The Sky Is Not Falling: The Pohlads Retaining Ownership of Minnesota Twins Has Silver Linings

[S Bart]

48 minutes ago, DocBauer said:

Ahhh....the Minnesota Twins. The team you hate to love and and ownership you love to hate. (Snicker)

I've never been a Pohlad apologist in any way, but I was also never a basher. I was kinda proud of them when they were the SECOND? organization to jump on board during covid to retain everyone and pay them. About 2019 through 2023 they re-signed Buxton, took a FA shot on Donaldson, then brought Correa on board for a Twins record deal, and had payroll around 90-95% of league average. 

And then they blew up Fandom and any chance to maintain all the good will and team momentum in one harsh budget changing notification while the fans were still upbeat, happy, and optimistic. That's when I became a "disliker" of ownership.

When MLB cuts you a check of well over $100M before the season begins, before any tickets are sold, before counting any Twins centric TV and radio $ is added, etc, etc, how can you be over $425M IN DEBT unless you are just running the team poorly? And as far as PR goes? I'm just not going to go there for fear of saying something I'll regret later. (Sigh)

Over the last 24+ hours, EVERYTHING Eric brought up in his 5 points has gone through my head. 

It's very possible these new investors are simply playing a long game of a future return on their investment 5-10-15-20 years from now and are content to just sit back and do NOTHING. But that idea sounds a little fatalistic and short-sighted IMO. I have a hard time believing any new investor in the team, with a seat at the table, doesn't want to know exactly where and how their $ is going to be spent. Further, wouldn't they be interested in seeing their minority owner investment grow? Would they really be content just sitting back, smoke a big cigar, grab another glass of scotch, and just say: "wake me up when someone wants to buy me out and give me a return on my investment"?

It's possible.

It's also possible 2 groups investing well over $400M in the Twins might want a say so about where their $ is going to be spent, and how can this team/investment be run better? Each new investment group will probably select a chair person to have a seat at the table, even as minority owners. Can you imagine the repercussions if they ask the Pohlads where the $ was spent and they say it was a paydown for their debt? I'd think lawsuits might be forthcoming if that was the case. But that's just speculation on my part because I have little idea about someone making a $400-500M investment in a business/professional sports team.

I'd LIKE to think said minority owners would like to see growth in their new product OTHER THAN just normal inflation of said product over the next several years/decades. Wouldn't that just make a little sense?

I have no illusions of a massive payroll increase. I think ANY fan of the team has ONLY EVER ASKED to be around league average to keep the team competitive. Wouldn't new investors want the same vs 1.5M or less fans coming to the ballpark and a sour taste in the mouths of fans? Would they truly be happy and content to see their new product immediately bottom out?  And again, would they be content to just sit back and play the long game knowing they'll make back their investment PLUS in another 10 years or so.

Or might they have some new marketing ideas to grow their new investment? Might they want to see their new investment grow as a product for an even better return 10yrs from now?

My HOPE is the new investors, even as minority owners, will bring ideas and pressure to make the overall product better, more marketable, and even more profitable going forward.

Not saying it's going to happen. But it's my HOPE. I just can't imagine investing in a new product and being content to sit back and do and say nothing and just wait for a return a decade from now.

Pure and simple, it's a business for the Pohlad family. From what I have read, they had substantial debt which led to potential buyers being reluctant to purchase the team. The Angels and Nationals were previously up for sale, but both were also pulled off the market by the owners.

[kasotamatt]

Limited investors: my guess is it might be the Cambria Davis clan ... and a Joe Mauer led group? 

[h2oface]

Just more contrived BS. Content calls, I guess. 

[USAFChief]

Presumably the "limited partners" have access to TV and/or the internet, right? They probably heard of the Twins trade deadline Armageddon? And they still invested?

Wouldn't it then follow, if they were consulted, or at least continued with investment plans, they agreed with gutting the team? 

Or if they were somehowb opposed, why they'd suddenly have any influence on baseball operations this winter?

[DocBauer]

My biggest concern is Joe Pohlad. I don't know if he has the PULL in the family to actually LEAD the franchise.

I have a mixed bag of likes and dislikes regarding how Falvey has handled his responsibilities. Is Zoll actually competent to be the GM? I honestly don't know. I've never heard a bad word about him, and it's my understanding he's been heavily involved with various trades, signings and contract negotiations before he was promoted to his current role. But is he actually in charge of anything?

It's my understanding that Joe was, more or less, handpicked to be Jim's successor to run the Twins. It's also my understanding that he's spent years of involvement in various roles of running a ML team. And HORRENDOUS PR be damned, I think he actually DOES love baseball and really DOES want the Twins to do well.

He might be the only Pohlad who actually DOES CARE. But how much power/control does he ACTUALLY have? The Correa deal was initially shot down by Falvey as the original ask was ridiculous. So the Astro's owner then bypasses BOTH Falvey and Joe to speak to Jim directly to get the deal done.

I thought Jim was removed/retired and was only a consultant at this point? So is Joe actually in charge of ANYTHING? Or is his title only a gift to a nephew who likes baseball so he's been given a toy to play with but his uncle...and the rest of the family...are really in charge and he's only a figurehead?

I think it's OK to ask WTF of Joe about a lot of things, including the RIDICULOUS press release sent out. But why do I have weird Nickelodeon/Disney almost Willy Wonka flashes where I see a 40yo Joe Pohlad stomping his feet and pounding the wall in front of Jim and screaming: "No. I don't wanna! I'm in charge now!"

I'm trying SO HARD to find some potential good that might come out of this. Theoretically, there ARE reasons to hold out some hope based on all the various possibilities as Eric has pointed out, and that I myself have mulled over in my brain.

But I just can't help seeing a dysfunctional family infighting with Uncle Jim still really in charge as everyone claws and fights for what THEY need and want and the new minority owners...IF approved...are going to end up pissed at some point and a whole nother mess is going to take place!

I really, really hope I'm wrong!

[Doctor Wu]

11 hours ago, Patzky said:

A pleased Buck can't be a bad thing.

Frankly, I think that's a huge thing. As things are looking lately, it would seem that most free agents will NOT be looking at Minnesota as an attractive landing spot in the near future, but if players like Buxton can "sell" the team to others that is a good thing indeed.

[Patzky]

9 minutes ago, Doctor Wu said:

Frankly, I think that's a huge thing. As things are looking lately, it would seem that most free agents will NOT be looking at Minnesota as an attractive landing spot in the near future, but if players like Buxton can "sell" the team to others that is a good thing indeed.

Agreed. I also think Pablo is a great team ambassador in so many ways.. I hope we can find a way to keep him.

[David HK]

Nope. 

We all bent over and took the debacle of the fire sale, fully believing that it paved the way for the silver-spoon nepo-baby crowd to be gone.  That was the one and only silver lining here.

Then they turned around and hosed us again.  The utter contempt that clueless family has shown the fan base the past couple of years negates any notion of goodwill or even a modicum of hope.  They can go to hell.

[jmlease1]

The good thing about Pohlad ownership has been that they don't tend to pretend they know baseball well enough to interfere with the day to day baseball decisions, screw around with the manager or try to act like a de facto GM. The bad thing about the Pohlad ownership is almost every other business decision beyond getting Target Field build has been either wrong or poorly executed. Maybe you'd prefer to blame that all on Dave St. Peter, but I'd say the massive bungling of their media rights and reach is on ownership and hasn't just been a 1-time thing. The stunning tone-deafness at multiple points is on ownership. 

Joe Pohlad almost certainly is a baseball fan in a way that no other member of the family is. Which is a good thing...except for the fact that he hasn't shown any actually competence/success in his time as the family's ownership representative...and still has to answer to the rest of the clan (Jim still represents the team to the league, and it's not like this transaction has increased Joe's share of the team where he individually controls a chunk of it; it's still just part of the Pohlad companies). On the one hand, we're being asked to hope that he'll be able to convince the family of more investment in the team. On the other hand, we're running the risk that the 3rd generation rich kid is going to try and involve himself more on the baseball side to try and prove himself.

The reporting says that the capital investment is going to pay down debt...but no one knows how much of that debt will get paid down, and we never will because they will never ever open their books to an independent evaluator that's allowed to speak publicly. And what about the Pohlad ownership should make anyone trust them at their word? And even if they're clearing their debt service off the operating costs, they're exactly the sort of owners that will just replace that with the money owed to Correa for the next 3 seasons, and keep payroll low for 2026 with the anticipation of lockout in 2027.

The apparent business decisions of the Pohlad Family in relationship to the Twins after getting Target Field built (utilizing public financing and a lot of public funds) have given me nothing to believe we should be ok with them continuing to own the team. 

[Jeff K]

12 hours ago, darin617 said:

Why? Because Falvey did what he was told to do? If Falvey went rogue and went overboard with the fire sale he most likely would have been fired. The deadline has passed and what do they really need him for until the season is over. 

Because Falvey built a team of designated hitters that are poor in baseball fundamentals.  That is on Falvey.

[stringer bell]

I remember when Carl Pohlad was a savior for buying the Twins. Of course, he also raised his hand to accept contraction several years later. His heirs haven't done much to enhance the view of ownership in the eyes of the fans. What the family needs is someone who can present a more positive view of ownership and the team and perhaps too much damage has already been done.

IMHO, the "silver linings" are the relative stability of ownership and their Minnesota roots. That probably doesn't offset the Mr. Potter image of a banker forclosing on a war widow that has been developed. 

Fully funding their product is what the fans want. We've been conditioned that we can't compete with the payrolls of the Dodgers, Yankees, Phillies and Red Sox. The books reflect that something has gone wrong, so a prudent business would take measures to fit it. 

[JD-TWINS]

14 hours ago, LastOnePicked said:

I applaud the effort, but I don't think you've quite worked through the stages of grief yet. I hate to toss cold water, but ...

1) The Pohlads certainly knew of all of this before the trade deadline. What we all witnessed was a sell-off. There will be no payroll bump. In fact, they'll be looking to offload Lopez and Ryan in the offseason.

2) Why is this a silver lining? If I love an organization, the last thing in the world I want to hear is that a rich fool with more money than sense is excited about running that organization.

3) They would have already announced this, if that were the intent. No, they just needed cash, so they opened the door to investors. They have no intention of sharing their family legacy toys.

4) The minority partners could bring new ideas, sure. None of them will be listened to. Silver spooners tend to believe they're the smartest people in any room, despite any evidence to the contrary.

5) Come on. Buxton is loyal to the people who have paid him millions. I'd probably say the same if a Pohlad lined my pockets with a good contract after several injury years.

Sorry, yesterday's news was absolutely the worse-case-scenario for this club moving forward. What am I saying? - I mean, for this stagnant club going nowhere.

I agree on #2 & #5 for sure …… somewhat meaningless how these two “feel”.

#1 ……. Duran & Jax have generally been in talks for trade since last off-season (young Catcher, Abel, & Bradley got them talented, young upside with more control)…..at least as possibilities in trade. They’ll make $11-12M combined in ‘26…,,not a huge savings. Trading both was a little discouraging for ‘26 ……..(Jax still struggling with Tampa, btw) The guys on 1 year deals would have been dealt by ANY organization that was on the outside looking in at the end of July! Varland was not a salary dump. Correa was an anvil around the neck of the organization at $35M…..,missed a bunch of time in ‘23 & ‘24 & was sub-par on average for 4 months of ‘25. As a Minnesotan, Varland was difficult to get head around but it’s not $$ based.

#4 Nobody spends $400-$450M without having some influence on how to better the organization to maximize ROI. The money came from smart $$ people - they aren’t just handing Pohlad’s money to “bail them out” w/o a plan to increase revenues & fan support. I think there’s flexibility now with payroll due to Castro - Bader - Duran - Jax - Coulombe - Correa being gone ……. Vazquez off payroll in 7 weeks. That is roughly $67-$70M in salary….. if they utilize the new, young assets and previous rostered guys, and spend $40M of what was saved on 3-4 FA’s for PEN & a couple bats, they are good next year.

Nothing stopping them from trading young pitching for a Catcher that can play now in off-season.

[Jeff K]

2 hours ago, Doctor Wu said:

Frankly, I think that's a huge thing. As things are looking lately, it would seem that most free agents will NOT be looking at Minnesota as an attractive landing spot in the near future, but if players like Buxton can "sell" the team to others that is a good thing indeed.

I want to believe that and I am a big fan of Buxton.  That said, I don't know that Buxton knows much about building a baseball team.  His loyalty is super impressive, but this feels like an expression of loyalty vs. what's good for the team.

 

[stringer bell]

1 minute ago, Jeff K said:

Because Falvey built a team of designated hitters that are poor in baseball fundamentals.  That is on Falvey.

There's a lot of truth to this. The front office has drafted hitters without many other talents as undervalued assets Far too many incomplete players on the position player side of the roster. On the pitching side, they've had some success developing college guys with modest velocity, but not enough to offset their failures with position players. 

[Jeff K]

10 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Presumably the "limited partners" have access to TV and/or the internet, right? They probably heard of the Twins trade deadline Armageddon? And they still invested?

Wouldn't it then follow, if they were consulted, or at least continued with investment plans, they agreed with gutting the team? 

Or if they were somehowb opposed, why they'd suddenly have any influence on baseball operations this winter?

This makes too much sense...

[TopGunn#22]

I agree with JD-TWINS on a number of points.  Most of the guys we traded we all knew SHOULD be traded...and they were.  Every guy on an expiring contract was rightfully traded.  Some, they got reasonable value.  Others, it seemed like they could have done better (Stewart for Outman for example). 

The Varland trade, while the value was decent, still confounds me because he would have been our closer the rest of the season and at worst, depending on what BP arms they acquire this off season our 8th inning guy in 2026, and he was under team control at bargain prices for his production for several years.  

It doesn't really matter what Buxton thinks and what else is he going to say?

It should also be concerning that Rocco is pleased because he was probably a goner if new ownership had actually happened.  And I believe Rocco is a major part of the problem.

So to me, there is no way you can spin the fact that we are cursed with the Pohlad's for how ever many additional years as a positive.  Just no way.

However, with the depth of starting pitching and the continued surplus of LH hitting corner OF there remains opportunity to continue the team makeover this off season.  I'm left with Falvey (and Zoll, the intrepid "Man in the Shadows") to execute this off season makeover.  It is here that I lack a high degree of confidence.

This would be a great time to have a paid subscription to BBTV so that I could wheel and deal to my hearts content.  Alas, I continue to refuse to pay for it, so I will be forced to depend on Doc Gast to share the blockbuster trades involving Ryan and Lopez, or the lower impact, yet still fruitful trades involving Larach/Ober or Wallner/SWR to bring us a young, major league catcher and other possible lineup enhancements like 1B, LF, RF.  

 

[nicksaviking]

10 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Presumably the "limited partners" have access to TV and/or the internet, right? They probably heard of the Twins trade deadline Armageddon? And they still invested?

Wouldn't it then follow, if they were consulted, or at least continued with investment plans, they agreed with gutting the team? 

Or if they were somehowb opposed, why they'd suddenly have any influence on baseball operations this winter?

And even if they had no influence, we're talking about 'partners' that agreed to buy their debt in exchange for a percentage of the Twins. This sounds more like Tony Soprano or Big Gus's Payday Loans kind of sketchy to me.

[Farmer Stafford]

I dunno, maybe I'm just not totally in on everything and maybe I'm just an outsider, but as a Twins fan what I care about is keeping the Twins in Minnesota as the Twins and winning. I can't root for the Minnesota Twins to win if they're moved by some billionaire from Tennessee who really wants Nashville to have a pro team. Wild speculation on my part I suppose, but if the Pohlads still own it and Joe is true to his word what else should we do but wait? Joe Pohlad has been in place for less than a year, and I can absolutely believe he wants to fix a mess of debt and right the ship for our cities for years to come. Maybe I'm naively hoping, but I guess I'll hope nonetheless. Seems better than to despair and shoot the chances of keeping our team in Minny.

[Jasper]

Looks like Pohlads plan is use somebody elses money to clear 400 million in debt and tear down team and then put back on the market for 1.7 billion or more imo. They will get their money one way or another.

[jmlease1]

3 hours ago, Doctor Wu said:

Frankly, I think that's a huge thing. As things are looking lately, it would seem that most free agents will NOT be looking at Minnesota as an attractive landing spot in the near future, but if players like Buxton can "sell" the team to others that is a good thing indeed.

Premier FA aren't going to look at MN as an attractive landing spot because the Pohlads are unlikely to issue a payroll that will accommodate their salary demands. They'll be able to sign free agents if they're willing to pay them. 

That's the basic reality with pro sports. Some teams have an advantage because playing in a bigger market is more attractive to many FA, but at the end of the day the biggest advantage those bigger markets have is their payroll. When things are evened out more (like the NFL) small markets have no trouble signing free agents so long as they pay them. Green Bay has no trouble signing people in the NFL. Hell, even a gross franchise with a disgusting racist owner and a lengthy track record of incompetence like the Clippers (Sterling Era) were still able to sign FA's...when they paid them.

Players want to get paid (as they should). Meet their price and you can sign them. Don't and they'll go elsewhere.

[nicksaviking]

33 minutes ago, Farmer Stafford said:

I dunno, maybe I'm just not totally in on everything and maybe I'm just an outsider, but as a Twins fan what I care about is keeping the Twins in Minnesota as the Twins and winning. I can't root for the Minnesota Twins to win if they're moved by some billionaire from Tennessee who really wants Nashville to have a pro team. Wild speculation on my part I suppose, but if the Pohlads still own it and Joe is true to his word what else should we do but wait? Joe Pohlad has been in place for less than a year, and I can absolutely believe he wants to fix a mess of debt and right the ship for our cities for years to come. Maybe I'm naively hoping, but I guess I'll hope nonetheless. Seems better than to despair and shoot the chances of keeping our team in Minny.

Joe Pohlad has been in charge since they said they were going to 'right size' the payroll after the successful 2023 season. He was there when the organization started dumping it's other business debts on to the Twins.

[nicksaviking]

26 minutes ago, Jasper said:

Looks like Pohlads plan is use somebody elses money to clear 400 million in debt and tear down team and then put back on the market for 1.7 billion or more imo. They will get their money one way or another.

The debt was about 25%  of the asking price, and reportedly they gave 25% of their ownership to the hedge funds new ownership groups. 

So it stands to reason, either they think they can ask for 25% more than the 1.7B in the next couple of years, or they aren't planning on selling. Third option, is to continue dumping real estate debt on the team, then get another investor to buy a stake and eat their debt again in a few years.

[USAFChief]

7 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Joe Pohlad has been in charge since they said they were going to 'right size' the payroll after the successful 2023 season. He was there when the organization started dumping it's other business debts on to the Twins.

Joe Pohlad was named Twins "Executive Chair" in November 2022.

https://www.mlb.com/twins/team/front-office/joe-pohlad

I don’t think we know when the debt occured, do we?

Or for that matter, the origin of the debt?

 

[Eric Blonigen]

7 minutes ago, USAFChief said:

Joe Pohlad was named Twins "Executive Chair" in November 2022.

https://www.mlb.com/twins/team/front-office/joe-pohlad

I don’t think we know when the debt occured, do we?

Or for that matter, the origin of the debt?

 

Correct. The least-vague answer they have given is “since 2020”, which of course would coincide with the commercial real estate market contraction. There’s almost no way they COULD accrue that much baseball debt given TV deals, national money, etc.

[Otaknam]

Of course Rocco is happy with this news. He will get a longer contract and longer leash, despite his inability to manage a game with an occasional hit and run, stolen base when least expected, and an over reliance on analytics. And the bullpen, thanks to the trades, is a shell of its former self now stacked with unknown 30 something journeymen. Hard to watch a flailing team with an incompetent at the helm. 

[Eric Blonigen]

3 hours ago, Patzky said:

Agreed. I also think Pablo is a great team ambassador in so many ways.. I hope we can find a way to keep him.

Agreed, assuming he’s still on the team next season.

[Eric Blonigen]

12 hours ago, S Bart said:

Pure and simple, it's a business for the Pohlad family. From what I have read, they had substantial debt which led to potential buyers being reluctant to purchase the team. The Angels and Nationals were previously up for sale, but both were also pulled off the market by the owners.

Yes; Dan Hayes reported that at least one buying group who was in it til the end this time was very turned off by the debt on the books. No debt (or less debt) certainly should make the team more attractive should they pursue a sale again.

[NapoleonComplex]

Somehow, some way, Eric Blonigen is an anagram for Joe Pohlad.

[Eric Blonigen]

15 hours ago, Patzky said:

Hey, your words needed to be heard at least by me. Probably by Peter too. I wanted so much to think the black cloud was an overreacting to the announcement yesterday, but I found no simpatico, no cause to not panic or (worse)! give up on the team.

You have valid points but thank you, mostly, for pause to consider. Buxton seems pleased. A pleased Buck can't be a bad thing. My ultimate taste test will be what happens with Pablo and Ryan. They're key not only to remaining competitive but to indicate to fans that there is indeed still an iota of caring about them from ownership.

Thank you again for writing this.

Agreed. If they dump Pablo, Ryan, or Jeffers for prospects in the offseason, then they are who we think they are. Hopefully they stay, or if they are moved, the trades are challenge trades where they are moved for legitimate major league players that can move the offense forward.

[Western SD Fan]

If we assume the worst possible scenario for the Twins and the Pohlad ownership conglomerate (including these new minority ownership stakes), here is a possible scenario that plays out.

1.  FO trades Joe Ryan in the offseason but keeps Pablo Lopez.  Sounds crazy, huh?  But the Pohlads need to take the John Fisher master class of payroll management.  Spend just enough to not get a grievance from the MLBPA.  This means keeping Lopez and spending money on overpriced, underperforming free agents to fill out the roster that they can dump these players again at next year's deadline in order to save the money they were forced to spend.

2.  The Pohlads will likely keep the payroll as low as they can go for 2026 with the knowledge that a likely player lockout is coming.  If you believe the reports coming from the meeting between Bryce Harper and Manfred, this lockout will be long and drawn out.

3.  When the owners finally crush the players in negotiations, they may not get a salary cap, but the owners will eventually get the concessions necessary to supposedly make teams like the Twins, Rays, A's, Royals, etc. more competitive.  Of course, this is all a lie to make the owners more money.  The post-lockout valuation of the Twins will likely be higher than it is now with a more stable plan to make money.  At this point, the Pohlads will put the team back out on the market and cash in as the team will likely be valued closer to $2 Billion.

Likely for us fans, we will not sniff a competitive team until 2028 or later.  Maybe we will get lucky, and this group of players will form a cohesive team bond and become competitive before this time frame.  If that happens, good luck pulling any kind of hope of adding to actually make a playoff run.