DFA Hughes

[KirbyDome89]

Huges has been bad/injured/recovering for 3 seasons now....

 

Why do we need to "monitor his recovery," for another offseason? Saying the Twins should keep him to mop up sounds eerily similar to the "keep Danny Santana because he can pinch run," argument. 

[Guest]

If you keep him, you don't sign someone to replace him, right?

If you keep him, you don't sign someone to replace him, right?

Right, but they can always remove him when they want to give his spot to someone else. Today, if they removed him, they could add Busenitz to the 25 or Melotakis to the 40. Not a big deal. In the future, if they were to, say, trade their sixth and tenth prospects and a reliever for two MLB relievers, they may have other thoughts about Hughes, although in that situation other pitchers could be at equal or greater risk.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Huges has been bad/injured/recovering for 3 seasons now....

 

Why do we need to "monitor his recovery," for another offseason? Saying the Twins should keep him to mop up sounds eerily similar to the "keep Danny Santana because he can pinch run," argument. 

 

Amen.

[Rosterman]

You know, you could write-off his contract for this season, possibly, and not have it hurt against future seasons (not that team would do that).\

 

[drjim]

Huges has been bad/injured/recovering for 3 seasons now....

 

Why do we need to "monitor his recovery," for another offseason? Saying the Twins should keep him to mop up sounds eerily similar to the "keep Danny Santana because he can pinch run," argument.

Santana vs Hughes are two very different decision trees.

[yarnivek1972]

Santana vs Hughes are two very different decision trees.

Yeah, Hughes' tree has 26,000,000 more branches on it...

[drjim]

Yeah, Hughes' tree has 26,000,000 more branches on it...

Correct. And the curent state of the pitching staff vs the current state of backup IFs plays a role.

[DJSim22]

 

Huges has been bad/injured/recovering for 3 seasons now....

 

Why do we need to "monitor his recovery," for another offseason? Saying the Twins should keep him to mop up sounds eerily similar to the "keep Danny Santana because he can pinch run," argument. 

 

Holding onto a pitcher who has been successful in MLB is not comparable to a pinch runner.  The Twins need pitching and are looking at every avenue.  The fact they keep claiming pitchers should tell you all you need to know.

[Riverbrian]

I believe that if the people in the front office believed that Hughes was cooked, done with no hope of recovery.

 

He'd be on that bus by now. 

 

I don't think money left on the contract is part of the decision if he is cooked, done with no hope of recovery. 

 

That would be like you and me saying "I spent $3,000 dollars on this TV that doesn't work and can't be repaired but I'm going to watch Big Bang Theory on it because I spent $3,000 on it". 

 

In the human race... A total of Zero People would do something like that so I'll give the Pohlad, Falvine and others the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn't do something like that either.  

 

 

 

 

 

[yarnivek1972]

I believe that if the people in the front office believed that Hughes was cooked, done with no hope of recovery.

 

He'd be on that bus by now.

 

I don't think money left on the contract is part of the decision if he is cooked, done with no hope of recovery.

 

That would be like you and me saying "I spent $3,000 dollars on this TV that doesn't work and can't be repaired but I'm going to watch Big Bang Theory on it because I spent $3,000 on it".

 

In the human race... A total of Zero People would do something like that so I'll give the Pohlad, Falvine and others the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn't do something like that either.

But what if that tv simply had bad reception? It was still watchable, but it was no longer the best tv in the house? Maybe it's even the worst in the house, but you can still use it. Still throwing it out? That's the case with Hughes. He can still get some MLB hitters out. He's proven that the last couple weeks or whatever.

[Squirrel]

But what if that tv simply had bad reception? It was still watchable, but it was no longer the best tv in the house? Maybe it's even the worst in the house, but you can still use it. Still throwing it out? That's the case with Hughes. He can still get some MLB hitters out. He's proven that the last couple weeks or whatever.

If someone else is paying for that TV, yeah, it's gone. If I'm paying for it, I'm getting out of it what I can before it just doesn't work anymore.

 

And comparing a TV to a person is a weird analogy, imo.

[Riverbrian]

 

And comparing a TV to a person is a weird analogy, imo.

 

Completely out of character for me. 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

In regards to the few posters who have brought up insurance.

I'm pretty sure it only pays out if he misses an entire season.

it depends on the policy, but as far as I know, every policy is based on injury.

[Riverbrian]

 

But what if that tv simply had bad reception? It was still watchable, but it was no longer the best tv in the house? Maybe it's even the worst in the house, but you can still use it. Still throwing it out? That's the case with Hughes. He can still get some MLB hitters out. He's proven that the last couple weeks or whatever.

 

If it can't be fixed... It's on the curb. Let someone drive by and pick it up... load it in the truck, carry into their house... hook it up and discover that there was a reason it was on the curb.

 

I think the Twins feel Hughes can improve or he'd be gone already. 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

But what if that tv simply had bad reception? It was still watchable, but it was no longer the best tv in the house? Maybe it's even the worst in the house, but you can still use it. Still throwing it out? That's the case with Hughes. He can still get some MLB hitters out. He's proven that the last couple weeks or whatever.

im trading in that TV for pennies on the dollar so I don't have to pay someone else to dispose of it for me later.

 

Opportunity cost of prospects getting low leverage experience being the "trade in value" for Hughes. The longer they wait, the more likely the injury. Hopefully it's not a Romero or Gonsalves or Berrios that gets injured

[old nurse]

 

You know, you could write-off his contract for this season, possibly, and not have it hurt against future seasons (not that team would do that).\

How. The money is guaranteed.  It is there as an expense for the next 2 seasons.

[kab21]

 

As I said previously, I believe that only counts for this year. After that, the new team would need to pick up his salary. Thus, no one will pick him up.

 

I could be incorrect about that, but I believe there was a rule change in this regard many years ago so that the team that DFAs is only on the hook for one year for the full salary if another team picks up the player.

 

Regardless of any of that, I established earlier that my opinion is his salary doesn't matter. It's the same regardless of what happens. The only thing the Twins should consider if player value.

No, the salary is guaranteed by the Twins and the Twins pay every season of it even if he is cut. They get a tiny amount of relief (MLB min I believe) if another team signs him. The only way the Twins get out of it is if a team claimed him on waivers (0% chance). I guess it is also possible that the team could offer some type of buyout but those rarely happen in the MLB.

[howeda7]

He's probably a lost cause. But there's no reason to DFA him and eat that cash just yet. He still has numbness in his fingers. DL him for the rest of the year and bring him to Spring Training focused only on being a reliever. Maybe it works. Maybe it doesn't. You can DFA him next April if not. 

[howeda7]

 

You know, you could write-off his contract for this season, possibly, and not have it hurt against future seasons (not that team would do that).\

It doesn't work like that and there's no salary cap, so it wouldn't matter even if it did. They owe him that money either way and there's no reason to give it to him in advance. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

Hughes gets DFAd when it's clear he cannot contribute again AND there's someone that needs a 40 man spot and no one else worth DFAing to put him there. Hughes isn't there... YET. I don't think that day is too far off, but there's more than enough marginal talent on the roster to keep his spot safe for now (and probably this offseason too). If the FO wants to keep him on the DL or give him a try in the pen, so be it. Given the need for pitching, I can certainly understand wanting to give a guy who has had success and is still 'young' every chance to succeed.

 

[Vanimal46]

 

But what if that tv simply had bad reception? It was still watchable, but it was no longer the best tv in the house? Maybe it's even the worst in the house, but you can still use it. Still throwing it out? That's the case with Hughes. He can still get some MLB hitters out. He's proven that the last couple weeks or whatever.

 

This happened to me in college... Remember those monster tube big screen TVs? We had one upstairs and no one wanted to move it. Still watchable! But no longer the best TV in the house... I sold it for a PTBNL.... errr.... I mean for $50, and they had to lift that monster down the stairs. 

[olivia11]

They can find an "injury", put him on the DL, and then basically not have to bring him up back up until September roster expansion.  Might as well keep him on the roster this season and see if his velocity improves by Spring Training 2018. 

[Doomtints]

 

No, the salary is guaranteed by the Twins and the Twins pay every season of it even if he is cut. They get a tiny amount of relief (MLB min I believe) if another team signs him. The only way the Twins get out of it is if a team claimed him on waivers (0% chance). I guess it is also possible that the team could offer some type of buyout but those rarely happen in the MLB.

 

I am aware of this, but I believe this is only for the 1st year that another team picks him up. Can anyone confirm?

[SweetOne69]

 

Hughes gets DFAd when it's clear he cannot contribute again AND there's someone that needs a 40 man spot and no one else worth DFAing to put him there. Hughes isn't there... YET. I don't think that day is too far off, but there's more than enough marginal talent on the roster to keep his spot safe for now (and probably this offseason too). If the FO wants to keep him on the DL or give him a try in the pen, so be it. Given the need for pitching, I can certainly understand wanting to give a guy who has had success and is still 'young' every chance to succeed.

 

As a side note, the Twins will have to open up a 40-man and 25-man roster spot today in order to "purchase" Colon's contract.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

This happened to me in college... Remember those monster tube big screen TVs? We had one upstairs and no one wanted to move it. Still watchable! But no longer the best TV in the house... I sold it for a PTBNL.... errr.... I mean for $50, and they had to lift that monster down the stairs. 

 

that's called cash considerations....

[kab21]

 

I am aware of this, but I believe this is only for the 1st year that another team picks him up. Can anyone confirm?

Maybe I am completely not understanding what you are talking about but if the other team had to assume his 2018-2019 salary if they picked him up next season he would be effectively out of baseball since nobody would sign him.

The Twins are completely stuck with the remainder of the salary and it doesn't matter if they waive him this year or next year.

[Oldgoat_MN]

 

Keeping him if they think he can get better isn't a big problem until a roster crunch occurs, which could be before the Rule V draft or during spring training cut-downs.

This is exactly true.

He needs to be on the 40-man through the Rule V draft.

They should know by the end of Spring Training next year whether he should be cut or has value the team covets.

[Doomtints]

 

Maybe I am completely not understanding what you are talking about but if the other team had to assume his 2018-2019 salary if they picked him up next season he would be effectively out of baseball since nobody would sign him.

The Twins are completely stuck with the remainder of the salary and it doesn't matter if they waive him this year or next year.

 

This very scenario came up, where a powerful team dropped a player with multiple years left, another team picked the player up and paid the minimum for several years. I believe the rule was changed so that the team that cuts someone is only on the hook for the 1st year. So if Hughes is dropped this year, and someone does not pick him up until next year, the Twins would owe this year + next year, but not the 3rd year.  Etc.

 

 

[kab21]

 

This very scenario came up, where a powerful team dropped a player with multiple years left, another team picked the player up and paid the minimum for several years. I believe the rule was changed so that the team that cuts someone is only on the hook for the 1st year. So if Hughes is dropped this year, and someone does not pick him up until next year, the Twins would owe this year + next year, but not the 3rd year.  Etc.

This is pretty vague but if anyone can come up with a source of this info then I would like to see it.

I feel pretty confident in saying that the Twins will be paying almost all of Hughes' salary regardless of when they cut him.

[Otto von Ballpark]

This very scenario came up, where a powerful team dropped a player with multiple years left, another team picked the player up and paid the minimum for several years. I believe the rule was changed so that the team that cuts someone is only on the hook for the 1st year. So if Hughes is dropped this year, and someone does not pick him up until next year, the Twins would owe this year + next year, but not the 3rd year. Etc.

No, it is fully guaranteed. The team that releases a veteran still owes him his full contract. If the Tigers released Zimmermann today, they would still pay him for the next 3 years, but another team could sign him right away and would not be responsible for anything over the minimum.