Edouard Julien v. Brooks Lee: Whom Should the Twins Trade?

[nicksaviking]

4 minutes ago, Fatbat said:

None of those corner OF’s was a #8 draft pick with the ceiling that Lee has. All that really was, was a FO continually drafting the same player type and not knowing how to build a championship team.  

Cuddyer, Kubel and Restovich were all top 30 prospects.

I won't disagree that the Twins didn't know how to build a championship team back then, but that's mostly because they traded the less valuable guys, like Kielty, Buchanon and and Lawton (who'd be the Polanco comp here) instead of trading the more revered prospects for pitching. We were begging for them to trade for the top arms like Halliday, Sabathia  and Lee but they never did. Losing Cuddyer would have hurt, but if this team uses one of those guys to get Curt Schilling in 2004 instead of the Red Sox, maybe we'd have had a World Series trophy.

Also, keeping them all not only meant wasting the equity, but it was pretty crappy to the players too. Of those three names listed above, one sticks out for being a bust, but that possibly had nothing to do with him as a player. In the very spotty opportunities he got with the Twins, Michael Restovich had a MLB OPS of .807. The Twins didn't set him free until he was 26 and out of options. He's now a middle-age man who certainly looks back and wonders what could have been had he been given an actual chance. 

[RpR]

4 minutes ago, MGX said:

Julien 2023 0 OAA at 2b, including +5 OAA over the last 3 months of the season

Polanco 2021 -2 OAA at 2b, 2022 -9 OAA at 2b & 2023 -5 OAA at 2b.

I'm not sure why you think Polanco is the better defensive 2b.

His performance last  year made it obvious.

You are comparing 3 months to 4 years, my oh my.

[Riverbrian]

10 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Cuddyer was moved to the outfield because Koskie and Casey Blake were blocking him and he wasn't good at 2nd, He played almost exclusively in the OF in 2003 at both the MLB level and AAA. Then Lew Ford took the job and ran with it in 2004 and the team traded for Shannon Stewart mid season so they pushed Cuddyer back to infield momentarily only BECAUSE the outfield depth was so strong.

But Allen and Mohr were absolutely legit considerations. Both were killing it in the minors, Mohr had a .961 OPS before he was called up. They weren't hitting the top prospects lists, but they earned their call ups over the higher valued prospects, who were at the same levels in the minors. They were certainly the Yunior Severinos and Anthony Pratos of that group.

Severino and Prato are not logs yet. They are safely stashed in our minor league system... when they get the call and perform at the major league level and become players who must play or the team is weaker... they can be a log. If Severino and Prato become logs and cause a log jam because we got a 26 man roster over flowing with talent... that's great news for us because we want a log jam. 

If Severino and Prato are logs... We got log jams all over the place including the starting rotation. 

Casey Blake had 68 AB's for the Twins... He shouldn't be blocking anyone. Cuddyer got OF work because the log jam of Jones, Hunter, Mohr, Keilty, Buchanan, Restovich and Ryan were either not playing well enough or not healthy enough to actually play. 

Dustin Mohr had .782 AB's with the Twins before he was traded to the Giants for a player to be named later. Chad Allen had 773 AB's before he was released after an injury. Neither player produced over 100 OPS+ during their time with the Twins. I'm all for them getting the opportunity to be something but they never became something. 

Bobby Kielty was in such a log jam that he had to be traded for another log in Shannon Stewart. 

 

[chpettit19]

2 hours ago, Fatbat said:

I agree with your 4 not getting it done. I don’t think anything will be done before 4/1. I have an idea that Lee is on the MLB roster early enough that the twins get a comp pick for his fast track to MLB. That pick is tradable and it can/will be included in a trade before the allstar break.  An established vet will also be part if the trade along with a Headrick/SWR type pitcher or two.  The timeframe also corresponds to more clarity of the  media deal/revenue issue. 

I'm confused by your timeline here. The Twins can't get an extra pick this year from Lee no matter how early they call him up. If he's up early enough and wins ROY this year he would get one for them next year, or if he finishes top 3 in the MVP voting before he's arb eligible (2 or 3 years) he could earn them a pick as well. But there's no pick he can earn that could be traded before the all star break this year.

[nicksaviking]

2 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

Severino and Prato are not logs yet. They are safely stashed in our minor league system... when they get the call and perform at the major league level and become players who must play or the team is weaker... they can be a log. If Severino and Prato become logs and cause a log jam because we got a 26 man roster over flowing with talent... that's great news for us because we want a log jam. 

If Severino and Prato are logs... We got log jams all over the place including the starting rotation. 

Casey Blake had 68 AB's for the Twins... He shouldn't be blocking anyone. Cuddyer got OF work because the log jam of Jones, Hunter, Mohr, Keilty, Buchanan, Restovich and Ryan were either not playing well enough or not healthy enough to actually play. 

Dustin Mohr had .782 AB's with the Twins before he was traded to the Giants for a player to be named later. Chad Allen had 773 AB's before he was released after an injury. Neither player produced over 100 OPS+ during their time with the Twins. I'm all for them getting the opportunity to be something but they never became something. 

Bobby Kielty was in such a log jam that he had to be traded for another log in Shannon Stewart. 

 

I don't think you're recalling that era well. All of those guys were crushing it in AAA and most had years where they were more than capable MLB players.

But that's hardly the point, aside from his unwillingness to even consider using math to form a roster, Terry Ryan's biggest sin was never using his prospects to trade for the pitching needed to win a World Series. Same boat now, different prospects. Go get a top of the rotation pitcher.

[stringer bell]

Regarding platoons--I get that managers want to get players in situations where they have the best chance to succeed. Kyle Farmer is a guy who has always hit left handed pitching better than right, so if he's in the lineup for 60-70 games, most of them should be against left handers. However (and this is @Riverbrian's point), pulling a superior hitter because a southpaw is coming in ultimately does more damage than good IMHO. 

The Twins figure to have four left handed hitting guys in the lineup regularly (Kepler, Wallner, Julien and Kirilloff) and will have Farmer as a guy who should be playing against left handers (perhaps adding Miranda or somebody like Donnie Barrels). Starting two of the four lefty hitters and resting two makes sense to me. That would give each of the lefty hitters somewhere between 20 and 30 starts vs lefties and wouldn't be a strict platoon for any of them. Kepler was decent vs. lefties last year, Wallner, Julien and Kirilloff were not. Neither was Willi Castro BTW. Farmer, Castro and Miranda (Solano etc.) have enough versatility that any of the four guys could be rested with a decent defensive option replacing them. 

[Cody Pirkl]

1 hour ago, Brett said:

Hey Cody, I think you hit a nerve here. 65 comments in just 4 hours!

Not germane to the topic, but does TD have some analytics going on the writers? Whose writing gets the most clicks? Who draws the most commentary?

I look forward to some day looking at the TD feed and having a writer’s stats at the top, headlined by CAR (Comments Above Replacement writer).

People have a lot of opinions on this one I guess! I remember an article of mine from way back in the day regarding the likelihood of the Twins non-tendering Eddie Rosario the following offseason that really blew up. Sometimes you get to writing about a topic and more people have strong thoughts on it than expected. It's fun to see people so involved with such little news to react to to be honest.

The views on articles and where those views come from i.e. Facebook, Twitter, Google etc. are tracked privately. Not sure if there's a grand total on the amount of comments individual writers draw in! 

[JD-TWINS]

3 hours ago, jmlease1 said:

What "blah attitude"? He's been perfectly fine, seems like a good due, and dealt with Farmer ragging him all season without losing it and instead just improved in the field. This reminds me of the days when people thought Torii Hunter was better than Joe Mauer because Hunter was "fiery".

I say no to trading either of them; there's no roster issue that says we really need to move one of them right now. I think Polanco is going to get moved, which means there's even less of a roster issue. Julien destroys righties, gets on base a ton and this season I expect him to get unleashed more on the bases. (we'll see if he does better against lefties/gets more run against them) Lee is going to fight his way on to the team sooner rather than later, and that's also just fine. There's plenty of PT at 1B, 2B, 3B and DH for this team to fit Lewis, Julien, Lee, and Kirilloff in (along with maybe Miranda) for the next few seasons while they're all still pretty cheap. Make the decisions when their arbitration numbers start to jump and the team control is running lower.

Not to say they are untouchable; if you get a deal for starting pitching for multiple years it might be worth it. But don't dangle them for anything less than star returns and certainly not for any rentals.

It says “blah defense”………..”attitude” was a separate comment. I don’t hate the guy but he appears cocky to me. Light on the hustle to first on ground balls - striking out looking and appearing (as many guys) that there was no way it was a strike……….attitude aside, I too had the Central Theme of, we shouldn’t trade either guy.

Good OBP - good pop - good offensive value……those were my comments on Julien.

“Farmer ragging him all season….” know nothing & have heard nothing about this…..,,many rookies have to put up with B.S., particularly if you can’t field your position.

 

[Cody Pirkl]

1 minute ago, stringer bell said:

Regarding platoons--I get that managers want to get players in situations where they have the best chance to succeed. Kyle Farmer is a guy who has always hit left handed pitching better than right, so if he's in the lineup for 60-70 games, most of them should be against left handers. However (and this is @Riverbrian's point), pulling a superior hitter because a southpaw is coming in ultimately does more damage than good IMHO. 

The Twins figure to have four left handed hitting guys in the lineup regularly (Kepler, Wallner, Julien and Kirilloff) and will have Farmer as a guy who should be playing against left handers (perhaps adding Miranda or somebody like Donnie Barrels). Starting two of the four lefty hitters and resting two makes sense to me. That would give each of the lefty hitters somewhere between 20 and 30 starts vs lefties and wouldn't be a strict platoon for any of them. Kepler was decent vs. lefties last year, Wallner, Julien and Kirilloff were not. Neither was Willi Castro BTW. Farmer, Castro and Miranda (Solano etc.) have enough versatility that any of the four guys could be rested with a decent defensive option replacing them. 

I agree with the point that these good young hitters should get a chance to sink or swim against same handed pitching certainly. I think it needs to be looked at with a bit of nuance and on a case by case basis when it comes to pinch hitting. I think at times the Twins got carried away with their platooning when they were pulling players in the 2nd or 3rd inning to get that platoon matchup, only to not have an option to adjust back in the later innings when another pitching change was made.

The opposite side of this argument is that there will be times in the late innings where everyone would agree that Kyle Farmer should pinch hit for Julien against Aroldis Chapman for example. There's plenty of space in between these two scenarios to get these guys at least some exposure which I believe is your point. 

I also think it's worth noting that the Twins may be more open to letting a lefty or two stay in the lineup against a southpaw if guys like Buxton and Correa are taking care of business. There were times last season where the lineup needed every percentage point of an advantage that they could possibly get

[sweetmusicviola16]

13 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

I'm confused by your timeline here. The Twins can't get an extra pick this year from Lee no matter how early they call him up. If he's up early enough and wins ROY this year he would get one for them next year, or if he finishes top 3 in the MVP voting before he's arb eligible (2 or 3 years) he could earn them a pick as well. But there's no pick he can earn that could be traded before the all star break this year.

Hey, thanks for posting this. I wasn't even aware that a players good performance could earn the team rewards.

[Cody Pirkl]

5 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

It says “blah defense”………..”attitude” was a separate comment. I don’t hate the guy but he appears cocky to me. Light on the hustle to first on ground balls - striking out looking and appearing (as many guys) that there was no way it was a strike……….attitude aside, I too had the Central Theme of, we shouldn’t trade either guy.

Good OBP - good pop - good offensive value……those were my comments on Julien.

“Farmer ragging him all season….” know nothing & have heard nothing about this…..,,many rookies have to put up with B.S., particularly if you can’t field your position.

 

FWIW I believe Aaron Gleeman mentioned the Twins told Julien not to run out grounders with full effort at the end of the year. He had a pretty noticeable hamstring problem for the last two months or so.

[Major League Ready]

15 minutes ago, RpR said:

His performance last  year made it obvious.

You are comparing 3 months to 4 years, my oh my.

That's pretty simple.  Julien was a rookie with a weakness that he worked on.  His defense was bad but it was very obvious he got a lot better.  The eye test showed it and this was consistent with Statcast.  The way to measure Julien's defensive ability is where he ended up not where he started.  For some reason you insist on ignoring his improvement?  

[Lasorda_This_Out]

Trade neither..

[JD-TWINS]

1 hour ago, RpR said:

aI would like to find one of the crystal balls so many here seem to be gazing through.

Julien has shown he has large gaps, in his performance; he is below average  at Second on his best day., and some here think if he keeps batting agaist pitchers that already own him, he will magically get better, good grief.

Polance in 4 seasons at Second is average, not below.

Lee is an unknown rookie; could come up and not be below average in any manner, or could be another De La Cruz: come up and looking like the next Joe Mauer , and then quickly fall down to Celestino level.

IF, if they would trade both it would be foolish to do so for any pitcher not at leaat at Gray's level, but that will never happen.

Polanco played 80 games in ‘23…….guessing here but am thinking 5-10 at DH & 10 at 3B - close? 60 starts below average at 2B blended with 3 previous years of defense at 2B can get the whole to be average. Physically, he’s creeping up on being washed.

[nicksaviking]

13 minutes ago, Cody Pirkl said:

The opposite side of this argument is that there will be times in the late innings where everyone would agree that Kyle Farmer should pinch hit for Julien against Aroldis Chapman for example. There's plenty of space in between these two scenarios to get these guys at least some exposure which I believe is your point. 

This will miss the point by drilling down a bit too deep, but I'd rather see Julien and his superior on base skills against a lefty with a history of terrible control. In the minors, even while his other numbers were down against lefties, his walk rate wasn't.

So I can understand about wanting to pinch hit for him against a lefty late in a game, but not always, and probably not usually. Even if he's not getting clutch hits, he should still be getting him on base better than most hitters.

[awmonahan]

If you can't spend on salaries, which the Twins apparently cannot, you keep both. If you can get a good, young pitcher built around a package for one, you consider it. If you have to trade one, you trade Lee because Julien is too good of a hitter. Well-rounded players are great, and my preference typically, but you can hide Julien's bat at second and with the way the game is currently played, it won't kill you.

Every year, I look at Philly and their softball style team and think they have no chance, but they have top level starters, bats and a reasonable bullpen, and do well in the playoffs. I hate the plan, but it works. 

[chpettit19]

33 minutes ago, sweetmusicviola16 said:

Hey, thanks for posting this. I wasn't even aware that a players good performance could earn the team rewards.

Just an FYI on the rule: Prospects have to be on at least 2 of the 3 Top 100 Prospects lists chosen in the CBA (Baseball America, ESPN, and MLB.com) and be called up early enough to receive a full year of service time (172 days) to be eligible. Basically has to be a top prospect and be called up within the first 2 weeks of the season to be eligible. The team can then earn up to 1 draft pick if the player wins ROY or is in the top 3 for Cy Young or MVP before they're arbitration eligible to get a pick after the first round.

[tony&rodney]

36 minutes ago, Cody Pirkl said:

FWIW I believe Aaron Gleeman mentioned the Twins told Julien not to run out grounders with full effort at the end of the year. He had a pretty noticeable hamstring problem for the last two months or so.

This is true. It was also mentioned numerous times on radio and a few times on TV.

Cody, I'm a little surprised you chose to write a Julien or Lee article. Lee plays exclusively on one side of the diamond and Julien plays on the other. It seems a little premature to think Lee adjusts so easily to second base. FWIW, I do think he would be fine there. Seems that all three of Lewis, Julien, and Lee belong. One has no MLB experience and the other two have barely gotten their feet wet. While I may want the Twins to keep all three, the point of any trade is to return value. As such, the angle may be who draws the most serious interest from another team and returns the the guy who the Twins are looking for to strengthen their team. Again, not really suggesting any of these players should be traded but surprised by the omission. 

[Cody Pirkl]

27 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

This will miss the point by drilling down a bit too deep, but I'd rather see Julien and his superior on base skills against a lefty with a history of terrible control. In the minors, even while his other numbers were down against lefties, his walk rate wasn't.

So I can understand about wanting to pinch hit for him against a lefty late in a game, but not always, and probably not usually. Even if he's not getting clutch hits, he should still be getting him on base better than most hitters.

It's a fine line, because Kyle Farmer's role in the MLB at this point relies heavily on hitting LHP, and he did so to the tune of an almost .900 OPS last season. It's going to be extremely hard not to use him in those spots in high leverage if he's on your bench.

[Riverbrian]

1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

I don't think you're recalling that era well. All of those guys were crushing it in AAA and most had years where they were more than capable MLB players.

But that's hardly the point, aside from his unwillingness to even consider using math to form a roster, Terry Ryan's biggest sin was never using his prospects to trade for the pitching needed to win a World Series. Same boat now, different prospects. Go get a top of the rotation pitcher.

I'll admit that I don't recall much from 20 years ago. I was in my thirties and groggy from hauling my kids around to hockey practice. 

But... I'll stop short with Capable. "More than Capable"... is probably worth a discussion on a different thread. 

On Terry Ryan's biggest sin... I agree every day of the week. And I'll competitively extend to you that not only did we not get anything for his prospects in trades... we didn't get anything for the prospects that put a major league uniform on either... you know... guys like Mohr or Allen. (Insert Emoji that sticks tongue out at you)

[Cody Pirkl]

7 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

This is true. It was also mentioned numerous times on radio and a few times on TV.

Cody, I'm a little surprised you chose to write a Julien or Lee article. Lee plays exclusively on one side of the diamond and Julien plays on the other. It seems a little premature to think Lee adjusts so easily to second base. FWIW, I do think he would be fine there. Seems that all three of Lewis, Julien, and Lee belong. One has no MLB experience and the other two have barely gotten their feet wet. While I may want the Twins to keep all three, the point of any trade is to return value. As such, the angle may be who draws the most serious interest from another team and returns the the guy who the Twins are looking for to strengthen their team. Again, not really suggesting any of these players should be traded but surprised by the omission. 

I think the general (public) consensus is that while Lee is playing exclusively SS in the minors, that's not where he'll wind up. Maybe the Twins think differently behind closed doors, but they did the same with Austin Martin all the way through the minors despite there never really being a chance for him to actually play there full time in his MLB career. 

I've seen Lee play SS in person a few times and personally I do think he could play a passable shortstop if they wanted him to. I don't think he'd be a plus defender there, though, and I think with Correa around he's left with either 3B or 2B. Add in Royce and I think he's left with 2B. Twins plans for him may change this conversation entirely, but just in my opinion, I could see Lee's offensive profile and defense being the best possible fit as a second baseman in the long run.

[tony&rodney]

1 minute ago, Cody Pirkl said:

I think the general (public) consensus is that while Lee is playing exclusively SS in the minors, that's not where he'll wind up. Maybe the Twins think differently behind closed doors, but they did the same with Austin Martin all the way through the minors despite there never really being a chance for him to actually play there full time in his MLB career. 

I've seen Lee play SS in person a few times and personally I do think he could play a passable shortstop if they wanted him to. I don't think he'd be a plus defender there, though, and I think with Correa around he's left with either 3B or 2B. Add in Royce and I think he's left with 2B. Twins plans for him may change this conversation entirely, but just in my opinion, I could see Lee's offensive profile and defense being the best possible fit as a second baseman in the long run.

Yes, Lee does play a fair shortstop but nearly every scout has suggested that his best position would be third base where he could compete with others for a gold glove. Lewis does not project in the same way. 

I was more curious why you omitted any discussion about trading Lewis in a post that wondered whether to consider trading Julien or Lee?

As an aside from my query if Lee comes up and Kirilloff and Miranda are not proving themselves at first base, Lewis would probably be a fine first baseman and his bat plays anywhere. I do think Lewis stays on the dirt, much to the chagrin of those who want him switched into the outfield.

[Dman]

Given that Chicago is asking for two top tier prospects plus guys in the 10 to 20 range for two years of Cease it seems like it is going to take more than just Lee or Jullien to get a deal done for a difference making arm with years of control.  Maybe in the End Chicago can't get that kind of value but that is what they are looking for to move him.

It probably takes Lee, Rodriguez and Festa to get a deal done for Luzardo.  Maybe even that won't be seen as enough hard to say.  IMO it is harder for small market teams to part with high end prospects as they need those types of players to compete long term.  

While I get the Twins window is open to a degree I guess I still don't trust they have an elite offense with so many questions marks yet in Lewis, Jullien, Kirilloff, Miranda, Wallner, even Kepler, Correa and Buxton are all question marks.  I just don't feel like this is the time to sell the farm for a top of the rotation arm that might give out at any time.

Maybe I am wrong.  Maybe the Twins can find a deal that doesn't move a fair bit of top end talent and or maybe they can survive just fine moving their top end guys.  It just seems unlikely to me given what I have been reading.  I think they will do something to address the rotation but I think it will fall short of what we hope.

[Rosterman]

Julien is a hard worker and if he can't stick at second, should become the Twins first baseman. Of course, Kepler was once a very had worker, too.

And speaking of Kepler and Polanco, both of whom are tradable...I'm not seeing the demand. More of a wait-and-see, which is only valuable to a team if they have a spring training injury ofr a mid-season need. Sadly the Twins have made it known that they would like to shred salary. That HURT the trading edge they sought.

Lee is being pushed, but I expect a full season at AAA, unless Correa is out for much of the year. The Twins will cycle in a Heilman or Prato and move internal pieces around, if they can. Get a good look at Martin. See if Kirilloff is a keeper for three more seasons or what. Buxton and Correa have, in some ways, complicated the Twins in both potential prospects getting playing time today and tomorrow, as well as strapped the team financially.

But a year from now the Twins will know more about Lee and Severino in the minors, Miranda and Kirilloff and others, who will play the outfield, is it worthwhile to shift Correa to third, and how will Buxton handicap the team going forward. Yes, Lee or Julien in a package for a rotation arm might entice a trade with The Braves or Mariners or some other team, but right now I would rather see both on the roster today and beyond and jettison Kepler and Polanco and a few mid-level blocked prospects at these positions, if possible.

 

[Major League Ready]

20 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Yes, Lee does play a fair shortstop but nearly every scout has suggested that his best position would be third base where he could compete with others for a gold glove. Lewis does not project in the same way. 

I was more curious why you omitted any discussion about trading Lewis in a post that wondered whether to consider trading Julien or Lee?

As an aside from my query if Lee comes up and Kirilloff and Miranda are not proving themselves at first base, Lewis would probably be a fine first baseman and his bat plays anywhere. I do think Lewis stays on the dirt, much to the chagrin of those who want him switched into the outfield.

It seems to be a reasonable omission because Lewis is the star people come to see.  He has all the intangibles.  Fans love this guy for good reason.  It just seems very unlikely they would trade him.  Plus, who's to say Lewis does not move to 2B.  Perhaps his athleticism would be even more valuable at 2B.  Who knows, the OF still could be a possibility as well.  Also, if Lee can play SS, he can definitely play 2B.

I think it's all moot because they are trading any of these guys this year.  Circumstances can and likely will change by next year but for now neither guy is going anywhere unless it's for a very good cost controller SP and the odds of that are low.  

[stringer bell]

1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

That's pretty simple.  Julien was a rookie with a weakness that he worked on.  His defense was bad but it was very obvious he got a lot better.  The eye test showed it and this was consistent with Statcast.  The way to measure Julien's defensive ability is where he ended up not where he started.  For some reason you insist on ignoring his improvement?  

Yes, it seemed that Julien had a lingering leg problem for most of the second half of the season. That he was able to continue to play was a win, I think. I would hope that he could show more speed and be more of an asset on the bases in 2024.

[Cody Pirkl]

25 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Yes, Lee does play a fair shortstop but nearly every scout has suggested that his best position would be third base where he could compete with others for a gold glove. Lewis does not project in the same way. 

I was more curious why you omitted any discussion about trading Lewis in a post that wondered whether to consider trading Julien or Lee?

As an aside from my query if Lee comes up and Kirilloff and Miranda are not proving themselves at first base, Lewis would probably be a fine first baseman and his bat plays anywhere. I do think Lewis stays on the dirt, much to the chagrin of those who want him switched into the outfield.

Personally I don't see a scenario where Lewis is traded, and I think he's a tier up from Julien and Lee in terms of how the organization views them. Even for a front office that's willing to trade anyone whether they're a fan favorite, home grown talent, etc., I think there's an attachment there that will make it difficult. He was the first draft pick they ever made after taking over the job, and after a winding road to the MLB which led to him basically carrying the team to their first playoff win in almost 20 years last season, I just can't see it. I'm sure there's a price, but I don't see anyone meeting it.

I think Lewis is too athletic to move him down the defensive spectrum to 1B. I think it's likelier that they'd move him to 2B if they're that intent on Lee playing 3B, but I suspect they won't mess with a good thing. Also of note, Lee's offense will probably profile better at 2B. 

[specialiststeve]

5 hours ago, Major League Ready said:

Suarez produced 7.3 fWAR over the past two years.  Polanco produced 3.3.  Granted, Suarez played 312 games but availability does provide value.  Suarez has also produced 3.9 fWAR or more in 4 seasons.  Polanco has one such season.  I think it's a reasonable comp.  

Sorry, Old school guy here and fWAR or effen'War means very little to me or to the eye. Suarez hits for power and is a pretty good glove but everything else is crap... Polanco when healthy does everything fairly well. Hit, hit for power, good glove. So as I would tell Rocco... lose the Metrics and actually look at the game and how it is played. 

Old crotchety dude.. ;) 

[Mike Sixel]

51 minutes ago, Rosterman said:

Julien is a hard worker and if he can't stick at second, should become the Twins first baseman. Of course, Kepler was once a very had worker, too.

And speaking of Kepler and Polanco, both of whom are tradable...I'm not seeing the demand. More of a wait-and-see, which is only valuable to a team if they have a spring training injury ofr a mid-season need. Sadly the Twins have made it known that they would like to shred salary. That HURT the trading edge they sought.

Lee is being pushed, but I expect a full season at AAA, unless Correa is out for much of the year. The Twins will cycle in a Heilman or Prato and move internal pieces around, if they can. Get a good look at Martin. See if Kirilloff is a keeper for three more seasons or what. Buxton and Correa have, in some ways, complicated the Twins in both potential prospects getting playing time today and tomorrow, as well as strapped the team financially.

But a year from now the Twins will know more about Lee and Severino in the minors, Miranda and Kirilloff and others, who will play the outfield, is it worthwhile to shift Correa to third, and how will Buxton handicap the team going forward. Yes, Lee or Julien in a package for a rotation arm might entice a trade with The Braves or Mariners or some other team, but right now I would rather see both on the roster today and beyond and jettison Kepler and Polanco and a few mid-level blocked prospects at these positions, if possible.

 

I don't think saying "we need to cut payroll" effects the return in trades at all. GMs and owners know what's what.....

[gman]

I don't trade either player. If the Twins propose to make consistent playoff appearances they need 12 or 13 players available. As we saw the first half of last year, they didn't have the team hitting to run away from a bad division. Keep the young talent and work them into starting roles, which doesn't mean 160 games a year roles anymore. Without a great amount of luck, the Twins are more than a #3 starting pitcher away from the World Series. Be patient and build a TEAM.