Twins/Tigers Players Vote to Postpone Tonight's Game

[ashbury]

Just think how many homeless people could have been helped with all the public money used to build Target Field. Now would be a good time to use it as a homeless shelter. We dont need it for baseball anymore.

The game's in Detroit.

 

[T_J]

They’re making a public statement. No sacrifice is needed to make a statement.

 

An artificially imposed sacrifice makes no sense and serves literally no one.

Sacrifice is needed to make changes. No change comes easy and without sacrifices. Taking today off only serves them teams that have chosen that path. Do tell me you care... show me you care. Show me what your willing to lose. This choice not to play isn't showing me anything. It's empty.

[OldTimeTwinkie]

Must not be homeless people in Detroit, right.

[LVTwinsfan]

Well, that’s what happened so I’m not sure what your argument is here. The players decided to not play, the front office and ownership supported them in that decision, so we’re all good here.

yes management supported them , their choice, but you , not management, asked why there should be consequences, not your choice.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Sacrifice is needed to make changes. No change comes easy and without sacrifices. Taking today off only serves them teams that have chosen that path. Do tell me you care... show me you care. Show me what your willing to lose. This choice not to play isn't showing me anything. It's empty.

No, it’s not. Several players across various sports have said sitting out is about creating awareness and quieting the sports world so Americans can dedicate their attention to the events surrounding us right now, which is more important than watching men and women hit and throw sports balls.

 

No sacrifice is needed to make that statement. A league imposed artificial sacrifice does the opposite, as it gives the optics of a bunch of rich white owners telling young black and Latino athletes to shut up and entertain us while Rome burns.

[LVTwinsfan]

This is an apples to oranges comparison. I'm guessing you don't have a job that involves millions of people tuning in to watch you on TV every day. Professional athletes have a unique platform to raise awareness and affect change, and I think it's commendable that they're willing to use it for a cause that they believe is bigger than sports. I don't know what MLB would get by punishing players for this, besides lots of bad PR.

maybe, it’s possible they lose fans too

[Brock Beauchamp]

yes management supported them , their choice, but you , not management, asked why there should be consequences, not your choice.

This... doesn’t make sense. People have asserted there should be consequences, yet no one has actually said why that’s the case when both players and ownership seem to be on the same page here.

[twinbythebay]

 

Sacrifice is needed to make changes. No change comes easy and without sacrifices. Taking today off only serves them teams that have chosen that path. Do tell me you care... show me you care. Show me what your willing to lose. This choice not to play isn't showing me anything. It's empty.

I suspect that this is just a first step for many players, and there will be sacrifices of time and/or money from those who really do care deeply about these issues. There are probably many players who have already sacrificed their time and/or money for similar causes. That kind of sacrifice makes sense and helps to bring about change; I can't see what would be accomplished through silly punishments like forcing a team to forfeit and take an L.

[LVTwinsfan]

This... doesn’t make sense. People have asserted there should be consequences, yet no one has actually said why that’s the case when both players and ownership seem to be on the same page here.

There will be consequences, there are a lot of fans who won’t agree, enough to have an impact should they choose to go that route. These players sometimes overestimate their appeal. As far as wins and losses or possible loss of pay, you’re correct if management supports the players then everything is good. Well there is the League too, but I think it’s safe to assume MLB supports the players too.

[Aggies7]

This... doesn’t make sense. People have asserted there should be consequences, yet no one has actually said why that’s the case when both players and ownership seem to be on the same page here.

They’re on the same page because literally none of them have anything to lose. Fans aren’t allowed in the stadium this whole year, so any fan boycotts aren’t going to be felt until maybe next year, if people even still care by then. The clubs would take a beating if they disciplined their players. Sponsors would pull out. The players get a night off, a days pay and no fines. It’s an empty gesture when there’s no skin in the game

[D. Hocking]

 

EXACTLY. There won’t be consequences. They’ll play the DH tomorrow and no big deal. The players will feel like they did something, the ownership will look good for not disciplining, and everyone wins. Now had you or I told our boss we weren’t coming in to work, and not using time off, what would the response be?

 

Not quite the same thing, but my company did tell people to take Juneteenth off even though it was not a regular day off for us.  They wanted people to take the day off and volunteer or reflect at what was happening and the on-going issues that had created the situation or simply use as a mental health day to deal with all the stress that was happening at the time.

 

I am sure some of it was a calculated PR move, but there have been what I take are sincere efforts to spot light things that go under the radar for a lot of us and highlight things that people of color have to thing about that would not even occur to me.  They had a number of employees candidly speak on what it is like to be the only person of color on a team or on a project or even in some offices, as well as warnings they have to give their kids if they ever get pulled over or how they can spot a clerk watching them when they are in a nice store etc.

 

Obviously, this is not going to solve all of the problems, but it is generating some additional discussion, and maybe some of the athlete's statements will make this seem more like a real issue to people who do not experience it.

 

I do realize I am lucky in that I could just take a day off, not everyone is in a situation where they can do that or has a job where that is feasible.

 

[Brock Beauchamp]

They’re on the same page because literally none of them have anything to lose. Fans aren’t allowed in the stadium this whole year, so any fan boycotts aren’t going to be felt until maybe next year, if people even still care by then. The clubs would take a beating if they disciplined their players. Sponsors would pull out. The players get a night off, a days pay and no fines. It’s an empty gesture when there’s no skin in the game

Again, it’s not an empty gesture when many players have said the point of sitting out games is to redirect attention to real events happening all around us.

[sampleSizeOfOne]

My impression is the game is just rescheduled, not cancelled.

[LVTwinsfan]

My impression is the game is just rescheduled, not cancelled.

lots of DH,s coming up

[LVTwinsfan]

Lots of games being played , the Brewers game is on, in Milwaukee

[Westcoast2]

I agree with those who point out that the decision not to play is intended to call attention to the issue.  Those who call for consequences simply do not understand civil protest. Take for example a mother who marches to the state capital with a sign encouraging the enactment of a bill to lower the cost of medication, say insulin, for her daughter, a type 1 diabetic.  The mother is bringing attention to the cost and seeking others to assist in a resolution she believes in.  There is no necessity for consequences.

[a-wan]

 

Lots of games being played , the Brewers game is on, in Milwaukee

 

Um they didn't play last night.

 

And I'd be happy if the company I work for and the federal government cared enough to actually supply enough PPE for me to do my job safely. 

[LVTwinsfan]

Um they didn't play last night.

 

And I'd be happy if the company I work for and the federal government cared enough to actually supply enough PPE for me to do my job safely.

what does that have to do with anything on this thread

[T_J]

I agree with those who point out that the decision not to play is intended to call attention to the issue. Those who call for consequences simply do not understand civil protest. Take for example a mother who marches to the state capital with a sign encouraging the enactment of a bill to lower the cost of medication, say insulin, for her daughter, a type 1 diabetic. The mother is bringing attention to the cost and seeking others to assist in a resolution she believes in. There is no necessity for consequences.

There is absolutely consequences for the person in this story. Time and energy are consequences. If she needed to find care for her ill child, that's consequences. Time away from he child is a consequence. She has decided the juice is worth the squeeze and she's willing to accept the sacrifices to improve a system. She's taking actions.

[Brock Beauchamp]

There is absolutely consequences for the person in this story. Time and energy are consequences. If she needed to find care for her ill child, that's consequences. Time away from he child is a consequence. She has decided the juice is worth the squeeze and she's willing to accept the sacrifices to improve a system. She's taking actions.

Now you’re just inventing scenarios that may not exist.

 

There is no reason to demand sacrifice to make a statement, much less create an artificial sacrifice for no real reason.

[Craig Arko]

As far as I can tell, the sacrifice seems to be on the part of people who don’t have a game to commentate on tonight. I am not sympathetic to their pain.

[MMMordabito]

I agree that consequences are not necessary to make a statement. I just wish the statements coming from each team weren't so generic. I also think the message has little clout when someone can just change the channel and watch a different game. That's what makes me thinks the teams are just falling in line as to not be singled out. It feels disingenuous. Every player probably feels like the guy in the commercial mulling over checking the organ donorship box on his driver's license. The entire room is staring at him, so he decides that he can lose the glaring eyes and maybe feel better about himself. Anyone who thinks that 100% of the players have strong feelings about this is just blinded by idealism.

[snotboogie]

I don't want to make this too long. I'm an old white guy. I live 7 blocks from where George Floyd was murdered and 3 blocks from the carnage on Lake St in May. I have suffered a loss because of the riots.  I also enjoy baseball. A lot. Herb Carneal was the background noise of my summers growing up.

 

I also roll my eyes at some celebrities who have spoken out about some cause. (Movie stars testifying before Congress? Really?) 

 

To me this is different. If the players haven't experienced racism personally, they know who has. Players, who if they are not black or brown, are living and playing ball with black and brown players from February to September (I only wish it was through October). They are comrades and going through the grind together. That the players, unanimously, decided not to play is a testament to their solidarity and love for one another. 

 

Sure, they are all going to get paid for the game, eventually. They won't be punished monetarily. I guess I don't care if they aren't paying a monetary price. They have a platform and they are making a statement. I care about that, and I care about the fact that as a team they thought this was important that these issues of race are brought up. I wholeheartedly agree with them. This is very, very important

[Aggies7]

I agree that consequences are not necessary to make a statement. I just wish the statements coming from each team weren't so generic. I also think the message has little clout when someone can just change the channel and watch a different game. That's what makes me thinks the teams are just falling in line as to not be singled out. It feels disingenuous. Every player probably feels like the guy in the commercial mulling over checking the organ donorship box on his driver's license. The entire room is staring at him, so he decides that he can lose the glaring eyes and maybe feel better about himself. Anyone who thinks that 100% of the players have strong feelings about this is just blinded by idealism.

The ownership can feel good

The players can feel good

No one had to do much heavy lifting

Life resumes tomorrow

 

Activism in 2020

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I don't want to make this too long. I'm an old white guy. I live 7 blocks from where George Floyd was murdered and 3 blocks from the carnage on Lake St in May. I have suffered a loss because of the riots.  I also enjoy baseball. A lot. Herb Carneal was the background noise of my summers growing up.

 

I also roll my eyes at some celebrities who have spoken out about some cause. (Movie stars testifying before Congress? Really?) 

 

To me this is different. If the players haven't experienced racism personally, they know who has. Players, who if they are not black or brown, are living and playing ball with black and brown players from February to September (I only wish it was through October). They are comrades and going through the grind together. That the players, unanimously, decided not to play is a testament to their solidarity and love for one another. 

 

Sure, they are all going to get paid for the game, eventually. They won't be punished monetarily. I guess I don't care if they aren't paying a monetary price. They have a platform and they are making a statement. I care about that, and I care about the fact that as a team they thought this was important that these issues of race are brought up. I wholeheartedly agree with them. This is very, very important

Great post. That’s a lot of tear gas you have inhaled—a sacrifice of breathable, fresh air if there ever was one. Thanks for hanging with us on Twins Daily!

[bird]

 

As far as I can tell, the sacrifice seems to be on the part of people who don’t have a game to commentate on tonight. I am not sympathetic to their pain.

Me neither.

 

I'd implore people to watch the video of Jacob Blake's mother, Julie Jackson,  addressing ALL of us. Personally, I will never know the depth and despair felt by so many after witnessing two more horrific acts of callous hatred play out in Kenosha. We don't know how this is impacting individual players and their loved ones. But I think it might be tone deaf to think of the "consequences" for any of them to be minimal, or to think they are "getting a day off."

[T_J]

Now you’re just inventing scenarios that may not exist.

 

There is no reason to demand sacrifice to make a statement, much less create an artificial sacrifice for no real reason.

I didn't invent that story. I was pointing out the consequences of the story. I'm not demanding anything. I'm pointing out that The Twins " Statement" is completely empty. It's selfish. It's virtue singling and nothing more as it stands right now because there are no consequences. Some want to praise The Twins - pat them on the backs - when they didn't do anything. Their action was actually inaction.

[LVTwinsfan]

Jacob Blake is handcuffed to his hospital bed

[MABB1959]

I am torn.  I hate that professional sports and celebrities are the people we listen to now.   I also think that justice will be done but it takes time.  Investigations need to be completed and in this case it may not be easy sorting out the facts before making an arrest.  In the George Floyd case the arrests were swift.   In my opinion justice is being served and will be in this case too.    Besides arresting the officer’s involved what other justice is expected.   

[snotboogie]

 

Great post. That’s a lot of tear gas you have inhaled—a sacrifice of breathable, fresh air if there ever was one. Thanks for hanging with us on Twins Daily!

Thanks. Fortunately, I didn't get the tear gas. But I did stand with my neighbor looking toward Lake St and wondering which building was burning. Having the National Guard in your neighborhood, not because they are there to help clean up from a natural disaster, but there to protect the fire department from violence is something I will never, ever forget.