Pohlad Family, Lords of the Realm, Choose Preserving Profit Over Seizing a Moment

[Parfigliano]

2 hours ago, NYCTK said:

The Mets have supplanted the Twins as my primary team. Not only because I live in New York now, but because it's refreshing to follow a team that actually wants to win. Steve Cohen is obnoxious with his massive wealth, but it's refreshing to see an owner that does not view his team as an asset to increase his wealth but instead a sports franchise which he wants to help win games.

An owner that's a fan of his team, how novel!

Also a Met fan.  Cohen spends freely.  He needs to learn how to spend.

[jimmyc]

Twins Writers, Pencil Pushers of the Realm, Push an Old, Sorry Trope instead of Original Thought and Writing!

[CRF]

Ted...I'm afraid you just got yourself crossed off the Pohlad Xmas/Hanukkah card list, and you can forget about getting an invite to dinner at one of their posh abodes. Proud of you, bud! 

[Blyleven2011]

It is plausible that the twins can win the division  with our easy schedule  , that's what we should be doing against bad teams ...

It's the elite teams we have to worry about in the playoffs  , we haven't played the elite teams well this season  ...

With little help at the trade deadline we could've been stronger contenders,  now I'm afraid the twins are going to embarrass us by starting another losing streak in the playoffs  ...

If we make the playoffs and get swept , pohlads face cutting payroll  again next year because they already know attendance and profits will be less ...

It discouraging that the owners did nothing to encourage the fans optimizium  , the fans see the window is open but the owners keep slaming the windows shut , not good business when the opportunity for glory  doesn't present its self maybe but once a decade ...

Ted I got reprimanded a couple of years ago for calling the pohlads PP's ...

[KirbyDome89]

1 hour ago, Vanimal46 said:

I’m bored of the Pohlad bashing. There’s 30+ years of evidence how they run the team. They actually shared the truth about having a very tight budget this season. Some chose not to listen.

At least this year they didn’t insult our intelligence by saying “We definitely would have approved a trade if Falvey presented it to us” 

We are all adults with the ability to make our own decisions. There’s 29 other MLB teams. I’m looking forward to this pity party ending and getting back to talking about the current roster of Twins players. 

They literally just marched Falvey out to explain that financial constraints had nothing to do with the inactivity at the deadline. That seems equally insulting. 

Everybody gets to choose their level of investment in this team. I have no issue with fans being pissed about what's going on with this club after a very public reminder. 

[Jocko87]

2 hours ago, Mike Sixel said:

We have reports from MN reporters saying money was an issue. I don't know how else to take that, other than money was an issue.

Well frankly, the reporting was absolute hot garbage.  That's a start.

I made a quick list of pitchers moved that would have been financially less than what they actually did.  Puk, Banks, Erceg and a dozen others would have been less money.  More prospect cost, but less dollars.

Not choosing to move on any of the dozens of cheaper (maybe better) players available would at minimum dispel the notion this is all about money.

Was money limiting in some ways? Sure but I'm not convinced it was any more than usual.  If the Pale Hose wanted one of the top 3 for Fedde, they can fedde the fedde off. 

All that said, count me among the disappointed that they didn't spend something from the prospect account to get a lefty.  But I trust our guys not to spend stupidly as well.  

[Jocko87]

Quote

Finding a Pohlad Pocket Protector in this era would be something of a miracle.

The bar was low.  It was not cleared.  JFC with this drivel. 

[Blyleven2011]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

I think this is fair. I think it's also fair that people vent less than 24 hours after the team they root for does nothing at the trade deadline. Not even a full day yet. 

I've been venting  24 / 7 , 365 days a year , makes me feel good  but I get nothing in return  ...

[Jim wyllie]

I agree the pohlads need to increase the teams payroll to give the fans a chance to have a championship team.  However, there were really no true impact players who could have given the team a significant boost available, and teams were often asking too much for the players available.  Yes I would love to see them acquire better players, but I think they made the best choices they could.  A rental player isn't worth selling the farm.  This off season they need to do 2 significant things.  First get a good tv deal settled and second parlay that into impact acquisition for the roster.

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, Jim wyllie said:

I agree the pohlads need to increase the teams payroll to give the fans a chance to have a championship team.  However, there were really no true impact players who could have given the team a significant boost available, and teams were often asking too much for the players available.  Yes I would love to see them acquire better players, but I think they made the best choices they could.  A rental player isn't worth selling the farm.  This off season they need to do 2 significant things.  First get a good tv deal settled and second parlay that into impact acquisition for the roster.

They have 10 40+ and 5 40 value players. They could have added a LHP for two of those and not sold the farm. It's not a switch, on/off. It's a dial.

[BH67]

"The Pohlads, coming in as something around the tenth richest owners in the sport, want you to believe that television uncertainty circumscribed their plans. They were one of more than a dozen teams dealing with that reality, but were the last (even behind Oakland) to make a trade. Major League Baseball is subsidizing their losses, and the franchise took the most lucrative deal they could get this winter, despite shutting fans out for three months in the process."

This hypothesis has become the irrefutable truth of the staff and much of the readership at Twins Daily. Perhaps you're right after showing that clip from Derek Falvey. Perhaps. If true, nothing will change this except either 1) a new owner or 2) the walkout of Falvine, combined with open sniping in the media by CC4 and other stars.

So let's first determine if this hypothesis is indeed true by getting the Pohlad family to explain it. That will require a concerted effort by traditional and social media working together, of which Twins Daily considers itself a key player. The unmitigated accusations and fury being expressed here in the absence of such clarity makes reading stories here not worth my time.

[Mike Sixel]

6 minutes ago, BH67 said:

"The Pohlads, coming in as something around the tenth richest owners in the sport, want you to believe that television uncertainty circumscribed their plans. They were one of more than a dozen teams dealing with that reality, but were the last (even behind Oakland) to make a trade. Major League Baseball is subsidizing their losses, and the franchise took the most lucrative deal they could get this winter, despite shutting fans out for three months in the process."

This hypothesis has become the irrefutable truth of the staff and much of the readership at Twins Daily. Perhaps you're right after showing that clip from Derek Falvey. Perhaps. If true, nothing will change this except either 1) a new owner or 2) the walkout of Falvine, combined with open sniping in the media by CC4 and other stars.

So let's first determine if this hypothesis is indeed true by getting the Pohlad family to explain it. That will require a concerted effort by traditional and social media working together, of which Twins Daily considers itself a key player. The unmitigated accusations and fury being expressed here in the absence of such clarity makes reading stories here not worth my time.

The media did report that money was an issue. What more do you want?

[BH67]

27 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

The media did report that money was an issue. What more do you want?

On these pages, "money being an issue" is synonymous with "the Pohlads are cheap and squeezing out cash value like a private equity firm." I am not convinced of the latter, but I can be.

[Mike Sixel]

17 minutes ago, BH67 said:

On these pages, "money being an issue" is synonymous with "the Pohlads are cheap and squeezing out cash value like a private equity firm." I am not convinced of the latter, but I can be.

No one is going to answer those questions......

[Vanimal46]

2 hours ago, KirbyDome89 said:

Everybody gets to choose their level of investment in this team. I have no issue with fans being pissed about what's going on with this club after a very public reminder.

Maybe one day Charlie Brown will kick that football Lucy is holding. 

[USAFChief]

2 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

Maybe one day Charlie Brown will kick that football Lucy is holding. 

Maybe.

But it seems to me you're mostly upset with sweet, gullible Charlie instead of with evil Lucy.

Or at least, that's who you're yelling at.

 

 

[Twins GFP]

5 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

I'm sorry ashbury about those big business takeovers that affected your life. This world is tough for the small guy. The Pohlad's takeover of the Twins wasn't eliminating the small guy but saving MLB baseball here in MN. The Twins were about to go out the door to somewhere else before the Pohlads stepped in & saved the day. They kept the Twins in MN, not only to just get by but also to bring a WS championship to MN. Whom I'm very grateful because they gave us many teams for us to cheer for. Plus I grew up under the Griffith era.

Andy MacPhail left the Twins because MN is a mid-market team not able to sustain a perennial WS contender. IDK if the Pohlads are losing money, making money or milking the money cow. But I don't begrudge them of making a profit to keep the Twins in MN. This Pohlad bashing especially by media does nothing to better the Twins situation but only sours the fans' support & maybe the Pohlads' motivation. Maybe one day they wake up & realize the Twins aren't worth the headache & sell the team to Nashville. Is that what we want? I think not. We need to quit blaming the Pohlads for this FO inability to initiate big trades.

This may be the first Pohlad apologist I have seen on this website.  Congratulations, you are a trailblazer!

1)  The Twins are making money.  Period.  Either in year-over-year cash profit or in overall team value.  To say otherwise is 100% false.  If owning a professional team was not a money maker, leagues would not exist (unless you are the WNBA subsidized by the NBA).

2) The complaint about the Pohlads is not just about the trade deadline.  The deadline inactivity just keeps compounding the major public missteps this team has made since the end of last year.

3) Owning a professional sports team is a long-view proposition.  It is not about squeezing every last penny you can today.  The Bally decision to take the immediate money now probably earned the team an extra few million today, but how much are they losing all of the other secondary revenue that comes with higher visibility?  Not to mention lower gate sales at home games... How many years is it going to take to repair that damage?  You need to spend money to make money, they just don't seem to get that.

I have said this before and will say it again.  I am a huge Twins fan.  I have been around long enough to see games at the old Met stadium.  I just want the Twins ownership to actually care about the product and their customers, instead of just looking at everyone like dollar signs.  Where is Mark Cuban when you need him?  

[BH67]

56 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

No one is going to answer those questions......

Then we're arguing over hearsay. A simpler route of discovery would be for the Twins to release audited annual financial statements. The Braves have done this recently, so there's precedent from which to request them.

[tony&rodney]

3 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

Not choosing to move on any of the dozens of cheaper (maybe better) players available would at minimum dispel the notion this is all about money.

 

True, but what does one do with their hate in that case?

[tony&rodney]

6 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

The Pohlad's takeover of the Twins wasn't eliminating the small guy but saving MLB baseball here in MN. The Twins were about to go out the door to somewhere else before the Pohlads stepped in & saved the day. They kept the Twins in MN,

FWIW, there were other groups willing to buy the Twins. MLB has final and complete control of who can buy a franchise. The other groups were not approved. A third group, in addition to the two rejected, was headed by Calvin's son. Believe it or not, the terms of sale were actually doable - $5M down with 5 years of payments of $5M each and then a balloon for the remainder. The sale did not include the minority portion owned by a Gabe Murphy (off the top of my head), which was 42-48% but had zero vote or control in the team. Carl later paid about $12M for those shares. 

Carl Pohlad did not save the Twins, but the ownership has been stable. This is more than some clubs and one should always be careful when making wishes.

Someone mentioned Mark Cuban in a comment recently. I forgot the context. Cuban tried to buy an MLB team but was turned down. MLB is an exclusive club. You cannot get in just because you have billions.

[Jocko87]

8 minutes ago, BH67 said:

Then we're arguing over hearsay. A simpler route of discovery would be for the Twins to release audited annual financial statements. The Braves have done this recently, so there's precedent from which to request them.

The precedent is that they are required to release them.  Everyone else is just guessing, and even financial statements are read differently by different people.

I guess that would get everyone the ownership change everyone seems to want.  Careful what you wish for, it would then have to be run as a business.

On the other hand, they could raise money from selling stock, which I would buy.  The org is in great hands, overall.  It's a long term deal, as mentioned many times, and they don't need the Twins Daily fan.  They already have us.  What they are doing, is not for us.

[stringer bell]

The Twins aren’t alone in having a goal of reducing payroll. Ownership seems to have a hard limit so that taking on even a small major league contract is more than they will tolerate. I suspect the payroll ceiling will be even more stringent in 2025, and at some point trading players because of their salary will be even a bigger factor.

They couldn’t unload Vázquez or Kepler for anywhere near fair value and they couldn’t move Farmer at all, so there was no room to add payroll. I’m not surprised. I certainly don’t like the path they’ve chosen and I think it is shortsighted. 

[Mike Sixel]

34 minutes ago, BH67 said:

Then we're arguing over hearsay. A simpler route of discovery would be for the Twins to release audited annual financial statements. The Braves have done this recently, so there's precedent from which to request them.

braves are publicly traded.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

The Pohlads just bankrolled record payrolls in 2022 and 2023. I'm not buying the narrative on this site right now. 

[Vanimal46]

3 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Maybe.

But it seems to me you're mostly upset with sweet, gullible Charlie instead of with evil Lucy.

Or at least, that's who you're yelling at.

 

 

The ball has been pulled 30 years in a row. I’ve learned not to attempt the kick anymore. 

[Mike Sixel]

24 minutes ago, Hosken Bombo Disco said:

The Pohlads just bankrolled record payrolls in 2022 and 2023. I'm not buying the narrative on this site right now. 

So, the reporting was bunk?

[Craig Arko]

7 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

The ball has been pulled 30 years in a row. I’ve learned not to attempt the kick anymore. 

Seems like a wise course.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

So, the reporting was bunk?

What reporting? 
(honest question; as i am not following the day to day much right now)

[Mike Sixel]

19 minutes ago, Hosken Bombo Disco said:

What reporting? 
(honest question; as i am not following the day to day much right now)

Dan Hayes reported money was an issue in making any deals. Unsure who else did...

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

15 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Dan Hayes reported money was an issue in making any deals. Unsure who else did...

I guess I knew that. The narrative I would push back on is that the Pohlads are cheap. Which sounds weird (to borrow a phrase). Record payrolls the last two years, and then a payroll reset this year. I can make sense of that logic. 

Falvey had all offseason and all summer to get creative and work a deal around the payroll constraints. Sounds like moving Kepler and a good prospect to New York for Nestor Cortes was a possibility at one point. Maybe try to trade away Margot’s salary for a song.