When do the Twins cut bait with Phil Hughes?

[ewen21]

I actually thought Hughes was a good signing at first.  The extension and the fact that the team didn't allow him to hit his incentive to me was puzzling.

 

I have soured on Hughes.  I live outside of the market and saw national game in 2016.  This was in Cleveland in (I think) May.  CJ Nitkowski conducted a dugout interview with Hughes.  When Hughes was asked how it is getting up  for games when you fall so far back early like the Twins did that year Hughes answered, "It's like we are playing with house money now"

 

I thought the answer was ridiculous.  The very next pitch the Cleveland batter hit into a double play and Phil overjoyed to get out of the interview. He really rubbed me the wrong way with the "house money" comment.  Maybe it was just a slip up and I am reading too much into it, but it bothered me because it reflects an attitude that says "these games mean very little to me"

When you say "playing with house money" you might use the term when you get into the playoffs by the skin of your teeth as a Wildcard.  Not in MAY.  I don't care how far back the team is.  That is just tone deaf

[ashbury]

Agree on this for sure.Hughes is taking up a valuable roster spot which could be handed to a youngster looking to break into the rotation.

I doubt the front office under-values the roster slot. But they probably view as another desirable outcome, Hughes rounding into shape and contributing strongly during a contending season, using that slot.

 

I don't share their optimism, but they have info I don't have, so my pessimism is merely that.

[yarnivek1972]

Again, it’s pretty likely Jim Pohlad’s call. He’s probably the one who would rather not pay someone $ 26 mil to not pitch.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Again, it’s pretty likely Jim Pohlad’s call. He’s probably the one who would rather not pay someone $ 26 mil to not pitch.

 

It better not be. That money is going to spent if he pitches, or a cheap player does. If he has influence over this kind of decision, the team is in trouble.

[ewen21]

 

I doubt the front office under-values the roster slot. But they probably view as another desirable outcome, Hughes rounding into shape and contributing strongly during a contending season, using that slot.

 

I don't share their optimism, but they have info I don't have, so my pessimism is merely that.

 

I think you have enough information to form an opinion on Hughes at this point.  The guy has had so many injuries and this thoracic outlet syndrome he is recovering from ends careers.  Josh Beckett, Shawn Marcum, Chris Carpenter,,,,it is derailing Matt Harvey's career right now.  Hughes has also had TJ.  Who has had TJ and the procedure to fix thoracic outlet syndrome?   Anyone else besides Hughes??  

 

So I don't see how the front office can justify their optimism in this case.

[yarnivek1972]

It better not be. That money is going to spent if he pitches, or a cheap player does. If he has influence over this kind of decision, the team is in trouble.

I think you are kidding yourself if you think that isn’t the case for most pro sports teams. Day to day? No. Sign player X? Sometimes, maybe but generally not. Total salary budget? Absolutely. Deciding to not attempt to get some kind of return on a $26 mil investment? I think so.

[Mike Sixel]

I think you are kidding yourself if you think that isn’t the case for most pro sports teams. Day to day? No. Sign player X? Sometimes, maybe but generally not. Total salary budget? Absolutely. Deciding to not attempt to get some kind of return on a $26 mil investment? I think so.

If Hughes is bad, they literally make more money replacing him. Winning sells. If they can't cut a bad player, and I'm not saying he is but if he is, then this team is in trouble. I think we will just disagree on this and move on. But if one million dollars stops them from making the team better, uh oh.

[adorduan]

 

I think you are kidding yourself if you think that isn’t the case for most pro sports teams. Day to day? No. Sign player X? Sometimes, maybe but generally not. Total salary budget? Absolutely. Deciding to not attempt to get some kind of return on a $26 mil investment? I think so.

sometimes the best investment decision is to sell at a loss and move on.  trying to recoup what you might consider full value can be a fools game.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

I think you have enough information to form an opinion on Hughes at this point. The guy has had so many injuries and this thoracic outlet syndrome he is recovering from ends careers. Josh Beckett, Shawn Marcum, Chris Carpenter,,,,it is derailing Matt Harvey's career right now. Hughes has also had TJ. Who has had TJ and the procedure to fix thoracic outlet syndrome? Anyone else besides Hughes??

 

So I don't see how the front office can justify their optimism in this case.

shaun marcum had Tommy John surgery as well.

 

But totally agree, TOS ends careers. I wonder how many careers it ended but went undiagnosed, or how many times it has been diagnosed incorrectly.

[darin617]

 

Replacing Hughes with a better pitcher from the minors costs the team 500,000 or so. If he's bad, there is no reason to keep him around. Not financial. Not loyalty. Not winning.a Therelso no rain for him to renegotiate.

To me, if he's not good, I ask him to go to Rochester. If he won't, let him go.

If he shows promise, give him some time in Minnesota, but make the leash short.

 

Only reason Hughes would be kept as for insurance purposes. If they can get most of the money back they will continue to hold onto him if he doesn't stay healthy.

 

If he just flat out stinks & they can pull an injury out of the sky to DL for the rest of the season they would be best served dumping him then.

[ewen21]

 

shaun marcum had Tommy John surgery as well.

But totally agree, TOS ends careers. I wonder how many careers it ended but went undiagnosed, or how many times it has been diagnosed incorrectly.

I don't see how he comes back.  When he was with NY he had what was diagnosed as "dead arm syndrome" as well and they sent him to the bullpen.  He turns 32 this year.  i would say he is fighting against heavy odds at this stage

[Vanimal46]

 

I think the dream of him finding 92 MPH again is over. He needs to reinvent himself as an 89-90 MPH pitcher.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I think the dream of him finding 92 MPH again is over. He needs to reinvent himself as an 89-90 MPH pitcher.

Which is improbable.

[Vanimal46]

Which is improbable.

Yeah, for many pitchers out there, losing a couple of ticks on the fastball is the difference between being serviceable and throwing batting practice.

 

Hughes is going to continue throwing batting practice until someone steps in and pulls the plug.

[Thegrin]

its time to kill this thread. 

[Taildragger8791]

 

I think the dream of him finding 92 MPH again is over. He needs to reinvent himself as an 89-90 MPH pitcher.

 

 

Which is improbable.

 

Here come the Jamie Moyer comps...

[Thegrin]

Pitchers who pitch predictable innings sometimes rebuild their arms and find a few xtra mph.  We can only

hope.  

 

[Vanimal46]

 

This is my nightmare.

[Brock Beauchamp]

https://twitter.com/AaronGleeman/status/973561365951479808?s=19

 

This is my nightmare.

Actually, it’s probably the right decision, as much as I don’t want to see Hughes pitch again. Mejia needs the reps and the Twins barely need a fifth starter to start the season.

 

But I hope Hughes has an extremely short leash once the team needs a fifth starter regularly.

[gil4]

 

its time to kill this thread. 

He's still on the roster. This thread could still be going until his contract expires (end of 2019?).

[Brock Beauchamp]

From the looks of things, the first time the Twins will need a fifth starter is April 12th. If there's a postponement between April 7-12, they won't need a fifth starter until April 22nd or 23rd.

 

There's a pretty good chance the fifth starter will pitch only three or four times before Santana returns in early to mid May.

 

So, yeah, probably best to let Adalberto get his reps in Rochester and let Hughes flail away out there.

 

edi: I looked at it again... The most the fifth starter needs to pitch - assuming there are zero postponements, a rarity in April - is five times through May 12th or so.

[jud6312]

 

This is my nightmare.

This is the kind of move they should spring on people at the end of the day rather than at (almost) the beginning of the day. I've got another 6 hours of work ... that's a long time to walk around with the taste of bile in my mouth.

[Vanimal46]

This is the kind of move they should spring on people at the end of the day rather than at (almost) the beginning of the day. I've got another 6 hours of work ... that's a long time to walk around with the taste of bile in my mouth.

They were on a roll of announcing signings on Saturday evening. Wish they would have waited until then to drop this news on us.

[jud6312]

 

From the looks of things, the first time the Twins will need a fifth starter is April 12th. If there's a postponement between April 7-11, they won't need a fifth starter until April 22nd or 23rd.

 

There's a pretty good chance the fifth starter will pitch fewer than three times before Santana returns.

 

So, yeah, probably best to let Adalberto get his reps in Rochester and let Hughes flail away out there.

Fingers crossed for an April 12 blizzard, an April 22nd implosion of Tropicana Field and an April 23 tsunami in the Bronx.

[howieramone2]

Our favorite team has only the one problematic contact. Most teams have several. I don't downgrade players who have been injured. Let it play out. It's possible he may be worth 3-6 million as a long reliever, and Rob Antony can dump him on the Angels at the deadline. What happens to Hughes is not going to be a season changer.

[Twodogs]

 

I think the dream of him finding 92 MPH again is over. He needs to reinvent himself as an 89-90 MPH pitcher.

Yeah I watched him pitch yesterday and that is exactly where his straight fast ball was sitting at, 89-90 mph.  He was getting a lot of his 82-83 mph off speed stuff across the plate though, so maybe he is trying to reinvent himself??

 

Good luck to him.

[Vanimal46]

 

Yeah I watched him pitch yesterday and that is exactly where his straight fast ball was sitting at, 89-90 mph.  He was getting a lot of his 82-83 mph off speed stuff across the plate though, so maybe he is trying to reinvent himself??

 

Good luck to him.

 

He'll have to be a junk ball pitcher primarily, and try to sneak an 89 MPH by a batter every now and again. He needs a lot of good luck. 

[nicksaviking]

I don't think that just because Mejia got sent down it necessarily means he won't get a look at being the fifth starter early.

 

I mean, there is no long man in the bullpen is there, early on the long man has to be the fifth starter right? Even if Duffy ends up being a long man out of need, all of the healthy starters look very sketchy to be able to consistently go deep into games. Unless they want to blow through their bullpen innings early in the year, I'd think they're going to need a starter getting a bunch of relief work early.

[Twins33]

Wondering if this means they won't do any skipping now? Doesn't seem to be set in stone yet though.

 

[Mr. Brooks]

From the looks of things, the first time the Twins will need a fifth starter is April 12th. If there's a postponement between April 7-12, they won't need a fifth starter until April 22nd or 23rd.

 

There's a pretty good chance the fifth starter will pitch only three or four times before Santana returns in early to mid May.

 

So, yeah, probably best to let Adalberto get his reps in Rochester and let Hughes flail away out there.

 

edi: I looked at it again... The most the fifth starter needs to pitch - assuming there are zero postponements, a rarity in April - is five times through May 12th or so.

Those 5 games could easily be the difference between making the playoffs and not.

I get they have a lot invested in this guy, but I still don't understand giving him a rotation spot- even if it's temporary.