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Posted

OK...  

How do I feel? 

I expected it. I can't even get pissed like I want to be. I am taking Falvey, Zoll and Shelton at their words lately. They have been telling us and I believe them. They think this team can compete and they are going for it. 

This signing removes any doubts of this off-season's intention. We are not trading our trade chips. The rebuild is going to start at this specific point. The selling of the bullpen and the cashing out the Correa contract was the start and finish of the beginning of this re-whatever it is

It just isn't the direction I would have gone... I'm disappointed to see more of the same. However... I've had time to prepare for it...at least two years of preparation...  nothing snuck upon on me. 

So... getting past that. 

In the context of what the Twins are going to try and do. 

If you just consider last year's stats. We have basically added another Larnach to the lineup. I meant that comparison as complimentary but it's another Larnach sized production addition based on last year's numbers.

Bell has more power but the overall production is about a Trevor Larnach contribution. I know some will take this as opportunity to say something about Larnach. Larnach isn't the point. I think that Larnach can hit so if that is what Bell brings... OK... it is what it is.

If this is what they are going to try and do... it makes sense. It's the What they are going to try and do part that doesn't make sense but it's what they've consistently done. I fear it will lengthen the process of whatever process this is but they are going for it.

Like digging a 5 foot hole with your toenails... they are going for it. 

SS will probably be addressed with IKF or Arcia. There will be bullpen pieces making one to two million each and that'll be your 20 million spent. 

There is no reason to make a 26 man decision now between the optionless Clemens or Julien. Someone could get hurt between now and the end of spring training. 

It's just not what I wanted them to do.

They're going for it. 

Posted
48 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

...Bell has more power...

Not really. ISO is .165 for his last 4 seasons. Larnach is .170 for the same period. They're the same as "power hitters"  Bell isn't a power hitter at all, he's barely median for ISO.

He gets to about 20 HR, but it takes him 600+ plate appearances to do it. He hasn't been serious "power" threat since pre-COVID.

 

Posted
13 hours ago, Nashvilletwin said:

Yes, I agree, 1B/DH was our most obvious position player of need. But there are cascading effects to these signings. Here are a few, many of which with I’m sure you will disagree:

1. Wallner DH opportunities. 
2. Julien ABs. (some of us would like to see what he has under new leadership).
3. Possibly Keaschall innings at both 2B and 1B. 
4. Delayed call ups later in the year around the fringes.

He’s just one more guy who will 100% not move the dial taking innings and ABs. Like so many before him. 

TWINS fans can only hope Bell blocks as many Eddie Julien opportunities as possible. If Julien is on the Team roster in ‘26 I’ll be shocked!

How does Josh Bell or any 1B signing take AB’s away from Luke Keaschall at 2B????

#4 is some extra reason to complain with seemingly no basis since it doesn’t have any specific that it refers to at all.

The only reason Bell would DH in front of someone else would be to utilize his ability to switch hit while keeping guys like Wallner & Larnach away from hitting against lefties……I have zero issue with that.

Posted
1 hour ago, Riverbrian said:

OK...  

How do I feel? 

I expected it. I can't even get pissed like I want to be. I am taking Falvey, Zoll and Shelton at their words lately. They have been telling us and I believe them. They think this team can compete and they are going for it. 

This signing removes any doubts of this off-season's intention. We are not trading our trade chips. The rebuild is going to start at this specific point. The selling of the bullpen and the cashing out the Correa contract was the start and finish of the beginning of this re-whatever it is

It just isn't the direction I would have gone... I'm disappointed to see more of the same. However... I've had time to prepare for it...at least two years of preparation...  nothing snuck upon on me. 

So... getting past that. 

In the context of what the Twins are going to try and do. 

If you just consider last year's stats. We have basically added another Larnach to the lineup. I meant that comparison as complimentary but it's another Larnach sized production addition based on last year's numbers.

Bell has more power but the overall production is about a Trevor Larnach contribution. I know some will take this as opportunity to say something about Larnach. Larnach isn't the point. I think that Larnach can hit so if that is what Bell brings... OK... it is what it is.

If this is what they are going to try and do... it makes sense. It's the What they are going to try and do part that doesn't make sense but it's what they've consistently done. I fear it will lengthen the process of whatever process this is but they are going for it.

Like digging a 5 foot hole with your toenails... they are going for it. 

SS will probably be addressed with IKF or Arcia. There will be bullpen pieces making one to two million each and that'll be your 20 million spent. 

There is no reason to make a 26 man decision now between the optionless Clemens or Julien. Someone could get hurt between now and the end of spring training. 

It's just not what I wanted them to do.

They're going for it. 

Larnach had a good ‘24 …… in ‘25 they let him have about 100 more AB’s v. LH pitching and it ripped up his stats line. He’s a good hitter v. RH pitching. Bring aging Bell on to roster will help Larnach specifically platoon v. RH pitching and this will push his OPS toward .765 and a BA near .260. With 450 AB’s against 90% RH pitching, this will get Larnach to 16-20HR and he’ll contribute as a solid DH and occasional few innings in corner OF spot.

I think Bell sees 125 starts at 1B.

I agree …….. $3-$4M each on a couple relievers and another $3-$4M on an IKF type at SS or maybe a little more for Castro’s flexibility (potential to bump Clemens off roster) ……..this is the sum of the adds for ‘25.

Posted

I don't dislike the signing...we HAD to do something to get some thump out of 1B.  We will never get that out of Clemens or Keaschall and I am pretty sure that Julien will never be back, unless he rides in on a pink Unicorn. 

Here is an interesting question: Bell is not the long term answer, so who do we start training in on 1B so he can take over in a couple of years?   We keep drafting highly rated SS's (Lewis, Lee, Culpepper, Houston, Winokur, Young, and likely another SS in 2026 draft, and don't forget Noah Miller, Cavaco, Austin Martin, Will Holland, etc) on the basis that they are such good athletes that we can move them anywhere on the field.  But we never do!  So, if we have all of these great athletes, which of them would you move to 1B?  

Honestly, I think the only one that really fits at 1B/3B is Lewis--he has the bat/power skills.  But, we just spent a couple of years trying to teach him 3B now, so let's not mess with that....anyone else? 

Emma or Gabriel?  They have hit tool, but might be too useful in the OF (I am looking forward to an OF of Emma, Gabby and Jenkins). 

Larnach and Wallner...and maybe only Wallner???  Could he convert to a good 1B man?  The no-speed plays, but the K's do not. 

Sabato has been in AAA for five years now, and for good reason.  

So, it seems like we need to draft or trade for a long term 1Bman and use guys like Bell/Clemens/Keaschall until he is ready.  We are stuck with Bell.

Could we come up with a package for any one of these guys??  We have ZERO future at 1B as it stands right now (other than, uhhhh.....Sabato, not gonna happen).  

 

image.png.ee2ace39db8cbbefca26c74b281c86c6.png

Posted
6 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

TWINS fans can only hope Bell blocks as many Eddie Julien opportunities as possible. If Julien is on the Team roster in ‘26 I’ll be shocked!

How does Josh Bell or any 1B signing take AB’s away from Luke Keaschall at 2B????

#4 is some extra reason to complain with seemingly no basis since it doesn’t have any specific that it refers to at all.

The only reason Bell would DH in front of someone else would be to utilize his ability to switch hit while keeping guys like Wallner & Larnach away from hitting against lefties……I have zero issue with that.

1. We simply have a difference of opinion on Julien. At least he might have some upside as Bell really does not.

2.  Bell’s presence might prohibit Keaschall getting an innings at 1B - which given our glut of existing and upcoming OFs, might be his best long term position.  In addition, if Julien and Clemens need ABs and Bell is at 1B, they may have to get those innings at 2B, thus impacting Keaschall.

3. Please check your data.  Bell cannot hit lefties. At all. He can’t field either, but that’s a different point. There is no reason for Bell, despite being a switch hitter, to DH against lefties.  Therefore, if he does DH, he will do so against righties, thereby taking valuable ABs from Wallner, and possibly Larnach if he’s still around.

Cody wrote a good piece that in a roundabout way points out the impact of Bell’s signing on the roster and many reasons why this isn’t a very good signing.

Just out of curiosity, is Bell - an aging one year rental - going to make you buy more tickets?

Posted
19 hours ago, Cory Engelhardt said:

LOTS of moves coming this offseason in my opinion, and that's why they got this one done earlier than they typically start to make moves.

I hope you are right about that. A flurry of earlier moves, and ones that help this team, will be a welcome change of strategy for the front office. 

Posted
11 hours ago, bean5302 said:

Not really. ISO is .165 for his last 4 seasons. Larnach is .170 for the same period. They're the same as "power hitters"  Bell isn't a power hitter at all, he's barely median for ISO.

He gets to about 20 HR, but it takes him 600+ plate appearances to do it. He hasn't been serious "power" threat since pre-COVID.

 

I used 2025 stats only... the paragraph above starts with that disclaimer. 

A homer every 21 AB's to every 29 AB's a .417 SL to .404 in 2025. That's the basis of my saying "more". without clarification of "Little" or "Lot" more. 

I'm willing to retract has more power if I can keep the main point.

Based on 2025 stats. We've added another Larnach type. 

It certainly doesn't imply that 2026 will just be a reproduction of those 2025 numbers. Someone or both may go up... Someone or both may go down. 

 

Posted
10 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

Larnach had a good ‘24 …… in ‘25 they let him have about 100 more AB’s v. LH pitching and it ripped up his stats line. He’s a good hitter v. RH pitching. Bring aging Bell on to roster will help Larnach specifically platoon v. RH pitching and this will push his OPS toward .765 and a BA near .260. With 450 AB’s against 90% RH pitching, this will get Larnach to 16-20HR and he’ll contribute as a solid DH and occasional few innings in corner OF spot.

I think Bell sees 125 starts at 1B.

I agree …….. $3-$4M each on a couple relievers and another $3-$4M on an IKF type at SS or maybe a little more for Castro’s flexibility (potential to bump Clemens off roster) ……..this is the sum of the adds for ‘25.

I agree with most everything you are saying. Maybe not the overall point or spirit of your post but it's accurate. Larnach's drop in his OPS was absolutely influenced by the increase against left handed pitching in 2025 and I appreciate you pointing that out. 

I have frequently and loudly campaigned against the Twins platoon system in regards to development.

While campaigning against the Twins extreme platoon utilization. I have said multiple times that the overall OPS of our young left handed hitters will probably tumble if they allow our young left handed hitters to develop against left handed pitching and I believe that is 100% OK to let them tumble a bit.

Larnach's .608 OPS against lefties last year isn't that impressive but the increased activity against them produced a higher OPS than any of his previous small sample sizes in the two years prior. Which was .579, .412. 

The Twins can focus on that .608 or they can focus on the .760 against right handers. I say don't worry about the 25%... Worry about the 75%. With more exposure... maybe that .608 increases to .650. Still not amazing but now he's in the ball park of what Royce Lewis and Brooks Lee produced playing every single day last year and that's OK with the Twins because Lewis and Lee are going to get the opportunity to work through it for a pay day down the road. No such pay day for left handed prospects against left handed pitching though. They just completely shut it down for two solid years. 

The Twins want to screw around playing marginal splits to slightly increase their chances in single AB situations but yet willing to completely erase any of these marginal gains with the constant of utilization of players who are producing those same numbers against both hands. Last year... Larnach reached base 29.7% of the time against left handed pitching. Lewis reached base 28.3% of the time against everyone. Lewis reached base 29.4% of the time against left handers. Brooks Lee reached base 28.5% of the time and 29.6% of the time against left handers. What exactly are we gaining on a per AB basis if the Twins are willing to just absorb what Lewis and Lee were doing overall. Lewis and Lee doing it is OK... part of the process but letting a left handed hitter face a left handed pitcher is not OK.  

I've passionately posted multiple times that the Twins just stop with the extreme platoon utilization that was screwing up the development of EVERY SINGLE LEFT HANDED HITTING PROSPECT knowing that it will cause a drop in overall numbers if they stopped doing it.

You need your left handed hitters to develop fully just like they allowed their right handed hitters to develop fully. You have starved them for 2 years. Nobody should expect immediate results upon the lift of that ban. It's OK... if there is a platoon split difference.  

The important point is that 75% of pitching is right handed. If the Twins want to play the platoon split correctly. Go get hitters who can hit that 75% instead of chasing down hitters who can hit the 25% of pitching and wasting roster spots on them.  

If the Twins go back to adding short side specialists in order to waste roster spots chasing the 25%. You have to limit the number of left handed hitters in order to do that. Larnach, Wallner, Julien have already been compromised in the early stages of their career. Clemens, Outman, Roden, Erod and Jenkins will also need handcuffs to avoid that 25% problem and there are not enough 26 man slots to provide enough short side extra handcuff slots.

The only way you can avoid this 25% problem is to limit the number of left handed bats  and by limiting the number of left handed bats... you have lost focus on the 75% problem.   

If they spend 7 million on a short side specialist... which Bell doesn't appear to be based on his own splits... the front office will need to be replaced.

If they try to make Martin a short side/pinch running specialist... Just throw Martin away right now. He will stop mattering to our future the very second they make that decision. 

Developing players need to develop 100%. By letting them do that... they increase their value to the team and they increase their value to other teams that would like to acquire them. 

The strip mining of our young prospects for the past few years is a big reason why our development of young hitting prospects has sucked. It's not the THEE reason but... it's a reason.  

 

Posted

I do wonder about Shelton's advocacy in this deal. 

Josh Bell played for Derek in Pittsburg his first year as Manager. The Covid Year. 

It was perhaps Josh's worst year in the majors but Shelton gave him 223 AB's to produce a .669 OPS in 2020. Only Adam Frazier had more AB's that year for Pittsburgh. 

Side Note: Frazier produced a .661 OPS that year. That's what Shelton was running out there trying to compete. Let the Vets kill us was what Shelton was doing in 2020 with Adam Frazier and Josh Bell leading the way. 

It would be pretty crazy if the Twins signed Josh Bell without asking Shelton what he thought about Josh since they worked together many years ago.   

So... I assume that Shelton gave a thumbs up. 

Posted
18 hours ago, old nurse said:

You mentioned 4 signings that met or exceeded expectations.

 

16 hours ago, old nurse said:

It also means it was not a bad thing. Complain when things work. 

I didn't say that late signings lead to bad contracts or poor performance.  I didn't even insinuate that.  I just stated facts.  I am not sure why you brought up that those signings met or exceeded expectations.  That had nothing to do with what I posted.

My point was, the Twins were looking at "mid-tier" 1B.  There are several of those guys available in November/December (lets say 6-8 of them).  As the offseason moves along and those guys start signing elsewhere.  The trickle down effect is now we have fewer FA available in February to potentially sign (lets say 1-3).  We would only get to pick from the limited number available and not from the larger pool of free agents that were available in November/December.   

In this case, instead of waiting out the market, they showed some conviction and were proactive targeting the guy they wanted.  We can question why they targeted Bell, but what I like is that they acted.  Has nothing to do with the quality of the signing or if Bell will perform.  

Posted

@Riverbrianpart of the problem with comparing the chances Lewis and Lee got vs LH outfielders is that those two are our only obvious candidates for SS/3B right now and there's a parade of LH corner OF guys waiting to get a chance to hit against lefties. It's not some giant plot, just a mismatch in the number of platoon partners for those guys. After the trade deadline Rocco may have wanted to give them more or fewer opportunities to hit against lefties, but there was no obvious youngster to check out on the left side of the infield whereas Outman and Roden and Larnach and Wallner and Keirsey all need to be given a chance and then kept or tossed. 

In 2026 Shelton is going to be asked to see what we have and what it will take to complete in either 2027 or 2028 (depending on the CBA tumult.) Looking at the organizational roster there were no internal 1B options  to build around so they spent some money, similar to what they'll do in the bullpen. They were short some RH pop so they got a vaguely league average stick and are probably not going to let him hit LH very much because they have a lot of LH hitters to evaluate this year.

Any complaints about Teams That Are Serious About Winning just comes from fans being fans, not a serious attempt to understand what the team is doing. To be fair the team is still flailing a bit in this regard, but from what Shelton said when he was hired, a year of evaluation followed by steps back towards contention supports what has been done so far. They're going to sort through what they have, fill the gaps that don't have obvious candidates and look ahead once they see the new hands start coming into their own.  

EDIT: I seem to have hit Enter too soon.

Posted
1 hour ago, Cris E said:

@Riverbrianpart of the problem with comparing the chances Lewis and Lee got vs LH outfielders is that those two are our only obvious candidates for SS/3B right now and there's a parade of LH corner OF guys waiting to get a chance to hit against lefties. It's not some giant plot, just a mismatch in the number of platoon partners for those guys. After the trade deadline Rocco may have wanted to give them more or fewer opportunities to hit against lefties, but there was no obvious youngster to check out on the left side of the infield whereas Outman and Roden and Larnach and Wallner and Keirsey all need to be given a chance and then kept or tossed. 

In 2026 Shelton is going to be asked to see what we have and what it will take to complete in either 2027 or 2028 (depending on the CBA tumult.) Looking at the organizational roster there were no internal 1B options  to build around so they spent some money, similar to what they'll do in the bullpen. They were short some RH pop so they got a vaguely league average stick and are probably not going to let him hit LH very much because they have a lot of LH hitters to evaluate this year.

Any complaints about Teams That Are Serious About Winning just comes from fans being fans, not a serious attempt to understand what the team is doing. To be fair the team is still flailing a bit in this regard, but from what Shelton said when he was hired, a year of evaluation followed by steps back towards contention supports what has been done so far. They're going to sort through what they have, fill the gaps that don't have obvious candidates and look ahead once they see the new hands start coming into their own.  

EDIT: I seem to have hit Enter too soon.

I understand that Lewis and Lee are our two obvious candidates for SS/3B and I understand that is why they are going to keep getting chances... I wasn't suggesting that they don't get those chances. I am pro-development. They need to develop. And I feel the same about young left handed hitters against left handed pitching. They need to develop as well. 

The point I'm making in a nutshell. Giving Lewis and Lee chances to work through it is actually more damaging due to 100% utilization but that is OK. And I'm Ok with it.

The other is not OK according to the club... it is stopped from the very beginning. It only plays a role in 25% utilization and it requires a 2nd player to execute. That's why I put the comparison point up there.  

There are 13 roster spots. 4 platoon combinations are the most that you can have. The Twins have maxed out on those 4 platoon combinations. In order to set up 4 platoon combinations... you need right handed hitting cover.

Adding more right handed cover in order to protect the left hander vs left hander is committing 4 players to 25% of pitching or limiting the amount of left handed hitters to to play the 75% of pitching. Injuries are just going to screw it up anyway and now you have your short side right handed hitter facing the right handed pitching more often than they face left handed hitting... the reason they were rostered in the first place. Just develop hitters... Period. Don't worry about the platoon split.

Side with the left handed hitter over the right handed hitter in the case of tiebreakers.  

Pitchers are not treated this way. They have to develop against both hands. They have the same platoon splits to contend with but they can't be sheltered so they get to work on facing both sides of the plate. Hitters...They get strip mined for parts. 

I am not worried in the slightest about how many left handed hitters we have. Put more on the roster... Play the 75% not the 25%.      

I get what they are trying to do. They are trying to win baseball games by marginal degrees instead of developing talent that will blow past those margins regardless of what batters box they stand in.   

I get what they are trying to do... I disagree with what they are trying to do. 

 

  

 

 

Posted
2 hours ago, Riverbrian said:

I do wonder about Shelton's advocacy in this deal. 

Josh Bell played for Derek in Pittsburg his first year as Manager. The Covid Year. 

It was perhaps Josh's worst year in the majors but Shelton gave him 223 AB's to produce a .669 OPS in 2020. Only Adam Frazier had more AB's that year for Pittsburgh. 

Side Note: Frazier produced a .661 OPS that year. That's what Shelton was running out there trying to compete. Let the Vets kill us was what Shelton was doing in 2020 with Adam Frazier and Josh Bell leading the way. 

It would be pretty crazy if the Twins signed Josh Bell without asking Shelton what he thought about Josh since they worked together many years ago.   

So... I assume that Shelton gave a thumbs up. 

"He was okay 5 years ago" is a really dumb reason to add someone.

Posted
18 minutes ago, DJL44 said:

"He was okay 5 years ago" is a really dumb reason to add someone.

He wasn't really OK 5 years ago based on his numbers in 2020.

But, I'd be surprised if they didn't ask his thoughts since they worked directly with each other. Personality... Club House Presence. Was he fighting through an injury that year. 

Hey Derek... This is Derek. We are looking at Josh Bell. What do you think? How was your experience with him?  

Like I said... I wonder about Shelton's advocacy. 

Posted
19 hours ago, mikelink45 said:

That is an understatement.

Does this really make us better or are we back to the Gallo mode? 

I am not buying the statement that his bat speed is increasing.  Let's see.

And a good clubhouse guy is your bench coach not your 1B

How much did we improve?  Cody Clemens 213/281/434 Josh Bell 237/325/417 are you whelmed or underwhelmed?  Clemens 19 HR in 348 AB - Bell 22 in 468

Clemens 1 WAR Bell 0.4 WAR

Like I asked - does this make us better?

Julein and Wallner are still here so it does not make us worse.

Posted
15 hours ago, DJL44 said:
On 12/15/2025 at 10:32 AM, Elliot said:

In the tree world lilacs have great range. Just try to keep one confined to one area. Difficult. 

There's a backstory behind that comment. I grew up outside of town and didn't have many neighbors. We still played ball but there were only a couple players on offense and a couple on defense at any given time. First base was an oak tree and third base was a lilac bush. If you could hit the oak tree with your throw before the runner got there he was out. If you hit the ball into the lilac bush on the fly it was also an out. I figure Bell has more range than the oak tree but not more than the lilac bush. The bush was about 8 feet across at it's widest spot.

I love the backyard baseball analogy and memory.. Probably the best description of Josh Bell defensively; "somewhere between an oak and a lilac".

The real reason for commenting was a break from all of the harshness and vitriol around the Pohlads, divas, coaches, and who has a right to comment or voice opinions. 

Thank you DJL44 for a pleasant diversion.

Posted
14 hours ago, JADBP said:

I don't dislike the signing...we HAD to do something to get some thump out of 1B.  We will never get that out of Clemens or Keaschall and I am pretty sure that Julien will never be back, unless he rides in on a pink Unicorn. 

Here is an interesting question: Bell is not the long term answer, so who do we start training in on 1B so he can take over in a couple of years?   We keep drafting highly rated SS's (Lewis, Lee, Culpepper, Houston, Winokur, Young, and likely another SS in 2026 draft, and don't forget Noah Miller, Cavaco, Austin Martin, Will Holland, etc) on the basis that they are such good athletes that we can move them anywhere on the field.  But we never do!  So, if we have all of these great athletes, which of them would you move to 1B?  

Honestly, I think the only one that really fits at 1B/3B is Lewis--he has the bat/power skills.  But, we just spent a couple of years trying to teach him 3B now, so let's not mess with that....anyone else? 

Emma or Gabriel?  They have hit tool, but might be too useful in the OF (I am looking forward to an OF of Emma, Gabby and Jenkins). 

Larnach and Wallner...and maybe only Wallner???  Could he convert to a good 1B man?  The no-speed plays, but the K's do not. 

Sabato has been in AAA for five years now, and for good reason.  

So, it seems like we need to draft or trade for a long term 1Bman and use guys like Bell/Clemens/Keaschall until he is ready.  We are stuck with Bell.

Could we come up with a package for any one of these guys??  We have ZERO future at 1B as it stands right now (other than, uhhhh.....Sabato, not gonna happen).  

 

image.png.ee2ace39db8cbbefca26c74b281c86c6.png

From an MLB.com article in October. It doesn't look like Hendry got any game action there, but... 

For now, Mendez is playing only the outfield, but he continues to get work at first base. The club would like to see how he works out at that position. He’s tall (6-foot-3) and rangy but has some defensive limitations in the outfield, meaning he could be an intriguing fit for first base at some point.

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