Breaking: Twins Promote Top Prospect Austin Martin To Minnesota

[Patzky]

1 hour ago, Ted Schwerzler said:

Check around noon today for that update. Also, I think this move speaks volumes about where Miranda’s arm/shoulder are at.

The Royce news wasn't great. Thanks.

[JD-TWINS]

3 hours ago, DJL44 said:

The expected choice, no surprise.

Against RHP I think I'd rather see him play LF with Wallner at DH and Kirilloff at 1B than see Wallner in LF, Kirilloff at DH and Santana at 1B. The defensive upgrade is about the same but I'd rather give playing time to the rookie and see what he can do.

I like Kirilloff as the long term solution but I like Santana batting LH & making every play at 1B v. Martin hitting against RH pitching.

Plenty of time for Martin to get playing time - I guess I’m not that curious.

Baldelli will mix it up plenty I’m sure.

I think they’ll use him to run for guys like Vazquez & Santana from 5th/6th inning and on in the game. He’ll see time in the OF!

[Shaitan]

Farmer/Castro platoon at 3B and Martin is the utility player, I assume.

[Shaitan]

2 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

It sounds like even a minor version of Lewis's injury takes a player out for a few weeks. A moderate version of the injury could be six weeks.

At this point in the season, I think the move is to be as conservative as possible and give him full time to heal. If we were in a playoff race I'd say otherwise... But muscle injuries can resurface so easily if they rush them (I'm comparing this, in a way, to the Vikings giving Jefferson an extra 1-2 weeks last season).

[JD-TWINS]

38 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

Yeah...no.

Martin is a marginal talent.

Julien can hit.

Martin doesn’t seem special at this point - maybe average?

Julien walks a lot with almost too much plate discipline, if that’s possible. He is a special hitter even with the minor criticism!

Julien homers like every 21 AB’s……..Martin might hit 8 HR in a season some day.

My assumption is the high walk rate being the comparison………. Maybe the BA being in the .260 - .270 range? Julien has way more Pop in his bat and always will.

[DJL44]

48 minutes ago, Parfigliano said:

The foolishness of signing Margot concisely explained.

After promoting Martin the cupboard is completely bare at AAA for outfielders. You may want to retract that statement.

[JD-TWINS]

2 hours ago, Karbo said:

Finally get a chance to see the guy that was the key in the Berrios trade. Now we'll see how they use him and how many AB's he gets.

Doubt he gets many - he may spell Buxton every 5th day?

I think he pinch runs and plays OF defense after entering games.

He’s insurance. He’ll get a few AB’s a week. Still behind Margot.

[Schmoeman5]

3 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

Hope for the first option, but neither are going to cripple the season. 

Looks like he'll be out for at least a month now. You sure about that?

[sweetmusicviola16]

Good luck to Austin Martin as he starts his ML career.

Best wishes to Royce Lewis in his rehab. You Mr. Lewis are one heck of a talent with an even better attitude. I'm still behind you 100%. Twins will be fine in his absence. Just gotta push through.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

3 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

I'm looking forward to seeing him, but I think the expectations for Martin are getting a bit lofty. Julien's MiLB OBP was !.437! and he hit more HR in 109 games at the majors last year than Martin has in his entire minor league career. I really don't think these are similar kinds of prospects.

Martin had a .387 OBP in AAA last year.  I don't consider being in the .370 to .400 range as lofty expectations.  That is what I hope he does while acknowledging it could be lower.  

How are they similar.  First off,  both know more for bat first players working on their defense and both trying to find a position.  Both High OBP players.  

Austin Martin   2021   .414   2022   .368   2023   .381

Ed  Julien          2021   .431   2022   .441    2023   .435 (minor league)   .381 MLB

They both have a similar skillset of commanding the zone well with more power from Julien, more speed from Martin.  If Martin can be in that .370 to .400 range that is an incredibly small group of players.  

There were a total of 14 players in the mlb who had an OBP of .370 or higher.   So Yes in comparison,  Julien and Martin could be very valuable offensive piece if he can continue to perform at his historical levels.  

 

[nicksaviking]

53 minutes ago, Schmoeman5 said:

Looks like he'll be out for at least a month now. You sure about that?

Yeah, it's still a poor division, I'm not worried, I'd rather it be a different player than Lewis missing time, but this team should have always had a post open for a rookie anyway; way too many are getting cornered out in St. Paul. I wouldn't say it's a silver lining, but maybe a nickel lining.

[nicksaviking]

2 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Yeah...no.

Martin is a marginal talent.

Julien can hit.

Yeah, I don't want to get all negative, because I'm really not, but if Martin hadn't been a 1st round pick or traded for Berrios, we'd probably be putting him in the same group as Helman, Kiersey and Prato.

All of whom I'm still looking forward to seeing at some point. Certainly these aren't dead-end prospects, the Twins found Dozier and Arraez from this kind of tier.

[USAFChief]

23 minutes ago, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

 

There were a total of 14 players in the mlb who had an OBP of .370 or higher.    

 

And you expect that from Martin??

Extremely unlikely. You can't maintain that OBP in the big leagues if you can't hit.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

1 hour ago, USAFChief said:

And you expect that from Martin??

Extremely unlikely. You can't maintain that OBP in the big leagues if you can't hit.

He has the ability whether he can or not is a different question.  His pedigree says he can,  just look at the stats I posted.   Now MLB is a jump up and actual umps calling strikes,  but he is showing more consistency of hitting the ball.     

What are the odds, 30-40%.  I feel more comfortable about him succeeding in MLB for the long run than Wallner.  

[Fatbat]

6 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

Yeah, I don't want to get all negative, because I'm really not, but if Martin hadn't been a 1st round pick or traded for Berrios, we'd probably be putting him in the same group as Helman, Kiersey and Prato.

All of whom I'm still looking forward to seeing at some point. Certainly these aren't dead-end prospects, the Twins found Dozier and Arraez from this kind of tier.

Julien was an 18 rd pick that was nowhere on any experts radar.  Martin can develop his game. He just has to put the work in. 

[nicksaviking]

1 hour ago, Fatbat said:

Julien was an 18 rd pick that was nowhere on any experts radar.  Martin can develop his game. He just has to put the work in. 

That's the point, we shouldn't care about where they were drafted after about year two, their minor league numbers aren't close to comparable.

[DocBauer]

I want to be clear before I say anything else that I'm NOT a downer or non believer in Martin. And I congratulate him on making his pro debut!

If Lee wasn't hurt, the Twins would have found a way to make room for him as he's the EASY choice with Lewis out. Probably Weiss to the 60 day IL? With Lee a non option at the moment, I honestly believe if the Twins had an EASY 60 day IL sitting in front of them...and they really don't this early in the season...I think they would have added Helman and brought him up. Why? Two reasons:

1] They Ike Helman...and that's been proven by consecutive ST invites, as well as playing him almost daily this ST, and keeping him until late...because he's more than proven himself at AAA, has a nice mix of power and speed, can hit and get OB some...not yet proven at the ML level...and can literally play 7 spots.

2] Even if they like Helman, they aren't as concerned about his future development as they are with Martin. Helman could play all over, get his 1st ML shot, and Martin could work at St Paul for a month or two to refine his game and get ready for HIS 1st opportunity. 

But alas, injuries and roster construction and limitations didn't make this a logical move. 

Martin was the correct move for NOW, based on many factors. AGAIN, I'm NOT down on Martin. I'm just not sure he's fully ready, or that this is the right TIME for him. Once the Jays completely blew his debut by throwing him in at AA and at SS, the Twins didn't have a lot of choice but to put him at AA and SS when they initially acquired him. I DO THINK the Twins were wrong to continue playing him at SS come the next season, 2022, despite their idea that more time at SS would only assist his development in the dirt with future ability at 2B and 3B. I get it, I just think it was wrong. The whole "swing and miss and look for power" is COMPLETELY wrong and MISCONSTRUED. The Twins NEVER tried to turn Arraez in to a power hitter, for example. And the Twins NEVER said they were trying to turn Martin in to a 30 HR slugger. And anyone who wants to continue to bang that drum is just misguided and will never change their opinion. What the Twins were TRYING to do, was take a young, talented, athletic player who could HIT, and see if they could amp up his power some to be a big doubles and double digit HR threat. EVERY TEAM in MLB tries to find power in their players where they can because power plays, and it always has.

If you can hit, have contact ability, and can work the count, but can't do anything more than punch a few hits here and there, you have Ben Revere. ML pitchers will eat you alive!

Now, physical maturity, experience, taking from what he tried, and doing now of what he knew, Martin had a hell of an AFL after the 2022 season. He hit, he got on base, and he stroked 6 Dbls and 1 HR for a SLG % of .482. Very good in a SSS. His elbow injury put him on the shelf for over half of 2023. When he was healthy and ready to go, he hit .263 at St Paul, but maintained a really good .387 OB%, meaning he has an understanding of the ZONE. He also hit 11 Dbls and 6 HR...his college has was 10...for a AAA SLG% of .405. That PLAYS if you can HIT, work the count for a good OB%, and provide double power and occasional HR power.

I think Martin was on course to build on his AFL production and THIRD-ish of a 2023 season. But I think he just really needed a couple of months to really get his offensive game together before he was brought up to be READY. I think Rocco will use him in the smartest ways possible. And MAYBE he'll play some LF/CF/2B and PH and PR so well he will stick, or be damn hard to send down like Julien and Wallner last year, and then come back again. I HOPE that's the case. Right now, it feels like he's been brought up a month or two early.. But he's the logical choice for now. He'll get opportunities at LF/CF/2B,  Let's hope he's ready to rake and forces the Twins to keep him up, or forces regret to send him down before coming back again like we saw in 2023 with Julien and Wallner 

[Dman]

11 hours ago, DocBauer said:

I want to be clear before I say anything else that I'm NOT a downer or non believer in Martin. And I congratulate him on making his pro debut!

If Lee wasn't hurt, the Twins would have found a way to make room for him as he's the EASY choice with Lewis out. Probably Weiss to the 60 day IL? With Lee a non option at the moment, I honestly believe if the Twins had an EASY 60 day IL sitting in front of them...and they really don't this early in the season...I think they would have added Helman and brought him up. Why? Two reasons:

1] They Ike Helman...and that's been proven by consecutive ST invites, as well as playing him almost daily this ST, and keeping him until late...because he's more than proven himself at AAA, has a nice mix of power and speed, can hit and get OB some...not yet proven at the ML level...and can literally play 7 spots.

2] Even if they like Helman, they aren't as concerned about his future development as they are with Martin. Helman could play all over, get his 1st ML shot, and Martin could work at St Paul for a month or two to refine his game and get ready for HIS 1st opportunity. 

But alas, injuries and roster construction and limitations didn't make this a logical move. 

Martin was the correct move for NOW, based on many factors. AGAIN, I'm NOT down on Martin. I'm just not sure he's fully ready, or that this is the right TIME for him. Once the Jays completely blew his debut by throwing him in at AA and at SS, the Twins didn't have a lot of choice but to put him at AA and SS when they initially acquired him. I DO THINK the Twins were wrong to continue playing him at SS come the next season, 2022, despite their idea that more time at SS would only assist his development in the dirt with future ability at 2B and 3B. I get it, I just think it was wrong. The whole "swing and miss and look for power" is COMPLETELY wrong and MISCONSTRUED. The Twins NEVER tried to turn Arraez in to a power hitter, for example. And the Twins NEVER said they were trying to turn Martin in to a 30 HR slugger. And anyone who wants to continue to bang that drum is just misguided and will never change their opinion. What the Twins were TRYING to do, was take a young, talented, athletic player who could HIT, and see if they could amp up his power some to be a big doubles and double digit HR threat. EVERY TEAM in MLB tries to find power in their players where they can because power plays, and it always has.

If you can hit, have contact ability, and can work the count, but can't do anything more than punch a few hits here and there, you have Ben Revere. ML pitchers will eat you alive!

Now, physical maturity, experience, taking from what he tried, and doing now of what he knew, Martin had a hell of an AFL after the 2022 season. He hit, he got on base, and he stroked 6 Dbls and 1 HR for a SLG % of .482. Very good in a SSS. His elbow injury put him on the shelf for over half of 2023. When he was healthy and ready to go, he hit .263 at St Paul, but maintained a really good .387 OB%, meaning he has an understanding of the ZONE. He also hit 11 Dbls and 6 HR...his college has was 10...for a AAA SLG% of .405. That PLAYS if you can HIT, work the count for a good OB%, and provide double power and occasional HR power.

I think Martin was on course to build on his AFL production and THIRD-ish of a 2023 season. But I think he just really needed a couple of months to really get his offensive game together before he was brought up to be READY. I think Rocco will use him in the smartest ways possible. And MAYBE he'll play some LF/CF/2B and PH and PR so well he will stick, or be damn hard to send down like Julien and Wallner last year, and then come back again. I HOPE that's the case. Right now, it feels like he's been brought up a month or two early.. But he's the logical choice for now. He'll get opportunities at LF/CF/2B,  Let's hope he's ready to rake and forces the Twins to keep him up, or forces regret to send him down before coming back again like we saw in 2023 with Julien and Wallner 

I agree Doc.  I like Martin a lot and he will be a good fit for this team eventually.  I just think he would be better served getting consistent at bats at AAA instead of a bench role with the MLB club.  If the Twins could afford a 40 man spot for Helman I agree he would have been a nice choice.  He played shortstop for St Paul last night and looked good there. and as you noted he can play 7 other spots.  He went 0 for 4 last night but the first two balls went to the warning track and a third was scorched but right to the 3rd baseman.  I can see why the Twins are high on him. I just think that if you were going to waste a guy on the bench giving it to the 27 year old Helman would have made more sense, however, since he is not on the 40 man Martin is a good choice as an infield\outfield replacement and pinch runner. Hopefully he can do some positive things while he is up there and prove he belongs.  It's just tough without consistent at bats to make it from the bench. That is my only concern.

[RpR]

It is only one game but it showed why they sent him to AAA today.

[KBJ1]

The $15M we spent on DeSclafani, Santana & Margot was an absolute waste! We had Varland, Martin & Miranda capable of filling those roles at league minimum and could have signed Gurriel or a pitcher instead.

UGH!

[RpR]

3 hours ago, KBJ1 said:

The $15M we spent on DeSclafani, Santana & Margot was an absolute waste! We had Varland, Martin & Miranda capable of filling those roles at league minimum and could have signed Gurriel or a pitcher instead.

UGH!

😂

[Mike Sixel]

3 hours ago, KBJ1 said:

The $15M we spent on DeSclafani, Santana & Margot was an absolute waste! We had Varland, Martin & Miranda capable of filling those roles at league minimum and could have signed Gurriel or a pitcher instead.

UGH!

DeSclafini was the cost of getting the other two players they got in the deal.

I agree on Santana, but am unsure about Margot (though I would not have spend that money that way, I get why they did).

What starting pitcher would you have signed for that 15 million?

[weneedneshek]

10 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

DeSclafini was the cost of getting the other two players they got in the deal.

I agree on Santana, but am unsure about Margot (though I would not have spend that money that way, I get why they did).

What starting pitcher would you have signed for that 15 million?

Seth Lugo