Vargas?

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

What to do about Kennys Vargas? It is often debated on this board about how many of our prospects (or young players) are being blocked, but Vargas seems to have been forgotten lately. If you look at his overall numbers you might feel that he is doing ok, but not great. But, one must look at his recent play and more importantly his platoon splits.

 

In the last 10 games he's hitting .395 and in the last 30 days he's hitting .305, which is pretty encouraging compared to his full season .257/365/434/799 slash line.

 

The real interest with him is his platoon split; 

 

Vs Lefties .085/.173/.149/.322 with 1HR in 47 AB's

Vs Righties .333/.442/.562/1.004 with 6 HR's in 105 AB's....oh, and 21 BB's to 27 K's. 

 

His 2015 splits in AAA are almost identical to the above.

 

Does this guy have any way to get back to the majors with this team other than injury, or an unlikely trade of those blocking him? Park and Mauer are not going anywhere, but Vargas is still just 25 and can rake RHP, or at least get on base at a great clip. This guy should be hitting in the majors vs righties on a club with only 11 wins. 

 

Since we know we can't move Mauer to a new team or new position, who best maximize our ball-club? Trading Park's power and nice contract might be an attractive chip to other teams, especially as it appears that he can really play 1B (probably better than Mauer even.) This would likely just move Sano to DH, but if not it would bring Vargas to DH and whatever we could get for Park. Or, what could Vargas get us at this point as a 25 year DH/1B who can rake against righties (the majority split)? 

 

I personally feel the Twins should be attempting to package Park along with Plouffe, Dozier, and junk SP contracts to see what we can get in return. It won't happen though. They will be more likely to sell on Vargas and watch him blow up for another team, while Park ages, and Dozier and Plouffe block young infielders. 

 

What are your thoughts on what we should and what we will do with Vargas. Problem is if the Twins did bring up Vargas they'd throw him out there everyday vs Lefty's and sit him sporadically against righties, which would lead to his rates to look like failure, and they'd give up on him. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jokin]

Vargas in May:

 

.329/.457/.616/(1.074) 6 HR 9 XBH BB/K= 18/17

 

 

And there's no chance that Vargas gets recalled because-

 

1) there's no chance they trade Park- plus,

 

2) he seemed to have burned all bridges to a future with the big club last season.

[Shane Wahl]

He will be traded, hopefully along with Plouffe, in a package deal for a catcher.

[jimbo92107]

Sounds like it's time to trade Vargas to Boston. Big Papi is almost done, so they'll be looking for the next one.

[diehardtwinsfan]

It will be interesting to see what they do with him.  He wasn't very good last year, and he's dominated the minors before.  I hot month though is impressive.  I honestly think they let him do this for another month unless there's an injury to Park/Mauer.  I think he could be part of a nice 3 way platoon between Mauer and Park at DH/1B/bench bat... problem is 2 bench bats during interleague play. 

 

I have to think though that if he's still doing this in mid June that he moves into a major league role at some point.

[Han Joelo]

The Mets are shopping apparently.  Saw a MLBTR blurb that suggested Park or Plouffe were options.  

 

The bummer thing about this season…check that.  One of the MANY bummer things is going to come when guys start getting traded and instantly not sucking.

[Lonestar]

He's going to show he can hit LHP's, even if he has to give up switch hitting.  Or Mauer is going to have to retire.

[wsnydes]

 

The bummer thing about this season…check that.  One of the MANY bummer things is going to come when guys start getting traded and instantly not sucking.

I'd be okay with that depending on what the Twins get in return and if it eases the logjams.  Sometimes those things just need to happen.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

He's going to show he can hit LHP's, even if he has to give up switch hitting.

The split looks bad this year, but it's hard to know at this point if it's just a sample size fluke.  For example, in 2015, his MLB OPS was actually significantly better vs LHP (although it looks like a BABIP thing).  In 2014 at AA, his OPS, K%, BB%, and ISO were all better vs LHP:

 

http://minorleaguecentral.com/player?pid=573627&type=batter&split=2014

[Thrylos]

What is the best thing to do with Mr Vargas?

 

• Play the best first baseman at first (Park)
• Move Mauer to a position of need that he can learn this season (LF)
• Trade Plouffe and move Sano to 3B
• Vargas at DH, spelling Park at 1B on occasion.

Would Ryan or whoever might be ru(i)nning the Twins do it?  Nope.  He had a chance.

[Shane Wahl]

 

What is the best thing to do with Mr Vargas?

 

• Play the best first baseman at first (Park)
• Move Mauer to a position of need that he can learn this season (LF)
• Trade Plouffe and move Sano to 3B
• Vargas at DH, spelling Park at 1B on occasion.

Would Ryan or whoever might be ru(i)nning the Twins do it?  Nope.  He had a chance.

 

While I agree that Mauer should have been moved some other damn place than 1B, I don't think I can get on board with this. Your answer closes off some room for Max Kepler and by domino effect Buxton.

Wouldn't it be better to add Vargas in to sweeten any Plouffe deal?

[Woody Wants Wins]

Trade Plouffe and/or Vargas to get a good young catcher.   Move Mauer to 3B and then have Park/Sano as DH/1B options.  I still don't think Sano can play 3B at a major league level.  Make Mauer have to learn a new position.  

 

 

[Kwak]

Vargas has no future with the Twins.  If you can't trade him, let him walk away.

[Vanimal46]

Vargas is going to be hitting 50 HRs a season for the Doosan Bears beginning next season. 

[Mike Sixel]

I agree, Japan seems likely. 

 

But, are we SURE that if Park continues to be bad, they don't send him down?

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

While I agree that Mauer should have been moved some other damn place than 1B, I don't think I can get on board with this. Your answer closes off some room for Max Kepler and by domino effect Buxton.

Note that while his plan moves Mauer to LF, it removes Sano from RF.  Should be a neutral move as far as Kepler and Buxton are concerned -- they'd still only have to beat out Arcia, Grossman, or Santana to play, same as now.

[gil4]

 

Vargas has no future with the Twins.  If you can't trade him, let him walk away.

 

As long as he has options, keep him (unless he gets in the way of someone better.)  I doubt he has much trade value, but don't let him walk until he needs to be kept on the 25-man (or until you need his spot on the 40 for someone else.)

[Shaitan]

Make him prove it for at least another month. I think that's the plan with all the players who have raked in AAA and failed at MLB so far. Make them "extra hungry" or whatever bad metaphor we choose.

 

He'll fester for a while, either until injury or he's out of options. That's essentially how the system works.

 

Personally, I'm okay with that and don't think he's ready yet. He's had his hot streaks before--maybe not as severely as Arcia, but he needs consistency to play MLB.

 

I wonder if might be a fit for the Mets, though. Other than as bench bat, I don't see a role in the Twins the next couple of years. But these things tend to sort themselves out.

 

[Thrylos]

 

While I agree that Mauer should have been moved some other damn place than 1B, I don't think I can get on board with this. Your answer closes off some room for Max Kepler and by domino effect Buxton.

Wouldn't it be better to add Vargas in to sweeten any Plouffe deal?

 

There still is room at CF.  I do not see Santana as an answer to anyone.  Mauer's deal will be done before Buxton and Kepler are close to their primes.

 

Still, I'd rather see Vargas (and Arcia) than Kepler next season, unless he develops some power.  RH power is sadly missing in this team and that is a gap that Vargas (with Arcia) can help close.   Also on the fence on whether Kepler will be a regular in a competing team or a fourth OF.  Got to see more.

 

I'd add Dozier to sweeten any deal and #FreeJorgePolanco, but that is another story.

 

I think that the Twins should hold onto Vargas (and Arcia) until they have some other serious LH power options

[sane17]

What is the best thing to do with Mr Vargas?

With all due respect to the Elvis Presley movie:

"Arrivederci Lost Vargas!"

[nicksaviking]

 

I agree, Japan seems likely. 

 

But, are we SURE that if Park continues to be bad, they don't send him down?

 

Well bad is a relative term, and in this case, his badness still makes him the best hitter on the team.

[Kwak]

Given the sad state of affairs with the Twins they should not limit themselves to hitters based on RH  or LH--anybody who hits is more than welcome!

[Arak30s]

Again Minnesota hangs on to players until they are literally worthless in a trade blocking the system with players that have been given opportunity and more opportunity, Let them warm their butts on the bench. Give others a chance equally until someone starts to perform and then fly with them.

[jorgenswest]

I concur with those keeping him in the minors until later this year. I would wait until the all star break. If he has sustained success through that time, bring him up. Unless this team makes a dramatic turn around, there will be a spot for a hitter.

[David HK]

 

What is the best thing to do with Mr Vargas?

 

• Play the best first baseman at first (Park)
• Move Mauer to a position of need that he can learn this season (LF)
• Trade Plouffe and move Sano to 3B
• Vargas at DH, spelling Park at 1B on occasion.

Would Ryan or whoever might be ru(i)nning the Twins do it?  Nope.  He had a chance.

Thrylos, are you on Linkedin?  You should get your CV to the Twinks FO in a hurry, just in case.  

 

Since I'm in total agreement with those moves, can I be your assistant GM?

[SF Twins Fan]

Do people really think Park is better at defense than Mauer at 1B? That's laughable - there have been at least two occasions when he's fielded a throw from either third base or SS where he's has his right foot on the base and been standing in foul territory for no reason at all instead of stretching toward the thrower. The first instance it didn't have an effect on the play but the second time, which was just weeks ago, he ended up not catching the ball because the runner was right there and almost ran into him. He was completely out of position and it didn't make any sense for him to be standing in the base path and in foul territory. I'm not saying Mauer is the best defensive first baseman in the league but he's definitely better than Park.

[sorney]

Why in a completely crap-ass season do people want Vargas to *prove it longer* in MiLB?!?!  I'm so sick of this season already, having a dude like Vargas take a couple hundred at bats would make me actually interested in watching the team this summer.

[Rosterman]

He is a good guy t have in reserve, but chances of him cracking the Twins ever again (except in case of injury) is probably slim to none, although they really don't have any viable 1st base candidates in the pipeline except, perhaps, Kepler (or if they move Sano there in the future - although it would be great to get 2-3 years of Sano at 3rd before Blanken or Cabbage materialize). 

 

He is also a valuable tradechip for a mid-level prospect, especially to a team like the Mets who are looking for someone cheap for a season, although his splits aren't that great.

 

Better if you can package him to a team like the Mets with, perhaps, Nolasco or Hughes for a couple of promising players who won't need a 40-man spot for at least another year.

[DocBauer]

What is the best thing to do with Mr Vargas?

 

 

• Play the best first baseman at first (Park)
• Move Mauer to a position of need that he can learn this season (LF)
• Trade Plouffe and move Sano to 3B
• Vargas at DH, spelling Park at 1B on occasion.

Would Ryan or whoever might be ru(i)nning the Twins do it?  Nope.  He had a chance.

In theory, I love this idea, and have stated such in another thread. However, it does with a couple caveats.

 

1} Vargas, as previously stated elsewhere, was my top prospect to click this season. I'm looking smarter lately than I did in April. I picked him because in the minors he has shown some nice ability and potential. And he showed some of that ability with his debut in 2014.

 

2} 2015 simply didn't turn out like anyone expected with Vargas. But he was actually starting to hit a bit when he got demoted. We talk about how poorly the Twins have handled young prospects this season. But what about Vargas last season? There may be more going on here that we don't know about, but why do you demote a youngster just as he's starting to hit?

 

3} I still wouldn't rush to promote Vargas just yet. In a lost season in which we are talking about giving prospects time to develop and be in a good groove, let's give Vargas a little more time.

 

All that being said, I am beyond dumbfounded by the attitude and approach to the 2016 roster of the parent club. I GET Park was a lottery ticket. And I GET keeping Plouffe, at least in the short term to hedge your bets against Park needing time and Mauer continuing to spiral. It made/makes perfect sense.

 

Park got off to a slow start, adjusted and got hot, and now is struggling lately. But I've seen enough to tell, me he will adjust and rally again. Mauer...I just don't know.

 

Mauer has turned in to a solid defensive 1B. Park is also quality there. He'd probably be even better with regular playing time there. But if you really are trying to put the best team on the field, and your best lineup, who in the hell decided the best option was to put your very best hitting prospect in RF?

 

Sano was a SS as a kid, moved to 3B, played solid tnere, worked hard to improve and did. Scouts were universal that he could play the spot, at least in the short term. And while not great tnere, we have seen that he CAN play the position. Question: will he get better or worse defensively at 3B the more he plays the spot?

 

So someone, in their infinite wisdom, decides if we're going to throw someone in to RF who has never played the position, it should be Sano. Why?

 

If we're going to build this team...the right way...why wouldn't you let Sano play his natural 3B, grow at the position, and put Plouffe or Mauer in RF? (I know Thrylos said LF, but Mauer and Plouffe have good arms, and RF in Target requires less coverage than LF)

 

SO here is the obvious scenario, we're going to stink defensively in RF, or be average at best, no matter what route we take. So let's take our top young player and mess with him instead of putting another veteran out there. How does this make any sense at all?

 

Play Sano at 3B. Put Mauer or Plouffe in RF. If the talented and powerful Vargas continues to perform...and he is both...then bring him up when the "proposed youth promotion" takes place. He can DH. Move Plouffe for whatever you can get.

[MileHighTwinsFan]

I would not be surprised to see Park get sent down if he doesn't pull out of his slump soon. Vargas would get a chance to DH against righties and get spot starts at first.

 

On another note, it is getting increasingly difficult to keep Buxton in AAA. He is now up to .333 with a 3-4 night and a homer. With Mastrionni out, Buxton could get a call back soon.