Slow Spring Training, Any Reason to be Concerned?

[Guest]

Spring training results don’t matter. Spring training results don’t matter. Spring training results don’t matter. Spring training results……..

[RpR]

9 hours ago, Bodie said:

Even in meaningless games, I HATE to see Ks outnumbering hits, especially after last year's (and not just last season...) K-palooza.

I can remember when any player who did so was almost universally deemed to not be a real MLB player.  No clue what the consensus would be about a team doing so would be, but I can guess!

As spring training means nothing,  💩 , Wallner's strike out percentage is now 51.7241379% but we all know when regular season starts he will maintain at the Mendoza line.

[Guest]

Wallner has done nothing to deserve coming North with the starters. Spring training results don’t matter except for the fringe where it does matter. Don’t tell me he is working on a super secret swing that he will abandon once the season starts. Larnach deserves left field as of today!!!!

[stringer bell]

25 minutes ago, Verified Member said:

Wallner has done nothing to deserve coming North with the starters. Spring training results don’t matter except for the fringe where it does matter. Don’t tell me he is working on a super secret swing that he will abandon once the season starts. Larnach deserves left field as of today!!!!

I don't think Wallner is guaranteed to be on the squad on May 1, but his performance in 2023 is enough to roll with the bad ST performance at least for a couple of weeks.

[Fatbat]

Its all about finishing strong in October.  Building blocks being placed together in March doesn’t always mean immediate wins.  Not concerned one bit about slow starts. 

[bean5302]

I would be stunned if Wallner was left off the 26 man after being one of the best hitters producing on pace for a 4 WAR full season in MLB last year. Spring Training has nearly two weeks left. I'm confident Wallner will get it together, and even if he doesn't, there's no way to say he's not working on something.

The Twins know what they have in Larnach. He's solid injury replacement depth, but he comes with maybe a 1.5 WAR ceiling due to his below league average bat. He's probably best considered a lefty version of Kyle Garlick on a team that doesn't need more lefty bats. It's a shame for Larnach because there are a few teams around the league where he'd have a better shot at some playing time.

[Doctor Wu]

On 3/16/2024 at 11:04 PM, FlyingFinn said:

Wallner, no. But don't expect great things in April. Notoriously slow starts almost every minor league season. I always said it was moving up levels but maybe it's mostly that it takes him forever to get in the groove.

I didn't realize that Wallner was a perpetually slow starter in regards to his performance each year. Man, he's had an awful spring so far, so I sure hope he gets in the groove very soon!

[Doctor Wu]

I'm certainly not concerned with the team's won-loss record in spring training, but a few of the individual performances certainly do make me wonder if it's just spring tweaks or something more amiss. Still, I would be nice to see Lopez have a clean  outing, or Topa show something in the bullpen, or Wallner start to hit. 

[Riverbrian]

I'm not sure how concerned I would be if this was the record after the first 19 games of the regular season... let alone the first 19 games of spring training with guys named Winkel facing guys named Serven. 

My concerns with the team are the same concerns that I had prior to the start of the spring training and those concerns exist only on paper and in my subjective head. 

The team is getting ready for opening day... I'm already ready for it. Getting ready for it is much easier for me. 

[bean5302]

4 hours ago, Doctor Wu said:

I didn't realize that Wallner was a perpetually slow starter in regards to his performance each year. Man, he's had an awful spring so far, so I sure hope he gets in the groove very soon!

He's not. Wallner had a slow start in 2022, but...

2023 AAA (3/31-4/15) = .280/.333/.600 OPS .933 wRC+123
2021 A+ (5/4-5/14) = .289/.378/.553 OPS .930 wRC+ 147

This spring Wallner is missing pitches by a bit. He's generating a lot of pop ups and not many line drives so it looks like there's a little hitch in his game he'll need to address. It's a non-issue at this point. Spring Training is nothing like the regular season.

[Hawkeye Bean Counter]

4 hours ago, Doctor Wu said:

 Still, I would be nice to see Lopez have a clean  outing, or Topa show something in the bullpen, or Wallner start to hit. 

You are not paying attention to how Lopez treats spring training.  He treats spring training as experimentation and refining pitches he wants to work on.   I think one spring training game last year all he threw was his new sweeper nothing else.   

“Pitching is an art; pitching is science,” López said. “It's about having the tools, having an idea of what you want to work on, to make sure that's what you're working on that day, stick to that thing. Next bullpen, it's going to be something else and something else, and then it's going to be a big final product.”

 

Same thing with the 0-2 sinker that Olson took deep on Monday. López knew he hadn’t thrown any 0-2 sinkers to lefties last season, so he challenged himself to try it and see if it could factor in at points this season.

“It didn't work out; he hit it like 600 feet,” López said. “But it's like, maybe that's not the right guy to do it if you're going to attempt a pitch like that.”

 

 

[RpR]

49 minutes ago, bean5302 said:

He's not. Wallner had a slow start in 2022, but...

2023 AAA (3/31-4/15) = .280/.333/.600 OPS .933 wRC+123
2021 A+ (5/4-5/14) = .289/.378/.553 OPS .930 wRC+ 147

This spring Wallner is missing pitches by a bit. He's generating a lot of pop ups and not many line drives so it looks like there's a little hitch in his game he'll need to address. It's a non-issue at this point. Spring Training is nothing like the regular season.

He is generating a LOT of Strike Outs and nothing else.

At that, Kepler and Margot are not a heck of a lot better at this point.

[stringer bell]

Last year, López was getting ready for the WBC, which probably changed his preparation. This year, it's all about the regular season. I'm glad he got plenty of work in for his last outing and I'm trusting he'll be ready for a big season. 

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

I'm not sure how concerned I would be if this was the record after the first 19 games of the regular season... let alone the first 19 games of spring training with guys named Winkel facing guys named Serven. 

My concerns with the team are the same concerns that I had prior to the start of the spring training and those concerns exist only on paper and in my subjective head. 

The team is getting ready for opening day... I'm already ready for it. Getting ready for it is much easier for me. 

All you have to do is review the 2021 season to see that if you get off to a sh!t start it is too hard to recover.  Twins need to be executing on opening day, not May 1!!!

[Riverbrian]

7 minutes ago, Verified Member said:

All you have to do is review the 2021 season to see that if you get off to a sh!t start it is too hard to recover.  Twins need to be executing on opening day, not May 1!!!

Is that all I have to do? 

2021 tells the story? 

 

 

[Fatbat]

Everything in ST before the last 3-5 games should be used to develop skills and habits to excel and stay healthy for the next 7 months. I am waaaay more concerned about short and long term health in ST than K’s by a couple sluggers or a dinger given up by an ace pitcher. Get the mistakes ironed out now, not in April, May and June. 
So the team won a meaningless game today but DeSclafani is shut down. Duran on the IL. Thielbar is behind schedule and Buck is sore and cant swing a bat. That stuff is important. Not todays win. 

[RpR]

1 hour ago, Fatbat said:

Everything in ST before the last 3-5 games should be used to develop skills and habits to excel

Do you mean get ones strike out percentage below 50 percent?

Should not have to develope that after having played in the Major last year.

[Fatbat]

1 hour ago, RpR said:

Do you mean get ones strike out percentage below 50 percent?

Should not have to develope that after having played in the Major last year.

Without knowing what he is trying to improve, it’s impossible to be an armchair coach.  Maybe he is trying to recognize breaking balls better? Maybe he is trying to unlock more opposite field power. My point was that just because there are strikeouts over 50% doesn't mean that a horrible season is inevitable.  If you want to care that someone is striking out most of the time in ST without knowing why, go for it. I could care a less. 

[Twins_Fan_in_NJ]

I'm still not a big believer in Popkins. I know the players like him, but the on-field results haven't been there. I think the line-up will be prone to prolonged slumps and a lot of strike outs. The division being what it is, the offense will do enough but when the post-season comes around, they'll be exposed (again).

[Mike Sixel]

2 hours ago, Twins_Fan_in_NJ said:

I'm still not a big believer in Popkins. I know the players like him, but the on-field results haven't been there. I think the line-up will be prone to prolonged slumps and a lot of strike outs. The division being what it is, the offense will do enough but when the post-season comes around, they'll be exposed (again).

Twins were 7th in OpS and tenth in runs scored for the season, with Julien and Lewis and Wallner playing half the year. CC was hurt. What are you expecting? They won a playoff series. 

I'm not sure I understand what fans expect. 

[sampleSizeOfOne]

"I could be bounded in a nut shell and count myself a king of infinite space, were it not that I have bad dreams."

What was the question again?

 

Oh yeah. Concerns. Somehow i think there are always concerns. Even if we weren't concerned about our players nit being good enough, that doesn't address the concerns others might still be better.

[Tuffjuff]

On 3/17/2024 at 6:29 PM, Verified Member said:

Wallner has done nothing to deserve coming North with the starters. Spring training results don’t matter except for the fringe where it does matter. Don’t tell me he is working on a super secret swing that he will abandon once the season starts. Larnach deserves left field as of today!!!!

I would argue Wallner isnt or shouldnt be on the fringe. What he did last year in his rookie year is better than anything Larnach has ever done at the Major League Level. Let Wallner start the regular season and we can readjust in May if he is still sputtering

[Twins_Fan_in_NJ]

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

Twins were 7th in OpS and tenth in runs scored for the season, with Julien and Lewis and Wallner playing half the year. CC was hurt. What are you expecting? They won a playoff series. 

I'm not sure I understand what fans expect. 

They won a playoff series because of pitching and heroics from Correa. If they are going to take the next step and be a legitimate threat to win the pennant, the line-up needs to be a lot longer and we need to see much fewer strikeouts. The feast or famine approach rarely works - look at the Yankees over the last few years.

[Doctor Wu]

On 3/18/2024 at 11:54 PM, Hawkeye Bean Counter said:

You are not paying attention to how Lopez treats spring training.  He treats spring training as experimentation and refining pitches he wants to work on.   I think one spring training game last year all he threw was his new sweeper nothing else.   

“Pitching is an art; pitching is science,” López said. “It's about having the tools, having an idea of what you want to work on, to make sure that's what you're working on that day, stick to that thing. Next bullpen, it's going to be something else and something else, and then it's going to be a big final product.”

 

Same thing with the 0-2 sinker that Olson took deep on Monday. López knew he hadn’t thrown any 0-2 sinkers to lefties last season, so he challenged himself to try it and see if it could factor in at points this season.

“It didn't work out; he hit it like 600 feet,” López said. “But it's like, maybe that's not the right guy to do it if you're going to attempt a pitch like that.”

 

 

Good observation about Lopez. I like the way he thinks and approaches the art of pitching, so I'm not too terribly concerned about him giving up runs in spring training. If he's working on various pitches and strategy in these ST games, hopefully that translates to a stronger regular season. 

[Parfigliano]

21 hours ago, Tuffjuff said:

I would argue Wallner isnt or shouldnt be on the fringe. What he did last year in his rookie year is better than anything Larnach has ever done at the Major League Level. Let Wallner start the regular season and we can readjust in May if he is still sputtering

Wallner has shown he is a MLB hitter.  Larnach has not.  Wallner goes north.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I don't get worked up about spring, whether the team is bad or good. But it's harder to consciously dismiss results when they're good.

[Major League Ready]

22 hours ago, Tuffjuff said:

I would argue Wallner isnt or shouldnt be on the fringe. What he did last year in his rookie year is better than anything Larnach has ever done at the Major League Level. Let Wallner start the regular season and we can readjust in May if he is still sputtering

He has almost 1500 professional ABs not to mention Wallner has performed better at the ML level..  Using 29 ABs in spring training to decide if he goes north would be pretty foolish.  Now, if Larnach kills it for 6 weeks and Wallner struggles, it will be nice to have a back-up plan.

[Mike Sixel]

23 hours ago, Twins_Fan_in_NJ said:

They won a playoff series because of pitching and heroics from Correa. If they are going to take the next step and be a legitimate threat to win the pennant, the line-up needs to be a lot longer and we need to see much fewer strikeouts. The feast or famine approach rarely works - look at the Yankees over the last few years.

How is the length of the lineup on the hitting coach? 

[jorgenswest]

I know better than to be concerned about the spring stats of any individual but it is getting hard to ignore all of the team losses. 

[KBJ1]

This team is not ready to gel and a slow start to the season will not help matters.

Should have signed an impact player like Gurriel and not wasted $15M on DeSclafani, Margot & Santana.

Varland, Miranda & Martin + $15 spend wisely would have been a much better option. But they panicked and went for mediocrity.