Reusse's suggestion for the 2019 Twins Marketing Slogan

[ThejacKmp]

 

I’m curious how you know how the Twins value Gonsalves, or know that other teams saw him as a highly valuable prospect?

 

Yeah, most prospect ratings I saw have seen Gonsalves as a solid high floor back of the rotation starter who maybe had the potential to be a solid #3 or #2 if he adjusted well to the pros. BTW, none of that has changed based on two starts. He doesn't have the ceiling of Berrios but he certainly isn't done. I've seen way too much freaking out about him. Let him adjust over this last month.

[yarnivek1972]

Criticism I agree with:

 

"Falvey’s new buzz word is “sustainability,” and he backs that up by running a temp service for manager Paul Molitor.

 

In a lost summer when the Twins should have been looking for an answer — yes or no — with relievers such as Alan Busenitz, Tyler Duffey, Jake Reed and John Curtiss, they were wasting appearances on Matt Belisle and now an ultimate journeyman, Oliver Drake"

 

Agreed, makes no sense. Hard to tell if he's implying that this is what Molitor wants or what Molitor is saddled with though.

 

And criticism I don't agree with:

 

"The new bodies from the trades and the rise of Lewis and Kirilloff might excite the Jim Callis [MLB.com prospect guru] crowd, but the majority of Minnesota’s sporting public has been turned so cynical about the words “Twins” and “prospects” that it does zero to create interest for next season."

 

I'd rather be making moves the likes of Jim Callis get excited about than the likes of Reusse's more casual readers. Frankly, I don't care if the casual fans have interest next season.

 

Also, aren't the above quotes contradictory? "Give the prospects a shot instead of these journeymen bums!" and "Forget about the prospects, they'll only disappoint us all!" Geez Reusse, pick a lane.

 

This isn't one of his better pieces.

The guys in the FO sure better care. The “casual fans” are the ones who drive up attendance with single game ticket sales. They buy the merchandise and patronize the TV and radio broadcast sponsors.

[mikelink45]

 

Ok? Better teams usually have more of a margin for error than worse teams. That's not breaking news. I think the Yankees and Cubs were both projected to win 10+ more games than the Twins this year. It's hardly a surprise losing Judge for 30 games or getting little from Darvish hasn't greatly impacted their W/L total. 

 

A Twins team that was thought of as a fringe wild card contender entering the season couldn't afford to get no production from Buxton/ Sano, and pretty crappy production from Dozier and surpass their expected win total. This isn't a surprise

 

If your answer is they should've built a team as good as the Yankees or Cubs in their 2nd season in charge, the issue is in your expectations, not anything the FO has done

We had a team that was a wild card, and we have not been able to build from that, so yes I do have criticism for this FO.  I know I am in the TD minority, but I cannot change that until I see some things that do impress me.

[KirbyDome89]

 

So....I assume this totally lines up with what he said in March and April right?

 

No?  Right.  There is nothing wrong with sustainability as the FO intends it.  It only becomes a dirty word if you twist it around to fit a narrative.  The Twins do need some good fortune and a big offseason - that might've made a better (and more coherent) thesis for an article.

Agreed that sustainability is important, but when it's promoted in lieu of the expectations and outcome this season it rings rather hollow. In a sense it does feel like a bit of a distraction from the short term issues. Fair? 

[djvang]

For the past several seasons the Twins have performed the opposite of pre-season expectations. That bodes well for next season.

[ND-Fan]

Finally one of the media questioning this front office and there moves. All i have heard for two years how brilliant this new front office has been. I also hear it from everyone its only been two years but i look around and i see teams that were worse shape than the Twins were two years ago now way ahead of the twins in rebuilding. The A's were just tore down 3 years ago and now they are about push world series champions in playoff spot. Phillies same thing they were starting to rebuild there already back as contender this year. Braves started about same time as the Twins and now they are contender. Also the Twins are giving playing time to none future players why we just start looking at some our talent see if they can make the jump to major leagues. The above mentioned teams have given some there very young talent chance and some have blossumed here major leagues. The Twins seem afraid to bring up their talent see if they can excell and when they do there older still seem to have hard transition. I think it comes down to starting service clock time clicking so we get players who don't get chances when they are young and don't get see what they need to work on . I think clock is now clicking on this Front Office

for performance because fans are tired of this silling game they have been playing with moving playerd like pieces in deck cards. I just wonder what it does team chemistry and performance and i am willing to bet the word is out amoung veterans were not place of choice to be signed for free agency. Its also probably why Levine is now talking of trading for talent to improve this team because free agency signings are not going to work here now because of the Twins way of doing business. I just wonder how long rest of media at least start questioning the moves this front office is making and what there plan is because time is growing short with the fan base with this group.

[djvang]

 

The thing is though, that's the deal. The organization and people around places like this, just salivate over a guy like Gonsalves and will hold him near their vest no matter what. These are the types of guys that should be traded when their "prospect" status is at their peak. What the Twins have always done is bring these guys up, they fail, then they demote and they aren't worth a thing anymore. Basically, they need to be better judges of talent and when you have a pretty good idea a guy will not be a piece for you going forward, move them when they are still looked at as highly valuable prospects. 

From what I've seen of Gonsalves so far he seems like a taller version of Tommy Milone. Soft throwing leftie who has to have perfect control to get guys out. If not, DUCK!

[Twodogs]

From what I've seen of Gonsalves so far he seems like a taller version of Tommy Milone. Soft throwing leftie who has to have perfect control to get guys out. If not, DUCK!

Dang, I was going to say the same thing!

[Twodogs]

They won 85 games last year. They added Jake Odorizzi, Lance Lynn, Logan Morrison, Addison Reed and Fernando Rodney to said team.

 

Young players, Buxton chief among them, were supposed to take steps forward. Or at least not regress to the minors. So improvement should have been expected.

 

And please point me to any source that guessed 95 wins would be the bare minimum to get to the playoffs.

 

In any event, if the Twins were on pace to simply improve by 5 games they absolutely would be in contention. And 5 games was not much to ask from this team given their additions over the offseason combined with improvement expected by the young players as well as starting pitching depth.

 

That they aren't in contention is a disappointment. As well it should be.

Also, if the Twins were on a pace to win 90, that those wins would have come at someone else's expense

[RaymondLuxuryYacht]

Didn't click the link - if I wanted to see that I would just turn and look down before I flush

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

From what I've seen of Gonsalves so far he seems like a taller version of Tommy Milone. Soft throwing leftie who has to have perfect control to get guys out. If not, DUCK!

 

In the minors, he's averaged a home run every 19ish innings... I think you might want to give him a bit of time before writing him off. 

[ChrisKnutson]

Sometimes I think we forget that we’re closing in on the worst decade in Twins history...

 

Obviously this isn’t Falvine’s fault, but it’s their job to turns things around, and if that means going into 2019 as a “rebuilding team,” then so be it.

 

At this point, I don’t care anymore that we made the 2nd WC in 2017, or that we’ve dealt with injuries this year, none of that should excuse years of inconsistent play and “status” (contending/rebuilding), especially when it stems from a lack of commitment to doing a thorough job.

[jimmer]

 

They won 85 games last year. They added Jake Odorizzi, Lance Lynn, Logan Morrison, Addison Reed and Fernando Rodney to said team.

 

Young players, Buxton chief among them, were supposed to take steps forward. Or at least not regress to the minors. So improvement should have been expected. 

 

And please point me to any source that guessed 95 wins would be the bare minimum to get to the playoffs.

 

In any event, if the Twins were on pace to simply improve by 5 games they absolutely would be in contention. And 5 games was not much to ask from this team given their additions over the offseason combined with improvement expected by the young players as well as starting pitching depth.

 

That they aren't in contention is a disappointment. As well it should be. 

Except that's not how it works.

 

You can't just bank 85 wins from one season, sprinkle in some players you hope will be okay, expect young players to just continue getting better (cause progression for young ball players is not linear) and then say there's 90 or more wins the next season. Just doesn't work that way.  

 

1.  Got to truly evaluate the team and wonder if we got lucky to win that many games based on the talent we had.  Did we expect to win 85 games after the amount we won the year before?

2.  Have to remember while we are working to improve our team in the offseason, so are other teams.

3.  Remember other teams might have under-performed their talent and don't just expect them to do it again.

4.  Remember other teams might have young players also expecting to take the next step.

5.  Remember other teams might have quality players coming back from injury.

6.  Remember we had quality players who, before the season started, we KNEW we weren't going to have for a good chunk of time.

7. And probably many, MANY other things that could be mentioned if I had more time.

 

In other words, our attempt to improve our team doesn't happen while every other team stands pat and does nothing. 

 

IMO, you have to forget last year's record completely.  It means nothing. Have to first start with comparing your rotation to other teams' rotations, cause MOST (not all) of the time, true contenders have truly good/great rotations.  Second, compare position players to the best team in your division and the other truly good/great teams in the AL.  Third compare relief corp too.  Four, compare depth in pitching staff and position players, both on the active roster and MLB ready in the minors.

 

It's just not as easy as saying, well, we had 85 wins, grabbed some players, and all of our young guys are just going to keep improving.  WAAAAY too many other things to consider.

 

[djvang]

 

In the minors, he's averaged a home run every 19ish innings... I think you might want to give him a bit of time before writing him off. 

I'm not writing him off. But he's not in the minors anymore.

[TheLeviathan]

Agreed that sustainability is important, but when it's promoted in lieu of the expectations and outcome this season it rings rather hollow. In a sense it does feel like a bit of a distraction from the short term issues. Fair?

 

Yes and no. Certainly teams try and spin poor seasons with goofy narratives, but isn't the ultimate goal we all have sustained excellence?

 

Reusse's entire argument is something of a false dilemma. The challenge is in winning and maintaing a talent base, not that any effort on one needs to come at the expense of the other.

[KirbyDome89]

 

Yes and no. Certainly teams try and spin poor seasons with goofy narratives, but isn't the ultimate goal we all have sustained excellence?

Reusse's entire argument is something of a false dilemma. The challenge is in winning and maintaing a talent base, not that any effort on one needs to come at the expense of the other.

Absolutely, but I think it's also fair to look at the moves that have and haven't been made and wonder what exactly is being sustained. 

 

I guess I didn't take it as him advocating that one had to come at the expense of another. 

[Twodogs]

In the minors, he's averaged a home run every 19ish innings... I think you might want to give him a bit of time before writing him off.

And the example that was being used, Tommy Milone, look at his stats in the minors. He looked un-hittable down there.

[Jacksson]

A team that should and could be GREAT, except that they aren't very good!

[Otto von Ballpark]

Flavine

I never understood why the Pohlads hired Thad Levine as GM, and Flavor Flav as president of baseball operations...

 

Maybe his clock just means it's time to rebuild?

 

[TheLeviathan]

 

Absolutely, but I think it's also fair to look at the moves that have and haven't been made and wonder what exactly is being sustained. 

 

I guess I didn't take it as him advocating that one had to come at the expense of another. 

 

Absolutely, some things have certainly not been done well by the FO.  

 

I guess I don't know exactly what Reusse's point was if not to take a shot at "sustainability".  And since there appear to be somewhere between 2-4 different suggestions for what it was in this thread alone....maybe I'm not alone in missing the point.  Or, perhaps, there wasn't much of a point other than to gripe.  (Which is fine, it's just griping doesn't really interest me much unless it comes with something of substance to go along with it)

[Jacksson]

Based on the efforts of some of the "heralded" minor leagers that were brought up this year and years past, seems like some mental counseling is needed by these players. Granted, this IS the MAJORS yet it seems like there is a lack of composure, a lack of toughness, a lack of prep by these players. They are making the biggest step in their professional careers - how about some added support for them from: coaches, former players, current players amd some mental health professionals to prepare them so they don't step out with the YIPPS.

[Thrylos]

I agree 100% with Reusse:

 

This front office needs to get rid of people like Radcliffe, Antony, Deron J, etc who proved that they do not cut the mustard the last 20+ seasons. Or something.

 

[nicksaviking]

The guys in the FO sure better care. The “casual fans” are the ones who drive up attendance with single game ticket sales. They buy the merchandise and patronize the TV and radio broadcast sponsors.

Great, 3 year extension for Mauer then.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Didn't click the link - if I wanted to see that I would just turn and look down before I flush

Thanks for sharing and coming to this thread anyway — as a result I clicked it three times on three different devices

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Sometimes I think we forget that we’re closing in on the worst decade in Twins history...

 

Obviously this isn’t Falvine’s fault, but it’s their job to turns things around, and if that means going into 2019 as a “rebuilding team,” then so be it.

 

At this point, I don’t care anymore that we made the 2nd WC in 2017, or that we’ve dealt with injuries this year, none of that should excuse years of inconsistent play and “status” (contending/rebuilding), especially when it stems from a lack of commitment to doing a thorough job.

not even close. 1994-‘01 was way more bleak. I wasn’t around for the Senators, but it’s impressive to have hundred loss seasons in 154 games.

 

I hate Reusse’s writing, but he had a couple points nestled in between his curmudgeonly grunts. This team has its work cut out for it, but I’m still hopeful this offseason and all those resources available [read: KA-CHING!] work out better than ‘18.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

not even close. 1994-‘01 was way more bleak. I wasn’t around for the Senators, but it’s impressive to have hundred loss seasons in 154 games.

I hate Reusse’s writing, but he had a couple points nestled in between his curmudgeonly grunts. This team has its work cut out for it, but I’m still hopeful this offseason and all those resources available [read: KA-CHING!] work out better than ‘18.

This is the eternal question. The Twins were terrible 1994-2000, but they were also coming off a second World Series championship. So the KC Royals have not shown “sustainable” success, but they had two pretty damn exciting seasons mixed in there, 2014 and 2015.

 

Which would you prefer?

[gil4]

 

2019 Minnesota Twins:

"We're offering more specialty food items to distract you from mediocre baseball!"

 

I was thinking "We normally don't suck in odd years" and hope nobody remembers back more than 4 years.

[twinssporto]

Ok - I'm thoroughly depressed after reading Reusse's article.  A lot of truth in it though.  I'm hopeful for 2019 and think this year was really just an injury plagued disaster.  I am going to take the rest of the night to come up with a slogan for the 2019 Minnesota Twins.  

 

In the meantime, I will share the slogan the Twins should start using right now until the 2018 season is over..... 

 

"The entire Minnesota Twins organization would like to apologize to our loyal fan base for our tepid 2018 results. We especially apologize if you bought season tickets or decided to quit sniffing glue."

 

Jim Pohlad

 

[tarheeltwinsfan]

Do I go to Spring Training in March 2019 or save my money and stay home? By March my annual Twins' winter of sorrows has usually faded and I am optimistic again. But right now, as we approach September and the soon to follow cold gray days of winter, I'm not so sure. I ask myself a question: "Why do I pull for the Twins year after year?" Somewhere deep inside do I need to suffer? Do I strive for mediocrity? Did my boyhood years of pulling for the hapless Washington Senators leave deep emotional wounds that require me to suffer annually by pulling for a losing baseball team? If you are a major league baseball fan, the odds are you will be disappointed at the end of every year. There is only one world champion each year. So why do we do it? Why do we pull for the Twins?

[Platoon]

It's sort of weird that so many who hate Reusse's writing and consider him old and cranky, still read his columns, and then comment how old and cranky he is. Few things pile up the page count on TD like a Reusse column.