Who's on Third? ... and other infield questions

[Doctor Wu]

I realize this subject has been covered occasionally in other threads, but I thought it might be handy to put all of these infield questions in one place. I can't remember an off-season when the Twins had so many question marks about their infield for the coming year.

 

Polanco is a given, but will he stay at shortstop or will the team try him at second? Do we want Sano starting at third base? And what about first base? Is Austin the answer there? The biggest hole seems to be at second base. I have doubts that Nick Gordon is ready for that job, so what does the team do?

 

I read on the SI website, in a column by Ben Reiter, that Josh Harrison might be a good free agent option for the Twins. I'd always considered Harrison more of an outfielder, but he CAN play various infield positions too. What do you think? Is a trade likely? Will be dip into the free agent pool to solidify the infield? What awaits us next year?

[IndianaTwin]

For those of us who aren't able to see games on a regular basis, how about an honest assessment of Sano's current skill set at third? (As in, not, "he'll eventually move to 1B to DH" and "he needs to lose 10-50 pounds.")

 

Range, side to side? Range, going in and back? Arm? Instincts?

 

One thing I'm struck with is that it seems like one of his biggest strengths defensively is the arm, which seems more helpful at 3B than 1B. 

 

Okay, a second thing -- is range as much of a factor if they are shifting 28 percent of the time? 

 

 

[Riverbrian]

We need 6 players to man the infield. Finding 4 won’t be enough. We currently have 3 with Sano, Austin and Polanco and 4 if you count Adrianaza.

 

Gordon and Arreaz are depth in Rochester.

 

I’d like to see them acquire a new 3B and 2 new middle infielders which will allow them to move on from Adrianaza.

[nicksaviking]

 

For those of us who aren't able to see games on a regular basis, how about an honest assessment of Sano's current skill set at third? (As in, not, "he'll eventually move to 1B to DH" and "he needs to lose 10-50 pounds.")

 

Range, side to side? Range, going in and back? Arm? Instincts?

 

One thing I'm struck with is that it seems like one of his biggest strengths defensively is the arm, which seems more helpful at 3B than 1B. 

 

Okay, a second thing -- is range as much of a factor if they are shifting 28 percent of the time? 

 

His range is poor due to his lack of speed and balls get by him or under his glove if he has to go too dramatically right or left. He is surprisingly nimble though and makes some really nice picks and barehanded plays when he's charging. His arm might be the strongest in the game. It can be inaccurate at times but it seems like those stretches mostly happen when his playing time at 3B is inconsistent. 

 

 

[Number3]

Pretty optimistic to do anything other than pencil in Sano anywhere on the roster. Almost impossible to imagine what the opening day lineup will look like which may not be all bad.

[tarheeltwinsfan]

 

His range is poor due to his lack of speed and balls get by him or under his glove if he has to go too dramatically right or left. He is surprisingly nimble though and makes some really nice picks and barehanded plays when he's charging. His arm might be the strongest in the game. It can be inaccurate at times but it seems like those stretches mostly happen when his playing time at 3B is inconsistent. 

Since Sano has such a strong arm, maybe he could play OF,,,no wait, that has been attempted....What about letting him pitch as an opener, then ...then what? He could throw out base runners from the catcher position....can you imagine the offense produced by Sano at catcher...no that won't work either...he may have trouble blocking those low pitches. Where does a strong armed, slow player best fit into a roster?  I say leave him at 3B and get a really fast SS with great range. Maybe we could have a super shift and put him at 1B during shifts and move the 1B to the shifted position? Or he may just be a DH for the rest of his career. Oh,  I give up. I'm going to go make a turkey sandwich.

[jorgenswest]

Sano’s arm strength should allow him to play a little deeper. Playing deeper will help his effective range though visually his range wouldn’t look different. He is a below average but capable 3B. He plays well enough at 3B that the Twins have the flexibility to look for a player at either corner.

[nicksaviking]

 

Sano’s arm strength should allow him to play a little deeper. Playing deeper will help his effective range though visually his range wouldn’t look different. He is a below average but capable 3B. He plays well enough at 3B that the Twins have the flexibility to look for a player at either corner.

 

Yeah, that might be the best move. Perhaps I'm wrong or haven't seen enough, but it seems to me Sano's best plays are when he's charging, so playing back might be the best bet.

 

Or maybe the second best bet; I'm not singling Sano out, but I'm really hoping that big overhaul of the strength and conditioning staff is due to confidence that some players can be improved physically. It would also be nice if they know how to add strength to Kepler and improve Polanco's throwing shoulder.

[Surelock]

Sano needs to show the Twins that he is capable of playing 145+ games this year at 3rd and not give up any of his at bats as he did last year.    He needs to show the FO that he is mature enough to handle the position or any other spot on this team.  The FO needs to see if  he can handle the spot at the major league level and not at AA or AAA. This FO will find a suitable backup for 3rd base.

[ChrisKnutson]

We need 6 players to man the infield. Finding 4 won’t be enough. We currently have 3 with Sano, Austin and Polanco and 4 if you count Adrianaza.

Gordon and Arreaz are depth in Rochester.

I’d like to see them acquire a new 3B and 2 new middle infielders which will allow them to move on from Adrianaza.

I know Gonzalez is probably everyone’s preference, but I’m pretty sure Harrison, Murphy, and Goins would be plenty, don’t you think? Harrison can share 3rd with Sano, Murphy can hold down 2nd base till Gordon's ready, and Goins can either replace Adrianza or be AAA depth.

[Surelock]

The infielders (Sano, Palanco, Gordon, Austin) have not played enough at the major league level to be considered anything more than being a “prospect with potential”.  It is time for them to figure it out, mature, and put their big boy pants on.  This is totally on the players, no more excuses.  They need to play a season of 145+ games and get 400+ at bats to show what they can do.  Then the FO can make appropriate moves to make the Twins better.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

His range is poor due to his lack of speed and balls get by him or under his glove if he has to go too dramatically right or left. He is surprisingly nimble though and makes some really nice picks and barehanded plays when he's charging. His arm might be the strongest in the game. It can be inaccurate at times but it seems like those stretches mostly happen when his playing time at 3B is inconsistent.

Sano needs to show the Twins that he is capable of playing 145+ games this year at 3rd and not give up any of his at bats as he did last year. He needs to show the FO that he is mature enough to handle the position or any other spot on this team. The FO needs to see if he can handle the spot at the major league level and not at AA or AAA. This FO will find a suitable backup for 3rd base.

 

These two topics combined is where I’m at. He doesn’t have the footwork/speed for the lateral movement required for 3rd combined with he hasn’t stayed healthy while at third. They might not be related, however maybe the move across the diamond would help keep him healthy.

 

He’s tall, has a good wing span, and has the ability to pick it, if he can get to it. His arm would be wasted at first (same with Mauer).

 

 

I’m firmly of the belief that Polanco and Sano on the left side of the infield leaves huge gaps in the standard alignment. Gotta improve SS or 3B. If f I had to choose 1, it would be SS. I tend to align with the “field well up the middle” dogma.

 

Sano has the potential stick to overcome his fielding deficiencies. Polanco hits well, but not enough to overcome the fielding issues. He also has lateral range issues and a so-so arm that’s exacerbated by his range. SS has more fielding opportunities and with a greater opportunity for double play.

 

Looking at the free agent market, this would mean giving up on some hit tool. The options available look to be one sided (hit well or field well, not both). It would shorten the lineup some if Castro and Buxton are your C and CF. If Garver and Kepler are your C and CF, or if Buxton somehow miraculously figures out how to hit, the lineup could handle a black hole at SS, especially if you can pull off a Goldschmidt trade.

[Jim Hahn]

I would like to see a full year of Sano at 3rd base. Given the the uncertainties surrounding him, I expect the Twins to sign a utility type infielder capable of playing 3rd and providing some offense. So Sano might end up shifting between 3rd, 1st, and DH. I think Gordon is likely a better ss than Polanco and closer to major league ready than most here seem to. Nevertheless, I doubt if the FO will put all their eggs in that basket.

 

The question becomes whether the Twins want to start the year with Polanco at short or go with someone else there and get Polanco over to 2nd where he likely belongs, to start the season. What it comes down to is how the FO views Gordon, how soon they think Lewis will will be ready to be a major league shortstop(if ever), and how strongly they want to go all in on 2019.

 

So, while I expect the Twins to do something with the middle infield, I am struggling to guess what it will be. Ryan used to sign a stopgap when he had a position of uncertainty, a Baptista or Castro. The fans often hated this but when he felt the prospect was ready, he would trade or cut the stopgap and promote or allow the manager to shift the appropriate replacement into that spot. It wouldn't surprise me to see this FO do something similar.

[Winston Smith]

Do you really want to go into the season hoping that Sano is a full time anything? Has he shown that he can be depended on? Get a real 3B and let Sano play 1B/DH, much easier spot to find a decent/replacement level fill in..

[Jim Hahn]

Do you really want to go into the season hoping that Sano is a full time anything? Has he shown that he can be depended on? Get a real 3B and let Sano play 1B/DH, much easier spot to find a decent/replacement level fill in..

I don't really want to see the Twins sign or trade for a full time 3rd baseman. Sano solves so many future problems if he can be counted on as full time 3rd baseman. By not making Sano 1b/DH you keep all your options open on how to structure of/dh/1b. As Rooker, Kiriloff, Weil or whowever get ready, you will have spots to work them in. You will have a chance to discover whether Austin is the real deal. You can still sign bat first options to cover at 1b/DH who can be traded or released as the prospects prove they are ready. I am sort of hoping for flexible solutions to the Twins current issues.

[blindeke]

I bet they do more shifting this year anyway. Playing 3B ain't like it used to be.

[Platoon]

I think playing third now requires more range than previously. Sano's biggest weakness? Lack of concentration. It was evident in Beloit when I watched him drop an easy pop up, and it's been evident in MLB when that still occurs. That results in kicking the easy plays and making the hard ones. Hands are there, arm is there, concentration on the simple plays is not.

[Winston Smith]

 

I don't really want to see the Twins sign or trade for a full time 3rd baseman. Sano solves so many future problems if he can be counted on as full time 3rd baseman. By not making Sano 1b/DH you keep all your options open on how to structure of/dh/1b. As Rooker, Kiriloff, Weil or whowever get ready, you will have spots to work them in. You will have a chance to discover whether Austin is the real deal. You can still sign bat first options to cover at 1b/DH who can be traded or released as the prospects prove they are ready. I am sort of hoping for flexible solutions to the Twins current issues.

The big question is "if he can be counted on". The last 3 seasons he's ave. 100 games.

[Jim Hahn]

The big question is "if he can be counted on". The last 3 seasons he's ave. 100 games.

You are right,"if" is the question. I just think now is the time to find out "if" Sano can answer that question at 3rd and if Buxton can answer similar questions in center.

[howieramone2]

Sano is set at 3B, as is Polanco at SS. We need a professional bat at 2B, with a shorter term contract. We should spent or trade at 1B.

 

I agree with the member who said he can't remember when the the infield was so up in the air. What I see is, we have players to trade, a farm system in the top 5, and more money to spend than we ever had. Don't stray too far from the board this off season, it's all going to get done.

[Riverbrian]

 

I know Gonzalez is probably everyone’s preference, but I’m pretty sure Harrison, Murphy, and Goins would be plenty, don’t you think? Harrison can share 3rd with Sano, Murphy can hold down 2nd base till Gordon's ready, and Goins can either replace Adrianza or be AAA depth.

 

Agreed.

 

For this off-season and every off-season to come. I am less concerned with the individual names and just simply concerned with getting names (plural) who can be counted on. 

 

I have a personal preference for Daniel Murphy because of his bat but if they trade for Starlin Castro instead. I'm going to be alright with that decision. 

 

Ultimately, my happiness with the off-season will be dictated by one simple thing: Will we have to suffer through sub-par play in 2019 for long stretches by any player because we only have sub-par replacements that the manager will not play. 

 

In other words... If Baldelli won't give Adrianaza (for example) or any player on the 25 man roster decent opportunity because he chooses to give the overwhelming majority of the playing time to a designated "Starter" even if that starter is producing an OPS in the .600 range for a long stretch of time.. We should not roster Adrianaza or any player that the manager won't trust to out produce a player hitting under .200 in June with a painful hip injury. 

 

If Baldelli has a player (or players) on the roster that he will only turn to if the world comes to an end and we waste any roster spot with a player like that. I will consider the off-season a complete failure and I will come to the realization that this organization will only pull itself to the upper echelon by pure luck of the chosen few actually working out without injury for a stretch of time. 

 

I think we need 3 (edit) players for the infield (unless they love Adrianaza) and I want the front office to only consider players that the manager will actually play. And then I want honest competition for the playing time and playing time rewarded based on actual performance on the field and not by any projections or opinions on who SHOULD be performing better on the field. 

 

That is how you build depth, and improve performance across the board. you give players the opportunity(Cave, Astudillo) to win a job, to be responsible for their own fate, to surprise us all with competent play by rewarding and demanding competent play from everyone.

 

It shouldn't have taken an act of congress to get Astudillo (for example) into the lineup in consideration of the horrible play we saw from multiple positions last year. 

 

This off-season will be a success if the front office staffs the 25 and 40 man roster from top to bottom with players that Baldelli will play. Weather it is Murphy or Josh Harrison matters but still matters much much less to me. 

 

 

 

[DocBauer]

IMHO, a healthy Sano is more than adequate at 3B. He charges well and uses his canon to great effectiveness. (Everyone has an error here and there). I have seen vast improvement in regard to chasing pop-ups. His hands are solid, though I agree his lateral range isn't the best. If he's serious about maintaining his new regiment, a slimmer Sano should be a better player overall, and possibly see some better range.

 

His remaining at 3B increases his overall value and has been pointed out, keeps 1B/OF/DH options for flexible.

 

I agree in depth, versatility and better roster management. But I still see Sano at 3B in 2019.

[ChrisKnutson]

Agreed.

 

For this off-season and every off-season to come. I am less concerned with the individual names and just simply concerned with getting names (plural) who can be counted on.

 

I have a personal preference for Daniel Murphy because of his bat but if they trade for Starlin Castro instead. I'm going to be alright with that decision.

 

Ultimately, my happiness with the off-season will be dictated by one simple thing: Will we have to suffer through sub-par play in 2019 for long stretches by any player because we only have sub-par replacements that the manager will not play.

 

In other words... If Baldelli won't give Adrianaza (for example) or any player on the 25 man roster decent opportunity because he chooses to give the overwhelming majority of the playing time to a designated "Starter" even if that starter is producing an OPS in the .600 range for a long stretch of time.. We should not roster Adrianaza or any player that the manager won't trust to out produce a player hitting under .200 in June with a painful hip injury.

 

If Baldelli has a player (or players) on the roster that he will only turn to if the world comes to an end and we waste any roster spot with a player like that. I will consider the off-season a complete failure and I will come to the realization that this organization will only pull itself to the upper echelon by pure luck of the chosen few actually working out without injury for a stretch of time.

 

I think we need 4 players for the infield (unless they love Adrianaza) and I want the front office to only consider players that the manager will actually play. And then I want honest competition for the playing time and playing time rewarded based on actual performance on the field and not by any projections or opinions on who SHOULD be performing better on the field.

 

That is how you build depth, and improve performance across the board. you give players the opportunity(Cave, Astudillo) to win a job, to be responsible for their own fate, to surprise us all with competent play by rewarding and demanding competent play from everyone.

 

It shouldn't have taken an act of congress to get Astudillo (for example) into the lineup in consideration of the horrible play we saw from multiple positions last year.

 

This off-season will be a success if the front office staffs the 25 and 40 man roster from top to bottom with players that Baldelli will play. Weather it is Murphy or Josh Harrison matters but still matters much much less to me.

 

100% agree, which is why I’m encouraged to see what happens next because I like the 40 man roster we got right now, but there’s definitely more improvements to be made (like dropping Slegers, Grossman, and Granite)(maybe some trades too). And while Adrianza ‘could’ be someone we choose to let go, I wouldn’t be so quick to replace him with Goins (or anyone), because for one, Ehire is much more versatile than most players and won’t have the bat knocked out of his hands like most utility infielders.

 

Also, when it comes to Sano, I wouldn’t be fully against making him the full time DH/backup 3B/backup 1B because his bat is what this team is depending on (along with Buxton), whatever he offers with the glove is a bonus. And if you think about it, this is how the Red Sox utilized J.D. Martinez in the outfield.

 

Like the FO said, there’s so many routes we could go (Santana, Goldschmit, moving Sano off 3B, moving Polanco off SS, Marwin, Murphy, Harrison, Lowrie), so here’s to hoping that they continue to head down this new, improved, and much clearer direction as an organization.

[PDX Twin]

 

I think playing third now requires more range than previously. Sano's biggest weakness? Lack of concentration. It was evident in Beloit when I watched him drop an easy pop up, and it's been evident in MLB when that still occurs. That results in kicking the easy plays and making the hard ones. Hands are there, arm is there, concentration on the simple plays is not.

 

This is what worries me about moving him to first. I can just see two or three balls a week skipping past him for throwing errors (not his). We've been really spoiled the last few years...

[Rosterman]

I Don't Know!

 

[Mr. Brooks]

This is what worries me about moving him to first. I can just see two or three balls a week skipping past him for throwing errors (not his). We've been really spoiled the last few years...

I don't believe most first baseman even get as many as 3 scoops per week, so Sano would have to miss every single chance to even come close to that.

[DocBauer]

This is what worries me about moving him to first. I can just see two or three balls a week skipping past him for throwing errors (not his). We've been really spoiled the last few years...

We have been spoiled, no doubt. But I wouldn't be concerned for a couple of reasons:

 

1] While range at any position is nice, it's probably easier to hide at 1B.

 

2] Sano, a former SS when signed, has pretty decent hands. It's more about repetition and "flipping" what you know and what you've done across the diamond previously. Thus far, in the limited time I've seen him at 1B, I haven't noticed any glaring mistakes when Sano has played 1B.

 

Even Mauer took a little time to adjust to the position. I think Sano would be fine there. I just think it would be a mistake to take his arm away from 3B too early, as well as his bat. Simply, it's easier to find a bat for 1B than it is at 3B. I still want defense, don't misunderstand! I just don't feel a healthy and relatively in shape Sano is the butcher some make him out to be. Not even close.

 

And I have to say, in my 45 years, or so, if watching baseball, I've seen a lot of guys with bug sticks who were borderline awful at 3B before growing in to the position and become adequate to very good. Heck, even a few former Twin favorites, Gaetti and Koskie took a few years before rounding in to fine 3B.

[DocBauer]

Honest question gang:

 

What is the best way to improve the keystone for 2019?

 

Almost everyone believes in Polanco, and his future, as an offensive player. But there is a big division between opinions as to whether he awful at SS, or barely adequate, VS, he's at least average and shows flashes of promise that indicate he will continue to get better, and be solid for at least the next couple of years until Lewis or Javier are ready.

 

While personal belief and choice for how to man 2B in 2019 is varied, it can't be argued that there is a plethora of available 2B available on the FA market to fill that position. And a number of them could really help spark the lineup. (You still have to make the smartest choice, of course).

 

There are far fewer options available at SS.

 

I love good defense and believe in it. But especially the way the game is being played now, with shifts and an emphasis on launch angles/power and seemingly acceptable high SO totals, are we moving away from defensive emphasis in the game?

 

2B or SS, for the next couple of seasons, considering both offense and defense, which way is the easiest/best way to improve the 2019 infield up the middle?

[Aerodeliria]

I think he'll be fine in the field if he takes off some more poundage. It might sound silly, but "fat" guys tend to be worse in the field because of their reduced movement...they also tend to get injured more frequently. I'm sure there are exceptions...

 

Does anyone know what they are doing with Sano during this off season to avoid a repeat of last spring? I haven't heard....

[DocBauer]

Agreed.

 

For this off-season and every off-season to come. I am less concerned with the individual names and just simply concerned with getting names (plural) who can be counted on. 

 

I have a personal preference for Daniel Murphy because of his bat but if they trade for Starlin Castro instead. I'm going to be alright with that decision. 

 

Ultimately, my happiness with the off-season will be dictated by one simple thing: Will we have to suffer through sub-par play in 2019 for long stretches by any player because we only have sub-par replacements that the manager will not play. 

 

In other words... If Baldelli won't give Adrianaza (for example) or any player on the 25 man roster decent opportunity because he chooses to give the overwhelming majority of the playing time to a designated "Starter" even if that starter is producing an OPS in the .600 range for a long stretch of time.. We should not roster Adrianaza or any player that the manager won't trust to out produce a player hitting under .200 in June with a painful hip injury. 

 

If Baldelli has a player (or players) on the roster that he will only turn to if the world comes to an end and we waste any roster spot with a player like that. I will consider the off-season a complete failure and I will come to the realization that this organization will only pull itself to the upper echelon by pure luck of the chosen few actually working out without injury for a stretch of time. 

 

I think we need 4 players for the infield (unless they love Adrianaza) and I want the front office to only consider players that the manager will actually play. And then I want honest competition for the playing time and playing time rewarded based on actual performance on the field and not by any projections or opinions on who SHOULD be performing better on the field. 

 

That is how you build depth, and improve performance across the board. you give players the opportunity(Cave, Astudillo) to win a job, to be responsible for their own fate, to surprise us all with competent play by rewarding and demanding competent play from everyone.

 

It shouldn't have taken an act of congress to get Astudillo (for example) into the lineup in consideration of the horrible play we saw from multiple positions last year. 

 

This off-season will be a success if the front office staffs the 25 and 40 man roster from top to bottom with players that Baldelli will play. Weather it is Murphy or Josh Harrison matters but still matters much much less to me.

 

Another great post, especially because I agree with you! Lol

 

Guys have slumps. Sometimes they need time, or adjustment, to work through them. But you also simply can't be stubborn enough to ride a guy just because you HOPE he figures it out!

 

I am going to take some issue with your opinion on needing 4 infielders, however. Good, bad, right or wrong, it's pretty damn hard to just re-build an entire infield in one off season. Along with being a bit unrealistic. You absolutely need options, versatility and backup plans. But if you are carrying 6-7 infielders, adding 4 would be a pretty tough mountain to climb.

 

So what do we have? Regardless of final position outcome, we have the talented Polanco. We also have Sano, who isn't going anywhere, and shouldn't at this point. Then we have Austin, who shows some promise, and could be a very dangerous lower third of the order hitter. Personally, I like Adrianza. I like his glove, and versatility, with a decent bat for a utility player. I like to him to play regular, but not too often. In that niche, he seems to perform well.

 

Assuming we can't just pull rabbits out of the hat, what needs to be settled is either a starter at 2B or SS. Decide for sure which way makes the most sense for 2019/2020 and get that guy!

 

At that point, if not before, I would sign or trade for the best "multi-position" guy I could get. Can he play up the middle? Is he a 1B/3B? Can he also do a credible job in the OF? Gonzalez would be a priority for me were I in charge. I'd pay him starter money, $8-10M per on a 3-4yr deal because he brings so much to my club. But is he obtainable? I feel he will have a few suitors. If he's not, find the next best fit, versatile player. (Still in depression mode about Escobar, to be honest).

 

That's TWO.

 

Next, I would scour every available AAA/AAAA infielder and sign the very best two I could for depth, promising opportunity. Something I feel the FO botched last season. (Losing Goodrum comes to mind).

 

Absolutely right about Astudillo! Will I get my very first TD warning points if I state that the way he was handled in 2018 was piss poor!? Signed as a catcher with positional flexibility, he was suddenly moved off catcher to play other spots when they marched a series of re-treads through that spot after Castro was done. Then, he gets a promotion to sit on the bench and make a few appearances anywhere BUT catcher. Somebody, finally, got their head screwed on straight and returned him behind the plate. And what did we get when he came up again? A decent looking catcher with positional flexibility who did what he bas entire milb career at EVERY level, barrel up and HIT!

 

I don't know good Astudillo can be. But it seems to me everyone previously has passed on him simply because he didn't fit some idea/ideal of what they wanted. And I don't know if he breaks 2019 with the club, or rides the Rochester shuttle some. But to me, at worst, he's my valuable and versatile 26th man. And if you sign that one, quality, everyday infielder, maybe Astudillo is your second utility player. I think it deserves consideration at least.