José Berríos Traded to Blue Jays

[Dodecahedron]

[h2oface]

2 minutes ago, AceWrigley said:

Holy moly, the White Sox just picked up Craig Kimbrel from the Cubs.

Kimbrel in an up year for the stretch. With getting their injured young stars back... they could be real dangerous in the playoffs.

[AceWrigley]

5 minutes ago, Dodecahedron said:

Some people realize the good things in life early on.

[AceWrigley]

Both Buxton and Josh Donaldson are being shopped by the Twins, MLB.com’s Mark Feinsand tweets.

[prouster]

I’m curious how people think the rotation will shake out next year. Right now we’re looking at:

1. Maeda

2. ?

3. ?

4. ?

5. ?

 

I’d assume Barnes and Ober might slot into a couple of those places. If I was calling the shots, I’d bring up Balazovic in September and toss him in the deep end next spring. I can see why others wouldn’t, though. So we might be looking at something like:

Maeda

Ober

Barnes

? (Balazovic)

?

 

Ryan, the other Tampa pitcher, Dobnak, Smeltzer, Winder, and Thorpe will probably be in the mix. By my estimation, they’ll need to bring in at least two established starting pitchers. Pineda is a good candidate. I’d like to see them package a couple of these prospects for another. Means in Baltimore would be a guy to check on. I’d also ask the Rays if they’d part with Glasnow. He has 2.5 years before free agency and is spending at least one of those on the IL. 

[Mike Sixel]

1 minute ago, prouster said:

I’m curious how people think the rotation will shake out next year. Right now we’re looking at:

1. Maeda

2. ?

3. ?

4. ?

5. ?

 

I’d assume Barnes and Ober might slot into a couple of those places. If I was calling the shots, I’d bring up Balazovic in September and toss him in the deep end next spring. I can see why others wouldn’t, though. So we might be looking at something like:

Maeda

Ober

Barnes

? (Balazovic)

?

 

Ryan, the other Tampa pitcher, Dobnak, Smeltzer, Winder, and Thorpe will probably be in the mix. By my estimation, they’ll need to bring in at least two established starting pitchers. Pineda is a good candidate. I’d like to see them package a couple of these prospects for another. Means in Baltimore would be a guy to check on. I’d also ask the Rays if they’d part with Glasnow. He has 2.5 years before free agency and is spending at least one of those on the IL. 

I'd call up every young guy that they think could start next year for 2-3 games. Get their feet wet.

100% they sign a guy like Pineda or better as a FA, imo. Unless they blow up the team. I also think we'll see a trade for a guy with 2+ years of control left. 

Ryan, Ober, Dobnak, Winder and Balazovic will all pitch for MN next year, but only 2 will start the year in MN, imo. I've been suggesting Means for a few weeks now. They have the depth to do that.

[prouster]

3 minutes ago, prouster said:

I’m curious how people think the rotation will shake out next year. Right now we’re looking at:

1. Maeda

2. ?

3. ?

4. ?

5. ?

 

I’d assume Barnes and Ober might slot into a couple of those places. If I was calling the shots, I’d bring up Balazovic in September and toss him in the deep end next spring. I can see why others wouldn’t, though. So we might be looking at something like:

Maeda

Ober

Barnes

? (Balazovic)

?

 

Ryan, the other Tampa pitcher, Dobnak, Smeltzer, Winder, and Thorpe will probably be in the mix. By my estimation, they’ll need to bring in at least two established starting pitchers. Pineda is a good candidate. I’d like to see them package a couple of these prospects for another. Means in Baltimore would be a guy to check on. I’d also ask the Rays if they’d part with Glasnow. He has 2.5 years before free agency and is spending at least one of those on the IL. 

Lol, I shouldn’t speak too soon. Heyman says they’re listening to offers on Maeda. 

[Mike Sixel]

1 minute ago, prouster said:

Lol, I shouldn’t speak too soon. Heyman says they’re listening to offers on Maeda. 

I would hate that more than you can imagine. 

[prouster]

2 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I would hate that more than you can imagine. 

It would sure complicate the question of who starts games next year. 

[h2oface]

13 minutes ago, AceWrigley said:

Both Buxton and Josh Donaldson are being shopped by the Twins, MLB.com’s Mark Feinsand tweets.

Now shopping Maeda, too. A team full of strangers, coming up. 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/07/byron-buxton-trade-rumors-twins-phillies.html

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

1 minute ago, Mike Sixel said:

I would hate that more than you can imagine. 

Then you know how it feels! 

The way this front office operates, it feels way too much like Minnesota Twins: The Board Game™

 

[Squirrel]

10 minutes ago, prouster said:

I’m curious how people think the rotation will shake out next year. Right now we’re looking at:

1. Maeda

2. ?

3. ?

4. ?

5. ?

 

I’d assume Barnes and Ober might slot into a couple of those places. If I was calling the shots, I’d bring up Balazovic in September and toss him in the deep end next spring. I can see why others wouldn’t, though. So we might be looking at something like:

Maeda

Ober

Barnes

? (Balazovic)

?

 

Ryan, the other Tampa pitcher, Dobnak, Smeltzer, Winder, and Thorpe will probably be in the mix. By my estimation, they’ll need to bring in at least two established starting pitchers. Pineda is a good candidate. I’d like to see them package a couple of these prospects for another. Means in Baltimore would be a guy to check on. I’d also ask the Rays if they’d part with Glasnow. He has 2.5 years before free agency and is spending at least one of those on the IL. 

Not to rain on your post, but there is a thread on this very subject asking that very question  

 

 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

1 minute ago, h2oface said:

Now shopping Maeda, too. A team full of strangers, coming up. 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/07/byron-buxton-trade-rumors-twins-phillies.html

I mean, why not, right?

[prouster]

Just now, Squirrel said:

Not to rain on your post, but there is a thread on this very subject asking that very question  

 

 

Sorry. I guess I should check the threads! My bad. 

[Squirrel]

Just now, prouster said:

Sorry. I guess I should check the threads! My bad. 

No bad here ... just showing you options  

[Mike Sixel]

Just now, Hosken Bombo Disco said:

Then you know how it feels! 

The way this front office operates, it feels way too much like Minnesota Twins: The Board Game™

 

They've traded one guy under contract for next year....and did a great job in 19 and 20 (and getting there). I really don't know what they've done that is so awful (so far).

[Mike Sixel]

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/twins-get-bounty-for-berrios-but-its-one-thats-not-without-risk/

[Major League Ready]

1 hour ago, notoriousgod71 said:

Yes, and they've already weeded out the possibility of being a bust by having a long career of success.

 

Acquiring prospects does nothing for me. They'll either be awful and we'll keep them too long or they'll be good and we'll trade them for more prospects. At no point will this formula amount to winning unless you keep your good players.

 

Like Blake Snell who many here thought was a no brainer trade who is playing at roughly replacement level or

Albert Pujlos who was one of the very best in the game and produced a negative WAR for 5 years straight or

Chris Davis who signed a mega deal and has produced -5 WAR or

Jason Heyward who has produced 8 WAR in 6 seasons after signing a mega deal. Or

Stephen Strausberg who signed for 7/245M and pitched 5 innings in 2020 and 21 IP in 2022.  Maybe he will bounce back this one could be disasterous.

We could go on and on.  Dexter Fowler, David Price, Jacoby Elsbury, Eric Hosmer, Johnny Questo, Ryan Zimmerman, Carl Crawford, Pablo Sandavol, Josh Hamilton, Ryan Howard, Prince Fielder and on and on.  We have not even mentioned the very long list of relief pitchers.  That would take a while.  Yep, sure bet!

[dbminn]

28 minutes ago, Vanimal46 said:

That’s my concern right now… 2022. Sports is an entertainment first business, and the team won’t be competitive/entertaining for the foreseeable future. The next 2 months for sure are going to be unwatchable. 

OTOH, Saints tickets will be tougher to find the rest of this season and most of 2022.

[AceWrigley]

Looks like the Twins had to sweeten the pot with a throw-in:

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

4 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/twins-get-bounty-for-berrios-but-its-one-thats-not-without-risk/

On the contrary, I think trading Berríos is the low risk move. 

Going into 2022 with essentially the same team we had in 2019, 2020, 2021 and your two best players in their final years... that is the high risk, high reward move, in my opinion. 

 

[Cap'n Piranha]

1 hour ago, h2oface said:

Berrios must be nothing. After all, he was a first round/supplemental compensatory pick, which is what he could have been replaced by if he refused a qualifying offer (at least under the current CBA, which may change) after he helped the Twins in 2022. And that would have been great for the prospect lists and books, too, and would have been more development years to talk and hope about.

And Martin was the 5th pick last year.  Hanging on to Berrios for a year your probably won't be competitive in, in the hopes of recouping a pick in the 31-38 range, as opposed to obtaining two guys who have already made it to AA makes no sense whatsoever.  Berrios has no more practical value to the Twins, in terms of the production he offers.  None of his remaining ~45 starts in 2021 or 2022 are likely to be for a Twins team on its way to the playoffs.  As such, getting the maximum amount of value for him is the only logical course, and suggesting a potential comp pick in early July 2023 (which will not be on anyone's Top 100 list) is preferable to 2 guys in late July 2021 (both of whom are on the majority of Top 100 lists) is just insane.

[Cap'n Piranha]

1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

I doubt their chances of signing Berrios changed any today.  They were going to need to outbid everyone to sign him and I think that scenario remains the same today.  The difference is we add to prospects that individually could be as impactful as Berrios and in Martin's case even more so.  The cost is Berrios for 2022.  

This is probably true.  I imagine that if the Twins make the best offer for him in December 2022, he will be more than happy to rejoin the organization.

[Cap'n Piranha]

22 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

I would hate that more than you can imagine. 

Why wouldn't you listen on Maeda?  I doubt he gets moved, but if the Padres get panicky, and agree to give you Abrams + something else for Maeda and Rogers, I think you have to do that.

[h2oface]

2 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

And Martin was the 5th pick last year.  Hanging on to Berrios for a year your probably won't be competitive in, in the hopes of recouping a pick in the 31-38 range, as opposed to obtaining two guys who have already made it to AA makes no sense whatsoever.  Berrios has no more practical value to the Twins, in terms of the production he offers.  None of his remaining ~45 starts in 2021 or 2022 are likely to be for a Twins team on its way to the playoffs.  As such, getting the maximum amount of value for him is the only logical course, and suggesting a potential comp pick in early July 2023 (which will not be on anyone's Top 100 list) is preferable to 2 guys in late July 2021 (both of whom are on the majority of Top 100 lists) is just insane.

I'll take that to mean that you are changing your statement of "nothing" to something, just insane. So not "nothing". Gotcha. 

[Mike Sixel]

4 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

Why wouldn't you listen on Maeda?  I doubt he gets moved, but if the Padres get panicky, and agree to give you Abrams + something else for Maeda and Rogers, I think you have to do that.

Sure, if they got one of the best prospects in the game, I do it......but that seems pretty unlikely.

They need at least one veteran to mentor the young guys this year. 

[notoriousgod71]

58 minutes ago, prouster said:

No, but there are economic realities that all but a handful of teams must confront. I don’t know why you’d expect the Twins to suddenly start spending at the top of the league. (This is all I’ll say on the matter, because it comes up literally every week in this website. It’s tedious, and no one has anything new or constructive to add.)

Well, can you see why this might be frustrating for someone who only wants their team to win to see said team take three steps back for every step forward year after year after year?

They aren't losing money. The only thing preventing the Pohlads from building a winning team is themselves.

Enjoyed the back and forth!

[h2oface]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/07/twins-cardinals-trade-j-a-happ-john-gant.html

No more JA Happ. THAT makes me Happy. Not for the return, just so I don't have to watch Happ pitch anymore.

[Cap'n Piranha]

8 minutes ago, h2oface said:

I'll take that to mean that you are changing your statement of "nothing" to something, just insane. So not "nothing". Gotcha. 

Fair enough.  It's certain Berrios would have left for potentially a glorified second-round pick in the most crapshoot draft in all of professional sports, but also potentially nothing.  Better?

[notoriousgod71]

26 minutes ago, Major League Ready said:

Like Blake Snell who many here thought was a no brainer trade who is playing at roughly replacement level or

Albert Pujlos who was one of the very best in the game and produced a negative WAR for 5 years straight or

Chris Davis who signed a mega deal and has produced -5 WAR or

Jason Heyward who has produced 8 WAR in 6 seasons after signing a mega deal. Or

Stephen Strausberg who signed for 7/245M and pitched 5 innings in 2020 and 21 IP in 2022.  Maybe he will bounce back this one could be disasterous.

We could go on and on.  Dexter Fowler, David Price, Jacoby Elsbury, Eric Hosmer, Johnny Questo, Ryan Zimmerman, Carl Crawford, Pablo Sandavol, Josh Hamilton, Ryan Howard, Prince Fielder and on and on.  We have not even mentioned the very long list of relief pitchers.  That would take a while.  Yep, sure bet!

Sweet, never play anyone over 25 then. They might suck at some point,