Multiple Twins Missing From The Athletic’s All-Quarter Century MLB Team

[Cody Christie]

Image courtesy of Jerry Lai-USA TODAY Sports

The Athletic recently unveiled its MLB All-Quarter Century Team, highlighting the most significant players from the past 25 years. The list featured the expected big names, including future Hall of Famers and inner-circle legends alike. But if you’re a Minnesota Twins fan flipping through the lineup, you might have noticed something familiar: neglect. Once again, the national baseball media has minimized the accomplishments of some of the best players ever to wear a Twins uniform.

We’ve been here before. It’s a tradition as old as the Hubert H. Humphrey Metrodome’s roof collapsing under a heavy snowfall. Let’s break this down.

The Mauer Problem: A Democracy Malfunction?
At catcher, The Athletic chose Buster Posey and Yadier Molina over Joe Mauer. This should set off every Twins fan’s injustice alarm.

Yes, both Posey and Molina were phenomenal catchers in their era. Posey won MVP honors and served as the quiet engine behind the San Francisco Giants dynasty in the early 2010s. Molina, one of the most respected defensive catchers of all time, helped guide the Cardinals to multiple postseason runs.

But Mauer? All he did was hit .306 for his career while playing Gold Glove caliber defense behind the plate. He won three batting titles, a feat no other catcher in modern baseball can claim, and it seems unlikely that it will ever happen again. He took home an MVP award in 2009 by putting up one of the best offensive seasons for a catcher in history.

Oh, and he was a first-ballot Hall of Famer this year. Did we all forget that already? The Athletic tried to hedge, writing, "We don't hate your team, Minnesota. It's just American democracy at work," because the Posey-Molina decision came down to fan voting. In fact, Posey and Molina were separated by a mere 22 votes.

That defense might make sense in a vacuum. But in the real world, especially in our current political climate, there are times when democracy gets it wrong. Inexplicably, Mauer got left off the list, and that is something the writers could have remedied. 

Imagine replacing Mauer’s Midwest humility with a spotlight on the East Coast or West Coast market. Would this even be a debate? The only thing Mauer lacked was flash. But three batting titles from behind the plate and an MVP award should be enough flash for any voter, casual or professional.

Johan Santana: Forgotten Ace
You’ll have to scroll further to find another Twins slight. When it comes to starting pitchers, The Athletic named a murderer’s row: Justin Verlander, Max Scherzer, Clayton Kershaw, Randy Johnson, Pedro Martinez, Roy Halladay, and CC Sabathia. Objectively? That’s an excellent group. It's hard to argue with those names. But Johan Santana belongs in this conversation, at least as an honorable mention.

From 2004 to 2008, there was no better pitcher on the planet. Santana won two Cy Young Awards and finished in the top five two other times. He led the league in strikeouts three straight years, won the pitching Triple Crown in 2006, and carried some middling Twins teams into October on sheer will and a devastating changeup.

The knock against Santana, both for the Hall of Fame and apparently here, has always been longevity. His career simply didn’t last as long as some of the other greats. But in terms of peak value? He was as good as any of them and better than most.

If Sandy Koufax can make the inner circle of baseball immortality based on a short but dominant prime, why can’t Santana get at least a whisper in these all-time lists? Again: small-market blindness. If Santana spent his prime doing this for the Yankees or Red Sox, he’d be canonized.

Joe Nathan: The Forgotten Closer
And then we come to the closers. The Athletic’s list includes Mariano Rivera, Trevor Hoffman, Billy Wagner, Kenley Jansen, Craig Kimbrel, and Aroldis Chapman. Not exactly bums. Rivera is the greatest closer of all time, and others on this list are not far behind. Kimbrel and Jansen have been strikeout machines for more than a decade. Chapman’s inclusion comes with off-field baggage, but his peak dominance can’t be denied.

I've written before that Nathan’s case stacks up remarkably well with Wagner’s, and that remains true. Nathan finished his career with a 2.87 ERA, 377 saves, and a WHIP below 1.00. During his prime with the Twins (2004–2009), he was arguably the most reliable closer in the American League by posting sub-2.00 ERAs multiple times.

Wagner may have flashier strikeout rates, but Nathan’s consistency and performance in a tougher league (remember, the AL didn’t get to pitch to the opposing pitcher every ninth hitter) made him every bit as valuable. Nathan’s Hall of Fame support has been thin (just like Santana’s), and here again, national writers appear to have undervalued him. Small market, small notice becomes the theme again.

If you’re a Twins fan, none of this is shocking. National lists like this have always been unkind to Minnesota baseball heroes. Mauer doesn’t get his due as one of the greatest-hitting catchers ever. Santana’s electric peak is forgotten in favor of longevity. Nathan is buried behind flashier names.

The Athletic swears they don’t hate the Twins. However, the pattern here suggests otherwise. Perhaps it is democracy itself that is failing in another area of American life. Or maybe it’s the same old truth: if you play in Minneapolis instead of Manhattan, you better be twice as good to get half the recognition. At least the rest of us know the truth. And maybe that’s enough... for now.

Which player most deserved to be on the team? Leave a comment and start the discussion. 

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[TwinsDr2021]

Mauer should have been a must absolutely, IMO the only person Santana could/should replace is CC, and for Nathan, if you remove Riveria and Hoffman, the rest could just be drawn out of a hat

[jmlease1]

I don't have a problem with Posey at all. Great player, will be in the Hall one day. The fact that Molina got picked over Mauer is a joke. Molina had 2 great seasons and a lot of ok to good seasons. Most of his all-star appearances were undeserving, and most of his career he was a good to great defensive catcher who didn't hit all that much. It's great that he was in St L forever and they love him, but this is why you can't have a fan vote for important things. Mauer won 3 batting titles as a freakin' catcher and they ignored it because Molina played for a million years. 10 (over half) of Molina's seasons in MLB he had a bWAR under 2 (aka, starter quality). Mauer had half as many, and most of them were after he'd moved to 1B and didn't get the advantage of positional differential that Molina had.

Mauer & Posey were the best 2 catchers of the last 25 years, period.

Johan's case is complicated; I think he deserves a mention, but excluding him isn't a crime considering the company.

Nathan on the other hand deserves more credit, but the injuries and lack of post-season success probably dropped him out. But I'd take Nathan over Kenley Jansen every day of the week.

[nicksaviking]

Mauer is the only snub, though he did only play 10 seasons at catcher.

Santana should be in the HOF, but those other guys are 1st ballot pitchers. I don't see the snub there. Nathan was great but objectively, Wagner was a hair better. Meanwhile Kimbrel and Jansen have now lapped Nathan on the all time Saves list while being just as dominant at their peaks. As for Chapman, his resurgence means he'll likely also pass Nathan on that list while also being similarly (if not more) dominant.

[tony&rodney]

Buster Posey was a really good catcher and hitter for an extended period of time (45.0 WAR). Molina was a fantastic defensive catcher whose longevity behind the plate justifiably earned him massive praise (41.7 WAR). Joe Mauer? 55.6 WAR. Fans or pundits who favor Posey or Molina could argue all day about this topic. Consider the pitching staffs of the 3 teams, the relative support financially from the clubs, and the injuries. For me Joe Mauer is hands down the best catcher there was in all of baseball during his career.

[The Great Hambino]

Mauer would've been a worthy choice, but it was clearly three options for two spots.  There's plenty of justification for the choices they made that don't rely on the old, tired, poor-me coastal bias rationale (remind me again which coast the booming metropolis of St Louis is on)

For a list like this that evaluates players at a specific position and not as overall players, it matters that Mauer wound up playing slightly less than half of his games at catcher.  That doesn't look great stacked up against Posey (83%) and Molina (97%).  When determining the best catcher, that matters in a close race.

Also, right or wrong, team success is given a lot of weight in player legacy discussions, whether they're for a list like this, hall of fame candidacies, number retirements, etc.   It generally bothers me how much weight is given to team accomplishments in an individual player evaluation (see: Manning, Eli), but it does have to be considered.  When your competitors each won multiple championships in their primes while you never won a playoff game, that's going to affect the final tally, especially when you're a key contributor.  Posey didn't exactly light it up during the playoffs, but he did have the highest bWAR on two championship teams and was third on the team as a rookie for the third championship team.  And while Molina had a pretty mediocre playoff batting record overall himself, he hit well in their two World Series runs (especially 2006).  So while I think Mauer gets waaaaaaaay too much heat locally for his teams' lack of playoff success (he won the same number of playoff games as a Twin as Rod Carew, after all), it does have to be acknowledged as a factor.

Mauer was worthy of a slot on the team.  If I were picking, I'd pick Posey and Mauer (for all the talk about Molina's defense, it's weird how it's just completely ignored that he was a below-average career hitter).  But his omission isn't egregious, and certainly doesn't require falling back on our collective regional inferiority complex

 

[Fire Dan Gladden]

Articles like this are written more to create views and discussions rather than speak truths.
In every facet of sports, the coasts and larger cities get promoted first, followed by larger cities and "popular" players.

As good as Joe Mauer was, he was underappreciated by the Minnesota media as much as the national media. First ballot HOFer, but seemingly generally behind Molina and Posey in discussions.

Nathan might be the most underrated, underappreciated reliever in the last 40 years. If played for a coastal team, he would be in the HOF already.

Santana? No discussion of Grienke, Pettitte, Wainright, Buerhle, and a handful of others that probably deserve consideration ahead of him. Santana had a great run, but it was unfortunately pretty short 

[jmlease1]

16 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

As good as Joe Mauer was, he was underappreciated by the Minnesota media as much as the national media. 

Truth. Led by a member of the media actively leading the charge against him and running him down at almost every opportunity (partially because Joe didn't have any interest in going on his show. Not that Mauer had much interest in going on anyone's show, really). Having the MN media whine about Mauer taking too many walks and not getting enough RBIs is still one of the dumbest things that's ever happened in MN sports.

(part of my ongoing series on "Why Dan Barreiro should never talk about baseball", part XXXVII)

[NYCTK]

10 minutes ago, The Great Hambino said:

Mauer would've been a worthy choice, but it was clearly three options for two spots.  There's plenty of justification for the choices they made that don't rely on the old, tired, poor-me coastal bias rationale (remind me again which coast the booming metropolis of St Louis is on)

For a list like this that evaluates players at a specific position and not as overall players, it matters that Mauer wound up playing slightly less than half of his games at catcher.  That doesn't look great stacked up against Posey (83%) and Molina (97%).  When determining the best catcher, that matters in a close race.

Also, right or wrong, team success is given a lot of weight in player legacy discussions, whether they're for a list like this, hall of fame candidacies, number retirements, etc.   It generally bothers me how much weight is given to team accomplishments in an individual player evaluation (see: Manning, Eli), but it does have to be considered.  When your competitors each won multiple championships in their primes while you never won a playoff game, that's going to affect the final tally, especially when you're a key contributor.  Posey didn't exactly light it up during the playoffs, but he did have the highest bWAR on two championship teams and was third on the team as a rookie for the third championship team.  And while Molina had a pretty mediocre playoff batting record overall himself, he hit well in their two World Series runs (especially 2006).  So while I think Mauer gets waaaaaaaay too much heat locally for his teams' lack of playoff success (he won the same number of playoff games as a Twin as Rod Carew, after all), it does have to be acknowledged as a factor.

Mauer was worthy of a slot on the team.  If I were picking, I'd pick Posey and Mauer (for all the talk about Molina's defense, it's weird how it's just completely ignored that he was a below-average career hitter).  But his omission isn't egregious, and certainly doesn't require falling back on our collective regional inferiority complex

 

Yeah, Yadier Molina has a claim as the greatest defensive catcher of all time and every single one of his 4th all time games at Catcher were in the 25 year period. It's not surprising he makes the cut.

And honestly, Mauer and Posey are pretty similar in their careers. Neither played as long as you'd like to see, batting champ, MVP. But Posey was the leader of a quasi-dynasty, winning 3 WS in 5 seasons. 

[mnfireman]

That defense might make sense in a vacuum. But in the real world, especially in our current political climate, there are times when democracy gets it wrong. Inexplicably, Mauer got left off the list, and that is something the writers could have remedied.  

More political BS from the TD staff/writers/owners, why am I not surprised.

This article could have absolutely been written without this paragraph, or at the very least, without the second sentence of the paragraph, whether the referenced article mentioned "American Democracy" or not. Politics HAS divided our country, there is no need to insert one's political leaning in a sports forum article about perceived slights on one writers "All-Quarter Century Team". State you feelings and your argument for the player you support and leave the politics out of it, especially given recent events in our state.

Yes, I know I did not need to write this post and I know I can just leave TD if I disagree with their views, but I am a Twins fan and for the most part like reading the articles and opining on our favorite team. As for articles with the author's political views inserted, those are available elsewhere, let's keep it focused on sports, please.

[Rod Carews Birthday]

39 minutes ago, The Great Hambino said:

Mauer would've been a worthy choice, but it was clearly three options for two spots.  There's plenty of justification for the choices they made that don't rely on the old, tired, poor-me coastal bias rationale (remind me again which coast the booming metropolis of St Louis is on).

 

Certainly it was a close race as all three were excellent, but I actually would perceive Mauer's omission as a slight.  I do think that coastal bias is a real thing, and yes, you are correct that St. Louis isn't on a coast (last time I checked),  I can't really explain it, except for long, long baseball traditions, but the Cardinals (and the Cubs actually) usually get the same sort of favorable coverage/outlook from the national media that teams like the Twins, Brewers, Royals, White Sox, et al. never receive.  The most obvious ways are direct and immediate, but the more insidious part is that the continuous glorification and coverage of those teams does lead to a different perception of them by the public on an ongoing basis.  You may not or may not agree with me, but I think it happens all the time professional sports.  I don't like it, but I can't do anything about it either. 

[The Great Hambino]

26 minutes ago, jmlease1 said:

Truth. Led by a member of the media actively leading the charge against him and running him down at almost every opportunity (partially because Joe didn't have any interest in going on his show. Not that Mauer had much interest in going on anyone's show, really). Having the MN media whine about Mauer taking too many walks and not getting enough RBIs is still one of the dumbest things that's ever happened in MN sports.

(part of my ongoing series on "Why Dan Barreiro should never talk about baseball", part XXXVII)

I also blame Barreiro for the bilateral leg weakness thing going completely off the rails and juicing up the pervasive anti-Mauer sentiments locally.  If they had instead called it complications from offseason knee surgery - which it was - it wouldn't have generated nearly as much heat (gotta give Bill Smith the assist for that one).  Combine it with the weird idea among segments of the fanbase that a high salary makes you indestructible, and Barreiro had the right concoction to spread it like wildfire with his smarmy, above-it-all schtick.  I am very thankful for podcasts

[NYCTK]

32 minutes ago, mnfireman said:

That defense might make sense in a vacuum. But in the real world, especially in our current political climate, there are times when democracy gets it wrong. Inexplicably, Mauer got left off the list, and that is something the writers could have remedied.  

More political BS from the TD staff/writers/owners, why am I not surprised.

This article could have absolutely been written without this paragraph, or at the very least, without the second sentence of the paragraph, whether the referenced article mentioned "American Democracy" or not. Politics HAS divided our country, there is no need to insert one's political leaning in a sports forum article about perceived slights on one writers "All-Quarter Century Team". State you feelings and your argument for the player you support and leave the politics out of it, especially given recent events in our state.

Yes, I know I did not need to write this post and I know I can just leave TD if I disagree with their views, but I am a Twins fan and for the most part like reading the articles and opining on our favorite team. As for articles with the author's political views inserted, those are available elsewhere, let's keep it focused on sports, please.

You lot truly need to stop getting triggered at every single minor thing. Life's a lot better that way. 

I don't disagree with you that it was weirdly inserted. But I laughed at it, scrolled up to remind myself the author, and then exclaimed "oh, Cody" and then went about my day, because I'm not under the impression that everything in the world has to tailor to my delicate sensitivities. 

Our democracy is currently, as I write this, voting to kick 5% of the country off their health care and give a tax cut to Jeff Bezos, not to mention the masked men abducting people off the streets and open endorsement of an apartheid state slaughtering tens of thousands of children.

If you're more offended by someone making some off handed allusion to their displeasure of our political reality than those things, well you probably have your priorities out of whack. 

[twinstalker]

Maybe if the Twins had done something more than beat four bad teams in half the years of a decade, they'd be remembered with more respect.  It's not that it's Minnesota, as much as you'd apparently like to imply that, it's that the Twins never really did anything while playing against an inferior schedule.

[NYCTK]

22 minutes ago, The Great Hambino said:

I also blame Barreiro for the bilateral leg weakness thing going completely off the rails and juicing up the pervasive anti-Mauer sentiments locally.  If they had instead called it complications from offseason knee surgery - which it was - it wouldn't have generated nearly as much heat (gotta give Bill Smith the assist for that one).  Combine it with the weird idea among segments of the fanbase that a high salary makes you indestructible, and Barreiro had the right concoction to spread it like wildfire with his smarmy, above-it-all schtick.  I am very thankful for podcasts

Talk Radio, and now its successor dumb guy podcasts, is the worst and ruins people brains. Sports, and especially politics. 

Bunch of dummies without any expertise filling time to sell ads, taken seriously by even bigger dummies. 

[TwinsDr2021]

31 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

You lot truly need to stop getting triggered at every single minor thing. Life's a lot better that way. 

I don't disagree with you that it was weirdly inserted. But I laughed at it, scrolled up to remind myself the author, and then exclaimed "oh, Cody" and then went about my day, because I'm not under the impression that everything in the world has to tailor to my delicate sensitivities. 

Our democracy is currently, as I write this, voting to kick 5% of the country off their health care and give a tax cut to Jeff Bezos, not to mention the masked men abducting people off the streets and open endorsement of an apartheid state slaughtering tens of thousands of children.

If you're more offended by someone making some off handed allusion to their displeasure of our political reality than those things, well you probably have your priorities out of whack. 

So Cody wasn't talking about Minnesota electing Tim Walz? Interesting, that was how I took his weirdly inserted comment.

[NYCTK]

5 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

So Cody wasn't talking about Minnesota electing Tim Walz? Interesting, that was how I took his weirdly inserted comment.

Absolutely could be. Another reason not to get annoyed over one sentence! 

[mnfireman]

35 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

You lot truly need to stop getting triggered at every single minor thing. Life's a lot better that way. 

I don't disagree with you that it was weirdly inserted. But I laughed at it, scrolled up to remind myself the author, and then exclaimed "oh, Cody" and then went about my day, because I'm not under the impression that everything in the world has to tailor to my delicate sensitivities. 

Our democracy is currently, as I write this, voting to kick 5% of the country off their health care and give a tax cut to Jeff Bezos, not to mention the masked men abducting people off the streets and open endorsement of an apartheid state slaughtering tens of thousands of children.

If you're more offended by someone making some off handed allusion to their displeasure of our political reality than those things, well you probably have your priorities out of whack. 

Not triggered, I come to this forum to get away from the "left" vs. "right" rhetoric that is literally everywhere. My life is fine and my priorities are where they need to be, my views don't get inserted in every conversation, and I haven't lost any friends (a few family members, maybe (wink, wink (sarcasm))).

A few TD writers/staff members insert their political views in their articles too often, especially so since its considered an off-limits subject.

Not touching this statement other than to say quit listening to MSM and AOC. 

Not offended at all, everyone is entitled to their opinion, in the proper setting, a sports forum is not that setting.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

1 hour ago, jmlease1 said:

(part of my ongoing series on "Why Dan Barreiro should never talk about baseball", part XXXVII)

Agreed on Barrerio. Very Minnesota bi-polar.

What is it with guys named Dan being brutal in their MN based sports media jobs?

[Doctor Gast]

I really like these 3 Twins & IMO, all of them should be in the HoF. I have to admit that I'm not up on SPs & closers of the past 25 yrs. so I'm prejudiced for our guys, Santana & Nathan IMO, should be on that list. Although Mauer got on the 1st round ballot HoF by raking at catcher. IMO, at catcher, it's more about defense & the many intangibles that are connected with catching than offense bias WAR. STL  was dominant while Molina was catching & was irrelevant after he left. SF had some good years with Posey, but MN wasn't able to do anything with Mauer. I'd also look at how many years they were in that prime position. Looking at these factors, I'd rank them Molina, Posey & Mauer. Mauer should have gotten some recognition, though.

[NYCTK]

1 minute ago, mnfireman said:

Not triggered, I come to this forum to get away from the "left" vs. "right" rhetoric that is literally everywhere. My life is fine and my priorities are where they need to be, my views don't get inserted in every conversation, and I haven't lost any friends (a few family members, maybe (wink, wink (sarcasm))).

A few TD writers/staff members insert their political views in their articles too often, especially so since its considered an off-limits subject.

Not touching this statement other than to say quit listening to MSM and AOC. 

Not offended at all, everyone is entitled to their opinion, in the proper setting, a sports forum is not that setting.

Gotcha. You were so NOT triggered that you took 6 words and wrote another 150 about them. 

Who the hell are YOU to police other people's writing? Do you understand how entitled you sound by saying that? If you don't like someone's writing, don't read it. 

BTW, AOC is beloved by her constituents which I regretfully am not one. I'm guessing you're the one that needs to stop listening to MSM, ie Fox News, who had to pay nearly a billion dollars for lying to their audience. 

[1985Fan]

4 minutes ago, NYCTK said:

Gotcha. You were so NOT triggered that you took 6 words and wrote another 150 about them. 

Who the hell are YOU to police other people's writing? Do you understand how entitled you sound by saying that? If you don't like someone's writing, don't read it. 

BTW, AOC is beloved by her constituents which I regretfully am not one. I'm guessing you're the one that needs to stop listening to MSM, ie Fox News, who had to pay nearly a billion dollars for lying to their audience. 

As you police someone else’s comments. Go to a political blog and express your righteous, pompous opinions. We’d appreciate if you kept your politics off this site. Stick to baseball. Not sure why the mediator hasn’t blocked you already. 

[mnfireman]

No entitlement here, this a sports forum so it should be sports articles. Not policing, just asking them to stick to the subject matter, per their own rules - sports, specifically baseball.

Seeing how you keep coming on here to argue your opinion AND state your politics, I'd say you're the one who's triggered. Your triggers are your responsibility, not mine.

I do believe that ABC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, et al have also had to pay out big $$$$ for lying as well, but you won't say that, doesn't fit your narrative

[DJL44]

American democracy has been getting things wrong for 250 years. It didn't start recently. Democracy is messy. An idea doesn't have to be good, it just needs 51% support.

[NYCTK]

6 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

American democracy has been getting things wrong for 250 years. It didn't start recently. Democracy is messy. An idea doesn't have to be good, it just needs 51% support.

Not even! The current president has never received a majority of the vote. Just need more than the other guy (or gal). But not even as he received even less votes than his opponent. Like you said, messy. 

[jmlease1]

1 hour ago, The Great Hambino said:

I also blame Barreiro for the bilateral leg weakness thing going completely off the rails and juicing up the pervasive anti-Mauer sentiments locally.  If they had instead called it complications from offseason knee surgery - which it was - it wouldn't have generated nearly as much heat (gotta give Bill Smith the assist for that one).  Combine it with the weird idea among segments of the fanbase that a high salary makes you indestructible, and Barreiro had the right concoction to spread it like wildfire with his smarmy, above-it-all schtick.  I am very thankful for podcasts

Yeah, that was absolutely brutal. But Barreiro is notorious for covering for guys who show up on his show and burying guys who don't.

National media treat Mauer better than the local guys, which is pretty abnormal, especially in baseball...unless the player gets into a real feud with a specific reporter and things get personal, which never happened with Mauer, who by most accounts is too bland to ever get into something like that.

It's a shame that Mauer still doesn't get more credit, but if they're going to let fans vote StL has a much bigger fan base than MN: much longer history, much bigger tradition. St. L is still a baseball town, and in MN the Vikings & hockey outrank baseball. But the idea that Molina was better than Mauer is silly. Better defensively and more durable, sure. But not better, because hitting matters too and Mauer was an outstanding hitter, and not just "outstanding for a catcher".

Stupid concussions. What an awful and unpredictable injury.

[NYCTK]

33 minutes ago, 1985Fan said:

Go to a political blog and express your righteous, pompous opinions.

 

I will continue to discuss topics brought up, respectfully.

I didn't bring up politics. I'm responding to someone that is complaining that they don't have a safe space from the highly triggering 6 words "especially in our current political climate".

[DJL44]

3 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Santana? No discussion of Grienke

I agree that Greinke is a much bigger oversight.

[TwinsDr2021]

Cody's articles are getting harder and harder to read, any valid point(s) he makes is over shadowed by inserting his political view and thus dis-railing the conversation. I am going to go with the George Bush quote (paraphrasing) Cody fool me once, I won't get fooled again. If he is the author of the article I will skip it because why bother writing a baseball article if it is just going to turn into a political spat. Hey maybe that is the only way he can get comments on his articles? 

[NYCTK]

4 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

I agree that Greinke is a much bigger oversight.

Santana is 24th in fWAR for 2000-2024 and his best season ranks 33rd. Greinke is 5th and 8th. 

Santana is barely even worth a mention. Which is why there was no Hall of Fame discussion around his career.