 3 above listed things keeping them from being as successful as they could be.  

Lastly, I really feel that we're simply in a holding pattern on everything - including the manager - until we see if this thing actually gets sold or not.  Hopefully a decision on that will come sooner rather than later.  Until then, on this and every other decision - we wait.

I'm quite confident there are managers that would have this team above .500 over the past 162 games.

Posted
Just now, Twodogs said:

I know when McPhail was in charge other teams were calling him to offer him a job in their organizations.  In the movie Moneyball Boston called Billy Bean to offer him a job.  Do you think anyone has called to offer Falvey a job?? I'm pretty sure good GM's get offered Jobs frequently.  So that's not saying he's in the bottom 5, but pretty sure no one is trying to pry him and Rocco away from the Twins.  

You are correct the Pohlads have been terrible, especially the kids.  But I don't really think Falvey has done a great job.  He's just done a job and a lot of other executives out there could have done just as well as Falvey.  So Falvey isn't terrible, but I don't believe he's been good either, had he someone would have taken him from the Twins organization.  

It was reported in 2023 that Falvey turned down an interview request from the Red Sox to replace Chaim Bloom.  I don't know all the details, perhaps it would've been for less control or something (maybe the fact that Levine ended up getting interviewed for the position means it was for less control), but at least one other org has shown some interest in him

Posted
33 minutes ago, Twodogs said:

I know when McPhail was in charge other teams were calling him to offer him a job in their organizations.  In the movie Moneyball Boston called Billy Bean to offer him a job.  Do you think anyone has called to offer Falvey a job?? I'm pretty sure good GM's get offered Jobs frequently.  So that's not saying he's in the bottom 5, but pretty sure no one is trying to pry him and Rocco away from the Twins.  

You are correct the Pohlads have been terrible, especially the kids.  But I don't really think Falvey has done a great job.  He's just done a job and a lot of other executives out there could have done just as well as Falvey.  So Falvey isn't terrible, but I don't believe he's been good either, had he someone would have taken him from the Twins organization.  

I don't think we'll ever know (unless Falvey writes a book...that someone wants to publish, lol) if he got offers or not, but there's certainly been rumors around other organizations being interested in him. YMMV on whether that means anything. (and we definitely know Levine was a contender for the Red Sox job and was in consideration when he was here) I don't think it happens to even the supposed top guys often just because there are so few jobs open annually.

Posted
1 hour ago, Twodogs said:

I know when McPhail was in charge other teams were calling him to offer him a job in their organizations.  In the movie Moneyball Boston called Billy Bean to offer him a job.  Do you think anyone has called to offer Falvey a job?? I'm pretty sure good GM's get offered Jobs frequently.  So that's not saying he's in the bottom 5, but pretty sure no one is trying to pry him and Rocco away from the Twins.  

You are correct the Pohlads have been terrible, especially the kids.  But I don't really think Falvey has done a great job.  He's just done a job and a lot of other executives out there could have done just as well as Falvey.  So Falvey isn't terrible, but I don't believe he's been good either, had he someone would have taken him from the Twins organization.  

Boston came calling for Falvey less than 2 years ago.

Edit: sorry, should've read more comments as others have already pointed that out.

Posted
11 hours ago, Nashvilletwin said:

The only reason that comes to mind is that maybe this is some inane strategy, like in Major League, to lose so badly that the owners make their best return by moving the team to Nashville. Ricky Vaughn, straight out of the California Penal League, here we come!

Please note the italics as a substitute for sarcasm font.

In all seriousness, I switched my MLB Network TV preference to the Brewers - way more fun to watch - and reducing my commitment to being a casual MLB watcher as opposed to an every dayer.  Please don’t think of me as a traitor - I’ve watched over 140 Twins games every year for the past decade.  I’ll come back when there is regime change. In the meantime. I’ll find other more rewarding things to keep me occupied until football preseason begins - I hear knitting and basket weaving are fun hobbies. Or maybe I’ll just watch paint dry - even that is better than watching this futile team and franchise led by the Pohlads, Falvey and Rocco. Just need something more positive now that the only true reason for hope - Rocco, bless his little heart, being fired - is gone.  Watching that ineptitude and then coming to the TD for all the carping (albeit well deserved) just isn’t a good use of always and increasingly valuable time.

Best to all of you TDers - it’s been real! 

 

See you tonight on the game thread

Posted

Canceled my twins.tv subscription. I don’t mind Rocco but the timing is a slap in the face. Twins need to take themselves seriously before i start to do the same. 

Posted
7 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

I'm sorry you're leaving, Nashville. I understand where you're coming from & I don't blame you. There is only so much a fan can take. I have considered the same thing many times. We must be delusional to think that Pohlads will become smart enough to fire Falvey & Co. I might be right behind you. Twins will lose a lot fans & lose a lot of money. Pohlads are crying that they are losing too much money the way it is. It's because they have no idea how to run a baseball team! The team should have been sold already. But they are holding out for more money! They'll only lose more money the longer they hold onto their incompetence. Pohlads, be happy with your $billion plus & step aside so someone else who knows what they're doing can take over. Because you have proven that you don't have a clue.

Nashville, I hope very soon that we can come together & celebrate the Twins success after the Pohlads are gone.

😆 He's going like you were last year when they traded Polanco and Noah Miller who I'm watching right now on the MLB network.  

Posted
5 hours ago, Peter said:

Twins aren’t getting sold-Rocco/falvey are package deal! One goes so will the other. Just got to ride out storm-only 2 back of wild card. Wins will come!!!

Thank you for this inspiring post.  As Oddjob said. "Down with the negative waves".

Posted
4 hours ago, jmlease1 said:

LOL, this is where fanbase irrationality comes into play. Falvey is well-respected across the league. While he might not immediately get a new job as a GM (there simply aren't that many of them), he will be in demand from other parts of the league. The same applies to Rocco, who is not viewed by people outside this market as being the worst manager in the league. Remember, the rest of baseball sees us as being a poor market, more akin to Tampa Bay than say St. Louis.

But the team stinks right now, so expecting rationality out of the fanbase is almost certainly a bridge too far.

Also, if anyone thinks they're sending the franchise a message by quitting the team, forget it. The team is for sale, and ownership doesn't care about you. Hells bells, it's the Pohlads: they've never cared about you as a baseball fan. They don't care about the baseball (well, except for someone like Joe...who doesn't appear to actually be good at the business or PR sides of it and likely has little to no say in the baseball aspects either), they care about the asset, and they just want to claw as much money as possible out of it.

I'm guessing Falvey did it thinking the team is being sold and wanting to protect his manager a little from the inevitable "new owner change" (which while we all crave, but can create new problems; as much as we were interested in Justin Ishbia, his brother Mat's Phoenix Suns are in deep trouble from a basketball standpoint). I respect the loyalty, but it's a bad look and not helpful to the team.

I watch MLB every day. I've never heard "well respected" and Falvey ever uttered in the same sentence. They all get air time during spring training or the winter meetings. It's not like they're going to say, here's Derek Falvey. He's really bad. Rocco being a good manager hasn't been mentioned either. I could be mistaken.

Posted
3 hours ago, farmerguychris said:

I think I'm in the minority here based on the comments, but for all the Rocco haters - do you really think ANY manager could lead us to a title when considering:

1 - Payroll limitations/ownership

2 - Injuries

3 - The current make up of the roster.

Rocco has no input on 1 and 2, and only limited impact on #3.

I would venture to guess there are ZERO managers available that could win a championship with the above restrictions/limitations.

Is Rocco perfect - far from it, but just by changing the name on the manager office door doesn't mean they'll be any better because they'll still have the 3 above listed things keeping them from being as successful as they could be.  

Lastly, I really feel that we're simply in a holding pattern on everything - including the manager - until we see if this thing actually gets sold or not.  Hopefully a decision on that will come sooner rather than later.  Until then, on this and every other decision - we wait.

Managers could have their players more focused on fundamentals, execution, and giving max effort. Those are things lacking. That's definitely on the manager. Sure he plays no part in 1 2 or 3. But there are NO repercussions for piss poor play or lack of hustle. If fans saw max effort there would be less blowback. Instead it's just the same old song. When was the last time you saw a hit and run? Twins have some speed. Bader Buxton and Castro. How about a bunt in situations late in a game or extra innings when they're playing for 1 run. Those are just a few in game situations that he does control. Unless you're saying, what does he have to work with. He has a top 5 SS and CF. to start with. He's not working with a talent short roster. Unless you think everybody else is just bad. 

Posted

We need to get rid of Falvey and Rocco and bring in a manager with some leadership qualities and holds players accountable. How many games can we embarass ourselves at home and have Bride finish the game

Posted

I stopped being a Rocco fan for 1 very particular reason.
The 2019 ALDS and the complete mismanagement of the bullpen, in my opinion. Duffy, Rogers, Romo and May should have been the main arms. I forget what Rocco said afterwards, but there's no excuse to not use your top arms in a game deciding moment.

Also, forever shame on Ervin Santana for not removing himself from the 2017 wildcard game. Twins had the momentum and then he "had nothing".

 

Posted
1 hour ago, chpettit19 said:

Boston came calling for Falvey less than 2 years ago.

Edit: sorry, should've read more comments as others have already pointed that out.

Boston "came calling" for Thad Levine too, which apparently is all the evidence anyone needs that he's good at his job.  Where did that in-demand, "respected around the league" guy end up again? 

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