Monitor: Manager of the Year and Fired?

[mickeymental]

whomever is responsible for keeping buxton in the majors despite his early struggles probably saved the season. at very least rowson needs a raise.

[laloesch]

 

I think the Twins win despite him. Wouldn't be upset if he doesn't come back.

 

That's how i feel.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I think the Twins win despite him. Wouldn't be upset if he doesn't come back.

I'm not going to be too upset either way but I think it's unfair to say they win despite him.

 

Do the Twins win despite Molitor's in-game management? I think one could make that argument and I'd agree with it.

 

But there's a lot that goes into managing that isn't in-game decisions. And Molitor's teams have overperformed twice and underperformed once. He's doing something right, I'd say.

[Jham]

Personally, I don't think that the fact that the team played up to its ability this year makes up for the fact that they played so far below it last season. The turnaround is impressive. But last year's collapse was just as unimpressive. Molitor is more of am assistant than a manager in my opinion.

 

Really, we're at where we should be. Last year was the deviation. In fact last year may have set us back more than we've regained this season. Bye Molly.

[h2oface]

 

Personally, I don't think that the fact that the team played up to its ability this year makes up for the fact that they played so far below it last season. The turnaround is impressive. But last year's collapse was just as unimpressive. Molitor is more of am assistant than a manager in my opinion.

Really, we're at where we should be. Last year was the deviation. In fact last year may have set us back more than we've regained this season. Bye Molly.

 

Pretty much how I feel. After 2015 and just missing, 2016 should have been improvement, like this year, and just getting in the Playoffs. 2017.... this year, Division champion and a real threat all season. 2016 is not forgotten for me. I feel they have underperformed twice, because this year should have been the 3rd in an upward progression, and much better if 2016 had not been such a total collapse. Granted... the pitching. Or lack of it, might be a better way to regard it. And mostly.... I just think he had his 3 years, and is not the guy to move forward with. As much as I think parting with Meintkevitz was not a good move, I think moving on from Molitor would be. It would have been interesting to see Meintkevitz managing during these last three years, but we will never know how that would have turned out. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Pretty much how I feel. After 2015 and just missing, 2016 should have been improvement, like this year, and just getting in the Playoffs. 2017.... this year, Division champion and a real threat all season. 2016 is not forgotten for me. I feel they have underperformed twice, because this year should have been the 3rd in an upward progression, and much better if 2016 had not been such a total collapse. Granted... the pitching. Or lack of it, might be a better way to regard it. And mostly.... I just think he had his 3 years, and is not the guy to move forward with. As much as I think parting with Meintkevitz was not a good move, I think moving on from Molitor would be. It would have been interesting to see Meintkevitz managing during these last three years, but we will never know how that would have turned out. 

I don't think it's really fair to say they've underperformed twice because the 2017 squad is going to end up with a better record than the 2015 squad, which overperformed their metrics by a bunch (like 10+ wins IIRC).

 

That 2015 squad may have won 83 games but they played like a low- to mid-70s win team. And the 2016 squad, while they regressed, played like a high 60s win team IIRC.

 

The 2017 squad is better than the 2015 squad and by more than a little bit. They should end up roughly ten games better based on actual play.

[wsnydes]

 

I'm not going to be too upset either way but I think it's unfair to say they win despite him.

 

Do the Twins win despite Molitor's in-game management? I think one could make that argument and I'd agree with it.

 

But there's a lot that goes into managing that isn't in-game decisions. And Molitor's teams have overperformed twice and underperformed once. He's doing something right, I'd say.

I'm in the boat that thinks that this team wins despite Molitor's in-game management.  I think he's pretty good with the off the field stuff that we can see.  His teams are motivated and bounce back nicely after rough games.  I think most of the player development is due to his assistants, but I've always thought that he was a pretty good instructor.  He's got so much experience and knowledge of this game that can be passed along to current players.  I think he's gotten better at this, but I don't feel that he allows younger guys to learn by playing as much as he could.  I do think that he's gotten better overall over the course of his tenure, but with where this team is at I'm not crazy about a guy learning on the job at the helm.   

[nicksaviking]

*Cough, cough,

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/09/pete-mackanin-moved-to-phillies-front-office-will-not-manage-team-in-2018.html

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

I'm really conflicted on this one.  I simultaneously admire Molitor for many reasons and at the same time don't think he's a great in-game manager.  I do, however, think he's intelligent and fully capable of adapting to and/or incorporating newer tools like analytics.  He doesn't strike me as a close-minded thinker.

 

While this year's results can be looked at as him having "earned" a new contract, I would expect (and want) the Twins to see if there is something better available.  I do think this year's results ratchet up the pressure on the front office to be right, if they in fact go a different direction...(assuming Molitor wants to continue).

 

I'm wondering if they could promote him to a front office role that maximizes his strengths while allowing them to find a better game manager. Just my thought, but the manager of a baseball team is hardly the #2 guy in the org.

[DaveW]

I doubt Molitor would take a "promotion" to the front office, which basically would be a token promotion in name only.

Pretty sure if the Twins decide not to bring him back, there are several teams that would be more than happy to bring on the first manager to take a 100 loss team and take them to the playoffs 1 year later. Could definitely see Detroit poaching him.

I obviously think Mollie should be back regardless, but if he is able to break the Yankee curse? You absolutely positively without a doubt have to bring him back. First manager to advance past round one in the playoffs in what, 15 years? Yeah, you give him a 2 year extension at minimum.

[spinowner]

In today's Strib LEN III predicts Molitor will be AL MOY.

[jimmer]

 

In today's Strib LEN III predicts Molitor will be AL MOY.

He should.

[Brock Beauchamp]

No. In grand Twins tradition, he should take second.

[ashbury]

NY Times writer today has Mollie as MOY too. I don't see the Twins firing him. Some small chance Mollie pulls a Johnny Keane and quits, but I doubt that too.

[brvama]

 

I just don’t know the answer to some of the most important elements in terms of whether I think they should extend Molitor. 

 

Does he lead / utilize his coaching staff.  Does he identify objectives and use his staff effectively to pursue those objectives?

 

Is his experience and method of working with young players a significant part of the development we have seen in our young players?

 

Do the players work hard at developing their skills as a result of his leadership?

 

Does his leadership style help build team chemistry and desire to win.

 

How is he adapting to analytics?  I had heard or read that he is working with someone from the analytics department to construct the somewhat unusual lineups that some have criticized.  It does appear to be working.

This is exactly what I expect the FO to answer in their analysis of bringing Molitor back. While in-game management is important, I believe it is lower on a good evaluation list such as ML Ready has so aptly listed. While being ignorant of the facts here, it's my supposition that the answers will be positive for a new contract for Molitor. And if they do, I'm ok with that; as well as, I'm ok if they negatively demand a change. 

[GCTF]

130+ posts and no one noticed it says "Monitor"? Everyone must be suffering from play in game fever.

[Craig Arko]

130+ posts and no one noticed it says "Monitor"? Everyone must be suffering from play in game fever.

Ahem...

[Squirrel]

130+ posts and no one noticed it says "Monitor"? Everyone must be suffering from play in game fever.

I noticed it ... and could change it ... but I wasn't asked to ... yeah, I'm being a bit of a brat, but I'm tired of editing these things.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

130+ posts and no one noticed it says "Monitor"? Everyone must be suffering from play in game fever.

Oh, come on. Why'd you have to go and ruin it for everyone?

[GCTF]

 

Oh, come on. Why'd you have to go and ruin it for everyone?

I'll show myself out.

[nicksaviking]

I wanted Molitor replaced, but now I hear he's great friends with Bruce Springsteen and is hoping to get him into the clubhouse prior to the WC game? Ugh, that gets him so many check marks in the 'Keep him' column, I'm torn now.

 

However Molitor loves his song No Surrender, how does he not see that bunting is a total surrender! Maybe The Boss can explain the song to him.

[yarnivek1972]

Not sure being a friend, and by extension a contemporary, of Bruce Springsteen helps Molitor’s case. Springsteen’s last hit was “Streets of Philadelphia” in 1994.

 

Kinda just shows that Molitor is old.

[ashbury]

I'd definitely vote for it.

 

USS_Monitor_at_sea.jpg

Guess this'un needed bumping up for admiration.

[DaveW]

Not sure being a friend, and by extension a contemporary, of Bruce Springsteen helps Molitor’s case. Springsteen’s last hit was “Streets of Philadelphia” in 1994.

 

Kinda just shows that Molitor is old.

Watch your blasphemy sir!

[mikelink45]

I find that there are very few really superb managers and Molitor has twice exceeded expectations, so would I fire him?   No.  I believe Maddon and Showalter are not available and no one else is a genius out there.  Bring in some starters, fix the bullpen and see what happens. 

[Pardon My Dinger]

I find that there are very few really superb managers and Molitor has twice exceeded expectations, so would I fire him? No. I believe Maddon and Showalter are not available and no one else is a genius out there. Bring in some starters, fix the bullpen and see what happens.

Absolutely no offense intended towards you personally, but I believe there are likely numerous candidates out there who may not availed themselves to you. It may not be your job to find them, but that's what Falvine are here to do.

[twinssporto]

I highly doubt the FO will can Molitor.  The main reason is this (which I don't think anyone has mentioned yet in this thread).  This is a team made up of mostly young and less experienced players.  If I'm Falvey, why would I want to mess with the team chemistry?  Why take the chance of bringing in a new manager that could blow the whole thing up?  I don't see a lot of meaningful upside by bringing in a new manager.  

 

I also think its important that these younger guys have some stability in the area of manager.  Tom Kelly "grew up" with the younger guys that came in the early 80's and so did Gardy with the team in the 90's.  We don't know what goes on behind the locker room doors before and after the game but my instincts say these players like Molitor.  

 

Does Molitor make some questionable decisions during the game? Yes.  Is there any real meaningful upside by bringing in a new manager especially as we are ready to break out as a team? Statistically speaking I think it would be very minor.  

 

 

 

 

 

He does some unorthodox things occasionally but nothing that would be a fireable offense.  

[nicksaviking]

Not sure being a friend, and by extension a contemporary, of Bruce Springsteen helps Molitor’s case. Springsteen’s last hit was “Streets of Philadelphia” in 1994.

Kinda just shows that Molitor is old.

The Boss has had six #1 albums this century including The Rising which everyone has heard of, you're just listening to the wrong music!

 

Talk trash all you want about Molitor, but so help me, if I hear another bad word about him I will amend the Comment Policy to say negative expressions toward Bruce Springsteen are expressly prohibited and may result in a perma-ban from this site.

[old nurse]

 

Not sure being a friend, and by extension a contemporary, of Bruce Springsteen helps Molitor’s case. Springsteen’s last hit was “Streets of Philadelphia” in 1994.

Kinda just shows that Molitor is old.

Molitor is so old that if you now make what he made in his rookie contract you would  be considered  living in poverty.

Molitor is so old that very few on this board would have seen him play at the U,

Molitor is so old that many here would not remember seeing him play for he Brewers

Molitor is so old that some here would not remember seeing him as a player

That Molitor, and Springsteen, are old should not matter in Molitor's case.  Ageism belongs in the same place as racism.

[old nurse]

 

 

I highly doubt the FO will can Molitor.  The main reason is this (which I don't think anyone has mentioned yet in this thread).  This is a team made up of mostly young and less experienced players.  If I'm Falvey, why would I want to mess with the team chemistry?  Why take the chance of bringing in a new manager that could blow the whole thing up?  I don't see a lot of meaningful upside by bringing in a new manager.  

 

I also think its important that these younger guys have some stability in the area of manager.  Tom Kelly "grew up" with the younger guys that came in the early 80's and so did Gardy with the team in the 90's.  We don't know what goes on behind the locker room doors before and after the game but my instincts say these players like Molitor.  

 

Does Molitor make some questionable decisions during the game? Yes.  Is there any real meaningful upside by bringing in a new manager especially as we are ready to break out as a team? Statistically speaking I think it would be very minor.  

 

 

 

 

 

He does some unorthodox things occasionally but nothing that would be a fireable offense.  

To some here bunts and sacrifices are a fireable offense, never mind that over the last 4 years Cleveland and Texas, the organizations that the FO come from,  are in the AL top 5 for bunt hits and sacrifices. Their FO must have some metrics that fly in the face of fangraphs.