The Joey Gallo Experiment Should Be Over

[ewen21]

16 hours ago, jkcarew said:

 

That’s the argument, anyway. It might be a thin argument or plain horrible…if you could trust Kirilloff’s health. Still, it’s hard to fathom Buxton (who Gallo has been better than, btw), Lewis, and Kirilloff all returning and Gallo surviving.

 

He shouldn't survive.  All this hand wringing over Gallo because Falvey and Levine just cannot square the idea that that he's been an disaster.  The saving grace is that Gallo is only a one year deal.  Once he is gone more attention will be on Buxton.  What in the world are we going to do with him?  If Falvey and Levine can't pull the plug on Gallo imagine how bad it can get with Buxton?

[Riverbrian]

15 hours ago, jdgoin said:

The Joey Gallo Experiment Should Never Have Started.

When this chapter of the book is finally written and sent to press. 

This will most likely be the easy conclusion. 

[yeahyabetcha]

I understand the frustration with him, but what exactly were the expectations??  He is a powerful left handed bat that strikes out too much while providing good defense at several positions.  
 

He manned LF until Wallner was deemed ready and now is mainly playing 1b because AK is hurt again.  There may be a time yet that he is cut loose, but I don’t think today is that day.

[Vanimal46]

7 minutes ago, yeahyabetcha said:

 

I understand the frustration with him, but what exactly were the expectations??  He is a powerful left handed bat that strikes out too much while providing good defense at several positions.

 

For me, the expectations were pretty minimal in March. Hope he bounces back to be on pace for 3-4 WAR and either flip him for prospects at the deadline, or keep him for a playoff run. If he still stunk it up at the plate, $5-6 million is not much to eat to DFA him by August 1st. 

The reason for my frustration is he is playing too frequently at a replacement level. 

[saviking]

Never should have given him a 11 mill contract after the horrible season he had the year before.

Should have cut bait before this.

Gallo's job is possibly safe until Krilloff comes back to take over first base. 

But if Krilloff, Lewis and Buxton come back I'm really going to be pissed if Gallo isn't let go. 

But if they don't comeback until September 1st and we can carry a couple of extra players my fear is they won't let Gallo go.

Obviously whoever is taking responsibility for having hired Gallo doesn't want to lose face by cutting him. That kind of stubbornness is un called for. Especially when the totality of Twins Nation is screaming for him to be cut .. I think this would be a rare occasion where the President of the Twins (new as he is) should step in and call that shot. It would show there is some form of accountability 

[laloesch]

22 hours ago, CRF said:

Of course not...but the guy had 4 hits last night and 2 big flys. I don't care if a lefty or righty is pitching today...he should be in the lineup. 

i'm not sure what to think of this statement. 

[yeahyabetcha]

34 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

For me, the expectations were pretty minimal in March. Hope he bounces back to be on pace for 3-4 WAR and either flip him for prospects at the deadline, or keep him for a playoff run. If he still stunk it up at the plate, $5-6 million is not much to eat to DFA him by August 1st. 

The reason for my frustration is he is playing too frequently at a replacement level. 

Who would you play at 1b in his place?  And please don’t say EJ, as I think he is playing regularly already.

[Vanimal46]

49 minutes ago, yeahyabetcha said:

Who would you play at 1b in his place?  And please don’t say EJ, as I think he is playing regularly already.

With Lewis coming back tomorrow, Polanco/Solano can temporarily play 1B until Kirilloff comes back. 

[yeahyabetcha]

14 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

With Lewis coming back tomorrow, Polanco/Solano can temporarily play 1B until Kirilloff comes back. 

Why can’t Polanco and EJ handle 2b and Dh for now?  Solano could at least share first base with Gallo, but how healthy is he right now?

[Vanimal46]

16 minutes ago, yeahyabetcha said:

Why can’t Polanco and EJ handle 2b and Dh for now?  Solano could at least share first base with Gallo, but how healthy is he right now?

We will see who is sent back to St Paul or DFA’d when Lewis is activated. Hopefully Julien or Wallner isn’t sent back just to keep Gallo on roster. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Gallo is obviously being buoyed by a 4 hit game in august - however, that 1 game I am willing to give him another week or two.  The statistical anomaly of him getting 4 hits is extremely high unless he fundamentally did something different and/or the pitching was poor, but he has faced poor pitching recently and did nothing with it.   The homerun to the opposite field was impressive to me,  he starts spraying a few more balls to left field he will find more hits.  He needs more contact period, but if he is a .200 hitter with a .350 or better OBP that is a valuable player.   He tends to be streaky, so if we hit for a month or two of him getting hot I will take it.   It is small sample size but for August he has a 38% strike out rate.  If he can keep it below 40% I think that is the key for him.  

 

Split	G	GS	PA	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	TB	GDP	HBP	SH	SF	IBB	ROE	BAbip	tOPS+	sOPS+
April/March	19	17	65	55	12	13	3	1	7	14	0	0	9	22	.236	.354	.709	1.063	39	0	1	0	0	0	1	.231	169	185
May	26	22	96	79	9	13	2	0	4	9	0	0	16	37	.165	.313	.342	.654	27	1	1	0	0	1	0	.237	76	81
June	16	14	53	49	5	9	3	0	3	4	0	0	4	26	.184	.245	.429	.674	21	1	0	0	0	0	0	.300	73	81
July	21	13	53	47	6	6	1	0	3	5	0	0	6	29	.128	.226	.340	.567	16	0	0	0	0	0	0	.200	47	52
August	12	8	31	24	3	6	0	0	3	6	0	0	7	12	.250	.419	.625	1.044	15	0	0	0	0	0	0	.333	172	180

[Mike Sixel]

20 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Right or wrong, I'd Wager there's no decision on Gallo unless/until Kirilloff returns to the active roster. Then I don't know what the Twins will do.

But they clearly believe they need him at first base.

Agreed, but they are wrong. The stats are mind blowingly awful. Truly. 

[Mike Sixel]

21 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

We will see who is sent back to St Paul or DFA’d when Lewis is activated. Hopefully Julien or Wallner isn’t sent back just to keep Gallo on roster. 

You thought I was calling for the FO heads before.....that would really be the 2045 last straw for me.

[yeahyabetcha]

38 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

We will see who is sent back to St Paul or DFA’d when Lewis is activated. Hopefully Julien or Wallner isn’t sent back just to keep Gallo on roster. 

Do you really think that is a possibility??  I don’t.  There are 3 or 4 that seem to be nursing injuries, I would think using the 10 day to get someone healthy would be a better choice.

[Vanimal46]

11 minutes ago, yeahyabetcha said:

Do you really think that is a possibility??  I don’t.  There are 3 or 4 that seem to be nursing injuries, I would think using the 10 day to get someone healthy would be a better choice.

They don’t have a ton of choices. I suppose they could put Castro on the IL for his back issue. All we’re discussing, really, is delaying the inevitable with Gallo. Sept 1 is right around the corner which will add 1 more position roster spot. With a lot of players set to return as well… Gordon, Miranda, Kirilloff, and Buxton could all potentially return and only Miranda has options remaining. 

[yeahyabetcha]

8 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

They don’t have a ton of choices. I suppose they could put Castro on the IL for his back issue. All we’re discussing, really, is delaying the inevitable with Gallo. Sept 1 is right around the corner which will add 1 more position roster spot. With a lot of players set to return as well… Gordon, Miranda, Kirilloff, and Buxton could all potentially return and only Miranda has options remaining. 

Gordon and Miranda don’t even look like options for the active roster this year anymore to me.  Kiriloff and Buxton need to get healthy and than stay healthy for the duration, neither of which can be counted on at this point.

[KirbyDome89]

7 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

The Twins consider the need for him at 1B to be real.  Whether we as fans like it or not, that won't change.  You can scream about bringing guys up to play that position all you want, but in reality there is really nobody to replace him.  He strikes out way too much for my tastes, but in today's game, he does have value.  As of yesterday for the year:
WAR = 0.6
OPS+ = 109

Personally, I think that Gallo takes too much of the negative brunt of the offense in general.  I bet if you look at the TD posts and articles, Gallo (along with the other two musketeers Kepler and Pagan) receive an incredibly high number of negative posts compared to Correa and Vazquez, (and to a lesser degree Buxton) who are way more to blame for the Twins current problems.

His overall offensive numbers are pretty close to his career averages.  He is a low-end starter with great defensive value.  He is what he is.  People need to stop complaining about this and move on.  He isn't going anywhere.
 

Gallo has been starting games since opening day, we're 75% of the way through the season, and he's amassed 0.6 WAR? Are you actually trying to claim that's some kind of positive? The guy is the definition of replaceable. 

His overall numbers are atrocious and he has provided no defensive value this season. What we need to stop doing is defending poor play.

[PDX Twin]

Perhaps we could arrange a Strat-O-Matic league for Gallo and Sano to keep their competitive instincts active without us having to watch all the strike threes.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

1 hour ago, KirbyDome89 said:

Gallo has been starting games since opening day, we're 75% of the way through the season, and he's amassed 0.6 WAR? Are you actually trying to claim that's some kind of positive? The guy is the definition of replaceable. 

His overall numbers are atrocious and he has provided no defensive value this season. What we need to stop doing is defending poor play.

This is really getting tiresome…

OPS+ this year:

Vazquez               61
Correa                  96
Buxton                 99
Gallo                     109

Vazquez, Correa, and Buxton were supposed to carry the team this year, not Gallo.  Gallo’s numbers are about his career averages.  He is doing what was expected (not hoped for, expected).  Yet Gallo takes the brunt of the heat here, not those three.  That's all I am saying.

You don't like Gallo, that is fine.  You think he is holding someone back (though I am not sure who), you are entitled to that opinion.  Maybe point your frustration at the players that deserve it more…

[RpR]

2 hours ago, KirbyDome89 said:

Gallo has been starting games since opening day, we're 75% of the way through the season, and he's amassed 0.6 WAR? Are you actually trying to claim that's some kind of positive? The guy is the definition of replaceable. 

His overall numbers are atrocious and he has provided no defensive value this season. What we need to stop doing is defending poor play.

Julien's bat is not what it was but they still have the shakiest glove in the Central at 2nd, que sera, sera.

[KirbyDome89]

7 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

This is really getting tiresome…

OPS+ this year:

Vazquez               61
Correa                  96
Buxton                 99
Gallo                     109

Vazquez, Correa, and Buxton were supposed to carry the team this year, not Gallo.  Gallo’s numbers are about his career averages.  He is doing what was expected (not hoped for, expected).  Yet Gallo takes the brunt of the heat here, not those three.  That's all I am saying.

You don't like Gallo, that is fine.  You think he is holding someone back (though I am not sure who), you are entitled to that opinion.  Maybe point your frustration at the players that deserve it more…

You're right, it is tiresome that certain fans feel a burning desire to defend a guy who has slashed .171/.292/.397 with a 45% K rate since May. The OPS, which has been spiraling downward since the first few weeks of the season, is entirely HR driven, and those HRs occur way too infrequently, i.e. it's an incredibly poor metric to use if you're going to argue relative value. Gallo was supposed to bounce back, that was the expectation, but he's been the same unplayable guy he was last year. 

This has already been explained to you, but I guess I'll repeat it, the Twins can (will) walk away from Gallo after this year, and they have/had corner OF prospects, guys who have an actual shot of carving out a future in MN, playing well at AAA. This isn't hard. Gallo is a failed signing, with zero future here, and the team has internal options that can offer the same paltry floor with some actual upside. 

Correa and Buxton (who have also received plenty of criticism) are under contract for the next 5+ years. Is it possible for the Twins to cut bait and move on like they can with Gallo? No? Mystery solved I guess....

[wabene]

I would not have signed a left handed corner outfielder this past off-season. If Joey Gallo was right handed, I still would not have signed him this off-season. 

This front office will not drop him before the end of the regular season. Two more roster spots in September will be the reasoning.

My only question is will they have the cajones to leave him off the playoff roster? 

[jorgenswest]

With about 20 minutes left in the trade deadline I saw Heyman reported that the Twins were close on Tommy Pham. The Diamondbacks won the deal and I wondered about the cost. It was a 17 year old top 50 International prospect. The Twins had three of those with two similarly ranked and Ariel Castro clearly higher and would win that deal. They could have acquired Pham for Castro. Should they have done that deal?

Pham since the trade deadline has an OPS of 641.

Kepler 926. Gallo 1044. Luplow 984. Kepler has had most impact with a WPA of 0.41. Pham has a WPA of -0.34.

The last two weeks are not at all predictive of the next two weeks but Pham has some catching up to do.

[IaBeanCounter]

1 hour ago, jorgenswest said:

Kepler 926. Gallo 1044. Luplow 984. Kepler has had most impact with a WPA of 0.41. Pham has a WPA of -0.34.

The last two weeks are not at all predictive of the next two weeks but Pham has some catching up to do.

What are the Twins going to do with Luplow?  I figured when they signed him he would be DFAd when Lewis or Buxton came off the IL, now I'm not sure.

[jorgenswest]

13 minutes ago, IaBeanCounter said:

What are the Twins going to do with Luplow?  I figured when they signed him he would be DFAd when Lewis or Buxton came off the IL, now I'm not sure.

He has an option. Minimally he can be on the 40 for depth if the Twins have players returning without others going on the IL.

[IaBeanCounter]

Is this another anti-jinx article?  Write a well thought-out position as to why a player shouldn't be on a MLB team only to have them go 5 for 5 PA and in next game he makes an game ending catch for a DP.  If so, please keep up the good work!

[specialiststeve]

On 8/13/2023 at 9:51 PM, RpR said:

A paralogical statement based solely on emotion.

No actually a statement based on playing (collage ball), coaching (legion) and watching his play. Not realizing this and trying to rationalize his poor play (hitting) Is as you would say (trying to sound smart) is paralogical (for the rest of us... illogical) !

[RpR]

5 hours ago, specialiststeve said:

No actually a statement based on playing (collage ball), coaching (legion) and watching his play. Not realizing this and trying to rationalize his poor play (hitting) Is as you would say (trying to sound smart) is paralogical (for the rest of us... illogical) !

If you so say, still it is just an opinion as unless some one here is a god, they do not know what is in any one else's head; to say so is arrogant foolishness.

 

[Jacksson]

I still think that the signing of Gallo was a back-handed payoff to Boras for his coming back to the Twins with Correa after swishing with the the Giants and Mets.  When are the Twins go for it??  This year was all about "insurance policies"

Taylor = Insurance policy for Buxton.

Gallo = Insurance policy for Kirilloff/Larnach.

Farmer = Insurance policy for Lewis/Miranda/Polanco/Correa

Castro = Insurance policy for SIX different positions.