What the Brewers Can Teach the Twins About Trading Joe Ryan

[saviking]

2 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

There is another aspect that is not in the essay - the Brewers seem to really know how to develop their pitching.  They trade well, but then they fill the void with really good arms.  We have not shown that.  Prielipp is out with a blister and has been okay, Festa is no where to be seen on the IL, Matthews has done okay, but not exceptional, Rojas has a good arm but is not the quality SP a contender needs.  Ober is not ready to be the Ace.  Raya is already on the IL. Abel is on the IL, Bradley is the next in line for the Ace position.  And Lopez?  I hardly remember when he pitched last - will he return as an Ace?

The article says we have a good farm system - its time to see it produce at MLB level.  Keaschall is struggling to regain his rookie production, Lee is an average player, Wallner is gone, Lewis is still suspect with his 219 BA, Martin is back to below average and we have our prospects on the IL or just waiting for a chance.

I agree he has to be traded - he will leave as a free agent, but so far I do not have the trust in our system that we will show the Brewers' shrewdness. 

For anyone that follows the Twins minor league box scores every night like I do I question how good our miner league talent is beyond, Culpepper Rodriguez and Jenkins. There are some nice pieces further down but when it comes to pitching the bulk are, to not put it nicely, a bunch of bums. Yes there are a few like Quick and Hill but every night the bulk of theor pitchers get raked. 

Just go down there list and it's littered with pitchers with ERA's well above 6 .. many are double digits. Just last night their top 3 levels gave up a total of 43 runs. That's over an average of 14 runs per game. 

We really need to restock the arms on the farm. 

[LA Vikes Fan]

4 minutes ago, The Great Hambino said:

I generally agree with the overall point that the best time to trade away relievers is at the deadline while the best time to trade away starters can be in the offseason under the right circumstances due to supply and demand factors that I'll save for another day and another rant. 

But this is not a typical offseason.  No one is giving up anything of real value for someone with one year of control when they aren't sure what they're actually getting for that control while the season is still up in the air.  If you're thinking you can just move Ryan in the offseason, you're making a massive gamble that they'll be avoiding a lockout (they will not be avoiding a lockout).  If that doesn't happen, what are teams giving up when what they're getting is a mystery box?

Too many unknowns to think you can maximize Ryan's value in the offseason.  So trade him this deadline or actually commit to competing while you still have him. 

I suppose one angle they could be taking is there could be a post-CBA environment where they'll be in a position to be able to offer him more than any other team in free agency if something similar to the NBA's Larry Bird rights materializes (plus some combo of revenue sharing and a floor that makes increased spending both more realistic and necessary), and they can more realistically view him as part of the core of the next few years.  But assuming that is coming is also a huge gamble.

 

I agree that there will be a lockout. I think the only question is will it get resolved in time for an entire 2027 season, for just a partial one, or if the entire 2027 season is wiped out. How the system will or will not change is a complete crapshoot at the is point. No one knows.  

But I don't think that changes the analysis unless you assume there will be no 2027 season at all, which I see as very unlikely and are far and away the least likely outcome.  The chances for a lockout will be factored into every trade decision at the deadline and will be in the off-season. It really doesn't change the calculation unless the entire 2027 season is wiped out and then the chance to have a guy like Ryan during 2027 will have no value, but only if the 2027 season is wiped out but still counts towards free agency. I also see that as a very small possibility; if the season is lost and then a  deal is made the players are not going to get a years worth of time to free agency from that lost season. So to me, the upcoming lockout is relevant only in the fact that the value of a contract that extends through 2027 and then ends may be lower than it would be in other similar circumstances but the upcoming lockout will affect the return equally regardless of whether the trade is at the deadline or the off-season. I don't see a lot of risk from waiting till the off-season based on the lockout unless there is no 2027 season at all and I see that as highly unlikely. Based on that, I think past history is instructive and we are likely to get a better or just as good return for Ryan in the upcoming off-season as we are at this year's trade deadline.

[TopGunn#22]

The Twins find themselves in an interesting position.  They are "competitive" in the worst division in MLB.  What does that really mean?  Does it mean the Twins have a realistic opportunity to make some noise in the playoffs should they win the division or grab a Wild Card spot?  Realistically, probably not.  

There is no chance.  Absolutely ZERO that Ryan Jeffers would sign any kind of extension.  Caratini is working out better than many people expected.  Jackson has also been better than expected.  The Twins have Tait in the minors and a chance at a VERY GOOD catching prospect in the draft this Saturday.  We are trading Ryan Jeffers.  

There are all sorts of guys that could and maybe SHOULD be traded.  Larnach, Wallner (if anyone will have him) Taylor Rogers, maybe a prospect like Emmanuel Rodriguez, but beyond Ryan Jeffers, everything comes down to Joe Ryan.  The Brewers example makes a good case for trading him.  But as always, it comes down to what the return is. 

To me, the big question is not "should we trade Joe Ryan??"  It's WHEN.  Joe Ryan is not signing an extension.  He's made it clear he would like to experience Free Agency.  The case CAN be made that we have the potential to get MORE in return for him if we deal him at the deadline.  More time with the acquiring team means more trade capital.  Where you begin to split hairs is how much does your return diminish if you wait until the off-season.  And how much does an all but certain Lockout/Strike affect any trades this off-season??

I think tony&rodney has the right idea.  The goal of a trade involving Ryan is to get a star level prospect in return.  Someone like the Brewers own Jesus Made.  To me, that is who I would target.  Made is a SS who projects to probably be a 3B.  With Marek Houston in the Twins pipeline and the chance that a Grady Emerson or Roch Cholowsky could be added as well, it's actually a bonus that Made fits best at 3B.

I would like to see how THIS season goes for the Twins even if it leads to a quick playoff exit.  But could an off season deal involving Joe Ryan and Brooks Lee for Jesus Made be a possibility?  Made is the #1 prospect in MLB.  Would adding Emmanuel Rodriguez or Dasan Hill be enough for the #1 prospect in MLB?? 

A future Twins infield of Made at 3B, Houston at SS and Culpepper at 2B (assuming we end up with Lackey as a Catching prospect) would be very fun.  Imagine what that IF could look like with Cholowsky or Emerson in a future mix?  

Made could see a Brewers call-up by the end of this season.  He's sure to be in the Majors for 2027.  Including Brooks Lee opens the door wide for Made to be the Twins starting 3B in 2027.  I think this is what tony&rodney is talking about.  Go BIG or GO HOME.  Is this what Pohlad sees as Go BIG or GO HOME??  

[nicksaviking]

I think people are mistakenly tying the Brewers perpetually good record to their trade success. Their trades for their star players have been AWFUL. Austin Martin and SWR for Berrios looks like a giant win compared to the Burnes and Hadar trades. If the Twins made those deals and still had Twins records, we'd still be complaining about them.

This isn't a 'You can't trade Joe Ryan' rant, it's simply pointing out the Brewers aren't winning (regular season games only) because of the trades, they are winning despite of them.

[SteveLV]

1 hour ago, chpettit19 said:

Joe Ryan signed a new deal this last offseason that included an option for next year. Not sure what reports you're reading, but they had to talk about his future with the team to do that. Joe Ryan has been very open for nearly his entire MLB career that he wants to hit the market and thinks the arbitration system is stupid.

The Twins are clearly not a super well-run team, but not having extensions for players doesn't automatically mean they haven't discussed it. As it turns out, players have the ability to say "no."

The contract the Twins and Ryan signed was to avoid the last 2 years of arbitration at a compromise figure that roughly approximates the middle ground for his last 2 arbitration years.  You jump to a startling conclusion that this means they discussed a post-arbitration, multi-year extension with zero proof, just speculation.  Please point us to any reporting that this Twins FO has tried to extend Ryan beyond his arb years.  Happy to be wrong, but I have never seen even a hint that this has been negotiated.

(There are dozens of examples where there are reports that the teams and players have been negotiating a multi-year extension. Sometimes they come to terms, sometimes they do not.  Nothing like that reported as happening for Ryan.)

But your conclusion is dead accurate:  Trade Ryan if you are satisfied with the return, Trade Jeffers unless it is a low-ball offer.

[chpettit19]

Just now, SteveLV said:

The contract the Twins and Ryan signed was to avoid the last 2 years of arbitration at a compromise figure that roughly approximates the middle ground for his last 2 arbitration years.  You jump to a startling conclusion that this means they discussed a post-arbitration, multi-year extension with zero proof, just speculation.  Please point us to any reporting that this Twins FO has tried to extend Ryan beyond his arb years.  Happy to be wrong, but I have never seen even a hint that this has been negotiated.

(There are dozens of examples where there are reports that the teams and players have been negotiating a multi-year extension. Sometimes they come to terms, sometimes they do not.  Nothing like that reported as happening for Ryan.)

But your conclusion is dead accurate:  Trade Ryan if you are satisfied with the return, Trade Jeffers unless it is a low-ball offer.

It's a more "startling conclusion" to assume they discussed an extension beyond his arbitration years when they were already talking about future seasons than assuming they haven't at all discussed a deal beyond his arbitration years? Your argument is that it's more realistic that they were talking about 2026 and 2027 but didn't even broach the idea of 2028 and beyond than it is that they mentioned 2028 and beyond when discussing 2026 and 2027?

Yeah, sorry, but that is a "startling conclusion" to reach. There are thousands of extensions that are reached or not reached without a single peep about them in the news. The most obvious conclusion to draw here is that they at least mentioned the idea of an extension. What is widely available in reporting is that Joe Ryan has been very staunchly against an extension and the arbitration process in general. That combined with the fact that they discussed at least 1 future year would make it a pretty simple jump to them having discussed an extension beyond his arb years and he told them he wasn't interested so let's just get the arb years done.

[miller761]

Giving out multi year contracts to 30 year old starting pitchers is risky business. Great article...it made up my mind. Some team would have to really offer MLB talent or MLB ready talent at the deadline for the Twins to trade Joe. Twins should trade Joe but in the off season.

[chpettit19]

41 minutes ago, TopGunn#22 said:

The Twins find themselves in an interesting position.  They are "competitive" in the worst division in MLB.  What does that really mean?  Does it mean the Twins have a realistic opportunity to make some noise in the playoffs should they win the division or grab a Wild Card spot?  Realistically, probably not.  

There is no chance.  Absolutely ZERO that Ryan Jeffers would sign any kind of extension.  Caratini is working out better than many people expected.  Jackson has also been better than expected.  The Twins have Tait in the minors and a chance at a VERY GOOD catching prospect in the draft this Saturday.  We are trading Ryan Jeffers.  

There are all sorts of guys that could and maybe SHOULD be traded.  Larnach, Wallner (if anyone will have him) Taylor Rogers, maybe a prospect like Emmanuel Rodriguez, but beyond Ryan Jeffers, everything comes down to Joe Ryan.  The Brewers example makes a good case for trading him.  But as always, it comes down to what the return is. 

To me, the big question is not "should we trade Joe Ryan??"  It's WHEN.  Joe Ryan is not signing an extension.  He's made it clear he would like to experience Free Agency.  The case CAN be made that we have the potential to get MORE in return for him if we deal him at the deadline.  More time with the acquiring team means more trade capital.  Where you begin to split hairs is how much does your return diminish if you wait until the off-season.  And how much does an all but certain Lockout/Strike affect any trades this off-season??

I think tony&rodney has the right idea.  The goal of a trade involving Ryan is to get a star level prospect in return.  Someone like the Brewers own Jesus Made.  To me, that is who I would target.  Made is a SS who projects to probably be a 3B.  With Marek Houston in the Twins pipeline and the chance that a Grady Emerson or Roch Cholowsky could be added as well, it's actually a bonus that Made fits best at 3B.

I would like to see how THIS season goes for the Twins even if it leads to a quick playoff exit.  But could an off season deal involving Joe Ryan and Brooks Lee for Jesus Made be a possibility?  Made is the #1 prospect in MLB.  Would adding Emmanuel Rodriguez or Dasan Hill be enough for the #1 prospect in MLB?? 

A future Twins infield of Made at 3B, Houston at SS and Culpepper at 2B (assuming we end up with Lackey as a Catching prospect) would be very fun.  Imagine what that IF could look like with Cholowsky or Emerson in a future mix?  

Made could see a Brewers call-up by the end of this season.  He's sure to be in the Majors for 2027.  Including Brooks Lee opens the door wide for Made to be the Twins starting 3B in 2027.  I think this is what tony&rodney is talking about.  Go BIG or GO HOME.  Is this what Pohlad sees as Go BIG or GO HOME??  

I like the idea here. I think it's tough to get a guy who's such an elite prospect and so close to the majors, though. Is 1 year (if they wait til the offseason) or 1 year and a playoff race of Joe Ryan worth plugging Lee in at 3B for the next 4 years instead of Made for the next 6? If the Twins would be looking to plug Made into the 3B job in 2027, why wouldn't the Brewers? 

I think Luis Pena may be a more likely target when talking about the Brewers specifically. Still an elite prospect, but not in AA yet and likely looking at more of an end of 2027 debut timeline. Or an Eli Willits type if the Nats want to get wild and make a push (not predicting that, but he's also farther away than Made). 

Cam Caminiti and Eric Hartman from the Braves have been my desired targets for Ryan. Both should be in AA at the age of 20 (sometime this season) but aren't likely to be expected to contribute largely to the Braves until 2028 (2027 debuts). Starting pitching and CFers are always good places to start (along with SS) when bringing back prospects.

[rv78]

1 hour ago, hitterscount said:

My counter to your point is Milwaukee will draw over three million this season. Most games Ive watched this season there aren’t 10,000 people in the park. Winning matters, consistency matters we aren’t there.

And the reason why "we aren't there" yet is because the last 10 years when the Twins were buyers Falvey did a poor job bringing in difference makers, and when the Twins were sellers, like last year, the return is so far away that we just extended the push strategy another year or two down the road. No one will remember if the Brewers drew 3 million fans and the Twins drew 1 million. (Except for the Pohlads and they don't seem to care). They will remember if/when the Brewers win a Championship. See the difference?

[SteveLV]

19 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

It's a more "startling conclusion" to assume they discussed an extension beyond his arbitration years when they were already talking about future seasons than assuming they haven't at all discussed a deal beyond his arbitration years? Your argument is that it's more realistic that they were talking about 2026 and 2027 but didn't even broach the idea of 2028 and beyond than it is that they mentioned 2028 and beyond when discussing 2026 and 2027?

Yeah, sorry, but that is a "startling conclusion" to reach. There are thousands of extensions that are reached or not reached without a single peep about them in the news. The most obvious conclusion to draw here is that they at least mentioned the idea of an extension. What is widely available in reporting is that Joe Ryan has been very staunchly against an extension and the arbitration process in general. That combined with the fact that they discussed at least 1 future year would make it a pretty simple jump to them having discussed an extension beyond his arb years and he told them he wasn't interested so let's just get the arb years done.

So you "assume".  Again, if you actually have any reporting that the Twins and Ryan discussed an extension beyond arbitration, please let us know. Otherwise, you are assuming and speculating.

We both agree Ryan has reportedly sought FA.  That contradicts your assumptions as well.

Ryan will not pitch for the Twins beyond 2027 in any scenario. so trade him now when his value is highest. We agree on that point.

[HeresWaldo]

To be honest my takeaway from reading through these trades is that the Twins should keep Ryan. The Brewers have a much better trading and development track record than we do, and even with that being the case a lot of these returns were just okay. In exchange for four All Stars they got a solid regular, a reliever, a couple interesting but unproven starters with big question marks, and a few okay prospects. And that's the return received by a team that's great at this.

I get that this is a depth sport and they've increased the quality of their depth which has some value, but there are Willi Castro and Kody Clemens types available on the waiver wire and cheap part of the free agent market every single year. I mean no offense to either of those guys because they were both really good with us, but if you're giving up stars you need to get more than these guys in return. Smart teams don't give up stars to get quality depth, they find or develop it cheaply.

[rv78]

2 hours ago, hitterscount said:

Our frugal spending will not change, so the question becomes when to trade Ryan. As long as the team is in contention for a postseason bid I would hold on to him and make the move this winter. But the bottom line is I wouldn’t pony up the cash that would be needed to extend him…. he’s earned it, but you can’t have that type of money he’s going to get tied to one player.

Did the Carlos Correa deal determine your opinion of tying too much money up into 1 player? It seriously depends on the player. Correa wasn't it. He was a good defender but pretty much an average hitter. His contract with the Twins was a huge OVER-pay. Joe Ryan is much better than average and worthy of big dollars much more than Correa was. 

[chpettit19]

1 minute ago, SteveLV said:

So you "assume".  Again, if you actually have any reporting that the Twins and Ryan discussed an extension beyond arbitration, please let us know. Otherwise, you are assuming and speculating.

We both agree Ryan has reportedly sought FA.  That contradicts your assumptions as well.

Ryan will not pitch for the Twins beyond 2027 in any scenario. so trade him now when his value is highest. We agree on that point.

"I would prefer they extend him, but this FO hasn't even approached Ryan for that according to all reports. Sad, but true." This is hard, factual data? Or, is this you assuming? We're all assuming. It's all we can do. Unless you have inside knowledge you'd like to let us in on? My argument is that it's a far more reasonable assumption that they at least asked about 2028 when they were talking about 2027.

No, it doesn't contradict my assumption. My assumption is the Twins asked about 2028 when they were talking about 2027 and he said no. Which sticks with him not being interested in an extension.

Yes, we agree there.

[snap4birds]

2 hours ago, Nashvilletwin said:

Here is what everyone is forgetting: a salary cap and floor is coming.  Make no mistake about it.  It will be here no later than 2028.  The floor will be at least $175MM (maybe there is a ramp up period over a year or two).

The Twins are going to need to spend money.  A lot of it.

This is why they will hold off trading Ryan now (and Buxton for that matter).  They will hold onto Ryan this year, play out their unexpected competitive season, and then decide if  Ryan is the right guy to extend or trade over the off-season.

The Twins are going to be chock full of young, cheap, up and coming position players and pitchers in ‘27 and ‘28.  They will need to augment that roster with a handful of higher priced players - Ryan just still might be one of them.  If they trade him now, the Twins will lose that option on Ryan (as he will surely be extended by the acquirer).  He stays.  

Teams that are “beneath the floor” will have a lot of opportunity to take on salaries from teams above the cap. They should be able to extract top prospects from those teams in exchange. So the Twins could benefit twice from trading Ryan. 

[SteveLV]

OK, so you admit you are assuming and that there is ZERO reporting that the Twins and Ryan have EVER discussed an extension beyond arbitration.

My point is that when teams and players ARE negotiating such an extension, it does get reported, even when they fail to reach agreement.  You position is that the Twins and Ryan MAY have discussed an extension, which both sides kept completely silent about.

I think my position is more likely accurate, but I am sure you disagree.  So there we are.

[bean5302]

2 hours ago, hitterscount said:

My counter to your point is Milwaukee will draw over three million this season. Most games Ive watched this season there aren’t 10,000 people in the park. Winning matters, consistency matters we aren’t there.

The Brewers are drawing 32k per game x 81 games 2.6MM. They're not getting to 3MM unless they have a deep playoff run, which they very well may. They're on pace for 103 wins or so.

The Twins are drawing 21k per game x 81 games 1.7MM and 25k over their past 10 home games (propped up heavily by the Dodgers series). They're on pace for 79 wins.

The Rockies are drawing 28k per game x 81 games 2.3MM. They're on pace to win 65 games. They're probably the worst team in baseball over the past decade. They always draw well. Denver is a mid-market base. Drawing fans is about the game day experience.

[Fatbat]

2 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Many people can agree with the "multiple young star" return idea. However .... Who are those young stars? In the last year I have proposed trades for Franklin Arias (last July) and Leodalis De Vries or Max Clark (last winter). Those were never likely to occur. I'm not seeing any proposals that pique my interest thus far.

At this time, the Twins may want to see where the team is on August 2 before making a decision. There may be ongoing discussions about a contract extension as well. I'm keeping an open mind. 

There has been quite a bit of discussion about the strength of the farm system, especially last year. It might be time to push some players forward. Kaelen Culpepper and Walker Jenkins could fill positions. The starting pitching has navigated through some challenges but is still managing to give the club solid starts. The main issue remains the bullpen. The biggest question is whether Ryan Jeffers and a few prospects can be traded for good relief pitchers. The speculation keeps building but the deadline could be quiet too.

As always, great knowledge from you! I dont know what Ryan, Jeffers and Larnach’s market is now. If anyone can get an overpayment, you gonna pull that trigger. If the market sucks, hold on until the offseason… 

[Fatbat]

15 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

The Brewers are drawing 32k per game x 81 games 2.6MM. They're not getting to 3MM unless they have a deep playoff run, which they very well may. They're on pace for 103 wins or so.

The Twins are drawing 21k per game x 81 games 1.7MM and 25k over their past 10 home games (propped up heavily by the Dodgers series). They're on pace for 79 wins.

The Rockies are drawing 28k per game x 81 games 2.3MM. They're on pace to win 65 games. They're probably the worst team in baseball over the past decade. They always draw well. Denver is a mid-market base. Drawing fans is about the game day experience.

The Twins have a downer for an ownership group and the city experience has been pure crap since G.Floyd. Our stadium is awesome but the city experience as a whole is nothing better than a sewer system.  Change that vibe and more fans would go to more games. 

[lukeduke1980]

Adding to Nashville's point- who knows how other teams are valuing 2027 control if there is a labor standoff and maybe not a season.  Just keep him and if nothing changes to salary cap/floor/etc just trade him next year once a season starts

[GNess]

This is a well covered topic, but here is a fundamental point of trading:

The team giving up the proven asset (Jeffers/Ryan etc) for. prospects must be particularly adept at assessing potential and development. It is inherently riskier to give up the known for the less certain. 

I am a bit concerned about comparing what the Brewers do (timely trading proven assets for potential) without knowing how they do it (that is, there ability to evaluate, develop, project) 

Knowing that fortune follows the brave, I understand why the Twins need to take such risks, but it is not close to certain it will work out.

 

[tony&rodney]

11 minutes ago, Fatbat said:

The Twins have a downer for an ownership group and the city experience has been pure crap since G.Floyd. Our stadium is awesome but the city experience as a whole is nothing better than a sewer system.  Change that vibe and more fans would go to more games. 

I don't live in Minneapolis or St. Paul. I have been to Target Field a ton of times. I'm sorry for those who have had a bad experience of some sort in Minneapolis and i hope to never experience what apparently some have seen or suffered. The entire George Floyd episode was unfortunate on so many levels, especially for GF. There is a pretty cool George Floyd Memorial. I'm not sure if it still exists. It was the #1 visited site for a year plus in Minnesota. All that said, I find the vibe around the North Loop quite enjoyable from friendliness to easy access to fantastic bars and restaurants. I'm really old but can still walk and have enjoyed just cruising around those neighborhoods to stretch my legs before arriving early for a game and like a little bite to eat and a cold one (only one) before heading back to my lair. I usually go alone because that is the way I like it but occasionally go with others and actually went to one game this year with my spouse. She liked the North Loop too. So, again, I'm sorry some people feel negativity towards Minneapolis but I have not experienced the downside and the people I know love living in the city. The lakes, the neighborhoods, and colorful yards are wonderful in the summer. I will say I do not like winter. Winter is for Mexico.

[GNess]

Additional consideration: The Twins are at present 2 GB for 1st in the division and 1 GB in the wildcard. 

Is throwing in the towel on this season by trading away an all-star level pitcher (yes a big asset) really the prudent move at this point.

[tony&rodney]

17 minutes ago, lukeduke1980 said:

Adding to Nashville's point- who knows how other teams are valuing 2027 control if there is a labor standoff and maybe not a season.  Just keep him and if nothing changes to salary cap/floor/etc just trade him next year once a season starts

Perhaps I am alone on an island but I don't see major changes to the salary system until the owners resolve the entire revenue sharing issue and the loopholes they created more than a decade ago. I'm expecting much blustering, a brief lockout, and April baseball in 2027 without caps or floors. Perhaps the whole CBA gets delayed a year or two with a short term agreement. 

A season without games would ruin baseball. I know the owners have to understand the stakes. Baseball would not recover as quickly as it did last time there was a major lockout. That was a long time ago and it took years for the game to come back. There are many more options in play in 2026 than existed in 1994.

The Twins need to make decisions based on their analysis of the system and roster needs in conjunction with how they feel about both this season and the next. I don't believe that a lockout is a player in their decisions.

[Mike Sixel]

4 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

To quote a Cubs fan I follow;:

”The Brewers have traded Freddy Peralta. Now they have 12 years of control of two new Freddy Peraltas.”

Of course, this only works if you’re elite at targeting and development, which the Brewers are and the Twins are not. 

Ya, those Ryan and Bradley trades? Yuck. 

Look, they aren't signing him to an extension. They aren't winning the WS this year. Trade him. 

The only strategy that actually works for winning it all is being in the top ten of salaries. That's not happening here. So, what to do? Maximize your odds by acquiring lots of assets and hope. 

[Mike Sixel]

41 minutes ago, Fatbat said:

The Twins have a downer for an ownership group and the city experience has been pure crap since G.Floyd. Our stadium is awesome but the city experience as a whole is nothing better than a sewer system.  Change that vibe and more fans would go to more games. 

There is nothing wrong with the city. People think there is....

[Brock Beauchamp]

8 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Ya, those Ryan and Bradley trades? Yuck. 

Look, they aren't signing him to an extension. They aren't winning the WS this year. Trade him. 

The only strategy that actually works for winning it all is being in the top ten of salaries. That's not happening here. So, what to do? Maximize your odds by acquiring lots of assets and hope. 

I'm not saying the Twins are bad at developing, but they're obviously one, and probably two, steps below the Brewers. Milwaukee has quietly become an absolute powerhouse of development.

[Mike Sixel]

2 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I'm not saying the Twins are bad at developing, but they're obviously one, and probably two, steps below the Brewers. Milwaukee has quietly become an absolute powerhouse of development.

Agreed, but that sure wasn't the tone, imo, of your post. What should they do with Ryan?

[Brock Beauchamp]

5 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Agreed, but that sure wasn't the tone, imo, of your post. What should they do with Ryan?

I'd do what the Brewers do: trade him this offseason.

Edit: I'll add the caveat that I *might* keep Ryan through 2027 depending how this season ends. The Twins need to regain public trust and trading away players is a move teams that the fanbase hates can't make without repercussion. The Twins are NOT in that situation, nor are they anywhere close to it. They need to throw olive branches to the fans at every turn until the stink of the past three years is washed away.

[Mike Sixel]

13 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I'd do what the Brewers do: trade him this offseason.

Edit: I'll add the caveat that I *might* keep Ryan through 2027 depending how this season ends. The Twins need to regain public trust and trading away players is a move teams that the fanbase hates can't make without repercussion. The Twins are NOT in that situation, nor are they anywhere close to it. They need to throw olive branches to the fans at every turn until the stink of the past three years is washed away.

Right sizing payroll after winning a playoff series has cost them tens of millions in ticket sales, maybe more. 

[Blyleven2011]

6 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

 I do not have the trust in our system that we will show the Brewers' shrewdness. 

I concur , my thoughts exactly when I read the headline  ...

Have they figured out any kind of plan , we really haven't had any inclination to a plan other than trading assets for prospects for restructuring as they put it , it's really a rebuild and it is showing some good signs with better baseball this year ...