Mahle shut down with elbow...

[wsnydes]

Mahle will miss his next start, possibly more with an elbow injury.  Severity yet to be determined as they run tests.

https://www.mlb.com/news/tyler-mahle-set-to-be-shut-down-miss-next-start?partnerID=mlbapp-iOS_article-share

 

[Craig Arko]

It’s Louis time.

[twins_89]

The Mahle trade is looking like a bust. He's been with the Twins for around 90 games and in that time he's made 9 starts, 3 of which he left early due to health issues.

[Dave Borton]

24 minutes ago, twins_89 said:

The Mahle trade is looking like a bust. He's been with the Twins for around 90 games and in that time he's made 9 starts, 3 of which he left early due to health issues.

Makes you wonder what the Reds knew?

[Eris]

It was known that Mahle had shoulder issues before the trade last year. 
 

https://www.mlb.com/news/tyler-mahle-reds-injury-shoulder-strain

 

 

[JD-TWINS]

1 hour ago, davidborton said:

Makes you wonder what the Reds knew?

They knew he was just average going forward. Too many pitches per inning (no guts) & too many HR. Not Great American Ballpark’s fault - he gave up 3 HR in his Target Field debut last year…….leading Twin’s starter this year with 5 HR. Live in Cincinnati - last summer I was hoping we’d trade whoever needed to get Castillo instead of Mahle. They are completely different guys………..if that happens, we re-signed Castillo - don’t have López & still have Arraez. Now we’re hoping we can replace Arraez’ offense with a guy (prospect) we could have traded to Cinti.

Live & learn - I like our FO & we did what we thought would work out. Mahle wouldn’t have helped enough last year - no foul. This new issue seems to be elbow & not shoulder……have to just wait & see. He’s thrown well enough for a 4/5 starter this year. He can help us even if he sits a couple times this year for 3 weeks. 12-18 quality starts helps us keep pace, not the end of the world. Surely doesn’t feel like a guy we want to try & extend.

Extend Gray while he’ll still talk to us. Always risk but 2 years at $42M seems to make sense. We can see that after Pablo signed his extension he’s not really Superman, just another 2-3 starter like Gray & Ryan. ALL 3 are really  valuable!!!

On pace for 95 wins after April & our offense has been anemic at times (2B & 1B began year at AAA) & two starting pitchers have had mediocre to bad starts to the season. Blew a game in the Pen yesterday. Best platoon player got hit by pitch in the face. Still winning………

Looking good for a successful year!!

[tony&rodney]

May brings a difficult schedule and an opportunity for the depth in starting pitchers to show their stuff. Ober is in the rotation and we will see if Varland or Woods Richardson or Headrick are ready for the big stadiums. I would guess Varland gets first crack. Wishing the guys luck.

First up is Chicago which just scored 7 runs in the bottom of the 9th inning to walk off the Tampa Bay Rays. Hopefully Joe Ryan can provide an example to whomever starts on Wednesday before Pablo Lopez gets a chance to bounce back from a couple of less than stellar outings.

Mahle is shut down for four weeks and then faces a two to three week buildup before he is back to MLB. Bad luck for him is an opportunity for someone else.

[CRF]

No doubt that Mahle has been a disappointment for us, due to the injuries. Even when he's been healthy enough to pitch, he really hasn't shown a whole lot. Hindsight being 20/20, we shouldn't have made the trade for him. I've said it before...I'd much rather see Ober and Varland in the rotation than Mahle, and now with Maeda out, we'll need both of them. 

[JD-TWINS]

20 minutes ago, CRF said:

No doubt that Mahle has been a disappointment for us, due to the injuries. Even when he's been healthy enough to pitch, he really hasn't shown a whole lot. Hindsight being 20/20, we shouldn't have made the trade for him. I've said it before...I'd much rather see Ober and Varland in the rotation than Mahle, and now with Maeda out, we'll need both of them. 

I live in Cincinnati and am not a huge Mahle fan. However, he only had 1 poor outing this year for Twins. He only pitched 4 innings last time out but his ERA is just above 3.00 for the season over 5 starts………he’s a solid option if he’s healthy for sure.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Disappointed, hopefully it’s just one start and he’s back quickly!

[CRF]

23 minutes ago, Richie the Rally Goat said:

Disappointed, hopefully it’s just one start and he’s back quickly!

Reports are he's going to be shut down and miss at least a month, then reevaluated. Looks like he could be done for a while. 

[Five minute major]

This one makes me crazy.  Called it a bad trade the day it was made and it's even worse than I expected.  Meanwhile, Steer is starting to look like a solid everyday player with CES batting .448 in AAA at age 23.  Anybody who though this was a good trade should be suspended from posting on this site.   This will go down as one of the worst trades in Twins history and it was so easily identifiable at the time.

[mnfireman]

Looks like Varland will be getting and extended look, though whichever of him and Ober isn't performing will likely be sent back to AAA when Maeda is ready.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/04/twins-tyler-mahle-to-be-shut-down-for-four-weeks.html

[wsnydes]

 

 

 

[KirbyDome89]

So 6-8 weeks until we see Mahle starting a game for the Twins, and that's if everything (recovery + rehab) goes well. 

Maeda is on the 15 day IL and it sounds like there's a chance that stint might be closer to 4 weeks.  

This team couldn't get into May without 2 starters going down. I was concerned about Mahle's shoulder, not his elbow, to start the year, but ahhhh......

https://twinsdaily.com/forums/topic/60913-current-twins-injuries/

some of this thread has aged like milk.

[Rigby]

The big loss in that trade very possibly will end up being Encarnacion-Strand. Really hated to lose him.

[Jocko87]

3 hours ago, Five minute major said:

This one makes me crazy.  Called it a bad trade the day it was made and it's even worse than I expected.  Meanwhile, Steer is starting to look like a solid everyday player with CES batting .448 in AAA at age 23.  Anybody who though this was a good trade should be suspended from posting on this site.   This will go down as one of the worst trades in Twins history and it was so easily identifiable at the time.

I don't know that I'd go that far. If you are calling it a bad trade it's for the injury, not the prospects sent. Those guys were going somewhere else regardless, they were a tier below Lewis, Lee, Martin and Julien. If you knew he was going to have arm troubles kudos to you.

Unfortunate result so far but I'd do something similar again this year.

I was worried about reoccurrence as we never really got any indication of what the problem was. Let's rest some more and see what happens? Seems like something is wrong in there.

[Battle ur tail off]

3 hours ago, mnfireman said:

Looks like Varland will be getting and extended look, though whichever of him and Ober isn't performing will likely be sent back to AAA when Maeda is ready.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/04/twins-tyler-mahle-to-be-shut-down-for-four-weeks.html

Don’t be so sure about that. My guess is neither Maeda or Mahle makes more than a handful of starts this year. Most knew it was going to be like this. The good thing is we have some depth. And hopefully at least one of those 2 can give you 100-120 innings 

[tony&rodney]

I have never been a fan of Mahle but was pleased the Twins traded for him. Pitching is tough to get and no team has enough it seems (ok, maybe the Atros). So, yes, I was a fan of the trade for pitching, even if it was Mahle. I would have offered a ton more for Luis Castillo, which is a gamble too. All pitchers are gambles. Look at Jacob deGrom.

What is difficult to understand is how fans are suggesting that Steer or CES are the missing piece for the Twins. I'm not sure either player would fit on the 40 person roster.  I say that and early last season I was very enamored with CES and his bat. Where does he play though? Do we bench Buxton? We cannot trade him due to the no trade clause in his contract. Sometimes a team needs to part with good players to get guys they believe will help them more. Gray for Petty was a risky but good trade. The Twins gave up quite a bit to get Jorge Lopez from Baltimore. The trade of Arraez for Pablo Lopez was another big gamble, especially if suddenly an elbow goes ouch. Sometimes trades work and other times not, but it remains a solid way to fill holes on a roster. 

Now, who is going to be upset if the Twins trade Brooks Lee, Marco Raya, and Noah Miller in July?

[Mike Sixel]

4 hours ago, Five minute major said:

This one makes me crazy.  Called it a bad trade the day it was made and it's even worse than I expected.  Meanwhile, Steer is starting to look like a solid everyday player with CES batting .448 in AAA at age 23.  Anybody who though this was a good trade should be suspended from posting on this site.   This will go down as one of the worst trades in Twins history and it was so easily identifiable at the time.

So they should have just sat pat while leading the division and needing pitching? Ugh. At some point, you have to try to win. 

[Chachi]

Paddock and Pineda…..Mahle.  At this stage - a bridge contact looks like a reasonable fallback to salvaging something for both sides.  

[roger]

So we are looking at a 30-45 day visit to the IL? 

We all have been wondering how the Twins will handle the three starters headed towards free agency, Mahle, Gray and Maeda? 

In Mahle's case, I hope he gets back on the mound by mid-June.  That would give him time to pitch well for six weeks so the Twins can trade him for a reasonable prospect at the deadline.

I am assuming that Ober/Varland will pitch well in the M&M boys absence, allowing the Twins to move one of the three.  They won't be able to count on Paddack returning for this year, but should count on him for 2024.  Still hope they resign one of the three, sure is looking like that one should be Gray.

[Nashvilletwin]

10 hours ago, Jocko87 said:

I don't know that I'd go that far. If you are calling it a bad trade it's for the injury, not the prospects sent. Those guys were going somewhere else regardless, they were a tier below Lewis, Lee, Martin and Julien. If you knew he was going to have arm troubles kudos to you.

Unfortunate result so far but I'd do something similar again this year.

I was worried about reoccurrence as we never really got any indication of what the problem was. Let's rest some more and see what happens? Seems like something is wrong in there.

The point is that “assets” are assets.  The “assets” given up in the Mahle trade could have been deployed elsewhere. And no mistake, they were valuable assets. For example, could they have been used to package with another player, say a Kepler, for a different pitching asset, say even a Pablo Lopez? 

It has been a bad trade - right from the start - in every respect thus far. It is unlikely ever to be a good trade.  Sorry, I do not give a pass to our FO on this one for the “who could’ve known” argument.  It’s their job to know - especially when it’s so evident right out of the gate.

The FO has other wins though, so we need to be a good ump and call balls and strikes as we see them.  This was a ball.  Give the FO credit though in seeing the risk in their mistake (and with Maeda’s return) and going out to get Lopez - it’s just too bad it cost us so much to mitigate it.

 

[Trov]

14 hours ago, Five minute major said:

This one makes me crazy.  Called it a bad trade the day it was made and it's even worse than I expected.  Meanwhile, Steer is starting to look like a solid everyday player with CES batting .448 in AAA at age 23.  Anybody who though this was a good trade should be suspended from posting on this site.   This will go down as one of the worst trades in Twins history and it was so easily identifiable at the time.

I would point out CES has played 6 games, so if he goes 0-4 a couple of games he will be well below .300 he does it 3 games may be below .200.  Not saying he will, but pointing a batting average after 6 games is very SSS.  He also was still our like 5 ranked infield prospect, so likely we would have been looking to move him at some point.  I also hear he cannot play much defense. 

[Trov]

1 minute ago, Nashvilletwin said:

The point is that “assets” are assets.  The “assets” given up in the Mahle trade could have been deployed elsewhere. And no mistake, they were valuable assets. For example, could they have been used to package with another player, say a Kepler, for a different pitching asset, say even a Pablo Lopez? 

It has been a bad trade - right from the start - in every respect thus far. It is unlikely ever to be a good trade.  Sorry, I do not give a pass to our FO on this one for the “who could’ve known” argument.  It’s their job to know - especially when it’s so evident right out of the gate.

The FO has other wins though, so we need to be a good ump and call balls and strikes as we see them.  This was a ball.  Give the FO credit though in seeing the risk in their mistake (and with Maeda’s return) and going out to get Lopez - it’s just too bad it cost us so much to mitigate it.

 

Speculating on what we could have got in other trades is hard to evaluate.  Would Miami have made same trade for Lopez, we will never know.  Would we have found some other pitcher out there available, maybe, would they have done any better, who knows.  Look what happened with other trade target every one seemed to have targeted on here.  Montas.  He failed bad in New York and now out the year for them.  Maybe we could have traded for him, and be in same situation. 

[DJL44]

16 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

Extend Gray while he’ll still talk to us. Always risk but 2 years at $42M seems to make sense.

That makes no sense for Gray. He'd be leaving $50M on the table.

[tony&rodney]

FWIW, during the Arraez - Lopez trade conversations there were comments from the Miami leadership that Arraez was the only player from the Twins organization that held interest as a main target. No Arraez, no trade. This does make sense and explains why that trade took so long to accomplish. The Twins did not want to send Arraez but needed pitching and ultimately the addition of Salas and Acuna sealed the deal.

[DJL44]

14 hours ago, Five minute major said:

This will go down as one of the worst trades in Twins history and it was so easily identifiable at the time.

If this is one of the worst trades in the history of the franchise they have been blessed with exceedingly good luck.

[tony&rodney]

Hayes, and others, have reported that Sonny Gray wants to go through free agency. 

[DJL44]

20 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Hayes, and others, have reported that Sonny Gray wants to go through free agency. 

If I was leading the league in ERA I would also want to go through free agency.