Is Anybody Watching? Twins See Sharp Decline In TV Viewers

[Otto von Ballpark]

12 minutes ago, Unwinder said:

That certainly sounds generous on paper, but if I only care about Twins games that's what, one every couple of weeks?

If that. But, that's still more access than the NHL or NBA or most major college leagues. NFL is kind of an outlier since they only play 1 game a week. And it's not that far off past broadcast history either -- I think the Twins free games on local TV were only once a week from 1990-2010 or so, and the last few years they were reduced to Sunday afternoon games. Maybe that would have fit your needs, but most people weren't particularly interested in that either -- they tune in to the baseball team when they can, not the one day of the week that the baseball team makes itself available.

It's still an area for development as broadcast models change. Looking north to Canada, their two big sports networks -- Sportsnet and TSN -- both have standalone streaming packages available by the month or by the year, and TSN even has a day pass option. Bally is exploring something similar for its US networks in 2022.

[wsnydes]

1 hour ago, Unwinder said:

What's ridiculous to me is that they paywall everything, yet they play more games than any other sport. You'd think they could spare a few!

I've never seen an organization/company/league that makes it so difficult to consume their product as MLB has become.  It's absolutely asinine from a business standpoint.

[Otto von Ballpark]

1 hour ago, Vanimal46 said:

That’s good… But as you said above, the free YouTube game of the day is weekday game days. Not exactly prime time to get kids’ eyes on it. School’s right around the corner, and most have their own activities during the day. 

I don't think there's any "prime time" for live TV in regards to kids in 2021. They just don't watch anything in that format. Notice how there are no weekday afternoon or Saturday morning cartoons on free TV anymore either -- those channels aren't losing that audience, the audience is just not there.

For targeting kids, highlights seem to be plentiful on social media, and it appears MLB: The Show is among the better selling video games.

[roger]

Pre COVID I watched about 90% of their games and went to maybe three a year.  I have HULU, so I have seen two games this year on FOX/FS1.  Won’t go to any as my wife has no interest in going to downtown Minneapolis.  Have the MiLB package and watch two or three Wichita or Saints game a week, although not always all 9 innings.  Enjoy seeing some of these young guys.

loved the comments above about regional divisions.  Wouldn’t a six team division with the Twins, Brewers, Cubs, Sox, cards and Royals be great?

perhaps the biggest problem that I haven’t seen mentioned is the major source of revenue.  In the NFL and NBA, a large percentage of revenue is from the national tv contract.  Baseball and hockey get much less from their national tv with a larger percentage from tickets, local media and other local/game day revenue.  That leads to the large discrepancies between say, the Yankees and Dodgers on one hand and Twins and Royales on the other. Yes, a salary cap/floor is needed.  But also better revenue sharing.

[Otto von Ballpark]

1 hour ago, Vanimal46 said:

Absolutely. Bottom line, they need to lower the bar for entry to watch their product. I’m sure a major reason why football is king is because only 1 game out of their 14-15 weekly games are behind a paywall. The rest is over the air for free. 

Football (American fútbol ) has all of their games on free local TV (even the MNF games are simulcast locally) -- but this is sort of intertwined with the fact that they only play 1 game a week, mostly on fall/winter weekends with a single national marquee game on Mondays and now Thursdays. Each game is event viewing.

Baseball, every team is playing every day, for 6 months throughout the spring, summer, and early fall. By the end of the era of the Twins on free local TV once a week (2010), nobody seemed to know or care. I actually remember people complaining when those games weren't on FSN and they had to find the channel number for WFTC or KSTC or whatever. The baseball schedule is so intrinsically different, there's really no way to leverage free local TV like the NFL does.

I wonder if the better play would be going all-in on an app to align themselves with Netflix, Disney+, etc. Not MLB.TV but something like MLB Network without the highly produced shows -- could be free (and cheap to produce), with live look-ins and highlights and maybe even a few marquee games. I think they might be looking in this direction because MLB.TV this year has a "Big Inning" show on weeknights which is basically that -- highlights and live look-ins.

[USAFChief]

I'm about as diehard a Twins fan as you're likely to find. I've watched 95% of games for as long as cable and internet have made that possible. Before that, I used to sit on the roof of my house after dark wherever I happened to be stationed trying to tune in some clear channel AM radio station from somewhere or other just to catch a fading, scratchy signal for a few innings. My mother on law used to record Twins games on cassette tapes and mail them to me overseas, where I'd listen to them over and over. I paid to watch the Twins again this year. 

And...I'm at less than 60 percent of games watched. That's less than any year since I've had the ability to watch them all.

The biggest factors for me: 

 

The poor quality of baseball I see from the Twins. 

 

The lack of action. TTO baseball is not very entertaining. 

 

The competitive imbalance. Baseball badly needs a salary cap. 

 

The pace of play needs attention. 

[Otto von Ballpark]

1 hour ago, Vanimal46 said:

I’m as casual of a soccer fan as you can get now that Austin has an MLS team. If they weren’t on an over the air TV channel, there’s no chance I would seek it out to watch. 

Up here in MN, the Loons MLS team has 34 games this season, and 19 of those are simulcast on free TV -- CW 23. CW 23 is kind of BSN's overflow network, it seems -- a couple Wolves games got bumped to it, during conflicts with the Twins and Wild. I'd be curious what kind of viewership numbers the free TV games attract -- and I wonder if BSN will want to keep those games if they go the direct streaming route next year.

[Otto von Ballpark]

FWIW, not sure if this was mentioned elsewhere, but all Twins Monday through Thursday evening home games in 2022 will start at 6:40 PM. While not a direct attack on the pace of play issue yet, this is still a positive development.

 

[Irishman]

On 7/10/2021 at 3:34 PM, sampleSizeOfOne said:

Are we allowed to make Law jokes too?

 

Or are they not as funny as Ober jokes?

 

[twinssporto]

I've watched maybe two games all year. Mostly at a bar because I cut the cord too. Sad it's come to this...MLB will pay a dear price for the stupidity of airing games the way they do. 

Remember pro boxing in the 70's 80's? Very popular. Turned to pay-per-view and that sport evaporated.  

I haven't even started complaining about the product the Twins put on the field this year or the slow pace of play, etc., etc., etc.

[Irishman]

I was raised in Worthington, MN.   My dad used to take us to watch Twins games in Bloomington.   In 70’s ticket was like $5 each.   Hot dog for 25 cents.   Pop soda for 20 cents.   

 

About 3 years ago My wife and I went to Target Field.   Tickets for us was $120.   Burgers, fries and soda pops cost about 35 dollars.   

 

I decided not to come watch games anymore.   Those players make too much money.   I think the majority of players are millionaires.   I haven’t watched any NBA games for 4 years.   I don’t care about those NBA players.   I don’t watch NFL games much because of those players kneeling and politics.   

 

MLB, NBA, NFL and NHL are not same as those players used to play in 1970’s.    Elite Players don’t want to play for Timberwolves.   

 

[wsnydes]

43 minutes ago, Otto von Ballpark said:

FWIW, not sure if this was mentioned elsewhere, but all Twins Monday through Thursday evening home games in 2022 will start at 6:40 PM. While not a direct attack on the pace of play issue yet, this is still a positive development.

 

A positive development, for sure.  I know it's helpful for me.  I'm at the office early and up at 4:30, so the 3+ hour games plus an hour home are difficult for me to pull off with regularity and still function at work.

[TNtwins85]

We got mlbtv free through T-Mobile so we’ve watched a lot of baseball this year. If not for the free baseball we would’ve dumped T-Mobile long ago. We’re cord cutters in TN so we haven’t watched the twins in ages. I could take em or leave em. Mostly watching The division races but the twins are still entertaining. Btw “F” T-Mobile. Unless you’re in a city the Internet seriously doesn’t work lol

[TheLeviathan]

Here's a bunch of observations, both generally and specifically to this thread:

1. I'm young enough and tech savvy enough to know I don't have to pay for a single game.  So when the price tags are what they are, you've tuned me out immediately.  Most sports viewers 40 and under are also on this track.  There are so many free options (baseball, other sports, entertainment in general) that I can find background noise for a fraction of the price.

2.  Baseball is horrifically slow.  It's not even interesting enough to be background noise anymore.  It truly wouldn't matter if the Twins were good, I'd rather invest my time in a highlight reel package and the box score on the internet.  

3. These trends aren't reversing - baseball viewership isn't coming back.  TV viewership in general isn't suddenly going to revert to old habits in this environment.  And people need to embrace that tracking sport engagement is better done through social media than ratings on TV.  That's where you see the passion.  Now, that being said, baseball might be the one sport that is hurt by this more than any other.  With their average fans being so much older than the NFL or NBA....TV viewers are pretty much all they have.  So these numbers should be scary.  Especially since lots of winning franchises - Houston, Tampa, Boston, etc. - are also seeing significant dips.  

4. Baseball is played every day for 6 months.  They don't deserve a pat on the back for having one free viewing of Colorado vs. Arizona a week.  Especially when they also make you pay to listen out of state to a freaking radio broadcast.  The NFL and NBA can do that because they know they have engagement.  Baseball doesn't.  They're squeezing blood out of a turnip.

5.  Speaking of which, cable greed continues to be proven as harmful folly.  People won't pay these prices and they continue to tune out the sport.  Bally's plan for a standalone app can be described as nothing less than utter stupidity wrapped in greed.

6.  Baseball's competitive imbalances are preposterous.  Why watch a sport that feels like it's going closer and closer to being the equivalent of letting Alabama play in the same conference as St. Thomas?

7. Baseball staunchly avoids being fun.  They literally harm each other when fun happens on the field.  What we're left with is a slog of slow-paced neuroticism masquerading as "nuance" and "game within the game".  Nope....just painful from an entertainment perspective.

8.  Lastly - it's too late.  I've been saying it here for 5 years.  Baseball is already dead.  It's a zombie and many of it's fans don't even realize it. They've lost an entire generation to complete indifference.  Measure it by ratings, social media, or anything else...this isn't the beginning of the end, that started awhile ago.  Get used to it.

[Ben B]

I agree with most of what's been said about the game itself so I won't write a lot rehashing it. I agree with banning the shift and adding a pitch clock. The game is boring as hell and too long.

I'm a cord cutter but I have MLB.TV and I know how to work around the blackouts. I would say I've watched 90% of games this year but always as background noise, and paying attention when there's some action. I can't remember the last time I sat down and watched a full game, even in the playoffs.

I'll also tune into other games to watch players that I have on my fantasy team. Even when the Twins are good, I'm almost more invested in my fantasy team than the real team! I'm not sure what that says about the sport, but it can't be good!

As for attending, I used to go 10+ games a year at the Metrodome. I've been to maybe 10 at Target Field SINCE 2010! Part of that is aging and having small children, but the cost to go is pricing me out.

[Squirrel]

8 hours ago, LA VIkes Fan said:

I really like the realignment idea assuming we're going to a universal DH. I'll post this as a separate blog, but here's my proposal for realignment. I know it's fantasy but hey, it's the dog days of summer so why not? 

5 divisions, not 6. 12 teams in the playoffs, The top 2 in each division plus two remaining teams teams with best records make the playoffs so there is a reward for being a little better than average. Four best records get byes while the other 8 play 3 games series down to 4. The remaining 8 teams (4 with byes plus 4 first round winners) re-seed by record, not location.  During the regular season you play all of the teams in three of the other four divisions 6 times each, 3 at home, 3 away.  That's 108 games (6 times 18 - 6 teams in each division). You play the remaining games in your division. You play 11 games each year against your 5 division opponents, except one only 10 times, for 54 games, total 162. Alternatively, add a game and rotate the unbalanced 81 home/82 away schedules in each division. You could rotate through the division the one team that you "only" play 10 times and you'll have to rotate each you which team gets the extra home game, 2 you get the extra, 2 your opponent, to balance the schedule.

Division are by location to create/enhance rivalries:

West Coast Division - San Diego, LA Angels, LA Dodgers, San Francisco, Oakland/Vegas, Seattle

Southwest/Rocky mountain Division - Houston, Texas (Dallas), Arizona, Kansas City, St. Louis, Colorado (Denver)

Midwest Division -  Chicago Cubs, Chicago White Sox, Minnesota, Milwaukee, Detroit, Pittsburg or Toronto (bummer that Twins are in a different time zone, but couldn't figure out a way to fix that)

Southeast Division -  Miami, Tampa Bay, Atlanta, Washington, Cincinnati, Cleveland or Baltimore (depends on whether you want the Ohio or Beltway rivalry)

Northeast Division - Boston, NY Yankees, NY Mets, Philadelphia, Pittsburg or Toronto, Cleveland or Baltimore     

You rotate through the other divisions in the regular season. One year, the Twins play the Northeast, Southeast and Southwest, next year the Southeast, Southwest, West Coast, next year the Southwest, West Coast, Northeast, etc. That away the existing rivalries that are being broken up still play 6 games against each other 3 out of every 4 years like the Cubs and Cardinals. Those will fade over time; the Cubs new hated rival will be the White Sox, the Cards, the Royals.  

What do you guys think?

'bummer that Twins are in a different time zone' ... from whom? Chicago, Milwaukee and Minnesota are in the same time zone ... 

[Brock Beauchamp]

4 hours ago, USAFChief said:

The pace of play needs attention. 

Frankly, this is the part of the conversation that gets ignored WAY TOO OFTEN.

Pace of play is important. It’s literally narrowing the non-action vs. action part of the game.

But a lot of that is intentional. The longer a pitcher waits, the harder they can throw consecutive pitches. The harder they can throw consecutive pitches, the more a batter misses. The more a batter misses, the less the pitcher needs to throw in the zone.

Hard pitch clock, 18 seconds. 16 would be best, 20 acceptable.

Everyone is going to hate it except fans.

[Richard Swerdlick]

Much of the reason I don't watch much is that for my schedule, the games start too late. I heard a player interview in which he talked about how great it was where he had played before, where night games started at 6:30 and most people loved it. Also, I have many tasks to do in the evening and find that listening on the radio while I do them works better for me. Then I also listen in bed until I fall asleep, often waking up in time to catch the ending.

 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

I watched 3 innings of one game, while doing homework. Grad school has overwhelmed me, but it’s almost done.

Bally is a mess, rumors are they are launching their own streaming service. That will help.

improving the rules for increasing pitch contact rate would help a lot on the enjoyment level.

[Melissa]

I’m a lifelong baseball fan (68 years old soon) and raised in Milwaukee without TV. So listening on the radio or occasionally attending games in person were the ways the sport got me hooked.

I like having baseball on the radio while driving, and enjoy pulling over to watch a couple innings of kids or even old guys play on parks around town.

I do watch (parts of) quite a few Twins games on Bally but also find it easy not to watch, when I have something else to do (semi retired now). I no longer watch pre-games — Tim Laudner says only the most obvious things, seems to think he’s profound, and then repeats himself — and few post-game wrap-ups.

The poor quality of play lessens my enjoyment, but I don’t need constant excitement to appreciate the game.

I enjoy being at Target Field the few times a year that I attend in person. I’m not afraid of downtown Minneapolis and have been glad to see the George Floyd sign on the right field wall.

I don’t see support for racial justice as unpatriotic— and as a couple of people have said, there’s space given before and during games to raising the flag, singing the national anthem, God Bless America and honoring veterans.

With so many foreign-born players and stars in the game I think we do enough to emphasize our patriotism. I think it’s fascinating how strong the game has become in Japan and Korea.

 

 

[Whitey333]

I watch when I can.  But need to go to a bar to watch it since the greedy cable/streaming services don't want us to watch it.  I love the game but not the recent game.  Manfredball is ruining the game with it's sophomoric gimmicks and dumb rules.  Analytics?  Don't even go there!  The barrage of new stats is overwhelming and hard to follow.  It's becoming totally unwatchable and it has nothing to do with the speed of the game.  

[Whitey333]

It doesn't help that we have a non competitive team, very little tv access to it, and a commissioner that seems determined to ruin the game with new idiotic rules and procedures.  It's virtually unwatchable!

[Nine of twelve]

I know of a free streaming site (which must not be named in this forum) which carries every game. If BSN is not available to me on cable, for example if another member of the household wants to watch something else, I still almost always have the game broadcast running on some platform if I'm home. Whether I follow closely depends on other options for my attention that may be present at a given point in time.

[Nine of twelve]

19 minutes ago, Melissa said:

I think it’s fascinating how strong the game has become in Japan and Korea.

 

 

And in Australia and Taiwan.

[Nine of twelve]

12 hours ago, twinssporto said:

Remember pro boxing in the 70's 80's? Very popular. Turned to pay-per-view and that sport evaporated.  

 

Boxing will (and should) evaporate anyway because it's the only sport in which the object is to inflict injuries on one's opponent.

[Nine of twelve]

18 hours ago, luckylager said:

I am curious as to how many have given the finger to greedy cable/streaming providers and are viewing the games through other "underground" channels? I may know at least a few who do. Maybe. 

We still have cable, but as I said in a post just above I use a free "underground" site when needed and have no complaints other than the comment stream on the side of the screen, which is easily ignore-able.

[Kal Lis]

When we cut the cord a few years back, I subscribed to MLB,com but soon discovered that Twins blackouts cover a rather large territory including the Dakotas. I now listen to most games on the radio. It's great in the background. Radio along with MLB.com highlights is actually becoming my preferred way to experience baseball. I do want to pay more attention to the YouTube free game of the week

As much as I would like MLB to provide it's own streaming service instead of giving cable providers a lock on the product, I doubt that will happen.

I'm guessing baseball will move from a mainstream to a niche sport over the next decade or two, but that's a result that comes from people having so many entertainment options.

[jonathanlund]

Bally stripping it off familiar platforms...forcing us to pay new stream charges was one big stupid decision. Good luck getting viewers back. 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

11 minutes ago, jonathanlund said:

Bally stripping it off familiar platforms...forcing us to pay new stream charges was one big stupid decision. Good luck getting viewers back. 

I think it depends on price and scope. Bally bought many of the RSNs, and the rumored price point is not obscene. We’ve gotten used to having multiple streaming services and could be ok. If Bally gets too greedy on price/access, as they did w/ cable providers, then Sinclair will be forced to get out of their contract and this whole ordeal will start over again.

[Mike Sixel]

10 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Frankly, this is the part of the conversation that gets ignored WAY TOO OFTEN.

Pace of play is important. It’s literally narrowing the non-action vs. action part of the game.

But a lot of that is intentional. The longer a pitcher waits, the harder they can throw consecutive pitches. The harder they can throw consecutive pitches, the more a batter misses. The more a batter misses, the less the pitcher needs to throw in the zone.

Hard pitch clock, 18 seconds. 16 would be best, 20 acceptable.

Everyone is going to hate it except fans.

The batter has to stay in the box then. I mean really, you have to adjust gloves and look at a sign with no one on base? So. Damn. Slow.

It gets to my point earlier about action. The ratio of activity to nothing is way too low.