Twins stuff from around the Web (Fangraphs, Twitter, Athletic, non-local news sites, etc)

[amjgt]

Zack Cozart is a pretty good Escobar comp and he got 3/38 last offseason.

 

Albeit without draft pick compensation tied to him.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Zack Cozart is a pretty good Escobar comp and he got 3/38 last offseason.

 

Albeit without draft pick compensation tied to him.

 

That's a HUGELY BIGLY difference.....

[Mike Sixel]

Rene
4:10 Think any team looks at Lance Lynn's track record and makes a move based on past success? He can't be this bad. Maybe a change of scenery guy?

 

Jeffrey Todd
4:10 This bad? Probably not. I mean, everyone predicted regression, but saw him as a back of the rotation dude. Can imagine him being moved, but the baseline isn't a mid-3 ERA.

 

https://www.jotcast.com/chat/mlbtr-live-chat-3629.html

[amjgt]

That's a HUGELY BIGLY difference.....

I wonder how much a 2nd round pick would go for.... like if the Marlins could auction off their Comp A pick, what would the top bid be?

[Mike Sixel]

 

I wonder how much a 2nd round pick would go for.... like if the Marlins could auction off their Comp A pick, what would the top bid be?

 

there are more recent studies....

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/tht/the-net-value-of-draft-picks/

 

Also, that's not exactly the "cost" of acquiring Escobar, in terms of value lost, since draft picks cannot be bought and sold, they are actually probably worth more.....

 

think of it this way, the Twins and others have paid over 3, sometimes 5 million for the baseball rights to a 16 yo.....

[Mike Sixel]

hmmmm...

 

mike sixel
2:41 Twins punted the season/Twins barely traded anyone/It doesn't matter, there is almost no chance it matters.....which one is the most true (in terms of baseball, not existence)?

 

Dan Szymborski
2:41 I don't think they screwed up - patience made sense.  They've had a lot go wrong in the offense.

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/dan-szymborski-fangraphs-chat-7-30-18/

[Mike Sixel]

Brian Dozier: Is there a middle infield market left?
July 30: Do any contending teams still need an infielder? We're about to find out, with Dozier still on the market as Sunday night turns to Monday.

 

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-trade-deadline/c-281084458?tid=282421090

[rujellis]

I tend to agree w/ Szymborski. 

 

But I am holding out judgement on the trade deadline until we see to what degree they are being 'patient'.  If in fact, its true they were willing to extend Escobar but were not close on terms...to me it could signify they are serious about giving it another run next year rather than stockpiling for 2-3 years down the road.  And in which case, I am glad they got what they could from Escobar now.  

 

But then that should also mean that outside of very top prospects being available they wouldn't really entertain trading Gibson.  So we will see...

[Mike Sixel]

Tony Womack
9:41 How do you evaluate the Yankees deadline deals? Seems like a rare instance where Cashman may not have come out on top.

 

Jeff Sullivan
9:42 I don't really get the Lance Lynn thing. Admittedly, I haven't examined it for a closer look, and I don't think Tyler Austin is important, but Lynn is bad

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/jeff-sullivan-fangraphs-chat-8-1-18/

[Mike Sixel]

Dan
1:33 Kohl Stewart has put together some nice starts recently. Can he still become a viable starter?

 

Keith Law
1:33 He hasn't, though. Still throws strikes with no out pitch.

 

 

[Dman]

 

Tony Womack
9:41 How do you evaluate the Yankees deadline deals? Seems like a rare instance where Cashman may not have come out on top.

 

Jeff Sullivan
9:42 I don't really get the Lance Lynn thing. Admittedly, I haven't examined it for a closer look, and I don't think Tyler Austin is important, but Lynn is bad

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/jeff-sullivan-fangraphs-chat-8-1-18/

 

Don't you think the Yankees picked up Lynn because of his success against the Red Sox same for Happ.  They want to make sure they have favorable match-ups when they play their arch enemies.   He also is an emergency arm for them and given how poorly Gray has pitched I don't think Lynn can do much worse.  Also they didn't give the Twins much in return anyway.  

 

I actually thought there might have been a market for Lynn for clubs that had injured arms (i.e. Brewers) or needed more depth (i.e. Yanks, A's, National league teams)  Mainly because he wouldn't cost much in prospects, But i guess most teams agree with Sullivan.  Lynn is just bad.  Hopefully the Twins catch a break there with prospects they received.

[Doomtints]

The Twins got the worst run of Lance Lynn's professional history, partly because he was signed so late. Twins fans can't pretend to be experts on Lance Lynn based on the past few months.

 

The Yankees grabbed him because they are smart.

[Mike Sixel]

I actually disagree on Lynn being "bad" right now........but I post ones I disagree with also!

[Vanimal46]

Dan

1:33 Kohl Stewart has put together some nice starts recently. Can he still become a viable starter?

 

Keith Law

1:33 He hasn't, though. Still throws strikes with no out pitch.

In general, can a pitcher develop an out pitch? Does a pitcher need a semblance of an out pitch and coaches will help develop the pitch more?

[Mike Sixel]

mike sixel
1:57 How good can Alex Kiriloff be, and when could we see him in MN? thanks,

 

Keith Law
1:57 That kid's a star. I think he's going to make more than a few All-Star teams if he stays healthy.

[Mike Sixel]

Yuan
1:57 Just read your take on Tyler Austin being moved - do you think he still has a chance to redeem himself or is the inability to hit offspeed too much to overcome?

 

Keith Law
1:57 He hasn't shown any adjustments to the slider yet. If he does, great, he can be a regular. If not, well, he can join the multitudes who never did figure it out.

[Mike Sixel]

The Twins went into the season with legitimate (and not unfounded) beliefs about being able to contend. It hasn’t worked out that way, and you see the team cashing in some of those players who are unlikely to play key long-term roles with the team. Pretty by-the-book here.

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/zips-trade-deadline-roundup-american-league/

 

[Mike Sixel]

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/kyle-gibson-on-fastball-efficiency-and-pitch-to-pitch-sequencing/

 

[Monkeypaws]

 

That's a HUGELY BIGLY difference.....

 

I was not aware former Wild goalie Ilya Bryzgalov posted here

[Monkeypaws]

On the Athletic, Jim Bowden gave the Twins an A- for their deadline:

 

 

The Twins did an exceptional job in acquiring 10 legitimate prospects at the deadline for players who were either on their free-agent walk years or were set-up relievers. The ability to get both quantity and quality in their four key trades with Houston, Arizona, Seattle and New York bodes well for their farm system and proves once again that the Twins baseball leadership is in great hands with chief baseball officer Derek Falvey and GM Thad Levine.

 

Full story here:

https://theathletic.com/453436/2018/08/01/bowden-grading-all-30-mlb-teams-on-their-trade-deadline-moves/

[Mike Sixel]

another grade:

 

Minnesota Twins (49–56, 8 GB in AL Central, 13.5 GB in AL wild card)
In: CF Gilberto Celestino, RHP Jorge Alcala, OF Luke Raley, 2B Logan Forsythe, LHP Devin Smeltzer, 1B/OF Tyler Austin, RHP Luis Rijo, RF Ernie De La Trinidad, CF Gabriel Maciel, RHP Jhoan Duran, RHP Chase De Jong, 1B Ryan Costello
Out: RHP Lance Lynn, RHP Ryan Pressly, 2B Brian Dozier, LHP Zach Duke, INF Eduardo Escobar

I guess the good news is that the Twins got a lot of prospects back, and they at least got something for all of their notable free-agents-to-be. By sheer volume, at least one of these guys should turn out to be good. While this fire sale doesn’t include anyone the Twins were building around, and they got back the best prospects they could, it’s still a bummer for a 2017 wild-card team that was supposed to be on the rise and turned out to be one of baseball’s biggest disappointments.

 

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2018/7/31/17637434/trade-deadline-winners-losers-manny-machado-chris-archer-dodgers-pirates

 

[Major League Ready]

 

On the Athletic, Jim Bowden gave the Twins an A- for their deadline:

 

 

Full story here:

https://theathletic.com/453436/2018/08/01/bowden-grading-all-30-mlb-teams-on-their-trade-deadline-moves/

 

It’s great that we have a thread based on outside perspectives, especially when the source has Bowden's credentials. I doubt it’s going to influence the detractors that insist the problem is the incompetence of the front office but hopefully a handful of them will take in what the people who are paid to assess these moves have to say. The articles on the 2018 deadline moves provides the rest of us a little confidence that the organization is doing what they can to make us sustainable winners. Here are two more outside perspectives.

 

CBS --- 

 

SB Nation 

 

The icing on the cake would be signing Escobar this winter.

[Han Joelo]

Nice article that is entirely Kyle Gibson talking about pitching:

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/kyle-gibson-on-fastball-efficiency-and-pitch-to-pitch-sequencing/

[Mike Sixel]

 

Nice article that is entirely Kyle Gibson talking about pitching:

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/kyle-gibson-on-fastball-efficiency-and-pitch-to-pitch-sequencing/

 

that's odd, I htought I posted that!

 

thanks,

[gunnarthor]

 

In general, can a pitcher develop an out pitch? Does a pitcher need a semblance of an out pitch and coaches will help develop the pitch more?

Did Gibson?

[Vanimal46]

Did Gibson?

I think he had a decent slider since he was drafted, and now it's a good out pitch.

 

Perhaps Kohl can develop one or make tweaks in order to make one of his pitches better.

[drivlikejehu]

Gibson's slider was considered an "out pitch" prior to being drafted by the Twins.

[Vanimal46]

My point is are we out of luck if Kohl doesn't have an out pitch like KLaw says? Can an out pitch be developed from an average or below average pitch?

 

These are things I don't know. If it can be done I'd move him to the bullpen and have him throw that pitch over and over again.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Gibson's slider was considered an "out pitch" prior to being drafted by the Twins.

Yeah, I think people are ignoring the importance of refining pitches and learning when to use them. Gibson's slider was always good but without the use of two fastballs to change eye level and location, the slider could be countered.

 

Also, control certainly played a factor. Gibson so often lived in the bottom of the zone with his sinker and missed, which allowed hitters to ignore the slider.

 

So refinement of the slider may (and likely) have been a factor but it didn't become miraculously better overnight, his other pitches helped set it up for success.

[Han Joelo]

 

that's odd, I htought I posted that!

 

thanks,

Maybe you did?  It's a great article, worth reposting if necessary.  Pretty interesting stuff--"I got an email from Derek and Thad when I got to Rochester, saying when I threw 50% or better strikes, I dominated..."

 

Certainly seems like Gibby has figured some stuff out, judging from his long expository.