How Can I Watch the Twins Today? (And Seven Other Questions about the Twins-Bally-Comcast Clustermuck)

[Mike Sixel]

1 minute ago, Riverbrian said:

Right now... All I can do is wait for this thing to get settled so I can watch the Twins again. I have no idea how long I'll have to wait but I have no choice. I'm not going to jump into any temporary fix. I'll wait for the new thing.  

I'm 58 and I know that change is necessary. I'm prepared for change but like everybody else in the 55 plus demographic... I don't really like change.

I just want to be left alone to do what I did yesterday and wash my metformin down with a bottle of mountain dew like all of us.    

I LOVE change, and I'm 60......

[Riverbrian]

23 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I LOVE change, and I'm 60......

You say that but yet you insist on watching the Twins in airports. 

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, Riverbrian said:

You say that but you yet you insist on watching the Twins in airports. 

 Sure, it costs a lot to get into the bars in airports, but it's TOTALLY worth it to watch the Twins play. 

[ashbury]

6 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I LOVE change, and I'm 60......

I'm 70 and I check my sofa cushions every day.

[Mike Sixel]

2 minutes ago, ashbury said:

I'm 70 and I check my sofa cushions every day.

For? I mean, you don't actually use CASH do you?

I totally remember finding coins in the cushions back in the day......now it is more likely to be a golf tee or ball marker (or popcorn). 

[ashbury]

Just now, Mike Sixel said:

For? I mean, you don't actually use CASH do you?

Which part of "I'm 70" did I mis-type?

[USAFChief]

1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

You do understand you're complaining about no longer having a place to stable your horse because all of your neighbors bought automobiles right?

We're asking for the cobblestones to be paved so we can all use this new technology, we have no interest in mounting a saddle again. The new option is and will be better once the infrastructure is in place, which would have happened years ago had the bigwigs not been all consumed by the profits dangled by those selling horses.

I'm not the one complaining. I'm watching the Twins as I type.

It's all you cord cutters who are complaining. 

Which is odd. You won. 

 

[TheLeviathan]

Interesting

To clarify...no, I am not actually psychic.  And who gets the blame?  Easy.  MLB and it's ridiculous web of nonsense they call "broadcasting" has slowly eroded their fan base and made their game take a further and further backseat.  The terrible media decisions even came with a bonus poison of having massive payroll inequality to boot!

Every decision about broadcasting during these changes to sports media has flowed from the league's unwillingness to grow with the times and prioritize eyeballs on their game over short-term profits.  The old guard has had baseball on the wrong path for decades.  It's already too late to fix most of the damage, just like Bally's dumb app was too late to change things there.

[jud6312]

The TV issue is annoying and I'm pretty unhappy about not being able to watch any games this summer, but it's the timing that's really bad.

 

Last year? Annoying, but I could have at least turned on the radio and listened to Provus.

 

This year? I would rather rip my own ears off, set them ablaze, and present them as a fiery offering to Joe Pohlad than listen to Kris Atteberry for a single inning, much less an entire summer. 

 

I guess I become a "box score fan" and call it a day. 

[jud6312]

I think we should all be on board with baseball moving to 100% streaming just to see how the older generations respond. Remember how the "old folks" lost their minds when WCCO lost the radio broadcast rights for a while? That alone should make everyone want to cut the cords ... I mean, aside from paying for a service that was state of the art 40+ years ago, but now forces you to (over)pay for 75 channels you don't watch so you have access to the 5 channels you do watch. 

 

 

[twinssporto]

MLB is has a real cluster %$&! on their hands. I've completely quit watching the Twins on TV. First time in my 52 years. I'll listen on the radio and read box scores or hit Twins Daily. Such stupidity on so many levels it boggles the mind. I cut the cord years ago and decided to try FUBO last year that worked well but $79.00 a month to just watch the Twins, forget it...

I tried MLB as well and that didn't work because of the local blackout. I could have used a VPN but that seems like stealing and won't do that either. Good luck to MLB and the Minnesota Twins. If a lifelong "rabid" Twins fan is mad and not watching what about the fair weather fans and younger kids????

Oh, almost forgot. If the Twins won't invest in their team (2024 payroll), why in the hell would I invest my time and money to watch that product? (10 game winning streak included).

 

 

[verninski]

12 hours ago, dxpavelka said:

I am a Midco subscriber in the SE MN and just woke up with the same message on my Bally channel

Yep for me Midco is done in ND and SD as well🙄

[Richie the Rally Goat]

10 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

Totally fair. I just think it's another shortsighted decision by the Twins. Their problem is a shrinking fanbase. They rejected the idea of fully diving into the streaming world because of the 1 year payout. I don't get why you wouldn't at least dip your toe in here and at least start the process of expanding your fan base. It shouldn't be about what Ballys wanted, it should've been about what was best for the future of the Twins. And getting their product in front of more fans is the very clear and obvious answer to that question. I don't see it as letting Ballys get everything they wanted just to have it, I see it as the Twins actively shooting themselves in the other foot after having already shot their first foot by signing up anyways. Their complete and utter rejection of streaming is mind blowing to me.

https://theathletic.com/5271325/2024/02/12/qa-dave-st-peter-bally-rsn-twins/
 

while I am super frustrated with The Twins, BSN and the watching options available… the article links above paints a picture without actually laying the blame, that the MLB strong armed the Twins into taking the 1 year deal with BSN and not accept a streaming rights deal in prep for an MLB package coming for 2025.

i frickin’ hate DSP…. But that changed my perspective a bit.

i hate this TV watching option this season, and pretty much the whole damn situation including laying blame at Pohlad and DSP, but also MlB too.

this never should have gotten this far

[twinssporto]

3 hours ago, twinssporto said:

MLB is has a real cluster %$&! on their hands. I've completely quit watching the Twins on TV. First time in my 52 years. I'll listen on the radio and read box scores or hit Twins Daily. Such stupidity on so many levels it boggles the mind. I cut the cord years ago and decided to try FUBO last year that worked well but $79.00 a month to just watch the Twins, forget it...

I tried MLB as well and that didn't work because of the local blackout. I could have used a VPN but that seems like stealing and won't do that either. Good luck to MLB and the Minnesota Twins. If a lifelong "rabid" Twins fan is mad and not watching what about the fair weather fans and younger kids????

 

 

 

7 hours ago, USAFChief said:

I'm not the one complaining. I'm watching the Twins as I type.

It's all you cord cutters who are complaining. 

Which is odd. You won. 

 

Great point. I'm a cord cutter and lost. You say I won but MLB and and the Minnesota Twins lost too. Hang in there long enough Chief and you'll eventually lose too. Be grateful you are out of market so you can watch on MLB.com.  Eventually someone with a brain will figure out a solution so more eye balls are able to watch this sport before it goes the way of broadcast TV, local/national newspapers and movie theaters. 

Cable will go by the wayside just like Ma Bell and rotary phones. How many peoiple still have a home phone line? Why pay for crap you dont need?

[Major League Ready]

20 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

I'm not getting defensive I'm pointing out that your claim of hypocrisy is wrong. Yes, that's precisely what would've happened. It's what's happening with all the streaming services out there now.

My point is that that's not what I'm complaining about. It would be hypocritical of me to complain about the cable/satellite model dying when I've played an active role in killing it. But that's not my complaint. My complaint is the Twins choosing to continue on the dying model when they didn't have to. They were out of the cable/satellite game and chose to get back in. That's my complaint. That is not hypocritical of me. I pay for MLB.tv. If the Twins had chosen to go that route like other teams did I'd have paid for their package. This isn't me being hypocritical because what I'm "up in arms about" is their decision to knowingly choose the torpedoed ship.

CDs are a torpedoed ship. I played a role in that by streaming music instead. It wouldn't be hypocritical of me to point out that it's a bad decision for an artist to only release their songs on CDs. 

The only problem with this argument is that the Twins did not rely solely upon Bally's.  As Chief pointed out, the product is available from other sources.  Also, had the Twins abandoned the Cable model, all of those customers would have had to switch (pay) for an alternative distribution.  Should we blame the customers who continue to rely upon an outdated model.  I don't think so.  I didn't blame people for CDs going away nor did I blame the companies that made CD players.  There is always some pain associated with this type product/market transition.  

[chpettit19]

1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

The only problem with this argument is that the Twins did not rely solely upon Bally's.  As Chief pointed out, the product is available from other sources.  Also, had the Twins abandoned the Cable model, all of those customers would have had to switch (pay) for an alternative distribution.  Should we blame the customers who continue to rely upon an outdated model.  I don't think so.  I didn't blame people for CDs going away nor did I blame the companies that made CD players.  There is always some pain associated with this type product/market transition.  

None of this has anything to do with whether or not cable cutters are hypocrites. Chief called us hypocrites for complaining about the cable model mess because we caused it. I pointed out that he was wrong and he called me defensive so I explained more how being a hypocrite works in this situation. We'd be hypocrites if we were complaining about cable dying while being the ones that are killing it. That isn't our complaint. Thus we aren't being hypocrites. So there's no problem with my argument. Chief incorrectly labeled us hypocrites.

But I'll respond to your point even though it isn't actually towards the point I was making in my back and forth with Chief. What "other sources" is this product available on? Other cable/satellite offerings? What's the difference between having to switch (pay) for a different cable/satellite offering and having to pay for streaming? If you had Comcast and live in the Twins "local market" you don't have another source that's available to you unless you want to switch to another cable provider. I don't know how cable contracts work anymore, but maybe they aren't year long contracts like they used to be so switching is easy. But there are many, many locations where there is only 1 cable provider. Thus there really is no other source because you literally can't pay anyone else for cable/satellite at your house, and you can't use the streaming option because you live in the Twins market. 

I don't care who you blame. The Twins tied their product to a "torpedoed ship" as Chief so poetically stated. He then called those of us who torpedoed the ship hypocrites for complaining about the Twins being on that ship. That is a misuse of the word "hypocrite." We aren't complaining about the torpedoed ship sinking. We're complaining about the Twins (and apparently MLB) choosing to take another ride on the ship they knew was sinking. And then coming out and shrugging their shoulders like they had no idea this was a possibility and there's nothing they could've done about the continued shrinking of their TV reach.

[Riverbrian]

11 hours ago, Richie the Rally Goat said:

https://theathletic.com/5271325/2024/02/12/qa-dave-st-peter-bally-rsn-twins/
 

while I am super frustrated with The Twins, BSN and the watching options available… the article links above paints a picture without actually laying the blame, that the MLB strong armed the Twins into taking the 1 year deal with BSN and not accept a streaming rights deal in prep for an MLB package coming for 2025.

i frickin’ hate DSP…. But that changed my perspective a bit.

i hate this TV watching option this season, and pretty much the whole damn situation including laying blame at Pohlad and DSP, but also MlB too.

this never should have gotten this far

If MLB is involved. 

That makes it harder for me to target my frustration. 

This package for 2025 better be good! 

[chpettit19]

11 hours ago, Richie the Rally Goat said:

https://theathletic.com/5271325/2024/02/12/qa-dave-st-peter-bally-rsn-twins/
 

while I am super frustrated with The Twins, BSN and the watching options available… the article links above paints a picture without actually laying the blame, that the MLB strong armed the Twins into taking the 1 year deal with BSN and not accept a streaming rights deal in prep for an MLB package coming for 2025.

i frickin’ hate DSP…. But that changed my perspective a bit.

i hate this TV watching option this season, and pretty much the whole damn situation including laying blame at Pohlad and DSP, but also MlB too.

this never should have gotten this far

Oh, MLB (and the MLBPA even) definitely gets some blame in all of this. I don't know that I'd use the phrase "strong armed" here, but MLB obviously had input and made known their plans to the Twins. I don't know enough to know if MLB pushed the Twins to just not give up streaming rights, even for a year, or if they pushed the Twins into the 1 year deal or what plan they actually wanted to play out. Did MLB want the Twins to do the Diamondbacks approach but the Pohlads wanted money so they played the middle ground and didn't give up streaming rights but still got their money? I wouldn't blame MLB at all for that. 

I don't know enough to know how much blame to put on who. But MLB absolutely gets some blame. Just like the TV deal expiring after last year wasn't some surprise to the Twins, this entire situation hasn't been some unforeseen surprise for MLB. This technology switch has been coming for a long time. Many of us have been pointing out MLB's lack of desire, or inability, to adapt to the times for a long time. They all get the blame.

[dex8425]

On 5/1/2024 at 6:15 AM, st Paul guy said:

This isn’t entirely accurate.   I subscribe to the streaming service Fubo.tv and they carry Bally FSN.  The price is same as YoutubeTv or Hulu and has similar set of channels.  It will still show  Twins games today.  I am not sure why this service is not mentioned by the Twins as a streaming option     It works

It's expensive though! MLB.tv is only 29.99/month. 

[USAFChief]

51 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

None of this has anything to do with whether or not cable cutters are hypocrites. Chief called us hypocrites for complaining about the cable model mess because we caused it. I pointed out that he was wrong and he called me defensive so I explained more how being a hypocrite works in this situation. We'd be hypocrites if we were complaining about cable dying while being the ones that are killing it. That isn't our complaint. Thus we aren't being hypocrites. So there's no problem with my argument. Chief incorrectly labeled us hypocrites.

But I'll respond to your point even though it isn't actually towards the point I was making in my back and forth with Chief. What "other sources" is this product available on? Other cable/satellite offerings? What's the difference between having to switch (pay) for a different cable/satellite offering and having to pay for streaming? If you had Comcast and live in the Twins "local market" you don't have another source that's available to you unless you want to switch to another cable provider. I don't know how cable contracts work anymore, but maybe they aren't year long contracts like they used to be so switching is easy. But there are many, many locations where there is only 1 cable provider. Thus there really is no other source because you literally can't pay anyone else for cable/satellite at your house, and you can't use the streaming option because you live in the Twins market. 

I don't care who you blame. The Twins tied their product to a "torpedoed ship" as Chief so poetically stated. He then called those of us who torpedoed the ship hypocrites for complaining about the Twins being on that ship. That is a misuse of the word "hypocrite." We aren't complaining about the torpedoed ship sinking. We're complaining about the Twins (and apparently MLB) choosing to take another ride on the ship they knew was sinking. And then coming out and shrugging their shoulders like they had no idea this was a possibility and there's nothing they could've done about the continued shrinking of their TV reach.

Stream Fubo.

 

Also...are you a Comcast customer?

If not, what's your complaint again?

[dex8425]

22 hours ago, USAFChief said:

I think the obvious answer is mlb.tv, with local blackouts eliminated. 

$30/mo to watch all Twins games...except the ones on Facebook, Apple, Fox..

 

Yeah, I'd gladly pay for that. But not paying close to $100 just to watch the Twins.

[USAFChief]

1 minute ago, dex8425 said:

Yeah, I'd gladly pay for that. But not paying close to $100 just to watch the Twins.

Hopefully next year that's an option for in-market fans.

Not sure why it didn't happen this year. It's the current model for the Dbacks. $20/mo for just the home team, $30/mo for full mlb.tv

Oddly enough, Phoenix (and Tucson) is still in San Diego's "local market" so their games are still blacked out. 

[chpettit19]

11 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

Stream Fubo.

 

Also...are you a Comcast customer?

If not, what's your complaint again?

My complaint is that the Twins are actively shrinking their fanbase. They cut payroll this offseason to "right-size" their business. If their fanbase goes down their revenue goes down and more "right-sizing" needs to happen which makes the team worse. And I like the team to be better, not worse. That's my complaint. 

[DJL44]

On 5/1/2024 at 9:54 AM, USAFChief said:

At the heart of this issue lies ?50? percent of TD readers.

Those of you who are "cable cutters" torpedoed the sports-on-cable model. You did so knowingly, and deliberately, so it's a little hypocritical to be up in arms now when the torpedoed model sinks. 

Yes, the consumer is always wrong and Twins fans should be happy to pay $150/month to watch the games (and continue to pay that during the off-season) as the cable companies jack up the price every year. I'm so sorry I knowingly and deliberately determined I'm not willing to pay that much.

[Riverbrian]

On 5/1/2024 at 11:12 AM, USAFChief said:

I think the obvious answer is mlb.tv, with local blackouts eliminated. 

$30/mo to watch all Twins games...except the ones on Facebook, Apple, Fox..

 

Agreed -- Accessibility!

Blackouts are a very simplistic symbol of the root of the problem. 

Blackouts are only necessary because nobody is going to hand you 50 million a year for the rights to broadcast your product unless those rights are exclusive. Once you grant exclusivity you are limiting accessibility and exclusivity is granted for $$$.  

They are paying for 50 million market share and audience level which determines how much they can charge advertisers and cable companies. If you are eroding that market share through other offerings...  you will be paid a lot less for the rights if paid at all. Exclusivity is a necessary evil in order to get the most money   

I don't have the how because it isn't just as simple just simply doing it. But, as @Jocko87 suggested... the clubs need to take the broadcast rights in house in order to be every where every one is on every device. 

They don't need Bally sales professionals to generate revenue for Bally. They can hire their own sales professionals to generate revenue for them.  

 

[Heiny]

On 5/1/2024 at 9:30 AM, Verified Member said:

If this keeps up Cory Provos may be the first TV play by play announcer not on TV.

That would be ok with me.  He should be a game show host anyway.  Bring back Dick and Bert and all tv contracts would fall into place.

[USAFChief]

1 hour ago, DJL44 said:

Yes, the consumer is always wrong and Twins fans should be happy to pay $150/month to watch the games (and continue to pay that during the off-season) as the cable companies jack up the price every year. I'm so sorry I knowingly and deliberately determined I'm not willing to pay that much.

So then what's your issue?

You're getting exactly what you want.

You don't want to pay for Twins baseball on TV. You weren't getting Twins baseball on TV. You're still not. Nothing has changed from what you wish to pay for.

The people who should be complaining are those who paid for Comcast. 

 

[whitsbrain]

I hate the terms "cord cutting" or "cable cutting".  In reality, you're dumping the Cable TV model.  Everyone still needs to pay for Internet access (the "cord") from somewhere to be able to stream.  Maybe you pay for Comcast's internet, T-Mobile, Midco...your connection to the Internet is not free.  Many/Most metro residents can't switch non-Cellular Internet providers.  It's not an option.  Most have only one.  You can switch to DirectTV but even they indirectly (pun intended) admit their satellite Internet speeds are so latency-crippled that their website points you to a service bundle with an AT&T Fiber internet connection that you can't get in MN, ND, SD, or Iowa, anyway.

So, the only real option (leaving out VPN pirating or stealing your neighbor's wide-open Wi-Fi connection) is using your current internet access and ponying up $100-a-month for FuboTV.  I'm personally not paying for that on top of the obscene amounts I already pay for Xfinity internet and Cable TV service (because my wife can't handle replacing her DVR and thinks that operating a streaming box is mind-blowingly difficult).

This all really sucks because I pay for my Mom's MLB.TV subscription so she can watch the Twins live from friggin' Cheesebutter, Wisconsin and I have to wait hours after the game is finished to catch a replay, while trying to avoid seeing a final score.  Why is this all so insane?!?  Ultimately, I'm going to forget about the Twins and the daily habit of having the game as a companion.  I'm happy for my mom, though.

[Major League Ready]

2 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

None of this has anything to do with whether or not cable cutters are hypocrites. Chief called us hypocrites for complaining about the cable model mess because we caused it. I pointed out that he was wrong and he called me defensive so I explained more how being a hypocrite works in this situation. We'd be hypocrites if we were complaining about cable dying while being the ones that are killing it. That isn't our complaint. Thus we aren't being hypocrites. So there's no problem with my argument. Chief incorrectly labeled us hypocrites.

But I'll respond to your point even though it isn't actually towards the point I was making in my back and forth with Chief. What "other sources" is this product available on? Other cable/satellite offerings? What's the difference between having to switch (pay) for a different cable/satellite offering and having to pay for streaming? If you had Comcast and live in the Twins "local market" you don't have another source that's available to you unless you want to switch to another cable provider. I don't know how cable contracts work anymore, but maybe they aren't year long contracts like they used to be so switching is easy. But there are many, many locations where there is only 1 cable provider. Thus there really is no other source because you literally can't pay anyone else for cable/satellite at your house, and you can't use the streaming option because you live in the Twins market. 

I don't care who you blame. The Twins tied their product to a "torpedoed ship" as Chief so poetically stated. He then called those of us who torpedoed the ship hypocrites for complaining about the Twins being on that ship. That is a misuse of the word "hypocrite." We aren't complaining about the torpedoed ship sinking. We're complaining about the Twins (and apparently MLB) choosing to take another ride on the ship they knew was sinking. And then coming out and shrugging their shoulders like they had no idea this was a possibility and there's nothing they could've done about the continued shrinking of their TV reach.

Whoa big fella.  I had absolutely nothing to say about cord cutters being hypocrites.  I said it was not true that the Twins were relying solely on the "sinking ship" of regional sports.  More importantly, shouldn't we also consider that everyone currently paying Comcast, DirecTV, etc would have lost access to broadcasts had the team not signed a new deal with Bally's.  A streaming option would have been ideal but my guess is there is a reasonable explanation as to why there is not.  Why would they turn down the chance to reach more viewers and generate extra revenue?  You can assume incompetence if you wish but nobody is that stupid.

[chpettit19]

19 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Whoa big fella.  I had absolutely nothing to say about cord cutters being hypocrites.  I said it was not true that the Twins were relying solely on the "sinking ship" of regional sports.  More importantly, shouldn't we also consider that everyone currently paying Comcast, DirecTV, etc would have lost access to broadcasts had the team not signed a new deal with Bally's.  A streaming option would have been ideal but my guess is there is a reasonable explanation as to why there is not.  Why would they turn down the chance to reach more viewers and generate extra revenue?  You can assume incompetence if you wish but nobody is that stupid.

No you didn't, but that's what the conversation between Chief and I was that you jumped into. If you didn't want a response about that you shouldn't have replied to a comment about it. You, again, jumped into a conversation about something else and forced it into the conversation you wanted to have.

If they told everyone currently paying Comcast, DirecTV, etc. that they weren't signing with Bally's at the start of the offseason those paying for those services only, or in large part, because of Twins games would've had a chance to figure out what they wanted to do for this season. But those who have Comcast because of Twins games right now can't just get out of that contract now that the Twins are no longer on that service. It's a very different situation. Sure, they could now add another $80/month to their spending to get Fubo, but that seems a little unrealistic for a team to ask their fans. Or, if they'd gotten a streaming deal in place (like they sent Provus out to tell they were going to, but don't worry I won't question their competence there) where blackouts weren't a problem none of this would've mattered.

The Twins have been losing viewership for years while they watched Ballys be available on fewer and fewer services. They didn't have a choice then because they were under contract. They had a choice this offseason and signed up for the same sinking ship. According to DSP they hope to be part of an MLB offered package next year. I hope that happens. They openly acknowledged that this deal was going to hurt their viewership this year. Because I don't assume incompetence even though you constantly say I do, I actually assume they were smart enough to know that Diamond and Comcast had their contract running out soon so they knew there was a chance even more of their fans would lose access. I would actually believe that MLB encouraged them to take this deal to help tank Bally's and hurt the bankruptcy proceedings by Diamond not being able to come to terms with Comcast if a reliable source said that was the back room dealings. I'd question the Twins being a pawn in MLB's scheme, but I'd accept it's what happened.

I don't care what other responses you have. I know your stance is, and always will be, that the business men are smart and do no wrong. But businesses go down all the time. Businesses are incompetent all the time. The Twins complained about Bally's/Diamond, promised their customers no blackouts for 2024, and suggested they were going to cut payroll in part because of their TV deal that wasn't going to pay as much but would be better for reaching their fans. They ended back with the guys they said they didn't like, still have blackouts, and cut payroll anyways. I don't care what you want to call that, but they failed. DSP said they failed. I mean he added that they "aren't tone-deaf," but he acknowledged they failed at improving their situation. Use whatever term you want. It's not automatically the right outcome just because you want to defend the business men. We aren't going to agree on this so I'm done with this conversation.