Twins (Ober) vs Royals (Marsh): 9/7/24, 6:15pm

[cheeseheadgophfan]

32 minutes ago, cheeseheadgophfan said:

This is freaking insane....is he really pulling Ober with 80 pitches.  The Royals have literally not hit a ball hard this whole game!!!!!

Is he really bringing in Duran in. the 8th???  Has Rocco not learned his lesson?  For a guy that claims to look at analytics, does he not notice his ERA is like 5 in non-save situations?  

I'm speechless. 

Yeah....I"m replying to my own post.....because it was posted before the inning started???

Where are "thumbs down" brothers now?  Talking about Sixel and CCHOF5yearstoolate???

 

[Aggies7]

Jax gets a blown save for this game. Coincidentally

[Montdak]

How many pitches did Ober have?  He was way low number and I’m sure ended that way.  Seems like the 10th time we’ve had a starter mowing them down with no real reason for removal.  But Rocco takes them out like he needs to be the hero with the big move and then the new guy blows it. Once we got the no 1-2-3 inning ever Duran out Jax almost saved it but it took bad luck and decision making by Brooks Lee.  Hopefully he will start playing with his head in the sunshine at some point.

[TwinsCD]

1 minute ago, nicksaviking said:

Ken Rosenthal is the world's greatest reporter if he's getting a scoop from Baldelli mid inning.

That's his take, could be true, but no chance that was a sourced idea.

 

You're right.  Rosenthal's wording was 'I remembered that last year Duran gave up a 9th inning walkoff grand slam to Witt' and (paraphrasing now) maybe the Twins didn't want to put him in that situation again in the 9th so they switched roles.

[nicksaviking]

**************Moderator Note******************

Awful loss, everyone's pissed off, but stop demeaning and trashing other posters. And blame who you want in the organization but do it without the name calling.

[ChermesZ]

1 minute ago, Danchat said:

How do we know that the other 29 managers don't make this mistake, though? Last I've seen Rocco pulls his starters at an average rate and plenty of other fanbases also think their managers are horrible, unless you've been watching all of the other teams how do you know? 

And even if Ober gets through the 8th without giving up any runs (which isn't a sure thing), how do we know Jax doesn't blow the game in the 9th like he blew it in the 8th?

Look, I don't like Rocco either and I am on board with him getting fired. But the assumptions about how the game would go aren't as sure of things as people seem to think they are. And any manager in MLB is screwed when their top two relievers give up a combined 7 baserunners in one inning. And the next Twins manager may as well make this same mistake - who's to say this regime even thinks that was a bad call?

I think all that anger towards Rocco is frustration talking.

 

this team is extremely frustrating.

 

Everything about the twins this year have been frustrating….and I fear it’s not over yet.

[LewFordLives]

Rocco will get most of the blame for this one, and he should definitely get a big share, but there's plenty of blame to go around. The bullpen choked.... again, and the lineup decided to take another night off. Five hits is usually not going to win many games.

This has been such a frustrating season.

[exeoud]

1 minute ago, Danchat said:

How do we know that the other 29 managers don't make this mistake, though? Last I've seen Rocco pulls his starters at an average rate and plenty of other fanbases also think their managers are horrible, unless you've been watching all of the other teams how do you know? 

And even if Ober gets through the 8th without giving up any runs (which isn't a sure thing), how do we know Jax doesn't blow the game in the 9th like he blew it in the 8th?

Look, I don't like Rocco either and I am on board with him getting fired. But the assumptions about how the game would go aren't as sure of things as people seem to think they are. And any manager in MLB is screwed when their top two relievers give up a combined 7 baserunners in one inning. And the next Twins manager may as well make this same mistake - who's to say this regime even thinks that was a bad call?

You have to at least allow Ober a baserunner. If the bullpen blows it after that then so be it. But even if it would have worked out, you put unnecessary stress on the bullpen so that Jax and Duran are probably down tomorrow. For what? The bullpen arms are at much higher risk of injury than Ober.

[h2oface]

19 minutes ago, Danchat said:

Maybe because Duran has been struggling lately and they wanted him to face the bottom of the lineup and have Jax face the heart of the lineup in the 9th?

Funnily enough, I can remember years ago (in the days of Glen Perkins as our closer) when many here complained about how our best pitcher shouldn't only be used in the 9th in save situations and be used earlier just to get to the 9th inning with a lead. And now we've wrapped back around to defined roles. Personally I am unsure which is the better method.

I don't care who goes first. Jax or Duran right now. Duran gets so much contact anymore. And Jax gets quite a bit, too. I don't think that bothers them. I think that if they pitch without pressure or the "high leverage" outings that they both lose a bit of focus. This wasn't the case, tonight. 

There is no way I pull Ober at 83 pitches and 15 in a row. Soft contact. Efficient. On a roll, and really, probably 2 more innings with his count. One at least. One and start the 9th. But he definitely comes out to start the 8th and we see how it goes. This was the type of game and time of year and importance of game that you ride the starter if they are cruising. Even to more pitches than he has pitched all season.

Baldelli probably would have taken Morris out in the 7th or 8th in game 7. I hate his managing. I am sure he is a nice guy. I hate his managing in so many ways. 

Looks like Houston in the wild card series, if anyone. Maybe better than the Yankees. Who knows. Like KC Chiefs, there are always a threat to go all the way, even when they don't look so dominant during the season. 

[CRF]

5 minutes ago, Craig Arko said:

 

AWESOME band!

[Jocko87]

13 minutes ago, UpstateNewYorker said:

Ken Rosenthal reported that the Twins didn't want Duran to face Witt in the 9th.

 

2 minutes ago, TwinsCD said:

You're right.  Rosenthal's wording was 'I remembered that last year Duran gave up a 9th inning walkoff grand slam to Witt' and (paraphrasing now) maybe the Twins didn't want to put him in that situation again in the 9th so they switched roles.

That makes more sense. Nothing about that sounds like anything this organization would say out loud.  Rosenthal has to comment on it on the TV so he did. 

No chance someone inthe Twins organization said that outside of the Falveys office.

[mnfireman]

10 minutes ago, CCHOF5yearstoolate said:

Jax is the better reliever and the bottom of the order was coming up in the 8th. Acting like you'd choose Bailey Ober to get 3 outs over Duran in any scenario is funny to me, though!

Ober was better than any other option tonight. He was cruising, 83 stress-free pitches and the last 15 in a row. The coaching staff over-thought it and cost them the games.

 

10 minutes ago, AceWrigley said:

Again, the offense didn't give the pitching staff much to work with.

Agreed. All the more reason to let Ober try and finish it, or at least the 8th.

[mrtwinsfan]

2 minutes ago, h2oface said:

I don't care who goes first. Jax or Duran right now. Duran gets so much contact anymore. And Jax gets quite a bit, too. I don't think that bothers them. I think that if they pitch without pressure or the "high leverage" outings that they both lose a bit of focus. This wasn't the case, tonight. 

There is no way I pull Ober at 83 pitches and 15 in a row. Soft contact. Efficient. On a roll, and really, probably 2 more innings with his count. One at least. One and start the 9th. But he definitely comes out to start the 8th and we see how it comes. This was the type of game and time of year and importance of game that you ride the starter. 

Baldelli probably would have taken Morris out in the 7th or 8th in game 7. I hate his managing. I am sure he is a nice guy. I hate his managing in so many ways. 

Your not alone,   

[Aggies7]

7 minutes ago, TwinsCD said:

You're right.  Rosenthal's wording was 'I remembered that last year Duran gave up a 9th inning walkoff grand slam to Witt' and (paraphrasing now) maybe the Twins didn't want to put him in that situation again in the 9th so they switched roles.

I would really hope decisions weren’t made based on an at bat from last year.

And I’m sure if Duran is the competitor he seems to be, he would want a crack at him to atone, get some revenge. That usually how the pros think, guys with silly bow ties might think differently

[insagt1]

Very embarrassing loss tonite. Very. Our starter is pitching a 1 hit shutout with only 80 pitches and yet our manager pulls him. Why? What in the world is wrong with the starter pitching the entire game when he is going so well? Its the era of pulling pitchers with no-hitters. Its the era of not letting a starter finish what he starts..or at least until he gets into hot water. The bullpen guys were terrible. The 'd' was shoddy and the bats disappeared. But Ober was terrific...so you yank him. Can't blow games like this late in a pennant race. A wasted effort by our starter which never should have happened.

Own this one Twins. It was terrible. And just an observation but Lewis is now I believe 0-13 which sort of corresponds to being asked to play 2nd base. More or less. Something is up. Anyway, this one hurt and should never have ended like it did. The guys who hit in the 9th looked totally defeated. Everyone who is disappointed, discouraged, disgusted tonite has a right to be. For me, taking a starter out after 7 innings with a low pitch count and allowing only 1 hit, is one reason today's brand of baseball is very frustrating for the ones who have been watching the game for decades. Barring unbelievable circumstances, there is no defense for what went on tonite.

[h2oface]

Absolutely. Lee with a hero complex, Lewis slump slump slumping, AAA players nervous and in the most important games of the season, This line up is not what got us here, anyway, and everyone is basically playing without a position. It is really amazing that anyone defends the organization, right now. Lots of hype about how good they will be, just no one really lasting a season, whether slumping or injury.

[TWTwinsFan]

Please fire Rocco,thats all I want to say

[Aggies7]

 Boston Detroit and Seattle all now 4.5 back. Boston will be 4 back in 3 outs. Odds are one will get hot.

[wabene]

Just now, exeoud said:

You would not have commented if you weren't a Rocco defender. Yeah, people on the internet use possible hyperboles to explain the magnitude of a situation. Get used to it. It

Rocco defender, lol. Your right there is a lot of crap on the Internet. Feel free to pile on.

[$tryf4Life]

28 minutes ago, mnfireman said:

But Duran IS the closer, that is his job. Way to build confidence, tell the closer he's not good enough.

Or, maybe Ober should have pitched the 8th and Jax the 9th.

The game I was watching said that 

[cmoss84]

Rocco deserves 100% of the blame. Don't try to talk yourself our of it. And I'm not even mad. Super happy (gummy defense) and ready for Vikings. Rocco needs out. Crystal clear after this game, unfortunately. 

[mnfireman]

5 minutes ago, insagt1 said:

 

Own this one Twins. It was terrible. And just an observation but Lewis is now I believe 0-13 which sort of corresponds to being asked to play 2nd base. More or less. Something is up. 

Lewis is 2-4 with a go-ahead HR and BB while actually playing 2B....

He has been at DH his last 3 games and has gone 0-11 with 4 K's...

SSS nitpicking I know, but so is the quoted statement.

[Aggies7]

It’s alright guys we have the Vikings tomorrow! 
 

[Danchat]

14 minutes ago, exeoud said:

You have to at least allow Ober a baserunner. If the bullpen blows it after that then so be it. But even if it would have worked out, you put unnecessary stress on the bullpen so that Jax and Duran are probably down tomorrow. For what? The bullpen arms are at much higher risk of injury than Ober.

I'm in complete agreement, my point was that sticking with Ober isn't a sure thing even if it is the more logical call. And also that it is difficult to be sure that Rocco is the only manager in baseball who makes that decision.

[h2oface]

Twins are great for the KC 7 game losing streak that they just came out of. 2 Runs in 2 games, and Baldelli reliance on his odds only. Recipe for success for KC with the pressure on. 

[Jocko87]

57 minutes ago, Jocko87 said:

Ober for the 8th has a bit of rhythm to it.

Like Henry the 8th song?

I'm Ober in the 8th, I am I am. 

Carry on.

Now its a funeral durge.

[nicksaviking]

*******************Moderator Note*********************

Ok, nice work everyone. Sometimes things suck, so I guess we should all act like children about it.

I'll be locking the game thread. It might be a first. Anyone who feels like respecting each other like adults can participate again tomorrow.