Twins Pursuing First Baseman in Free Agency or Trade

[JD-TWINS]

15 hours ago, Doctor Gast said:

 I advocated to trade Miranda last year because of the reason you stated with Lewis & Lee coming up at 3B, & he's not irreplaceable at 1B or needed long term. His trade value was way uo there. I'm a firm believer in selling high on a player that can be easily replaced. & advocate that even when I get a lot of blow back.

But now Miranda's stock has bottomed out. This isn't the time I'd like to trade Miranda. I'd like to get his stock up to where his true worth is at. IMO Miranda's hitting will return especially against LHPs & can be serviceable at 1B. Then I'd trade him. Same with Polanco & Larnach, I have faith that Polanco will have a very good season this year & hope that Larnach will learn how to hit off-speed.

You think Miranda will come back - maybe so? I just see him as an insignificant piece in the organization. Trade now or later - don’t bank on him helping the Big Club is my opinion.

Respectfully, saying you have faith that Polanco will have a very good season is like me saying I think Buxton will have a very good season. Polanco 104 games & hit .235 in ‘22 & 80 games & hit .255 in ‘23. No real reason to think he’s going to be more physically available this season…………..at this point Farmer’s D is better at all 3 positions they may play………..Farmer hit .255 in ‘22, played 145 games & he hit .256 in ‘23, played 120 games (.255 career hitter) while he missed about a month after getting hit in the face. Availability & consistency!

If Larnach is playing well this year he should be on Big Club….I don’t see him lasting with organization until Spring Training. He’s shown flashes 3-4 times but doesn’t seem to sustain. He looks good but again, hasn’t been consistent.

 

[chpettit19]

31 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

You think Miranda will come back - maybe so? I just see him as an insignificant piece in the organization. Trade now or later - don’t bank on him helping the Big Club is my opinion.

Respectfully, saying you have faith that Polanco will have a very good season is like me saying I think Buxton will have a very good season. Polanco 104 games & hit .235 in ‘22 & 80 games & hit .255 in ‘23. No real reason to think he’s going to be more physically available this season…………..at this point Farmer’s D is better at all 3 positions they may play………..Farmer hit .255 in ‘22, played 145 games & he hit .256 in ‘23, played 120 games (.255 career hitter) while he missed about a month after getting hit in the face. Availability & consistency!

If Larnach is playing well this year he should be on Big Club….I don’t see him lasting with organization until Spring Training. He’s shown flashes 3-4 times but doesn’t seem to sustain. He looks good but again, hasn’t been consistent.

 

 

22 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

IMO, Miranda is not part of the Team’s plan forward. Kirilloff is the 1B going forward.

 

Aren't these 2 stances a little contradictory? Not saying I totally disagree, but if the lack of consistency and availability is a reason to move people shouldn't you be advocating for moving Kirilloff just as much as Polanco and Miranda? He's never ended a major league season healthy, and never played 100 games in an MLB season. 0-3 with major surgeries ending his season twice and another surgery that was feared likely major ended the third. Not exactly a great example of consistency or availability.

I assume the difference is where you see their talent levels, and that's why I don't totally disagree. But counting on Kirilloff as the 1B going forward is awfully risky as well.

[Doctor Gast]

2 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

You think Miranda will come back - maybe so? I just see him as an insignificant piece in the organization. Trade now or later - don’t bank on him helping the Big Club is my opinion.

Respectfully, saying you have faith that Polanco will have a very good season is like me saying I think Buxton will have a very good season. Polanco 104 games & hit .235 in ‘22 & 80 games & hit .255 in ‘23. No real reason to think he’s going to be more physically available this season…………..at this point Farmer’s D is better at all 3 positions they may play………..Farmer hit .255 in ‘22, played 145 games & he hit .256 in ‘23, played 120 games (.255 career hitter) while he missed about a month after getting hit in the face. Availability & consistency!

If Larnach is playing well this year he should be on Big Club….I don’t see him lasting with organization until Spring Training. He’s shown flashes 3-4 times but doesn’t seem to sustain. He looks good but again, hasn’t been consistent.

 

As I stated before Miranda has no future with the Twins, we agree on that. As a business mind I'd like to raise his stock before I'd trade him. That's it. But Miranda does seems to be a streaky player & takes awhile before he gets warmed up. So if we have someone interested I'd trade him now.

The Twins have been abusing Polanco a lot by over playing him while hurt not letting him heal properly through out the years. And his production shows it during these times. Last year Paparesta finally allowed him to fully heal. I know Polanco, when he's healthy & have time to vamp up & get in the groove, he rakes & hits in the clutch. He was starting to do that on a regular basis in the 2nd half. He finished the seaso healthy & will start next season healthy. That's what I'm basing my opinion on. We still need his bat & glove.

The pitchers are on Larnach they know he has trouble with off speed pitches. Hopefully he can adjust but if he can't he's gone.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

This discussion should start and stop with Justin Turner.  He rings every "need" bell both on offense and defense.  He won't cost a prospect and can be had for around $12m (what they paid Solano and Gallo).

This no-brainer should have happened yesterday.

[RpR]

2 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

This discussion should start and stop with Justin Turner.  He rings every "need" bell both on offense and defense.  He won't cost a prospect and can be had for around $12m (what they paid Solano and Gallo).

This no-brainer should have happened yesterday.

A gent who proves age 30 is not when player go lose it.

[nicksaviking]

6 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

This discussion should start and stop with Justin Turner.  He rings every "need" bell both on offense and defense.  He won't cost a prospect and can be had for around $12m (what they paid Solano and Gallo).

This no-brainer should have happened yesterday.

I could go with either he or Rhys Hoskins, but yeah, as fun as free agency can be, getting either of them would be all I want this year.

Presuming pitching is acquired via trade like it is every other off season.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

12 hours ago, nicksaviking said:

I could go with either he or Rhys Hoskins, but yeah, as fun as free agency can be, getting either of them would be all I want this year.

Presuming pitching is acquired via trade like it is every other off season.

Two concerns with Hoskins:
1) He missed all of last year with an ACL surgery.  Twins tend to shy away from unknowns...
2) He will probably cost $5-6m more than Turner.

I would be ok with either, personally I just have a stronger preference towards Turner.

[nicksaviking]

1 hour ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Two concerns with Hoskins:
1) He missed all of last year with an ACL surgery.  Twins tend to shy away from unknowns...
2) He will probably cost $5-6m more than Turner.

I would be ok with either, personally I just have a stronger preference towards Turner.

#1, may help with #2 if the rest of the league is weary. 

And I'm not afraid of a year old ACL surgery for an offensive player, especially a first baseman. The Twins have seen several hitters come out the other side with flying colors, so I'd think if any team is less weary, it'd be the Twins.

 

[Johnny Ringo]

The Twins want to cut payroll in 2024. Because of the RSN death star explosion, half of the MLB teams face an altered reality. Some teams will have to cut payroll as they don't have the relative financial flexibility that the Twins enjoy (if they care to exercise it).

This will create opportunity at first base and other places. 

As bummed and POd people are about the payroll topic, I think there is an opportunity for the FO to shine and distinguish themselves this season. 

 

[HerbieFan]

With payroll to be somewhat limited, I HIGHLY doubt they invest much FA money into a 1B.  

[Shaitan]

On 11/11/2023 at 3:56 PM, JD-TWINS said:

If we want contact - less K’s - consistency at 1B how about starting Kirilloff 130 games?

I think that's been the plan at 1B the last 3 years.

How has it worked out?

[Shaitan]

3 hours ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

Twins tend to shy away from unknowns...

I'm not sure I agree with this: 

Buxton, Kirillof, Paddack, every trade for a pitcher they've made other than P Lopez, Gallo...those are just the examples I came up with in 5 minutes.

I think this FO absolutely embraces unknowns, though with some contractual conditions to limit risk (i.e. AB escalators, multi-year contracts after surgery, etc).

[Fire Dan Gladden]

5 minutes ago, Shaitan said:

I'm not sure I agree with this: 

Buxton, Kirillof, Paddack, every trade for a pitcher they've made other than P Lopez, Gallo...those are just the examples I came up with in 5 minutes.

I think this FO absolutely embraces unknowns, though with some contractual conditions to limit risk (i.e. AB escalators, multi-year contracts after surgery, etc).

Buxton, Kiriloff are knowns.  They were internal guys, the Twins knew what the medical risks were.

I am not sure the Twins would have offered Correa the money they did if he had not been here a year first.  He was a known product at that point, the risk was mitigated.  Gallo was not a risk, he was a 1 year flier.

This FO will not dump a bunch of money into unknown individuals.  You won't see an outside FA signing of 7/$150.  That is the unknown/known I am referring to.

[Cris E]

Bellinger flitting between 1B and CF solves all! Just put all the available money on Red and spin the wheel, baby.  C'mon, live a little!

[nicksaviking]

46 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

This FO will not dump a bunch of money into unknown individuals.  You won't see an outside FA signing of 7/$150.  That is the unknown/known I am referring to.

Who's getting a seven year deal? Ohtani and Yamamoto? 

I've seen one projection of Hoskins getting a three year deal and the others all at one or two. We're talking about a first baseman with 15 career stolen bases, having two ACLs is probably like having two tonsils. Me and Mickey Mantle have been trying to think of baseball players who couldn't come back from an ACL tear and we're coming up blank. You used to just play without them, but now they get professionally fixed any you're ready to roll after only 6-9 months of recovery. 

[Cory Engelhardt]

I wanted to throw out a name I read could/should be available this winter; Harold Ramirez of Tampa Bay. He is team controlled through 2025, and is definitely a decent right handed 1b/dh bat who wouldn't cost an arm and a leg to acquire.

Last year for Tampa, he hit .313/353/460 with a 5.1% bb rate and an 18.2% k rate. He did have a crazy (lucky) babip of .359, so he most likely isn't a .300 hitter, but he doesn't strike out all that much and he has a little bit of pop.

Seems like a good platoon bat (he hit .387/411/555 against lefties in 2023) with a healthy Kirilloff or Julien at 1B. 

 

And who knows, maybe a trade could net us BOTH Glasnow and Ramirez?

 

Thoughts?

[Fire Dan Gladden]

1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

Who's getting a seven year deal? Ohtani and Yamamoto? 

I've seen one projection of Hoskins getting a three year deal and the others all at one or two. We're talking about a first baseman with 15 career stolen bases, having two ACLs is probably like having two tonsils. Me and Mickey Mantle have been trying to think of baseball players who couldn't come back from an ACL tear and we're coming up blank. You used to just play without them, but now they get professionally fixed any you're ready to roll after only 6-9 months of recovery. 

I was speaking in generalities.  The Twins do not give a ton of money or contract length to the unknown FA...

Their biggest true FA signing was Josh Donaldson I believe...

[Cory Engelhardt]

3 minutes ago, Fire Dan Gladden said:

I was speaking in generalities.  The Twins do not give a ton of money or contract length to the unknown FA...

Their biggest true FA signing was Josh Donaldson I believe...

Correa did get more, no? Even though he had opt-outs initially right?

[mnfireman]

I think Larnach, Wallner, Polanco and Jeffers should all get a 1B glove for Christmas and put in a lot of practice after receiving it. Julien and Miranda as well. Or they could re-sign Solano as none of the other FA 1B intrigue me. Well, maybe Hoskins, but his price will be too high

[MABB1959]

I think any player with significant time on the IL in 2022 and 2023 should be put on the shelf.

We have to stop the bleeding on the "if healthy" scenarios.

[tony&rodney]

3 hours ago, MABB1959 said:

I think any player with significant time on the IL in 2022 and 2023 should be put on the shelf.

We have to stop the bleeding on the "if healthy" scenarios.

Tough. So, Lewis gone?

[DocBauer]

On 11/11/2023 at 9:56 AM, Doctor Gast said:

With the budgets cuts we can't splurge on non neccessities. 1B is a non neccessity. We have more than enough adequate 1B men with Kiriloff, Miranda, Farmer & Julien. Julien is a 1B man that they've tried to groom as a 2B all these years. Put Julien at 1B where he belongs in spring training & leave him there. With little competion in the Central, we can afford to have him at 1B & have him perfect the position, Better late than never

In general, I agree with you here. 1B is the easiest spot to fill overall. And I still have a lot of faith/hope that Kirilloff is going to man that spot for years to come. I'm, of course, relieved that his shoulder injury/procedure was not bad. And unless something was hidden from us, I never heard a single word that his wrist wasn't 100%. 

I watched a lot of Julien at 2B last year and it was rather bizarre. He was hesitant or sloppy on plays that often seemed routine, and then would make a very nice play when it was harder/quicker, and more reaction based. The last couple of months, I saw a great deal of improvement from him there, and feel pretty comfortable with him at 2B going forward, at least when it comes to lineup versatility. 

I don't agree with him being a primary 1B as I think/believe that's for AK. But I think he should be worked in there as I think he can handle it on an occasional basis. (Still holding out some hope he MIGHT be "good enough" at tracking the ball to play a little LF at some point).

I'm a little worried about a healthy body and mind rebound from Miranda at 1B. I sure haven't given up on him. He looked like he was still trying to figure out the position in 2022, but he did look smoother as the season went along.

I'm just not sure the FO is feeling comfortable at 1B right now for all the obvious reasons. And it IS a spot where a big bad COULD be added. I just don't think the $ is available to add a lot there right now. Maybe a better than Solano kind of RH bat that's not expensive? The problem with AK and Julien there is a RH balance. 

[Parfigliano]

On 11/13/2023 at 11:55 AM, HerbieFan said:

With payroll to be somewhat limited, I HIGHLY doubt they invest much FA money into a 1B.  

Need to invest in SP.

[Parfigliano]

8 hours ago, MABB1959 said:

I think any player with significant time on the IL in 2022 and 2023 should be put on the shelf.

We have to stop the bleeding on the "if healthy" scenarios.

Me too.  Ditch Buxton.

[Doctor Gast]

6 hours ago, DocBauer said:

In general, I agree with you here. 1B is the easiest spot to fill overall. And I still have a lot of faith/hope that Kirilloff is going to man that spot for years to come. I'm, of course, relieved that his shoulder injury/procedure was not bad. And unless something was hidden from us, I never heard a single word that his wrist wasn't 100%. 

I watched a lot of Julien at 2B last year and it was rather bizarre. He was hesitant or sloppy on plays that often seemed routine, and then would make a very nice play when it was harder/quicker, and more reaction based. The last couple of months, I saw a great deal of improvement from him there, and feel pretty comfortable with him at 2B going forward, at least when it comes to lineup versatility. 

I don't agree with him being a primary 1B as I think/believe that's for AK. But I think he should be worked in there as I think he can handle it on an occasional basis. (Still holding out some hope he MIGHT be "good enough" at tracking the ball to play a little LF at some point).

I'm a little worried about a healthy body and mind rebound from Miranda at 1B. I sure haven't given up on him. He looked like he was still trying to figure out the position in 2022, but he did look smoother as the season went along.

I'm just not sure the FO is feeling comfortable at 1B right now for all the obvious reasons. And it IS a spot where a big bad COULD be added. I just don't think the $ is available to add a lot there right now. Maybe a better than Solano kind of RH bat that's not expensive? The problem with AK and Julien there is a RH balance. 

As always, I appreciate your reasonable response Doc. I agree with you that Julien looked hesitant & sloppy at 2B at the beginning but that's just nerves from playing an unnatural position at the MLB level. Yet that's not what I'm talking about. In my book a defensive position up the middle (CF, SS or 2B) the prerequisite is range. If they don't have adequate range then they are disqualified. If they have the range then the rest can be learned.

Julien doesn't have the range that I'd like for a 2B man. Many people like place players in position not according to their defensive abilities but how their bats play there. I disagree. I really don't like the idea of Julien being our main 2B man.

We'll face in majority RHPs & I'd play Julien mainly there at 1B because AK can play OF & in the beginning AK might be taken easy. I'd try to get their bats in the line-up on a constant basis especially against RHPs.

[MABB1959]

15 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Tough. So, Lewis gone?

Honestly a few times last year I thought it could be Buxton II

[MABB1959]

15 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

Tough. So, Lewis gone?

So far I haven't read any scenarios that actually say "If healthy" related to Lewis.

[AJR]

Why not Polanco for 1st base and DH?

[Richie the Rally Goat]

8 hours ago, AJR said:

Why not Polanco for 1st base and DH?

Maybe he can do it, but he’s 4” shorter than Buck or AK. Being able to stretch that wingspan out is a big advantage. He’s shown more consistent hitting than either Buck or AK, so maybe it would work.

he’s one of the most tradeable MLB assets the Twins have, so in my mind he’s already traded. Too soon for that mindset!

[tony&rodney]

On 11/17/2023 at 8:13 PM, Richie the Rally Goat said:

Maybe he can do it, but he’s 4” shorter than Buck or AK. Being able to stretch that wingspan out is a big advantage. He’s shown more consistent hitting than either Buck or AK, so maybe it would work.

Well, Solano is 5'-8" and both Buxton and Kirilloff are 6'-2". Polanco is a tad over 5'-11". So it is all whether the Twins want to use Polanco there. Buxton pitched in high school sometimes but has otherwise always played in the outfield. Jorge knows the infield as well as anyone, so if this is a consideration I'm sure he Polanco will be decent there.

Personally, I'm hoping Alex Kirilloff hits all year for the Twins as he did for the Saints. The procedure he had should be fully healed with all rehab and strengthening finished before Spring Training. This could be the first time AK begins the year in full health since 2018 when he was returning from Tommy John surgery.