Article: Deadline Deal: Twins Trade Brian Dozier to Dodgers

[akmanak]

Falvey was quoted during the Twins game about the amount of prospects we got and how they will come into play during the offseason. I believe he is going to make some big moves.

[h2oface]

 

Somebody should inform this announcer that the Dodgers haven't won anything since the Reagan years.

 

Well, just since 2013, they have won 5 consecutive NL West Division titles (winning 92, 94, 92, 91, and 104 regular season games - and they won 3 more Division titles in the aughts and two NLDS plus a wild card ticket to an NLDS), 3 NLDS, and 1 NLCS, and were pretty damn close to winning the World Series last year, only losing 4 games to 3. You can't get much closer than that. I wouldn't call that not winning anything. And they are gearing up for a playoff run this year, with some great moves at the deadline. Those aren't alternate facts, but history.

 

I would take that run for the Twins in the next five years (6 counting this TBD year) in a heartbeat. Hell, I would even take winning one post season series for a start. Even one. Just one.

Edited August 1, 2018 by h2oface

[jimmer]

 

Well, just since 2013, they have won 5 consecutive NL West Division titles (winning 92, 94, 92, 91, and 104 regular season games - and they won 3 more Division titles in the aughts and two NLDS plus a wild card ticket to an NLDS), 3 NLDS, and 1 NLCS, and were pretty damn close to winning the World Series last year, only losing 4 games to 3. You can't get much closer than that. I wouldn't call that not winning anything. And they are gearing up for a playoff run this year, with some great moves at the deadline. Those aren't alternate facts, but history.

 

I would take that run for the Twins in the next five years (6 counting this TBD year) in a heartbeat. Hell, I would even take winning one post season series for a start. Even one. Just one.

Yeah,exactly. Fans in glass houses...

[Otto von Ballpark]

Somebody should inform this announcer that the Dodgers haven't won anything since the Reagan years.

Yeah, and the Twins won it all as recently as the Bush years!*

 

* Okay, the earlier Bush years.**

 

** Not the current "Billy Bush" years either, no.

[Otto von Ballpark]

I believe you, but for the website, I think it's really close to 100%

100% here think that "they should have gotten so much more for an asset like Dozier"?

 

If you believe that, I just wish you were in charge of estimating the Twins playoffs odds too!

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

There should be absolutely no push back to using prospects in trades in order to acquire better players next year. None. They have 30+ players that grade out C or better.

 

You can ask, but the other team can (and usually will) say no. Other than Pressley, these deals were pretty much take it or leave it.... and even then, no way we could have packaged someone like Gonsalves in there to get a top 100 guy. That only works if the guy you have is a hot commodity and the team trading for him happens to need some near ML ready pitching in the high minors. 

 

The amusing thing behind this is that Dozier himself was never much better than a C+ prospect if I remember right.

[laloesch]

 

I'd like to a see a link to this speculation about Dozier complaining about not getting an extension. He signed the deal he signed so that he could test FA this offseason.

 

That was very public.

 

See the quoted text in my previous post.  Article by Jim Souhan back in March. 

Do you want me to do a song and a dance too?

 

http://www.startribune.com/brian-dozier-sounds-willing-to-walk-away-from-twins-after-season/475776713/

 

if you don't call that whining i don't know what is.   

 

 

Edited August 1, 2018 by laloesch

[Blackjack]

It sure would be fun to be a fly on the wall in the GM's office, listening in on the trade talk conversations.  Who makes the first call?  The seller or buyer?  Who makes the first offer? How many times do they talk before a trade is consummated?  how many trades are discussed that never get made? It would be interesting....

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

See the quoted text in my previous post.  Article by Jim Souhan back in March. 

Do you want me to do a song and a dance too?

 

http://www.startribune.com/brian-dozier-sounds-willing-to-walk-away-from-twins-after-season/475776713/

 

if you don't call that whining i don't know what is.   

 

I don't call that whining.. he was asked a question and answered it. It certainly doesn't portray the sulking/bad attitude that people are claiming he has.

 

I'll admit that this is the first time I've seen anything indicating he wanted to stay. As I said before, it was quite public that he didn't want his FA years bought out when he signed that extension. Them's the breaks. That's the risk he took.

[Vanimal46]

You can ask, but the other team can (and usually will) say no. Other than Pressley, these deals were pretty much take it or leave it.... and even then, no way we could have packaged someone like Gonsalves in there to get a top 100 guy. That only works if the guy you have is a hot commodity and the team trading for him happens to need some near ML ready pitching in the high minors.

 

The amusing thing behind this is that Dozier himself was never much better than a C+ prospect if I remember right.

My thought when I typed that is if the Twins find themselves in contention in 2019 they should be the ones trading for rentals. We don't always have to be the team to sell pending FAs.

[Dman]

 

Logan.200

 

We needed another Logan that is a black hole at the plate this year.

Dodgers needed to keep under the luxury tax limit.

 

Dozier gets to be in the playoffs, probably. My bet is he takes off and really benefits the Dodgers and his own upcoming free agency. This is a win/win/lose trade. Dodgers win. Dozier wins. Twins lose.

 

But hey.... the low level prospects fill rosters in the farm. Farm out. Far out. The maybes and maybe nots.  

 

So how exactly do the Twins win?  By not trading him and letting him go for nothing?  What is your logic for Twins lose?  It was a take it or leave it deal for a guy who is massively under-performing and could  not get hot to save his soul this year.  They got what they could.  If they had found a better deal I am sure they would have taken it but Dozier did them no favors this last few weeks.

 

I do agree the Dodgers win because they have a plan to platoon Dozier playing him against left handed pitching which is a strength of his and weakness for their team.  It would have been nice to extract more for Dozier but what would you pay in prospects for two months of a platoon player?  I am guessing not much and that is exactly what they got.  At least they have a lottery ticket.  The more they collect the better the odds of one of them working out.  That's a win for me.

[gocgo]

I don't know if the guys they got back will ever pan out.  What I do know was that the sunshine pump was in high gear last night on the radio.  Let me summarize what Derek Falvey said:

 

...toughest part of my job...blah blah blah...took the best deals we could get...blah blah blah...high upside...blah blah blah...successful future...power arm...power bat...blah blah blah...high expectations for the rest of the season...blah blah blah...competitive team on the field...blah blah blah...we'll see what free agency in the offseason brings...blah...blah...blah.

 

I think that about covers it.

[laloesch]

Sometimes the best deals are addition by subtraction. 

Edited August 1, 2018 by laloesch

[Vanimal46]

I don't know if the guys they got back will ever pan out. What I do know was that the sunshine pump was in high gear last night on the radio. Let me summarize what Derek Falvey said:

 

...toughest part of my job...blah blah blah...took the best deals we could get...blah blah blah...high upside...blah blah blah...successful future...power arm...power bat...blah blah blah...high expectations for the rest of the season...blah blah blah...competitive team on the field...blah blah blah...we'll see what free agency in the offseason brings...blah...blah...blah.

 

I think that about covers it.

Did they talk about SPIN RATE?!

[Monkeypaws]

 

When was the last time the Twins made a move were they traded multiple prospects for an established player?  

 

The only one I can remember is Midre Cummings and Denny Neagle for John Smiley, 1992. 

 

It is rare with this team.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I don't know if the guys they got back will ever pan out.  What I do know was that the sunshine pump was in high gear last night on the radio.  Let me summarize what Derek Falvey said:

 

...toughest part of my job...blah blah blah...took the best deals we could get...blah blah blah...high upside...blah blah blah...successful future...power arm...power bat...blah blah blah...high expectations for the rest of the season...blah blah blah...competitive team on the field...blah blah blah...we'll see what free agency in the offseason brings...blah...blah...blah.

 

I think that about covers it.

Don't forget "sustainable championship contender!"

[alarp33]

 

I don't know if the guys they got back will ever pan out.  What I do know was that the sunshine pump was in high gear last night on the radio.  Let me summarize what Derek Falvey said:

 

...toughest part of my job...blah blah blah...took the best deals we could get...blah blah blah...high upside...blah blah blah...successful future...power arm...power bat...blah blah blah...high expectations for the rest of the season...blah blah blah...competitive team on the field...blah blah blah...we'll see what free agency in the offseason brings...blah...blah...blah.

 

I think that about covers it.

 

I'm curious what exactly you expected him to say? "Yeah Dozier really sucked this year which in turn made our team a non contender and took away any value he may have had"

 

I'm guessing he also woud've been ripped on here by the folks who thought a 7-10 game deficit to Cleveland was nothing had he not spoken publicly

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

When was the last time the Twins made a move were they traded multiple prospects for an established player?

They did trade two guys for Kevin Jepsen in 2015.

[USAFChief]

See the quoted text in my previous post. Article by Jim Souhan back in March.

Do you want me to do a song and a dance too?

 

http://www.startribune.com/brian-dozier-sounds-willing-to-walk-away-from-twins-after-season/475776713/

 

if you don't call that whining i don't know what is.

heh... this is the exact OPPOSITE of whining.

[slash129]

 

I don't know if the guys they got back will ever pan out.  What I do know was that the sunshine pump was in high gear last night on the radio.  Let me summarize what Derek Falvey said:

 

...toughest part of my job...blah blah blah...took the best deals we could get...blah blah blah...high upside...blah blah blah...successful future...power arm...power bat...blah blah blah...high expectations for the rest of the season...blah blah blah...competitive team on the field...blah blah blah...we'll see what free agency in the offseason brings...blah...blah...blah.

 

I think that about covers it.

 

It's part of Falvine's job to sell this team to the fans.  From the lowest level of the minors to the latest big league acquistions, they are always going to present the best possible spin.  As an example, Falvey's comments on Logan Forsythe reflect that more than anything else.  I'm 95% sure that Forsythe was part of the deal due to the Dodgers current payroll proximity to the luxury tax limit, but Falvey went with how much they liked Forsythe. Getting cynical or judging the FO based on comments made during an inning in the broadcast booth is basically the same as judging a house on the market because of some cheap faux wood blinds that were put up before an open house.  

 

If Forsythe is offered as an FA, then a big plate of crow will be what I deserve.

 

 

[gocgo]

 

I'm curious what exactly you expected him to say? "Yeah Dozier really sucked this year which in turn made our team a non contender and took away any value he may have had"

 

I'm guessing he also woud've been ripped on here by the folks who thought a 7-10 game deficit to Cleveland was nothing had he not spoken publicly

No, you certainly don't put down Dozier and I know that they have to put the positive spin on everything, but talking about putting a great product on the field while your clearly selling is stretching it pretty far.  If he would have said that we are looking forward to seeing what some of the young guys have to offer to assess offseason needs, that's fair.  That's honest.  Pulling out the sunshine pump and saying that we will be competitive while unloading some of our best players is just lying to the fans. 

[alarp33]

 

No, you certainly don't put down Dozier and I know that they have to put the positive spin on everything, but talking about putting a great product on the field while your clearly selling is stretching it pretty far.  If he would have said that we are looking forward to seeing what some of the young guys have to offer to assess offseason needs, that's fair.  That's honest.  Pulling out the sunshine pump and saying that we will be competitive while unloading some of our best players is just lying to the fans. 

 

I think you're looking for a reason to be mad at him and grasping at straws. He got out in front of it and was honest in my opinion. I'm not sure why you need him to come out and say the exact words "were packing it in this season", weren't the 5 trades enough?  I found him to be fairly candid and enjoyed hearing about some of the prospects. 

[Number3]

I have absolutely no curiosity about anything the Twins do at this point for the foreseeable future. They have totally wasted the past 9 years since 2010 and NOW they go into rebuild mode.

I am curious to see how Dozier does in a truly competitive environment where the team and fans actually have high expectations. That should be interesting. Pressure is one thing he never had to worry about playing for the Twins.

[alarp33]

 

I have absolutely no curiosity about anything the Twins do at this point for the foreseeable future. They have totally wasted the past 9 years since 2010 and NOW they go into rebuild mode.

 

 

Who is "they"? You understand the Twins Front office has only been on the job since November 2016?

 

Also, since when does trading 4 expiring contracts and a 29 year old reliever who had 1 year left constitute "rebuild mode"

Edited August 1, 2018 by alarp33

[twinfan]

My take on the trades. I would not have traded Escobar who was valuable for the many positions he plays and as a decent hitter. I would have signed him for 2 years if they even made an offer. The others were expendable, though Lynn also could have been made an offer. He missed Spring training and thus was bad in the first month but decent after that (except for a recent slump that they all go through). It would not surprise me to see him do much better- especially next year. Dozier was really expendable because, even though he hits a lot of home runs, he is making too much money. I never really liked Duke but he was effective after a slow start. It seems we got a few possible decent hitters and one pitcher who could make an impact down the road. As with all trades, we won't know until a year or two. Our minor leagues are not doing well overall and do not seem to be able to give us anyone for next year at this time. Just my take. 

[alarp33]

 

My take on the trades. I would not have traded Escobar who was valuable for the many positions he plays and as a decent hitter. I would have signed him for 2 years if they even made an offer. The others were expendable, though Lynn also could have been made an offer. He missed Spring training and thus was bad in the first month but decent after that (except for a recent slump that they all go through). It would not surprise me to see him do much better- especially next year. 

 

Just to be clear, as it seems lots are forgetting this. Lynn and Escobar can certainly still be made an offer in November

[ThejacKmp]

 

I would have signed him for 2 years if they even made an offer.

 

They made him an offer. In the month leading up to the trade, they talked to him about an extension. Reasonably, he was not interested since he can hit free agency for the first time and should have some suitors. Unless the Twins blew him away (hard since he was at peak value), he's unlikely to take it.

 

Also, you're likely delusional if you think Escobar is signing a two year extension. He will be looking for a long-term deal of at least 3-4 years. I think any extension would have had to be 3 years $36 million. The Twins are wise to see if he keeps up this hot year and how the market develops. There are other 3B out there (Machado, Moose) and they may be able to get a better deal in the offseason.

 

Plus they get the prospects they traded him for, who were not insignificant.

[twinfan]

 

I'm curious what exactly you expected him to say? "Yeah Dozier really sucked this year which in turn made our team a non contender and took away any value he may have had"

 

I'm guessing he also woud've been ripped on here by the folks who thought a 7-10 game deficit to Cleveland was nothing had he not spoken publicly

 

Dozier was, by far, NOT the reason the Twins have lagged behind. Try Sano, Buxton, Lynn (especially early), Santana's absense, continual failures of middle relievers and Morrison. They are the real reasons we are not in contention. Dozier was hot early but his numbers are only a little bit short of his lifetime averages.

[ThejacKmp]

 

I have absolutely no curiosity about anything the Twins do at this point for the foreseeable future. They have totally wasted the past 9 years since 2010 and NOW they go into rebuild mode.

I am curious to see how Dozier does in a truly competitive environment where the team and fans actually have high expectations. That should be interesting. Pressure is one thing he never had to worry about playing for the Twins.

 

The pessimism of TD is astounding. A week ago everyone wanted to blow it up. Now they're mad it's blown up and call it a rebuild. This is why I regularly take weeks off from this site (why do I come back? I can't quit you!)

 

No reason the Twins won't be competitive next year. They have massive payroll space, interesting young players (including Kepler, Buxton, and Sano - all of whom are young enough to bounce back), and play in a still-weak division (and the Indians will be worse next year as they lose Miller and Allen).

 

This is not even a retool. It's just realism. They weren't going to win, they got a nice haul and they're ready to go for it again next year and beyond.

[twinfan]

 

They made him an offer. In the month leading up to the trade, they talked to him about an extension. Reasonably, he was not interested since he can hit free agency for the first time and should have some suitors. Unless the Twins blew him away (hard since he was at peak value), he's unlikely to take it.

 

Also, you're likely delusional if you think Escobar is signing a two year extension. He will be looking for a long-term deal of at least 3-4 years. I think any extension would have had to be 3 years $36 million. The Twins are wise to see if he keeps up this hot year and how the market develops. There are other 3B out there (Machado, Moose) and they may be able to get a better deal in the offseason.

 

Plus they get the prospects they traded him for, who were not insignificant.

 

My doctor (a Yankees fan) also thinks I'm delusional for rooting for the Twins. I think Machado wants to play short but we probably won't spend THAT kind of money. We'll see (and I'll keep rooting for the Twins).