Game Thread: Twins v Red Sox, 4/20 @ 12:35pm CT

[RpR]

Twins need fielders with STRONG arms, which Larnach and Gordon do not have at this point.

[chpettit19]

1 minute ago, USAFChief said:

What? The Twins should give a player a role based not on play but on contract incentives?

I'm sorry but this is ridiculous. 

 

1 minute ago, Jocko87 said:

They gave him every opportunity to start and they lost a year and a half to TJ.  Free agents know its a business too.

This is his 3rd start. If you're a FA starter and they want to tie incentives to your # of starts and the team says "every opportunity to start" is 3 starts you're hanging up and never answer their call again. 

I'm sorry you think 2 starts is enough to change a player's role. It's not hard to see why fans aren't running teams.

[Aggies7]

This is getting ugly 

[jkcarew]

6 minutes ago, CoastiePilot08 said:

Makes you wonder if Pagan should have had the 10th on Tuesday. 
 

be going for the sweep today. 

I'm thinking the series would be 1-1, and Moran would be pitching right now.

[MMMordabito]

7 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Wonderful way to attract free agents, and negotiate deals with incentives in them in the future. Tell players "it's business so damn to your incentives." Team building 101 there.

The Twins didn't negotiate the incentives in that deal. The Dodgers did.

[Aggies7]

Don’t the red Sox have a washed up reliever they could throw in? Calvin schraldi?

[chpettit19]

2 minutes ago, MMMordabito said:

The Twins didn't negotiate the incentives in that deal. The Dodgers did.

So? The Twins knew the incentives when they acquired him. Players care about money. They want their money. And if their money is tied to something the team doesn't allow you to achieve it sends a message to other players that the team may want to attract later. Pretending players don't take note of how players are treated when it comes to incentives is ignoring reality.

[stringer bell]

Emilio may be who thought he is. 

[MABB1959]

20 minutes ago, umterp23 said:

I guess Buxton is exhausted for actually having to run or jog a base or two couple times in last 6 days.  Treating him with kid gloves is quite pathetic.  At some point when will the Nick "one year wonder" Gordon experiment get pulled.  No options sure, but at least you can find a buyer that will give you a low level prospect.  Flash Gordon's bulb doesn't shine brightly this year.

Castro while a nice story should be odd man out when Polanco and Farmer are both back on the club and Julien could stay if they move Castro and Gordon.  I know I would. Julien while playing everyday in AAA would be nice, rather have him on bench that can give a jolt into the ball vs other two.  More upside with him

 

The Kepler sitation reminds me of the Dozier situation.  Kept waiting for him to heat up.  I think he is done like Dozier was?  The Gordon situation is heartbreaking but what are they waiting for expectin?

[USAFChief]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

 

This is his 3rd start. If you're a FA starter and they want to tie incentives to your # of starts and the team says "every opportunity to start" is 3 starts you're hanging up and never answer their call again. 

I'm sorry you think 2 starts is enough to change a player's role. It's not hard to see why fans aren't running teams.

Giving someone more than 3 starts based on current and/or past performance has absolutely NOTHING in common with giving players roles based on contract incentives, which was your original point

Sorry, you're just flat wrong here. 

You play to win, not give players chances to earn incentives. 

[Aggies7]

Didn’t think we’d lose 2/3 to these bums

[RpR]

Pagan has given up more hits this inning than he did in his previous six games, when it rains it pours or some similar clishe'.

[RpR]

1 minute ago, Aggies7 said:

Don’t the red Sox have a washed up reliever they could throw in? Calvin schraldi?

Who on this day would strike out the side.

[Kummel]

Yikes.

[Bamboo Bat]

Pagan needs to be released. Before this inning is over. Good lord, he's awful. 

 

[Taildragger8791]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

So? The Twins knew the incentives when they acquired him. Players care about money. They want their money. And if their money is tied to something the team doesn't allow you to achieve it sends a message to other players that the team may want to attract later. Pretending players don't take note of how players are treated when it comes to incentives is ignoring reality.

Incentives are there to be earned. If his performance doesn't dictate the right playing time to hit those incentives then that's on the player. The team has given him all the rope he could reasonably expect. He physically isn't holding up to a starting role.

[HawksNest]

Holy meltdown!

[Aggies7]

So which position player will be pitching today?

[Parfigliano]

3 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

Emilio may be who thought he is. 

Never doubted that.

[MABB1959]

32 minutes ago, James said:

They loaded the lineup with lefthanded batters. Buxton might be in later. 

I don't think it is paying off.  Need to get back to playing with gut feelings instead of projected stats.

[bighat]

Pagan is such garbage. Twins are going to let him wear it. 

Looks like Rocco's already thinking about tomorrow, Twins going to get just stuffed into a locker on their way out of town. Demoralizing series in Beantown, only able to get hits of the skeleton of Corey Kluber. 

I think the Twins' leadoff hitter has struck out to lead off the past 6 games or something incredible like that. 

 

[James]

 

[RpR]

Just now, Aggies7 said:

So which position player will be pitching today?

All of them.

[tony&rodney]

Something that is almost impossible to quantify much less explain is how some pitchers can have a plethora of good pitches yet their pitches seemingly manage to find the opponents's barrels. Emilio Pagan is such a victim. He has proven that definitively throughout his career and makes a significant salary serving up meatballs. He may be a great guy, a wonderful teammate, and have numerous impressive pitches, but his lot in life is to be that guy (pitcher) who gets hit hard.

[James]

2 minutes ago, Aggies7 said:

So which position player will be pitching today?

Yes

[Aggies7]

Nice little 1-5 stretch after the emotional comeback win in the Bronx 

[Dman]

Yeah this game is over.  Houck looks ready to go 7 innings and we have a reliever that can't even get out of one inning.  I think Pagan needs to go.  Just can't trust his stuff in any way shape or form.  Headrick took care of three innings of these guys only giving up one run.  They are better off using pretty much almost anyone else.  He just doesn't have the stuff to get the job done.

[MMMordabito]

1 minute ago, chpettit19 said:

So? The Twins new the incentives when they acquired him. Players care about money. They want their money. And if their money is tied to something the team doesn't allow you to achieve it sends a message to other players that the team may want to attract later. Pretending players don't take note of how players are treated when it comes to incentives is ignoring reality.

It's quite the outlier of a contract.  I doubt any agents are using it as a blueprint.  I'm not too worried.  I doubt anyone is going to look at the Twins as manipulators when looking at the circumstances surrounding Maeda (older, TJ-comeback, not really holding up very well even before the liner off the leg).

[nicksaviking]

17 minutes ago, chpettit19 said:

Wonderful way to attract free agents, and negotiate deals with incentives in them in the future. Tell players "it's business so damn to your incentives." Team building 101 there.

The Twins didn't negotiate incentives, the Dodgers did.

And the Dodgers clearly didn't give a damn about them seeing as he was a regular in their bullpen.

I honestly don't think any free agents would want to come to Minnesota if they thought the Twins would put together a less competitive team to appease inferior teammates.

[wavedog]

Too bad for Pagan that Chang couldn't bat 3 times in a row.     I think we have seen enough of Pagan - time for a DFA