Week in Review: Lewis Awakens, Deadline Decisions Loom

[S Bart]

Ichiro Suzuki's full Hall of Fame induction speech | 07/27/2025 | MLB.com

CLASS ACT!!!

[Doctor Wu]

8 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

Man...I knew Lee had been bad lately but those totals for July are preposterously bad.

I didn't realize he had been that bad either. I think the idea of a demotion is warranted. 

[NYCTK]

8 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

Man...I knew Lee had been bad lately but those totals for July are preposterously bad.

Not really hindsight cause I said this at the time, but trading Lee before the 2024 season for major league help was very clearly the best way for him to improve the team. Sadly we now know he's another slow as hell Twin that plays a bad defense. So even if he does improve to become a 115 OPS+ type the Twins just have another Jose Miranda on their hands. 

[old nurse]

Yup Nick nailed it when he said that they can’t blame injuries., People must believe it did not matter the least bit that the ace of the pitching staff has been on the 60 day IL, the touted on these pages as a Cy Young candidate pitcher is also on the IL, because the next 2 men up Festa and Mathews are going to be stars an uninjured. 

[NYCTK]

17 minutes ago, old nurse said:

Yup Nick nailed it when he said that they can’t blame injuries., People must believe it did not matter the least bit that the ace of the pitching staff has been on the 60 day IL, the touted on these pages as a Cy Young candidate pitcher is also on the IL, because the next 2 men up Festa and Mathews are going to be stars an uninjured. 

And as we all know the Twins are the only team to ever experience injuries. Depth has never been discussed because injuries never happen and it's never needed. 

Have the Twins been one of the healthier teams the last couple seasons? Sure. But there were some injuries and no team can ever overcome that. 

[Vanimal46]

9 hours ago, Nick Nelson said:

What does breaking apart this core of players look like, in practicality? Get specific with me here Van.

Trade one of Duran and Jax 

Trade one of Wallner and Larnach - as we see with Julien and Miranda, their stock can always get worse. 

Combine Bader and Coulombe in the same trade to get a slightly better prospect 

Trade Castro 

Fire Rocco and see what a new voice does for the next 2 months. 

In the offseason, then we discuss trading one of Lopez, Ober, and Ryan

[Woof Bronzer]

9 hours ago, Nick Nelson said:

 If you're saying you want them to trade all their best players away and commit to being bad in the name of some vague rudderless rebuild, then no, I reject that notion fully.

Literally no one is saying this. 

Two weeks ago you ridiculed any fan who advocating selling at the deadline. Now you disingenuously are advocating the same thing and ridiculing any fan who points out your bad faith. It appears you've learned a thing or two from your favorite team about how to treat your customers poorly.  It's not our fault that you can't or won't see what's blatantly obvious:  this is a bad team and a bad organization.  

[Nick Nelson]

9 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

 

What it seems like is that you're taking your frustrations on how the season has played out on fans who just saw the writing on the wall before you did.  Rather than admit "Yup....changed my mind.  I held out hope longer.  I'm not excited and I'm guessing none of you were either.  This sucks...but it's the only way" you keep doubling down on bad faith arguments.

 

"The writing on the wall" implies it was a foregone conclusion they were going to go 3-6 coming out of the All-Star break. Nah. They play the games for a reason. I watch the games for a reason. Sitting there in early July when they are a couple games under .500 and saying they should give up and sell is not some sign of savvy baseball genius. It's a quitter mentality. 

They played badly since then, they blew opportunities against teams they very easily could have beaten, and as a result, now they are in position where they need to sell. That's how this works. You "change your mind" based on the events that play out. It's literally what happened with the actual front office. 

[Nick Nelson]

48 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

Trade one of Duran and Jax 

Trade one of Wallner and Larnach - as we see with Julien and Miranda, their stock can always get worse. 

Combine Bader and Coulombe in the same trade to get a slightly better prospect 

Trade Castro 

Fire Rocco and see what a new voice does for the next 2 months. 

In the offseason, then we discuss trading one of Lopez, Ober, and Ryan

None of this qualifies as "breaking up the core" at the deadline other than kind of trading Wallner or Larnach (which is a horrible idea btw). Rentals and the manager are not part of the core you were referencing.

If you wanna discuss trading Lopez, Ober or Ryan in the offseason sure, but understand you're just giving up on 2026 and giving ownership cover to cut spending. 

[Jeff K]

3 hours ago, NYCTK said:

Not really hindsight cause I said this at the time, but trading Lee before the 2024 season for major league help was very clearly the best way for him to improve the team. Sadly we now know he's another slow as hell Twin that plays a bad defense. So even if he does improve to become a 115 OPS+ type the Twins just have another Jose Miranda on their hands. 

I'm as unhappy with Lee as the next person, but he is a far better fielder than Miranda.  2nd base is not the right position for him.  He plays a solid 3rd base and an acceptable SS.  Miranda has no position.  But at least he can't hit either...since his hot streak last summer.  All that said, depending on what happens at the trade deadline, Lee should be playing for St. Paul soon.

[Nick Nelson]

25 minutes ago, Woof Bronzer said:

Literally no one is saying this. 

Two weeks ago you ridiculed any fan who advocating selling at the deadline. Now you disingenuously are advocating the same thing and ridiculing any fan who points out your bad faith. It appears you've learned a thing or two from your favorite team about how to treat your customers poorly.  It's not our fault that you can't or won't see what's blatantly obvious:  this is a bad team and a bad organization.  

Because two weeks ago advocating for selling at the deadline was lame. There was no bad faith. I said it then, I'm saying it now. I'm sick of people just assuming the team will suck and then saying "SEE I TOLD YOU." 

How about cheering for the team and hoping they do well, and then re-evaluating when they don't? It's what the front office did, it's what fans who actually like the Twins do. There's not some bonus prize for giving up as early as you can.

[Vanimal46]

7 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

If you wanna discuss trading Lopez, Ober or Ryan in the offseason sure, but understand you're just giving up on 2026 and giving ownership cover to cut spending

We’re on pace to miss the playoffs 4 out of 5 seasons. Giving up on 2026 is continuing doing the same thing. Relying on 3 injury prone players to carry the offense and filling the gaps with cheap, replacement level veterans. 

[Mike Sixel]

We've been asking Nick for a month what his plan is.....

[NYCTK]

26 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

"The writing on the wall" implies it was a foregone conclusion they were going to go 3-6 coming out of the All-Star break. Nah. They play the games for a reason. I watch the games for a reason. Sitting there in early July when they are a couple games under .500 and saying they should give up and sell is not some sign of savvy baseball genius. It's a quitter mentality. 

They played badly since then, they blew opportunities against teams they very easily could have beaten, and as a result, now they are in position where they need to sell. That's how this works. You "change your mind" based on the events that play out. It's literally what happened with the actual front office. 

They played badly before that too. For example, 2024. And the first half of 2025. 

Too many people think that a few lucky breaks, a 53-52 record and this team would miraculously be a contender. It hasn't been a contender since Gray left. And that's been obvious to those that are willing to see it. 

28 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

I'm sick of people just assuming the team will suck and then saying "SEE I TOLD YOU." 

(we told you so)

28 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

How about cheering for the team and hoping they do well, and then re-evaluating when they don't? It's what the front office did

This might explain why the front office has proven to be quite inept. I agree, fans should try to remain optimistic and hope for the 90th percentile outcomes for all their players. But that's absolutely not what a front office should be doing. 

[Nick Nelson]

8 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

They played badly before that too. For example, 2024. And the first half of 2025. 

Too many people think that a few lucky breaks, a 53-52 record and this team would miraculously be a contender. It hasn't been a contender since Gray left. And that's been obvious to those that are willing to see it. 

They were a .500 team in 2024 and the first half of 2025. That's not bad, it's meh. Certainly not indicative of a hopeless team. (What was the Tigers' record in 2023 and the first half of 2024? What was the Twins' record in 2022 and the first half of 2023?)

If the Twins had a 53-52 record right now they would be like 2 games out of a wild-card spot and very literally a contender. Again, you're welcome to just act negative and cynical at every turn, and I know there's a certain segment of people on this site and elsewhere who will happily join you, but most fans - and people in the game - understand that it's a sport of ups and downs, and things can change quickly. What happened last is not proof of what's going to happen next. If anything, with this team, quite the opposite.

[Nick Nelson]

40 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

We’re on pace to miss the playoffs 4 out of 5 seasons. Giving up on 2026 is continuing doing the same thing. Relying on 3 injury prone players to carry the offense and filling the gaps with cheap, replacement level veterans. 

And in your opinion the best thing to be done about this is trading one (or more) of their best pitchers in their primes for prospects while entrusting this front office to target the right guys and develop them? Rather than shoring up the offense and trying to win around these very good pitchers?

Again I don't see how this "rebuild" concept is doing anything other than giving ownership a pass to not try for a while. Having two ace-caliber starters atop your rotation is very obviously one of the single most important ingredients in building a championship contender,

[NYCTK]

2 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

They were a .500 team in 2024 and the first half of 2025. That's not bad, it's meh.

In the league's worst division and an astounding 70-79 against teams that weren't the worst team in major league history. 39-59 against teams above .500! I know you play the games you're given but the Twins "success" in 2024 was always a mirage. 

They've similarly been 24-34 against teams that are above .500 this season. It's a team built to compete in the AL Central exclusively. 

5 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

If the Twins had a 53-52 record right now they would be like 2 games out of a wild-card spot and very literally a contender.

This is the cause of the disconnect. No, a mediocre team sitting outside of the extended playoff format is NOT a contender. If you think they are, that's having remarkably low expectations. 

 

[TheLeviathan]

35 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

We've been asking Nick for a month what his plan is.....

He answered: do nothing.

Exciting!

[Vanimal46]

3 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

And in your opinion the best thing to be done about this is trading one (or more) of their best pitchers in their primes for prospects while entrusting this front office to target the right guys and develop them? Rather than shoring up the offense and trying to win around these very good pitchers?

Again I don't see how this "rebuild" concept is doing anything other than giving ownership a pass to not try for a while. Having two ace-caliber starters atop your rotation is very obviously one of the single most important ingredients in building a championship contender,

That’s the position we’re in Nick. They will have to trade their surplus of pitching talent to shore up the offense. Because the budget for FA will be minimal once again. There’s no path to shoring up the offense and trying to win with this group of pitchers. If we only trade one of Ober, Lopez, and Ryan, that still leaves 2 ace-caliber starters atop your rotation. 

[SteveLV]

I would personally rather watch a young team put up this kind of record and try and develop those young players and give them MLB at bats than watch this current mess of a team supplemented by waiver wire wannabes.

With no cap in MLB, the only way this team can get competitive is to hit on some young prospects and ride them before they go play for the Yankees and Dodgers.

[TheLeviathan]

58 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

"The writing on the wall" implies it was a foregone conclusion they were going to go 3-6 coming out of the All-Star break. Nah. They play the games for a reason. I watch the games for a reason. Sitting there in early July when they are a couple games under .500 and saying they should give up and sell is not some sign of savvy baseball genius. It's a quitter mentality. 

They played badly since then, they blew opportunities against teams they very easily could have beaten, and as a result, now they are in position where they need to sell. That's how this works. You "change your mind" based on the events that play out. It's literally what happened with the actual front office. 

Not a foregone conclusion, a matter of probability.  You're the one dealing in absolutes here and it's part of the problem.  Could they have gone on a heater and I changed my mind?  Possible.  Likely?  I mean, mathematically their best percentage of playoffs was 20ish percent.

The issue isn't about changing your mind.  The issue is the BS arguments where you call people quitters.  Another example: you're in this thread arguing that selling is "giving cover to ownership" - aren't you the same person who argued "people are overrating the role ownership plays"?  You know, when several of us pointed out that selling is our only option because we know ownership won't buy anyone....YOU gave cover to ownership.  (I can cite those posts if you want to deny it)

All of us know the Front Office will wait to make that call.  It's ok that you waited longer to make that call.  I won't call you names for waiting.  I get it.  But....tt doesn't make us quitters, or excited, or whatever other ******** label you want to use next that we decided sooner.  It just means we arrived there quicker based on what we were seeing.  

[TheLeviathan]

8 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

That’s the position we’re in Nick. They will have to trade their surplus of pitching talent to shore up the offense. Because the budget for FA will be minimal once again. There’s no path to shoring up the offense and trying to win with this group of pitchers. If we only trade one of Ober, Lopez, and Ryan, that still leaves 2 ace-caliber starters atop your rotation. 

This is the key.  How else do we change this roster if not trading?

Ownership tapped out two years ago.  That's not changing.  It's trade or get miracle development.  And how's that last one looked the last two years?

[rdehring]

Interesting article, Nick.  And very interesting discussion by everyone here.

I was so hopeful earlier this season for another year of exciting baseball.  After all, guys my age don't have a lot of seasons left to enjoy.  So I watched the first couple innings yesterday, then asked my wife if she wanted to get started on that puzzle we bought on Saturday.  So for me, the Twins have lost me for another year.

Want to comment on Brooks Lee.  Will agree with the above comments that he is slow.  That got my attention as I love the way a lot of smaller market teams play that have a ton of speed.  But I want to defend Lee's defense a bit.  I'm not saying his D has been good.  But it seems since the day he arrived in Minnesota he has been playing three different positions.  Considering his background, I believe if the Twins let him play one position for an extended period he would eventually be good defensively at said position.  Also believe he was rushed to the Twins last year and the rest of the year at St. Paul to work on his hitting and ONE defensive position would help.

Must disagree, however, with your comment on trading one of Larnach or Wallner.  Heck, if they got the right offer I would trade both of them.  Neither is good defensively and both are slow.  On the other hand, will be disappointed if Bader gets traded.  Would like to see him re-signed at year's end as their fourth outfielder for the next couple years. 

[Blyleven2011]

59 minutes ago, Nick Nelson said:

Because two weeks ago advocating for selling at the deadline was lame. There was no bad faith. I said it then, I'm saying it now. I'm sick of people just assuming the team will suck and then saying "SEE I TOLD YOU." 

How about cheering for the team and hoping they do well, and then re-evaluating when they don't? It's what the front office did, it's what fans who actually like the Twins do. There's not some bonus prize for giving up as early as you can.

This season was over coming out of spring training , as most fans here have a love of the game and want the twins to succeed  , it just isn't⁵ going to happen ...

Vanimal46 said trade 1 or the other of wallner or larnach , well it would not be wise to trade wallner because  his value has plummeted even though he would be the one I would trade or at least demote to AAA  ...

We need to make changes for the better , we haven't made any real changes since deadline of 2022 and here we are , a stagnant offense with solid team pitching  , we need both 

We as fans evaluate players every single game , our game is not exciting , no speed , no fundamentals  , offense has been in the tank since spring except for a 13 game winning streak ( by the way , has anyone ever looked up to see if a team has had 2 consecutive seasons with a 12 game plus winning streak and not made the playoffs ) ...

I hope nick you get your hope on the twins turning this around  but your in for a big disappointment or you can rub it in our faces ...

We are old baseball players that didn't make it all the way to the show , I had a passion to at least try in the 70's with several clubs at their June tryouts , I had talent , just not enough ...

I do cheer for the Twins , I live for opening day and the world series and everything in-between  ...

[rdehring]

20 minutes ago, Blyleven2011 said:

This season was over coming out of spring training , as most fans here have a love of the game and want the twins to succeed  , it just isn't⁵ going to happen ...

Vanimal46 said trade 1 or the other of wallner or larnach , well it would not be wise to trade wallner because  his value has plummeted even though he would be the one I would trade or at least demote to AAA  ...

We need to make changes for the better , we haven't made any real changes since deadline of 2022 and here we are , a stagnant offense with solid team pitching  , we need both 

We as fans evaluate players every single game , our game is not exciting , no speed , no fundamentals  , offense has been in the tank since spring except for a 13 game winning streak ( by the way , has anyone ever looked up to see if a team has had 2 consecutive seasons with a 12 game plus winning streak and not made the playoffs ) ...

I hope nick you get your hope on the twins turning this around  but your in for a big disappointment or you can rub it in our faces ...

We are old baseball players that didn't make it all the way to the show , I had a passion to at least try in the 70's with several clubs at their June tryouts , I had talent , just not enough ...

I do cheer for the Twins , I live for opening day and the world series and everything in-between  ...

Loved the above comment, Blyleven.  Although I never played the game, your last few lines brought tears to my eyes.  Thanks!

[DJL44]

2 hours ago, Nick Nelson said:

"The writing on the wall" implies it was a foregone conclusion they were going to go 3-6 coming out of the All-Star break. Nah. They play the games for a reason. I watch the games for a reason. Sitting there in early July when they are a couple games under .500 and saying they should give up and sell is not some sign of savvy baseball genius. It's a quitter mentality. 

Their playoff odds were less than 10% at the All-Star break. This team has been mostly bad since last August. Success after the break was the least likely scenario.

[KBJ1]

Sadly it's sell time. First the Team. New owners get rid of Falvey & Baldelli.

So much for our "prospects" Lee, Martin, Miranda, Julien, none of whom will ever be star players. Trade them all for a couple of youngsters with potential.

The one expiring contract we need to keep is Coulumbe. We have Zero LH pitchers in the organization and he won't be that expensive next year. Other than that, I got nothing. This season of "it's all going to come together" never got off the ground. Matthews & Keaschall are the lone bright spots (& Buxton) in a season of poor coaching, poor play & injuries. The same reasons, in inverse order,  as the last few seasons.

It ALL needs to change. 

[Woof Bronzer]

2 hours ago, Nick Nelson said:

How about cheering for the team and hoping they do well, and then re-evaluating when they don't? It's what the front office did, it's what fans who actually like the Twins do. There's not some bonus prize for giving up as early as you can.

Lol now you're on to fan policing.  Resorting to calling those who disagree with you bad fans is a real sign that you're winning the conversation.  Well done sir. 

2 hours ago, Nick Nelson said:

Because two weeks ago advocating for selling at the deadline was lame.

This is the same team it was two weeks ago.   Sorry you couldn't see what everyone else could.  Nobody likes being wrong, but lashing out and calling people "quitters" and "lame" and bad fans is frankly middle school behavior.  

[theBOMisthebomb]

46 minutes ago, Blyleven2011 said:

This season was over coming out of spring training , as most fans here have a love of the game and want the twins to succeed  , it just isn't⁵ going to happen ...

Vanimal46 said trade 1 or the other of wallner or larnach , well it would not be wise to trade wallner because  his value has plummeted even though he would be the one I would trade or at least demote to AAA  ...

We need to make changes for the better , we haven't made any real changes since deadline of 2022 and here we are , a stagnant offense with solid team pitching  , we need both 

We as fans evaluate players every single game , our game is not exciting , no speed , no fundamentals  , offense has been in the tank since spring except for a 13 game winning streak ( by the way , has anyone ever looked up to see if a team has had 2 consecutive seasons with a 12 game plus winning streak and not made the playoffs ) ...

I hope nick you get your hope on the twins turning this around  but your in for a big disappointment or you can rub it in our faces ...

We are old baseball players that didn't make it all the way to the show , I had a passion to at least try in the 70's with several clubs at their June tryouts , I had talent , just not enough ...

I do cheer for the Twins , I live for opening day and the world series and everything in-between  ...

Did you play in high school, college, town ball, or the minor leagues? I find everyone's playing journey interesting. If you are located in or near Minnesota and want to continue playing the sport, there is an age 50+ baseball league and also a 60+ baseball league. They use wood bats and it's a great chance to get out there and compete. 

[Nick Nelson]

1 hour ago, rdehring said:

Must disagree, however, with your comment on trading one of Larnach or Wallner.  Heck, if they got the right offer I would trade both of them.  Neither is good defensively and both are slow.  

Who's going to come along and give the offer, at this moment in time, for either one of them? They are playing some of the worst ball of their careers right now! That was my point, not that I'm opposed to the general idea of trading either one.

I don't think a lot of the ideas being proposed as deadline plans are actually sensible or realistic, other than selling off rentals. Which, I'm sorry, isn't going to upgrade the system all that meaningfully. A lot of people yelling at me for being unwelcoming of change while refusing to acknowledge the realities and implications of making those changes.