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POLL: Grade the Deadline


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  1. 1. How would you say the Twins did?



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To be more specific, I'd probably give them a B-. They did a very good job with Cruz and Berríos but missed with lower wattage moves, particularly Pineda. I don't see a reason why Pineda couldn't bring back an interesting prospect in the low minors.

I'm giving them a fair amount of slack on Kepler or Donaldson, as the position player market looked really weak yesterday and there's no reason to trade Kepler if the return isn't good. I doubt they even had a real shot to move Donaldson given the rest of the market.

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B+  I think they traded away the guy the knew they couldn't sign.  They also got return for two of the horrible free agent signings.  And, two good prospect arms for Cruz.  We also save money for free agency in 2022 since we don't have to go through arb with Berrios.  The pipeline is now full of good arms.  I am optimistic about the future, maybe even 2022 as long as the FO does a better job with free agents.  Still a decent remaining group of of vets, and a very good core of young position players.  Time will tell if the gaps can be filled properly.

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I gave them a B+.  They hit on the two big trades, but failed to deal Pineda.  They somehow managed to deal Happ though.

That said, I think they did really well on the two important trades.  That's a much bigger deal for the franchise.

It would be nice to see them pivot and extend Pineda now.

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I’ll elaborate my opinion on it because why not

Them getting a prospect for Happ is mind-boggling. That prospect is basically for free, kind of like the Vikings getting 2 thirds basically for free this past draft.

Sad to see Berrios go, but they got a haul back for him. Good job there.

Like Happ, getting a prospect for Robles is basically a free prospect.

I also like the haul they got for Cruz.

But how did they not deal Pineda? There was no reason not to.

All and all, I have good first impressions of it. I more wait to grade it until I see how everything unfolds.

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2 minutes ago, twins_89 said:

I give the team a straight B for the trade deadline. The moves they made were good, but being unable to move Pineda, Simmons, and Colome reduces the grade.  

Those two players are so bad that teams probably weren’t going to give up a player with more than one year left to get them. The Happ trade is an exception.

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I gave them an A.  They got overpays for Cruz, Berrios, and Happ.  If Simmons could have hit a baseball the last two to three weeks they likely could have gotten something for him as well.  Donaldson was always a long shot and they still could trade him in the offseason if they think that is the right thing to do.  There was no real pressure for them to trade him at the deadline absent a good deal.

I have to believe Pineda didn't get dealt for a reason. There were several teams who could have used him.  I think the FO wants him back next year so if they didn't get an overpay they were not going to move him. Obviously they didn't like the offers so they didn't move him.  Maeda and Pineda can anchor the rotation with a good FA signing or two they should have 5th starter covered between Ober, Jax and Ryan.  Maybe Dobnak is still in there as well.  Keeping Pineda gives them more stability going into the offseason.  If they hadn't dealt Berrios I am guessing they would have moved Pineda.

Hard for me to criticize who they didn't deal.  They got overpays for most all their deals so hard to see why that wouldn't be an A.  I mean getting something for Happ should technically make it an A right there.  If overpays are not enough to give them an A then I don't think they are ever going to get an A because you can always come up with scenarios of what they could have done.  What they did do was really good and I think it deserves an A.

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Considering Faucher was the only throw-in prospect they lost, kudos to the Twins. They managed to move Robles who has been horrible going into the deadline. They managed to get something for Happ, a guy who had one more start with the Twins before going away, even if the Twins had to include some cash.

All the other names? Donaldson would be a great pickup for anyone, if they had a spare $25m laying around. There were so many other outfielders NOT named Kepler. Simmons could've been packaged with someone the Twins MIGHT NOT be able to protect come the Fall, but there was no one needing his services that wasn't replaceable within their own ranks, period.

 

Was really surprised on Pineda. Except that there are further suspension or injury fears with the guy for the remainder of the season. Was the Twins asking price too high? At least, keeping him, we get to see if he IS worth keeping for his benefit to the clubhouse! Which can be BIG!

 

I am more curious to see how the Twins handle the need to play ANYONE not on contract to possibly return NEXT season, come September. They have the opportunity to use it as a try out for some maybees trolling in AAA ball, get some advance looks (and experience) for folks who could break camp, or egt an early callup.

 

Waiting to see if the Fall League happens and who the 3-5 are that go that way.

 

Plus the list of six year free agents vs. guys needing Rule 5 protection. The Twins can still have 7-9 open spots on the 40-man going into the November deadline. I would like to see at least four of the names added and getting play in September.

 

I'm going to give them an A! If you kept Berrios for another season, paid him $10m, made a qualifying offer, and got a draft pick...well, basically the Twins saved $10m, got a draftpick the Jays paid $7 million to sign, something the Twins would probably never ever do. And the guy (and corresponding pitcher) are fast-tracked in the system. They could see service come 2022 if you don't worry about adding them to life too soon.

Plus, the Twins will continue to be BAD for the year, which means they get a much higher draft pick next season. So, there can still be a plus in that as they manage to still draw 20,000+ folks a game to see outdoor baseball.

 

 

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I give them an A. I also am only grading the moves they did make. With Berrios leaving I think they had to keep Big Mike, plus I bet they resign him because he will take a reasonable deal based on his past decisions and the missed time again this year. If you trade him you are very unlikely to resign him next year. With Maeda and Pineda you actually have a chance to fill a rotation next year and be the dark horse that stuns the Sox!

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I'd go B+. I would have liked them to move on from Donaldson (mostly so they could use the savings to invest in pitching and open up a spot for Miranda) and would have thought moving Pineda would have brought a good return for a guy who is a FA next year. But I'm increasingly thinking they plan to bring back Pineda to give another anchor for the pitching staff, so it bothers me less. Really thought Rogers was going to get moved; I'm guessing the injury shut down getting the return they thought he was worth, and I approve of not letting teams take advantage of us or starting a true fire sale.

I like the return from Cruz & Berrios a lot. I like that we got rid of Happ and got something, anything. I would have preferred to keep Berrios and extend him, but he's just not interested in an extension and I think on the FA market we'd struggle to sign him. The starting point is going to be Wheeler money, IMHO, and even if the team is ok with that kind of number...someone else could easily kick in another $5-10M or more to take him away. I might have kept him anyways, but this return was excellent because I really like Martin. I'm not buying that his power will never develop, and I think he's going to make the people downgrading him for not hitting for power in his first professional season while dealing with a hand injury are going to look very very dumb.

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I have them a B. I think they got two pitchers that could start, two that could be relief pitchers, and a great hitting prospect.  The fact they got anything for Happ and Robles, and a bit of money is amazing. 

I like they kept Pineda, and I know not everyone agrees on the importance of mentoring.....

I love they still have Buxton. 

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Having had a bit if time to let all this settle--the return the Twins got can't be honestly evaluated for another season or two. I know the FO doesn't have the luxury of saying that when they make the moves, but we can! Prospects...especially pitchers are volatile. More miss than make. So we'll see.

I know that having Cruz for another 2 months was a luxury that Twins weren't willing to keep. Other than the fun of seeing him in 'our' uniform everyday, it did make sense to get something for him since Twins are going nowhere this year.

Berrios made it pretty clear he wanted to move on so that trade also sadly, made sense. (he was well received in Toronto and pitched very well today to get the win...something that eluded him over the last month he was here.) The other guys who got traded totally deserved to go.

For me the biggest 'plus' were the trades we didn't make...particularly Buxton, Polanco, Donaldson and yes Pineda (since Berrios is gone)

Shame they couldn't offload Simmons, Colome, and frankly just about anyone else in the bullpen. But we have the offseason for that. Twins aren't going to win a lot of games going forward..so its clearly audition time!

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B+.  They did a fantastic job in the Happ, Berrios, and Cruz deals.  They got an interesting guy for Robles too.  

Where I ding them just a bit is in not getting rid of Simmons and for potentially falling short on other deals by their unwillingness to include money to get deals done.  It sounds like that was a consistent issue with Donaldson trades.  Maybe it was right not to deal JD, but not because of an unwillingness to move cash.

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11 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

Where I ding them just a bit is in not getting rid of Simmons and for potentially falling short on other deals by their unwillingness to include money to get deals done.  It sounds like that was a consistent issue with Donaldson trades.  Maybe it was right not to deal JD, but not because of an unwillingness to move cash.

With Bryant not moving until the eleventh hour and the general squishiness of the position player market, I wonder if there was a real opportunity to move Donaldson at all.

I don't have any real problems with them keeping any specific player but I would have liked to see them move one more bigger name, probably either Kepler or Donaldson.

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13 hours ago, TheLeviathan said:

B+.  They did a fantastic job in the Happ, Berrios, and Cruz deals.  They got an interesting guy for Robles too.  

Where I ding them just a bit is in not getting rid of Simmons and for potentially falling short on other deals by their unwillingness to include money to get deals done.  It sounds like that was a consistent issue with Donaldson trades.  Maybe it was right not to deal JD, but not because of an unwillingness to move cash.

I did not see the rumors that the issue was them not sending cash with Donaldson.  Got a link?  I would liked to have seen Donaldson moved too and there were a lot of deals that included cash.  They needed to go with the flow.  Maybe I am too optimistic about Miranda but he has been a beast and even better at AAA.  It seems like they are playing it half-way. and I don't generally like that approach but it might make sense in theis specific case.  They might be thinking they will be able to move him anytime if they are willing to cover a portion of this salary.  This way they can get a look at Ober / Ryan / Winder the rest of this year.  If they look good that positions us not just in terms of pitching but flexibility in payroll.  Maybe they take a crack at one of the FA SSs.  Who knows.  Maybe they are thinking the return will be better if the DH is adopted in the NL.

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6 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

With Bryant not moving until the eleventh hour and the general squishiness of the position player market, I wonder if there was a real opportunity to move Donaldson at all.

I don't have any real problems with them keeping any specific player but I would have liked to see them move one more bigger name, probably either Kepler or Donaldson.

Me either, I just don't like what I read here@Major League Ready Now, if the return stunk even with money, fine, but if they turned down a good move over a few million bucks I'd be a little irritated.  

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23 minutes ago, TheLeviathan said:

Me either, I just don't like what I read here@Major League Ready Now, if the return stunk even with money, fine, but if they turned down a good move over a few million bucks I'd be a little irritated.  

A bit of an aside but the analysis on Berríos is pretty terrible there:

Quote

He averages 1.1 HR/9 over the last 4 seasons and currently holds a career ERA of 4.08. Those numbers don’t match up with the stuff. I’d be able to look past it a bit, or at least understand it more, if he was playing in a hitters park. However, Minnesota’s Target Field is a pitcher’s park.

1. Target Field has been roughly neutral for years, as far as I'm aware.

2. Using Berríos' career ERA is just lazy. 4.08 career ERA. If you remove that atrocious rookie campaign, it drops to 3.82. If you look at only the last three seasons, it's 3.61 (which is a 120 ERA+).

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On 7/31/2021 at 4:48 PM, cHawk said:

Those two players are so bad that teams probably weren’t going to give up a player with more than one year left to get them. The Happ trade is an exception.

Simmons and Colome are both players with some reputation.  I would be surprised if no one called about them and offered a prospect.  

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