Article: Making a Machado Bid

[snap4birds]

If 7/175 is accurate, the Twins could top that offer and front-load the first couple years.  Then you don't have to worry so much about affording Sano, Buxton, etc. if/when they start producing.  

 

I think there might be rules about how much you can front-load (or am I thinking of the NFL???).  But something like 30/30/30/25/25/20/20 would come to 180 million, so you could add or subtract a couple million here and there to make it work.  

 

 

[kab21]

I don't understand the reasons to not sign Machado. Unless of course TD has been infiltrated by Pohlad agents.

Block Gordon? Was this sarcasm? Gordon is an average player at best and a disappointing utility player at worst.

 

Extend their own future stars? Who is a future star? Buxton? Sano? Kepler? Polanco? Rosario? Perhaps Berrios but the Twins don't really have future stars. They so far have unfulfilled potential and I am not going to not take opportunities if they are available. 

 

He isn't a pitcher. Pitching still needs works so this is somewhat valid but if you have an opportunity to add an MVP caliber player then you do it. 

Not a winner? Pretty soon there will be an argument about clutch hitting...

At some point the Twins need to stop being so conservative about moves and chasing value. I think they have made some nice value moves this offseason but the Twins remain an 80+ win team and they will stay there for the foreseeable future unless they find a way to add some significant talent.

[Doomtints]

Machado would immediately become the best and most reliable player on the team. I think this tells us all right there it won't happen. The Twins only upgrade on the margins. We're talking about signing a potential hall of famer who is about to hit his prime years, and in free agency of all things. He has 34 bWAR and he's not even halfway through his career! He is worth 2-3 times any player on the current roster.

 

But, have no fear, if the rumors are true we will all get to see him hit dingers at Target Field often, just in a White Sox uniform. The Twins will also have a nice reitrement ceremony for him to celebrate him dominating the Twins all those years like we saw with some recent retirees from other teams. It'll be fun for all.

Edited January 17, 2019 by Doomtints

[Squirrel]

 

I don't understand the reasons to not sign Machado. Unless of course TD has been infiltrated by Pohlad agents.

Block Gordon? Was this sarcasm? Gordon is an average player at best and a disappointing utility player at worst.

 

Extend their own future stars? Who is a future star? Buxton? Sano? Kepler? Polanco? Rosario? Perhaps Berrios but the Twins don't really have future stars. They so far have unfulfilled potential and I am not going to not take opportunities if they are available. 

 

He isn't a pitcher. Pitching still needs works so this is somewhat valid but if you have an opportunity to add an MVP caliber player then you do it. 

Not a winner? Pretty soon there will be an argument about clutch hitting...

At some point the Twins need to stop being so conservative about moves and chasing value. I think they have made some nice value moves this offseason but the Twins remain an 80+ win team and they will stay there for the foreseeable future unless they find a way to add some significant talent.

Thank you, yes, and yes, and more yes, please.

 

 

[Mike Sixel]

It will be hard to add 1-2 top of the rotation arms and extend their own future stars, if they commit $35-40M a year to a single player, plus putting most of your eggs in one budget highly increases the risk.

 

If the Twins were willing to trade top prospects for cheaper controllable top of the rotation pitching, would have been a different story. However, I am not sure that they are willing to do this at this point, not that what they are doing is "wrong" by any means. It is a strategy.

There's no evidence they'll sign big time free agents either.

 

This ownership has no interest in even trying right now. No idea why anyone thinks this is a possibility.

[Puckett34]

 

What championships has Bryce won?

2018 Home Run Derby. 

[Tomj14]

 

I don't think Machado is a winner.  Harper please.

is it 33.8 WAR, 1050 hits, 175 homers, or .822 OPS all by the age of 26 that makes him not a winner, or is it that played for Baltimore for 6 1/2 years that makes him not a winner?

[Number3]

It won't happen.

It shouldn't happen.

 

The Orioles let Machado go and now the Dodgers. So he is a savior for the Twins? I don't think so.

Take away Harper's stats for April and May and you have a run of the mill player. Even at his still young age, he gets worse as the season progresses. Last year when his average was teetering near the Mendoza line, he started flaring balls to left just to get his average up to a semi respectable level knowing it was free agent time.

Do not come anywhere near either of these two. They are both toxic.

[Doomtints]

 

If 7/175 is accurate, the Twins could top that offer and front-load the first couple years. 

 

His agent(s) say the reported numbers were inaccurate and low, and they were very upset this got leaked because it affected their ability to negotiate with the Yankees who were prepared to open the checkbook much further.

I suspect the numbers are accurate and this caused the Yankees to rethink what they had on the table...

[Mike Sixel]

It won't happen.

It shouldn't happen.

 

The Orioles let Machado go and now the Dodgers. So he is a savior for the Twins? I don't think so.

Take away Harper's stats for April and May and you have a run of the mill player. Even at his still young age, he gets worse as the season progresses. Last year when his average was teetering near the Mendoza line, he started flaring balls to left just to get his average up to a semi respectable level knowing it was free agent time.

Do not come anywhere near either of these two. They are both toxic.

The Dodgers have all stars at third and short.... And other needs. I'm not sure what people expect at all.

 

As for taking away good times, then judging players, zero Twins would pass that unreasonable test.

[Doomtints]

 

 

Last year when his average was teetering near the Mendoza line, he started flaring balls to left just to get his average up to a semi respectable level knowing it was free agent time.

 

 

Hm. When I look at his numbers from 2018, I don't see any down months at all, in fact he probably outperformed any Twin in any given month. If he had a slump, it was no more than around ten days in length and he more than made up for it.

 

It's a shame he was hitting around .200 for a week or whatever though. Seems like a positive that he adjusted as you describe, and still managed to hit 37 dingers and had a .905 OPS by year end.

We seem to tolerate our "stars" hitting near .200 for longer stretches with nowhere near this performance at the monthly or yearly levels, so I'm having a hard time seeing any negatives about Machado.

Edited January 17, 2019 by Doomtints

[tvagle]

From Nick's Standing Pat Article, I posted this possible scenario on Dec. 10th

 

 

3rd year Opt out puts Machado in line for another BIG contract at 28-29 years young

 

Besides the fact that the Twins have tried the M&M boys with two players already...sign Manny Machado and they can reuse all that advertising schtick!

[Steve Lein]

Offer him a high dollar, short-term deal. Solves all the "can't sign their players" problems in the future

 

He wouldn't do it (probably?), but I would be happy they attempted something.

 

And, like his agent is saying, I don't think any of these reports are accurate. Owners are just asking for a strike if they are.

[MMMordabito]

While we are riding through Oz, I'll take a '65 Shelby Cobra CSX1000 Series.

 

(pay no attention to that man - Jim Pohlad - behind the curtain)

[howieramone2]

 

There will never be a better opportunity to add a player of this caliber. Do it.

Completely agree.

[Otto von Ballpark]

The Orioles let Machado go and now the Dodgers. So he is a savior for the Twins? I don't think so.

 

The Orioles let Machado go because they were terrible and he wasn't going to re-sign there. (A more accurate phrasing would be that Machado let go of the Orioles...)

 

The Dodgers let Machado go because they already have Seager and Turner at SS and 3B. (Seager was hurt last year, hence why they were interested in Machado as a rental.)

 

I'd say it is curious that the Yankees apparently haven't pursued Machado in FA, but those top clubs also have luxury tax concerns which affect their strategy, so I wouldn't read too much into that.

Edited January 17, 2019 by spycake

[Number3]

Doomtints ..."Hm. When I look at his numbers from 2018, I don't see any down months at all, in fact he probably outperformed any Twin in any given month. If he had a slump, it was no more than around ten days in length and he more than made up for it."

 

Harper hit 18 home runs in April and May and finished with 37 while struggling to hit .250. What am I missing? On top of that his mere presence dominates a dugout and the persona of a whole team. He would destroy the "new" Minnesota Twins until they can establish their own identity and be able to absorb a Bryce Harper or anyone like him. Unless you want the Minnesota Twins to be the Harper Twins, stay away.

[Mr. Brooks]

Doomtints ..."Hm. When I look at his numbers from 2018, I don't see any down months at all, in fact he probably outperformed any Twin in any given month. If he had a slump, it was no more than around ten days in length and he more than made up for it."

 

Harper hit 18 home runs in April and May and finished with 37 while struggling to hit .250. What am I missing? On top of that his mere presence dominates a dugout and the persona of a whole team. He would destroy the "new" Minnesota Twins until they can establish their own identity and be able to absorb a Bryce Harper or anyone like him. Unless you want the Minnesota Twins to be the Harper Twins, stay away.

Maybe you are missing all the other stats besides HR's?

 

His OPS in August and September were basically the same as April:

 

April: .986

August: 958

Sept.: .959

 

He had a twinkle June, but every other month was over 800.

[howieramone2]

 

But but he would block Gordon and we might not have the money to pay our guys if they ever get close to as good as he is.

No and no,

[howieramone2]

 

He's perfect in every way for this team. I'm boggled that the FO didn't push ownership to go at him. If we could get him on an 8 year deal, we should. 

Gunn, I think they played the market. 

[GP830]

 

Besides the fact that the Twins have tried the M&M boys with two players already...sign Manny Machado and they can reuse all that advertising schtick!

 

I've been waiting for them to role out the "Mitch and Max" M&M Boy promos!

Edited January 17, 2019 by GP830

[USNMCPO]

I keep thinking about the local fans constant bitching about Mauer's contract. If MM went into any kind of slump or some other free agent doesn't sign with the Twins all hell would break out about how MM was holding the Twins back from being WS champs. That said, I agree with Chief. This never happens. Go for it.

[SF Twins Fan]

 

It will be hard to add 1-2 top of the rotation arms and extend their own future stars, if they commit $35-40M a year to a single player, plus putting most of your eggs in one budget highly increases the risk.

 

If the Twins were willing to trade top prospects for cheaper controllable top of the rotation pitching, would have been a different story.  However, I am not sure that they are willing to do this at this point, not that what they are doing is "wrong" by any means.  It is a strategy.

 

 

So, they need two top of the rotation arms now? Since when? You're delusional if you think the TWINS, being the cheap team they are, are going to spend the money to get not 1 but 2 top of the rotation arms. And there is no way Machado is going to get $35 - $40 million a season unless it's a short term deal. If the offer that has been put out is anywhere close that's a $25 million per. There is no way he gets another $10 - $15 million per season added onto his deal.

[djvang]

Bad seed. Steer clear of him.

[nicksaviking]

Offer him a deal, even a one year deal. You will get value out of it, even at 30M.

Yeah, I bet 1 year for $30-35M beats the Sox offer.

 

But I still bet he gets 10 years $30M plus, and I’d bet he’d have little interest in spending the next decade in Minnesota. For all the grief I’ve given Terry Ryan, I think his frustration toward the end of his career was legit when he was on MLB Network and said the Twins couldn’t even give their money away to attract free agents.

[ashbury]

Yeah, I bet 1 year for $30-35M beats the Sox offer.

 

But I still bet he gets 10 years $30M plus, and I’d bet he’d have little interest in spending the next decade in Minnesota. For all the grief I’ve given Terry Ryan, I think his frustration toward the end of his career was legit when he was on MLB Network and said the Twins couldn’t even give their money away to attract free agents.

I respect Terry Ryan very much, but that quote came across as someone having trouble keeping up with the sharp increase in payrolls. He sounded like Grandpa at Thanksgiving dinner complaining about "prices these days". I think he felt he was making competitive offers, but they were actually just enough light to not be in the running. Just my guess, of course.

[nicksaviking]

I respect Terry Ryan very much, but that quote came across as someone having trouble keeping up with the sharp increase in payrolls. He sounded like Grandpa at Thanksgiving dinner complaining about "prices these days". I think he felt he was making competitive offers, but they were actually just enough light to not be in the running. Just my guess, of course.

That was my original and resentful take, but after just spending a week in Florida, I’m once again reminded how everyone south of here makes our area the butt of the joke. Everyone is incredulous that we simpletons would subject ourselves to such inhabitable environments. It would take an act of God, not money, to talk a young Floridian man into committing his formative years to live in Siberia.

[TheLeviathan]

 

That was my original and resentful take, but after just spending a week in Florida, I’m once again reminded how everyone south of here makes our area the butt of the joke. Everyone is incredulous that we simpletons would subject ourselves to such inhabitable environments. It would take an act of God, not money, to talk a young Floridian man into committing his formative years to live in Siberia.

 

Are all these Yankees free agent signings just totally ignorant of the climate in the northeast?  That's one hell of an effort if they've pulled off that feat of magic......

 

I live in Phoenix.  They literally whine about the "No one wants to come here" thing too.  It's what's made me realize how ridiculous that excuse is.

[Mike Sixel]

That was my original and resentful take, but after just spending a week in Florida, I’m once again reminded how everyone south of here makes our area the butt of the joke. Everyone is incredulous that we simpletons would subject ourselves to such inhabitable environments. It would take an act of God, not money, to talk a young Floridian man into committing his formative years to live in Siberia.

Boston, New York, Chicago, Detroit.... They seem to attract people.

[Otto von Ballpark]

It would take an act of God, not money, to talk a young Floridian man into committing his formative years to live in Siberia.

Not necessarily in baseball, thanks to an act of the devil (Jeffrey Loria).

Edited January 18, 2019 by spycake