The Danny Valencia trade, pretty much frames Plouffe's value

[Thrylos]

Today the A's traded Danny Valencia (whose career numbers have been pretty much identical to those of Trevor Plouffe) who is in his last arbitration year, for a 23 year old former supplemental 1st round pick SP, who has a lot of pitches, but his best pitch is a two-seamer and he does not strike out much, and his last name is Blackburn (cannot make it up.)

 

So... would you trade Plouffe for Blackburn, keep him and block a few players or non-tender him?

 

 

[Brandon Warne]

Not really. Valencia is regarded around the game as a difficult personality to the point where the A's were reportedly considering DFA'ing him around the trade deadline. 

 

 

[Brandon Warne]

Valencia also has much better offense and much worse defense on tape over the last year or so. I don't think they're really comparable at all. *Maybe* the return would be similar, but it's not because their career numbers are similar. Plouffe is also slated to make a lot more cash in arbitration.

[theBOMisthebomb]

Yes. I would move Plouffe for any reasonable offer.

[Shaitan]

I agree with all posters here. Last year I was all for "only trade him for an above average offer." Now there's no role and,while $8mil isn't much in current MLB economics, it's a lot for a bench bat.

 

If they can get someone with Mejia's ceiling, take it.

 

I might even take Nick Blackburn as upgrade over last year's rotation.

 

[Thegrin]

ahh for the days of Baker, Liriano, Pavanno & Blackburn. The golden age of Twins pitching.

[diehardtwinsfan]

Plouffe is to be non-tendered in my plan, so yes I'd move him for a non-40 man option, even if it isn't a good one.

[theBOMisthebomb]

ahh for the days of Baker, Liriano, Pavanno & Blackburn. The golden age of Twins pitching.

It certainly might have been one of the deepest Twins rotations in recent history.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Id take what I could get with Plouffe.

[Linus]

Id take what I could get with Plouffe.

While I generally agree I wouldn't take on any mediocrity that requires a 40 man spot. At that point I would take a prospect - any prospect.

[kab21]

I don't think anyone knows what the Twins know or plan to do with Sano next year. He should play 3B every day but if they think his elbow can't handle it then a case can be made to keep Plouffe. If Sano is expected to play (or can) 3B then there is no reason to keep Plouffe.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

While I generally agree I wouldn't take on any mediocrity that requires a 40 man spot. At that point I would take a prospect - any prospect.

id take project too, but agreed no 40-man chaff

[Doomtints]

 

ahh for the days of Baker, Liriano, Pavanno & Blackburn. The golden age of Twins pitching.

 

The 2010 Twins were brought to you by an elite bullpen, elite defense, and hot hitting.  That starting staff was barely good enough and in spite of their individual W-L records they never seemed dominant outside of Pavano. 

 

The Twins would have had a good shot at winning a playoff series had Gardenhire understood that the bullpen was stronger than the starting staff and pulled Pavano and Liriano after 5 innings. In fact, I bet they would have gone up 2-0 in that series.

[HitInAPinch]

For people [like me] who didn't remember what happened:

 

"The trade of Valencia comes as no surprise. He was rumored to be on the trading block ahead of the 2016 trade deadline, but the A’s never found a deal to their liking.

 

The likelihood of a trade then increased in August, when Valencia was involved in a physical altercation with teammate Billy Butler in the visiting clubhouse in Chicago. The incident resulted in Butler suffering a concussion, which forced him out of action for a week."

 

 

[Boom Boom]

No, I don't want another Blackburn, but I do think the Twins need to move on from Plouffie. A useful minor leaguer in return would be nice but I would take the open roster spot on its own. I'd even let the acquiring team keep their could-be-back-of-the-rotation-sinkerballers.

 

Plouffe is a useful piece for the right team but not for the Twins at this point.

[Shaitan]

 

I don't think anyone knows what the Twins know or plan to do with Sano next year. He should play 3B every day but if they think his elbow can't handle it then a case can be made to keep Plouffe. If Sano is expected to play (or can) 3B then there is no reason to keep Plouffe.

 

If they still have Dozier, then they plug Polanco at 3B or maybe move Dozier over.

[darin617]

3rd base, 1st base & DH are a complete disaster with what the Twins have to work with. Sano & Park look to be full time DH's, Mauer has 1st base held down because of his contract. I can see a team waiting to pounce on the chance to give Vargas a change of scenery and an actual hitting coach and turn him into a solid player. I am not sure how this will all shake out and can clearly say I would not wish this mess onto anyone. Good luck and let's hope for the best.

[Eris]

 

3rd base, 1st base & DH are a complete disaster with what the Twins have to work with. Sano & Park look to be full time DH's, Mauer has 1st base held down because of his contract. I can see a team waiting to pounce on the chance to give Vargas a change of scenery and an actual hitting coach and turn him into a solid player. I am not sure how this will all shake out and can clearly say I would not wish this mess onto anyone. Good luck and let's hope for the best.

 

Park is a decent defensive 1st baseman.  Although 24 games is a SSS, his UZR/150 was 13.5 (2nd best) and he had 2 DRS.  Extrapolating the DRS over 1337 innings (Rizzo's innings with 11 DRS), Park would have led all MLB 1st basemen in DRS with 13 DRS.  From a defensive view point, the Twins would be better off with Park over Mauer at 1st (again based on a small sample size).  Whether or not Park can produce enough offensively to justify being penciled in the line-up every day remains to be seen.  (Data is from Fangraphs)

[dxpavelka]

 

ahh for the days of Baker, Liriano, Pavanno & Blackburn. The golden age of Twins pitching.

Funny how the last 6 years make us miss going one and done in the playoffs.

 

[Brandon Warne]

It's a one-year deal and Plouffe is a bounce-back candidate. 

 

I'd tender him with the hopes that he can play roughly half the time and rebuild value. 

 

If not, cut him during the season. 

 

But I think he's good enough to give one more shot. I'd probably platoon him with Mauer at first and some playing time between third base and DH. 

[Mr. Brooks]

It's a one-year deal and Plouffe is a bounce-back candidate.

 

I'd tender him with the hopes that he can play roughly half the time and rebuild value.

 

If not, cut him during the season.

 

But I think he's good enough to give one more shot. I'd probably platoon him with Mauer at first and some playing time between third base and DH.

I might agree in theory. But, Molitor has proven with his actions that he plays his veterans if they are healthy.

 

His recent words in the Strib seem to suggest he has no patience for FO giving lineup input.

 

I fear that if Plouffe is on the roster, he'll play everyday. Unless he's hurt, but if he's hurt then he's not going to be tradable anyways.

[Mike Sixel]

It's a one-year deal and Plouffe is a bounce-back candidate.

 

I'd tender him with the hopes that he can play roughly half the time and rebuild value.

 

If not, cut him during the season.

 

But I think he's good enough to give one more shot. I'd probably platoon him with Mauer at first and some playing time between third base and DH.

What possible value does he have as a part time dh and first baseman? So, you just do what with Vargas?

[markos]

 

What possible value does he have as a part time dh and first baseman? So, you just do what with Vargas?

I'm not advocating this, but I think the hope is that he would be healthy and effective, especially if he primarily hits against lefties, and in a part-time role has ~250-300 PAs by the end of July. Then at the trade deadline he would fetch a decent prospect, much like Aaron Hill and Steve Pearce did this past year.

 

Of course, having Vargas on the roster without options complicates things...

[Mr. Brooks]

I'm not advocating this, but I think the hope is that he would be healthy and effective, especially if he primarily hits against lefties, and in a part-time role has ~250-300 PAs by the end of July. Then at the trade deadline he would fetch a decent prospect, much like Aaron Hill and Steve Pearce did this past year.

 

Of course, having Vargas on the roster without options complicates things...

300 PA's by the trade deadline is pretty close to a full time player.

He won't get that platooning with Joe. That means he's full time DH against righties.

Has Plouffe ever hit well enough to have value at DH?

Will he bring back enough that you are willing to move on from Vargas? Because that leaves almost no PA's for Vargas.

I know some here probably would.

I still want to see more from Vargas, so I'd just say no to Plouffe.

[David HK]

 

If they still have Dozier, then they plug Polanco at 3B or maybe move Dozier over.

Yes, Dozey to 3B would be a great move.  

[TheLeviathan]

Plouffe's existence on the roster gives the team and the manager far too many viable excuses to play the wrong player (Plouffe) over others.

 

No thanks.  He needed to be gone last year, punting it another 3-4 months is just a continuation of a huge mistake.

[kab21]

 

If they still have Dozier, then they plug Polanco at 3B or maybe move Dozier over.

And then they have no depth across the entire IF for an entire season. If they plan to play Sano at 3B then Plouffe doesn't have a role on the team. If his elbow isn't good enough to play there more than 2 days/week or the incoming FO makes defense a priority then Plouffe is a solid player to keep on a one year deal.

[Rosterman]

Valencia was largely traded to play first or the outfield at this point in his career.

 

[Pardon My Dinger]

This is not a valid comparison. Danny Valencia punched Billy Butler in the head. He was going to get traded at the first opportunity. Until Plouffy flips his lid and decides that he wants to clean Joe Mauer's clock, I don't think that Valencia's trade return is a very reliable benchmark. 

[Vanimal46]

It's a one-year deal and Plouffe is a bounce-back candidate.

 

I'd tender him with the hopes that he can play roughly half the time and rebuild value.

 

If not, cut him during the season.

 

But I think he's good enough to give one more shot. I'd probably platoon him with Mauer at first and some playing time between third base and DH.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that the Twins would cut an $8+ MM player if he wasn't performing.

 

Please, just let him go.