Desclafani health

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

Does anyone have any update on Desclafani and his elbow.  I have read where they expect him to be healthy, however that doesn't quite jive with what has occurred.  So Desclafani,  was struggling they found the grade 1 flexor strain and shut him down, after 2-3 weeks or a month can heal on its own.  They checked him again in July, it had not healed.  They then gave him a prp injection,  which if works should be healed in 8-12 weeks,  He was expected to be cleared at the end of Sept. early October and said it in an interview.   However, at the trade we received an update he has still not been cleared.  

DeSclafani was limited to 19 starts in 2023 due to a right flexor strain, and while the hope is that he'll be ready for Opening Day, he's yet to get the all clear. Once healthy, he'll compete with Chris Paddack and Louie Varland for one of the final two spots in MInnesota's rotation.

So he has gone now almost 7-8 months and it still hasn't healed on its own, even with the PRP injections.  Am I missing something here?  To me looks like a Tommy John candidate unless he is close to getting full bill of health they are just waiting a little longer to ensure strength.  Does anyone have any input on this?  

[Cory Engelhardt]

I've read that he should be ready for spring training. I guess we'll find out soon if that is true. 

[stringer bell]

With ST just a few days away, I guess we’ll soon find out where DeSclafani is medically. mlbtraderumors.com had a list of possible 60-day IL assignments and didn’t include DeSclafani, but did list Staumont. 

[DocBauer]

22 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

With ST just a few days away, I guess we’ll soon find out where DeSclafani is medically. mlbtraderumors.com had a list of possible 60-day IL assignments and didn’t include DeSclafani, but did list Staumont. 

I would like to think that Staumont is NOT a 60 day candidate because he's either ready, or expected to be really soon, so they don't want him on the 60 day and unavailable for that long.

I'd like to think the Twins checked him out thoroughly and believe he's ready or relatively close to it.

(crossing fingers)

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

35 minutes ago, DocBauer said:

I would like to think that Staumont is NOT a 60 day candidate because he's either ready, or expected to be really soon, so they don't want him on the 60 day and unavailable for that long.

I'd like to think the Twins checked him out thoroughly and believe he's ready or relatively close to it.

(crossing fingers)

Staumont when he talks is already throwing the ball.  Maybe not at 100% and maybe taking a little longer to get his feel back.  I agree I don't think they plan to put him on the 60 day.  The only change in that philosphy is that the plan was always to put him on the 60 day, and treat him as almost a trade deadline player that you don't have to trade any assets for. 

Desclafani's situation is just weird as he hasn't been given an all clear for almost 8 months.  

[jorgenswest]

If either isn’t 100% early in the spring they should utilize the 60. They are going to need time at 100% building up and they will probably need the full rehab slot. That will take close to the 60 days. These two pitchers are going to need to be 100% to be helpful. Give them the early part of the season to get right. There probably won’t be a time in the season where the Twins are healthier than in April. They will need them at their best as other injuries occur.

[CRF]

It wouldn't shock me in the least to see Desclafani go in for a TJ job before too long. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 hour ago, jorgenswest said:

If either isn’t 100% early in the spring they should utilize the 60. They are going to need time at 100% building up and they will probably need the full rehab slot. That will take close to the 60 days. These two pitchers are going to need to be 100% to be helpful. Give them the early part of the season to get right. There probably won’t be a time in the season where the Twins are healthier than in April. They will need them at their best as other injuries occur.

If he isn't healthy,  it means the strain isn't healing on its own, or with PRP injections, meaning he will need Tommy John.  Even if cleared I am going to be having Paddack nightmares in those first 2 months worried it gives out.  If he can get 3-4 months in should be good to get through the season.  

[jorgenswest]

58 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

If he isn't healthy,  it means the strain isn't healing on its own, or with PRP injections, meaning he will need Tommy John.  Even if cleared I am going to be having Paddack nightmares in those first 2 months worried it gives out.  If he can get 3-4 months in should be good to get through the season.  

Makes sense. Paddack was pretty effective until the injury. I hope that DeSclafani doesn’t throw too many ineffective innings while injured. If he isn’t right IL him. 

[DJL44]

Didn't he have to get a physical to get traded?

[stringer bell]

We have a rather offhand mention that he had not begun throwing (as of ??) and many here are already putting him on the 60-day IL prepping for TJ surgery. The most recent thing I’ve read (from BBRef) is that only Staumont is a possible 60-day assignment, which would indicate that DeSclafani will be participating in Spring Training.

Given his injury in 2023, I am skeptical that non-surgical treatment will get him all the way back, but the Twins must have thoroughly examined his medical records. I don’t think it is worth it to speculate, especially with Spring Training on the horizon, when there will be concrete answers. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

On 2/10/2024 at 10:11 PM, stringer bell said:

We have a rather offhand mention that he had not begun throwing (as of ??) and many here are already putting him on the 60-day IL prepping for TJ surgery. The most recent thing I’ve read (from BBRef) is that only Staumont is a possible 60-day assignment, which would indicate that DeSclafani will be participating in Spring Training.

Given his injury in 2023, I am skeptical that non-surgical treatment will get him all the way back, but the Twins must have thoroughly examined his medical records. I don’t think it is worth it to speculate, especially with Spring Training on the horizon, when there will be concrete answers. 

No if they were taking him on as a negative asset, affective "as-is."  the medical records or physical would make no difference.  They would know a heck of a lot more about the situation than us.  Even still,  a player that has not been cleared for 8 months from injury, does not sound good.  And in, he has not pitched for 8 months,  there is a very real possibility he will need the 60 day even if healthy just to strengthen up.  I have no idea what the Twins have planned, and maybe he is cleared tomorrow for all I know.   I much more concerned on his health than I was when we traded for him.  

[Major League Ready]

On 2/10/2024 at 2:17 PM, DocBauer said:

I would like to think that Staumont is NOT a 60 day candidate because he's either ready, or expected to be really soon, so they don't want him on the 60 day and unavailable for that long.

I'd like to think the Twins checked him out thoroughly and believe he's ready or relatively close to it.

(crossing fingers)

If they put him on today, he would only be unavailable for the 1st 2 weeks of the season.

[jorgenswest]

I respect the Giants front office and wonder if there is enough left for him to approach a league average starter. There is no guarantee he comes back all the way from his injuries combined with the natural decline from his last good season at age 31 to age 34.

The Braves took on some bad contracts this winter and released or outrighted or traded with cash the players. I think that includes Marco González, David Fletcher, Evan White, Max Stassi and Matt Carpenter. The Mariners found a new home for DeSclafani. The Twins have kept him. 

He really needs to show something in the spring. He can’t be the 5th starter if Varland is ahead of him. If he gets that spot he needs to perform and continue to perform. The Twins won’t find a taker during the season to flip a mediocre starter. They will need to release him at that point,

[jorgenswest]

24 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

If they put him on today, he would only be unavailable for the 1st 2 weeks of the season.

I think the 60 day starts on opening day or maybe the first game of the season where opening days vary by team.

[IndianaTwin]

11 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

I think the 60 day starts on opening day or maybe the first game of the season where opening days vary by team.

Correct -- someone can be put on the 60-day at the beginning of spring training, but the 60-day calendar itself doesn't start until Opening Day. 

[stringer bell]

14 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

I think the 60 day starts on opening day or maybe the first game of the season where opening days vary by team.

That's correct. The 60-day list can be used once teams report to camp, but the 60 days start on Opening Day, so anyone put on the 60-day IL is out until the tail end of May.

Edit: Ninja'd by @IndianaTwin!

[IndianaTwin]

On 2/10/2024 at 11:11 PM, stringer bell said:

.... I don’t think it is worth it to speculate, especially with Spring Training on the horizon, when there will be concrete answers. 

What's the purpose of the internet if not to speculate on things without complete information?

/s

[chpettit19]

 

That is from just a few minute ago. Both guys self-reporting that they're 100% goes on the first day of workouts.

[stringer bell]

On 2/10/2024 at 3:17 PM, jorgenswest said:

If either isn’t 100% early in the spring they should utilize the 60. They are going to need time at 100% building up and they will probably need the full rehab slot. That will take close to the 60 days. These two pitchers are going to need to be 100% to be helpful. Give them the early part of the season to get right. There probably won’t be a time in the season where the Twins are healthier than in April. They will need them at their best as other injuries occur.

This early in the spring, it isn't wise to utilize the 60-day IL unless the player is certain to be out long-term. There really isn't any 40-man issue until a non-roster player makes a push to be on the active roster or the Twins sign a major league free agent. I would think that Weiss would be DFAed before any player is put on the 60-day IL to make room for someone. 

I think both Staumont and DeSclafani are huge injury risks. I also think that if fully healthy, both could be big additions to the pitching staff. 

[stringer bell]

7 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

 

That is from just a few minute ago. Both guys self-reporting that they're 100% goes on the first day of workouts.

So was Byron Buxton last year??? Self-reports aren't the most reliable, but nonetheless it's better than saying they can't throw from the pitching rubber to home plate.

[chpettit19]

2 hours ago, stringer bell said:

So was Byron Buxton last year??? Self-reports aren't the most reliable, but nonetheless it's better than saying they can't throw from the pitching rubber to home plate.

Byron and the team at the start of spring said he wasn't 100% and wouldn't be playing the field at all in spring and would start the year at DH in the hope that he would heal up after the first month or 2 of the season and then be able to play the field.

 

I'm betting we get some videos of them throwing pen sessions, too. I guess people can believe whatever they want, but I'm not seeing any reason to believe either of these guys are hurt based on the information we have available to us.

[DocBauer]

2 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

Byron and the team at the start of spring said he wasn't 100% and wouldn't be playing the field at all in spring and would start the year at DH in the hope that he would heal up after the first month or 2 of the season and then be able to play the field.

 

I'm betting we get some videos of them throwing pen sessions, too. I guess people can believe whatever they want, but I'm not seeing any reason to believe either of these guys are hurt based on the information we have available to us.

That's all very encouraging news. But I do feel better about Staumont simply because he's had surgery to fix an issue, gone through rehab, and is reportedly good to go and presumably been throwing for some time now.

DeSclafani still worries me. I can't help the little voice in my head that says the PRP and rest is covering up a larger/longer term issue that is going to result in a tear and TJ surgery still. I really hope I'm wrong. I'm still not much of a fan of acquiring him. But I know how good he was in 2021 for the Giants, and I know he was probably just as good the first 6 weeks or so in 2023 before his elbow began to flare up. Disco for 25-26 games started this season would mean his arm was holding up, and he was pitching well. And that would be good news! 

[nicksaviking]

2 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

Byron and the team at the start of spring said he wasn't 100% and wouldn't be playing the field at all in spring and would start the year at DH in the hope that he would heal up after the first month or 2 of the season and then be able to play the field.

 

I'm betting we get some videos of them throwing pen sessions, too. I guess people can believe whatever they want, but I'm not seeing any reason to believe either of these guys are hurt based on the information we have available to us.

Maybe it's just wish-fulfillment on the fans side. 

I don't want anyone to be injured, but I also don't want either of these guys on the team.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

So the reports were completely erroneous.   Not only is he healthy now, but my other concern, of not only a long healing schedule, but also that he hadn't thrown this winter was also false.  So now I am back to being cautiously optimistic, he may show his early 2023, and 2021 form.  We will see.   That elbow is still going to be something to watch this year.  

[Doctor Gast]

23 hours ago, jorgenswest said:

I respect the Giants front office and wonder if there is enough left for him to approach a league average starter. There is no guarantee he comes back all the way from his injuries combined with the natural decline from his last good season at age 31 to age 34.

The Braves took on some bad contracts this winter and released or outrighted or traded with cash the players. I think that includes Marco González, David Fletcher, Evan White, Max Stassi and Matt Carpenter. The Mariners found a new home for DeSclafani. The Twins have kept him. 

He really needs to show something in the spring. He can’t be the 5th starter if Varland is ahead of him. If he gets that spot he needs to perform and continue to perform. The Twins won’t find a taker during the season to flip a mediocre starter. They will need to release him at that point,

Because the Twins took on this project he takes priority over Varland until his wheels fall off. It's the way it is.

[Nashvilletwin]

Well, if both DeSclafani and Staumont are healthy, then, other than outlier performances (good or bad) and/or injury, the pitching roster is set.   The only position player battle is the last seat on the bench with Larnach and Martin as the primary contenders.

Here’s hoping for an injury free, no drama spring training. 

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

14 minutes ago, Nashvilletwin said:

Well, if both DeSclafani and Staumont are healthy, then, other than outlier performances (good or bad) and/or injury, the pitching roster is set.   The only position player battle is the last seat on the bench with Larnach and Martin as the primary contenders.

Here’s hoping for an injury free, no drama spring training. 

They still appear to be looking for SP depth,  whether a AAA contract or another SP4-5.  Lorenzen, Thor, Clevinger types.   

[nicksaviking]

8 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

They still appear to be looking for SP depth,  whether a AAA contract or another SP4-5.  Lorenzen, Thor, Clevinger types.   

If they sign another 4-5 on a MLB deal, I might lose my mind. 

It would show they learned nothing from the Happ/Shoemaker/Archer/Bundy signings. Absolutely nothing.

[Cris E]

If Descalfini is healthy and effective then you don't need more rotation depth, because he's it. That's what depth looks like: injury risk, poor performance risk, possible upside if a few things line up, cheap and easily replaced if it doesn't work out.  You're hoping for a #4/#5 arm here, not a playoff swingman.

Lopez, Ryan, Ober, Paddack, Decsalfini is backed by Varland, Festa, SWR, Canterino, Headrick and other lesser lights like Winder, Sands or Balazovic if we need more than ten starters. And that assumes no one at AA somehow cuts to the front of the line, however unlikely.