Pitching injuries

[USAFChief]

I think the baseball industry really needs to take a long hard look at how the training and development of pitchers has evolved.

Industry-wide there's been a gradual but long trend of asking less and less, with the hope of avoiding injury. Pitchers throw fewer and fewer pitches, over fewer and fewer innings. This is even more pronounced in the minors where young hurlers are to the point of never being asked to do even half what used to be commonplace. 

And it seems to me all this has accomplished is even MORE injuries. Quite honestly, I'm not surprised. 

I cant think of any other athletic activity in which the idea of enhancing endurance is thought to be the result of doing the activity less and less.

 

[Vanimal46]

https://www.latimes.com/sports/story/2025-07-20/mlb-pitching-injuries-keith-meister-tommy-john-surgery

A good article about the topic. Until changes are made at the top level, it's going to keep trickling down to the lower levels. Over the last 15+ years the only thing that's mattered is maxing out your effort, velocity, and spin on every pitch. Elbow ligaments be damned. 

[The Great Hambino]

6 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

I think the baseball industry really needs to take a long hard look at how the training and development of pitchers has evolved.

Industry-wide there's been a gradual but long trend of asking less and less, with the hope of avoiding injury. Pitchers throw fewer and fewer pitches, over fewer and fewer innings. This is even more pronounced in the minors where young hurlers are to the point of never being asked to do even half what used to be commonplace. 

And it seems to me all this has accomplished is even MORE injuries. Quite honestly, I'm not surprised. 

I cant think of any other athletic activity in which the idea of enhancing endurance is thought to be the result of doing the activity less and less.

 

It's because they're not trying to increase their endurance.  They're trying to increase their velocity.

They've decided that they're better off having starters go shorter but harder, then handing it off to a platoon of relievers that also are throwing harder and harder.  Sort of how even the world record holder in the 400 meter dash couldn't hold a candle to a mediocre 4x100 relay.  It's not as romantic or as aesthetically pleasing as seeing a Bob Gibson go the full 9 every time out, but it's coldly more effective against lineups where just about everyone is a legitimate threat to go deep.  Bob and his friends didn't have to face that in their day.  And if they came up today, they'd be throwing shorter and harder too.   And before someone goes "BUT BUT MADDUX!!!", we're talking about someone with perhaps the greatest command of his pitches of all time.  Unicorns don't disprove general trends.

To me, it's the logical endpoint of the race against batters to neutralize each other's power.  Players throw harder, swing harder, hit more homers, and strike out more often as a result.  I do wonder if this cultural shift is a byproduct of the steroid era.  Today's MLB pitchers were just starting their youth careers in the aftermath of that time period, and I wonder if the all-encompassing quest for velocity had permeated all levels of baseball instruction by then.

Secondarily, I've gotta believe that these lab-designed breaking pitches (which are also incredibly effective) aren't necessarily the best things for elbow ligaments.  But pretty much everyone has them now, so it's just next man up if someone goes down.  

What's the solution?  The best I can come up with is reducing the size of pitching rosters (with fewer available relievers, starters would have to pace themselves as a necessity), but that could just as easily create more problems than it solves.  It's also treating a symptom, not the disease. I don't know how that genie gets back into that bottle.

[DJL44]

34 minutes ago, The Great Hambino said:

What's the solution?  The best I can come up with is reducing the size of pitching rosters

Expansion could help. Increase the difference between the worst teams and the best teams. More blowouts where the best starting pitchers can get by with 80% of their stuff. End the DH and bring back pitchers hitting.

[Jim H]

Interesting topic. I have followed the Twins since they came to Minnesota. I tend to agree with Chief on his points about pitching. Pitching shouldn't be all about velocity and spin rate.  One of things I miss is the lack of craftmanship. Few pitchers have good command of their pitches. Few pitchers field their position well, cover 1b well, or hold runners on well.

It is interesting that with the emphasis on velocity, the use of the fastball is actually less. Reducing workloads for starters  means we are seeing more pitchers to the point where we usually see at least 25 different pitchers a year. The rotation of pitchers to protect your best pitchers arms means we get to watch a lot of bad pitching.

I don't have good solutions for all this. In the good old days a lot pitchers blew out their arms from overuse and poor management. There were a lot of guys who had a great season or two and were done at a young age. Unfortunately, modern pitcher management doesn't really change that reality.

[nicksaviking]

Yeah, this is tough. Hitters have adjusted to being able to hit 98 MPH fastballs and 90 MPH sliders. Everyone is going to look like Ted Williams if pitchers start pacing themselves like they did last century.

Bigger, stronger, faster has always been the evolution of pro sports. Guys were always going to figure out how to throw harder and harder. These ligaments ain't evolving though.

Let them carry nail files and throw spitballs again? 

[Eris]

19 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Hitters have adjusted to being able to hit 98 MPH fastballs and 90 MPH sliders.

Part of this is because in order to achieve max velocity many pitchers have a similar delivery.  The training for this starts before high school in many parts of country or the Caribbean. 

[jorgenswest]

At some point they will need to play on a larger field with more space between the bases, more distance from the pitcher to home plate and a correspondingly larger home plate. That will be beyond my lifetime. When it happens strikeouts will drop so successful pitchers will need to keep hitters off balance and get groundballs. On a bigger field successful position players are going to need more athleticism and speed.

I don’t think that conversation starts until there are a few really serious injuries or perhaps even deaths. That path is inevitable though with the always increasing pitch velocities and exit velocities.

[DJL44]

I wonder if a slightly heavier ball would help. It would prevent home runs and put more balls in play.

[strumdatjag]

And Cory Lewis is hurt despite being a knuckle-ball pitcher.  If thrown right, that pitch is viewed as putting less strain on an arm.   Does Cory Lewis throw it correctly?  Don’t ask me. 

[old nurse]

14 hours ago, Jim H said:

Interesting topic. I have followed the Twins since they came to Minnesota. I tend to agree with Chief on his points about pitching. Pitching shouldn't be all about velocity and spin rate.  One of things I miss is the lack of craftmanship. Few pitchers have good command of their pitches. Few pitchers field their position well, cover 1b well, or hold runners on well.

It is interesting that with the emphasis on velocity, the use of the fastball is actually less. Reducing workloads for starters  means we are seeing more pitchers to the point where we usually see at least 25 different pitchers a year. The rotation of pitchers to protect your best pitchers arms means we get to watch a lot of bad pitching.

I don't have good solutions for all this. In the good old days a lot pitchers blew out their arms from overuse and poor management. There were a lot of guys who had a great season or two and were done at a young age. Unfortunately, modern pitcher management doesn't really change that reality.

Anecdotal events for basing judgements are limited by the tendency to forget what doesn’t fit the thesis. The good old days days always are better because you forget. The bad 

[FlyingFinn]

10 hours ago, strumdatjag said:

And Cory Lewis is hurt despite being a knuckle-ball pitcher.  If thrown right, that pitch is viewed as putting less strain on an arm.   Does Cory Lewis throw it correctly?

He throws more than the knuckleball. With his lower fastball velocity, he probably thinks (or has been told) that he has to add a few mph to his fastball to have a chance at making it to the big leagues.

[Linus]

I’ve thought about this topic from a slightly different angle. Modern baseball isn’t as fun to watch due to long stretches of inactivity. Here is an idea that might work. 10 man pitching staffs combined with a deader ball. Pitchers would have to pitch more innings but with the deader ball they could go back to more of a pitch to contact approach. Try and get hitters out earlier in counts. More action and moves the game along. 

[Craig Arko]

Robot pitchers to go along with the robot umpires?

[DJL44]

1 hour ago, Linus said:

I’ve thought about this topic from a slightly different angle. Modern baseball isn’t as fun to watch due to long stretches of inactivity. Here is an idea that might work. 10 man pitching staffs combined with a deader ball. Pitchers would have to pitch more innings but with the deader ball they could go back to more of a pitch to contact approach. Try and get hitters out earlier in counts. More action and moves the game along. 

15-inning 1-0 games.

[Linus]

2 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

15-inning 1-0 games.

Could be but I’m not sure. They scored runs back in the day, it was just done differently 

[bean5302]

On 2/17/2026 at 11:16 AM, USAFChief said:

I think the baseball industry really needs to take a long hard look at how the training and development of pitchers has evolved.

Industry-wide there's been a gradual but long trend of asking less and less, with the hope of avoiding injury. Pitchers throw fewer and fewer pitches, over fewer and fewer innings. This is even more pronounced in the minors where young hurlers are to the point of never being asked to do even half what used to be commonplace. 

And it seems to me all this has accomplished is even MORE injuries. Quite honestly, I'm not surprised. 

I cant think of any other athletic activity in which the idea of enhancing endurance is thought to be the result of doing the activity less and less.

 

Higher velo = higher stress on the arm. High school kids are now maxing out the radar gun to try and get drafted.

Chase Petty hitting 100mph for example. He "threw" 100mph, but even today, his velo at the MLB level was 95-96mph last year and he sat about 94mph in previous MiLB years as I recall.

I think expecting 100-120 pitches from pitchers WOULD reduce injury but only because max effort pitching would go out the window as a result. This would have another impact in that movement, deception and more pitch options would grow in importance as hitters would crush lower velo pitches without superior movement.

Right now, teams believe there is an advantage in run production from max effort for 5-6 innings, and TJ every 5 years.

[UpstateNewYorker]

On 2/17/2026 at 12:58 PM, The Great Hambino said:

It's because they're not trying to increase their endurance.  They're trying to increase their velocity.

They've decided that they're better off having starters go shorter but harder, then handing it off to a platoon of relievers that also are throwing harder and harder.  Sort of how even the world record holder in the 400 meter dash couldn't hold a candle to a mediocre 4x100 relay.  It's not as romantic or as aesthetically pleasing as seeing a Bob Gibson go the full 9 every time out, but it's coldly more effective against lineups where just about everyone is a legitimate threat to go deep.  Bob and his friends didn't have to face that in their day.  And if they came up today, they'd be throwing shorter and harder too.   And before someone goes "BUT BUT MADDUX!!!", we're talking about someone with perhaps the greatest command of his pitches of all time.  Unicorns don't disprove general trends.

To me, it's the logical endpoint of the race against batters to neutralize each other's power.  Players throw harder, swing harder, hit more homers, and strike out more often as a result.  I do wonder if this cultural shift is a byproduct of the steroid era.  Today's MLB pitchers were just starting their youth careers in the aftermath of that time period, and I wonder if the all-encompassing quest for velocity had permeated all levels of baseball instruction by then.

Secondarily, I've gotta believe that these lab-designed breaking pitches (which are also incredibly effective) aren't necessarily the best things for elbow ligaments.  But pretty much everyone has them now, so it's just next man up if someone goes down.  

What's the solution?  The best I can come up with is reducing the size of pitching rosters (with fewer available relievers, starters would have to pace themselves as a necessity), but that could just as easily create more problems than it solves.  It's also treating a symptom, not the disease. I don't know how that genie gets back into that bottle.

Limiting the size of pitching staffs could be the solution. Teams would then have to start developing starting pitchers to go more than four or five innings.  (Right now there's no incentive for teams to do this.) They'd also have to have a long reliever or two on the staff instead of seven guys who pitch one inning.  A downside I suppose is there'd be a constant shuttling of pitchers from AAA, but that happens almost every season anyway. 

[stringer bell]

Another factor in the pitching injury game is that the players are accepting the risk of injury knowing there is a very good chance that they will be able to recover from the injury and pitch again. The number of pitchers who never suffer an injury encompassing at least half a season is pretty small.

[Twodogs]

Around 2009 it seemed like the strike zone expanded up, and squeezed closed on the sides of the plate a little bit.  Not saying this would be a fix all.  But a high strike from a pitcher that throws slower is not good.  Hard throwers and slower throwers can get ground balls when hitters have to chase a few more inches outside.  Maybe lower the zone a little bit and widen it a little bit and the control pitcher could be someone's 4th or 5th dude again??

[Chembry]

Here is a good article talking about velocity and UCL injuries:

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/is-velocity-really-the-culprit-behind-rising-baseball-injuries/

[Twodogs]

On 3/2/2026 at 12:46 PM, Chembry said:

Here is a good article talking about velocity and UCL injuries:

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/is-velocity-really-the-culprit-behind-rising-baseball-injuries/

Probably why guys who threw hard back in the day didn't get hurt nearly as often.  Like Nolan Ryan, in his day and age he didn't need to show up to so many prospect camps and throw as hard as he could.  Guys back then probably just played high school baseball and eventually got noticed, when they finally were fully developed.  Some developed early and got noticed early some developed later and got noticed later??