Souhan rips Perkins and Hughes

[mikelink45]

I am fine with the Souhan article.  It really has an underlying theme that is more important.  We are now hearing about these two players being out of shape, of Sano having a bad attitude...These are the signs of a team that is more than bad on the field.  It is a team that is disintegrating from within.  Bad Karma, Bad juju, bad everything.   

 

It is more than missing Hunter, it is a bad mix of players who are blocking one another from the positions they should play, it is the lack of veterans showing the way, and it is the management from field to FO that is not addressing the issues and clearing the deck to build the right team for the future.

As I chose to read this I saw another article in the forums about trading Sano.  Maybe we should go back to David Ortiz statements about how the Twins handled him.  Maybe we should have some latin American coaches on a team with a growing number of Latin American players.  

 

Perhaps we need an owner who steps forward and does something besides telling us it is a system breakdown - may we remind him - it is your team and, therefore, your system.

[markos]

 

He wasn't so classy back in 2009 when he threw a stink about his much deserved demotion.

I might be mis-remembering, but I thought his stink had more to do with being hurt, getting optioned back to the minors, and then getting placed on the DL, thus losing major league service time. That's why the union got involved with his grievance.

[Shane Wahl]

With regard to Hughes, have any of you have pitched with a dead arm? Memory lane:

I was 13 and we (a Bemidji "Babe Ruth" league) team were playing against  . . . Prior Lake or something in a tournament (P-towns are all the same in that state to me). After three innings my arm just stopped. Something totally weird was going on. The sensation is actually like you feel you have a lack of control of your arm . . . both control-wise and certainly with regard to velocity. I probably only threw 60-65 back then (shut up--though my peak probably never got much higher . . .) but I really didn't know if I could throw that or my next pitch was going to be 40 or something.

It is more psychological (I think David Wells used to pitch with it for the Yankees in the playoffs) than physical in terms of an actual practical problem in game situations.

And I was not really more than a part-time pitcher. That particular game I don't think I was ready . . . no long toss, really, for instance.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I agree with Souhan though no surprise he is very clumsy about what he is saying. I also think guys like Perkins confuse normal nicks and dings with real injuries and it's unfortunate that his injury announcements always seem to come after rocky outings (disclaimer: Perkins might actually be injured! Who knows!)

 

It's also telling that there's an unnamed front office member predicting Perkins won't pitch again this season. And that prediction was apparently made before his setback while playing catch Sunday. 

[DaveW]

 

Nor was Perkins a "class act" in 2014 when publicly ripped Josmil Pinto after his demotion:

 

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/extra-bases/2014/06/17/glen-perkins-throws-josmil-pinto-under-bus/10674587/

But Pinto was awful at catching...

[DaveW]

 

 

I might be mis-remembering, but I thought his stink had more to do with being hurt, getting optioned back to the minors, and then getting placed on the DL, thus losing major league service time. That's why the union got involved with his grievance.

You are correct, he had every reason in the world to be upset about that.

[Vanimal46]

 

Is there a damn journalist in that town who is good? 

Nobody that's willing to give up their cushy seat in the press box to write what's really going on in the organization... Guys like Reusse and Souhan seem to forget they're not compensated by the Twins to do their job. They want to be a part of the gang instead of being journalists IMO. Unless there's some sort of agreement between the Star Trib and the Pohlad's to present the team in the best light that we don't know about. 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

 

I don't care what they watch on tv, I can't believe anyone here thinks that's an issue. Like, I really cannot believe it at all.

Agree completely, but I think it's more of "who" was at the party, than what they were watching. 

[Han Joelo]

 

I don't care what they watch on tv, I can't believe anyone here thinks that's an issue. Like, I really cannot believe it at all.

 

Sounds, frankly, like you are trying hard not to imply something about their manhood.....

I don't care, really.  I am just grasping at straws.  I AM implying something, not about their manhood, but about their competitive fire.  I just can't relate.  I can picture 'team building' get togethers I've had, where we watched extreme whitewater or skiing videos, or the Chappelle show, or classic SNL skits.  (Men and women, mind you.)  Or movies.  The Matrix. Braveheart.  The Shawshank Redemption.  Anything at all that involves either humor or the idea that the weak can overcome impossible odds would be better than fake, scripted reality television.  

 

So I guess, yeah, it does matter to me after all.  When Byung Ho-Park strides to the plate with the bases loaded, what would be more inspiring to hear from the dugout:

 

"You're ten feet tall and you've got lightning bolts coming out your arse!  Freedom!"

 

"We've been crawling through a river of ****!  Salvation lies within!"

 

"Serve them some pancakes!"

 

or,

 

"Give Addison the Rose!"

[Mr. Brooks]

But Pinto was awful at catching...

So that makes it classy?

 

By the way, as demonstrated in the linked article, Suzuki was worse. Where are Perkins comments ripping his catching ability?

 

Comments ripping teammates are best kept behind closed doors.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I might be mis-remembering, but I thought his stink had more to do with being hurt, getting optioned back to the minors, and then getting placed on the DL, thus losing major league service time. That's why the union got involved with his grievance.

That is generally correct, but it's a really blurry line between injured and ineffective.  Perkins had a 5.89 ERA that year (2009) which was only getting worse.  He was put on the DL on August 12th with "shoulder inflammation" (the same generic injury that DL'ed JR Graham for 15 days late last year), and was healthy enough to make a rehab appearance on August 29.  There was absolutely an argument that he should be optioned at that point, and should be nowhere near the MLB roster during a September pennant race.

 

Note that his settlement with the Twins did not restore all of that service time, so he still fell short of arbitration eligibility that winter.  Even given his health, it was probably clear that Perkins was lucky to get 5 months service time for that 2009 season -- the Twins had a valid case for optioning him much earlier than they did.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

But Pinto was awful at catching...

I don't dispute that.  But Perkins' public comments about it hardly constitute "a class act."

[LimestoneBaggy]

If the brass/players are feeding Souhan this trash, where's the sign up sheet for fire everybody, because that would be the tip of the iceberg for me.

[DaveW]

 

I don't dispute that.  But Perkins' public comments about it hardly constitute "a class act."

He was telling the truth, he is still a class act though.

[Thrylos]

 

Also, isn't Perkins like really into long distance running or something? That seems to clash with the idea that his conditioning was poor.... I mean the guy is running half marathons and stuff, it's not like he was sitting on his couch all off-season or something.

 

Perkins has been a class act his whole time in Minnesota and has been a heckuva player for the Twins, it's really crappy that the org is making him out to be the scapegoat now. "Minnesota nice" indeed, "anonymous passive aggressive" comments from the front office about him. Bush league.

 

Perkins is into home brewing, his wife is into running.  12oz curls instead of marathons is his fitness regiment (and had shown big time.) 

 

Class Act?  

 

When he sued the Twins for demoting him when he sucked, or when he was throwing his Rookie Catcher under the bus (on the same Souhan who wrote this btw) while the Twins' Union Rep?  Or when he threw the 2015 season by decided that he was "good enough to go", instead of getting his rear end to the DL and maybe the Twins would add someone else before the deadline.

 

The only class act thing about Perkins is his "mouth".  Bush league all the way.

 

Glad that there is some sense in the Twins' FO and someone wanted to get rid of him last off-season.  His fastball/slider plays when it is 95/85 but it is a batting practice combination at 90/81.  The writing has been on the wall about Perkins.

 

Souhan should had got one further and noted the other similarity between Perkins and Hughes:

Ryan extended them both after career years, instead of trading them, and they started under-performing.  

 

At least there is hope that Hughes maybe can salvage himself in the pen, because Perkins is done.  Stick a fork in him.

 

 

[Champuckett]

Souhan, like most of the other sports journalists in the Minnesota and midwest area continue to miss the point, and I do believe it is deliberate.

 

Yes a lot of the players have been sucking it up in a variety of ways this year, but is this really the issue we should be focusing on and writing about?

 

A systemic 6 year (and arguably 10 year) drought of of good baseball should not be pinned on players that have only been contributing in a major way for only a few seasons.

 

Hughes, Perkins, and any of the other players you want to conjure up are symptoms, not the source of the problem.  

 

It would be nice to see some sports journalists in the area get some cajones and write about Pohlad and TR, but I can see why they don't.  They want to continue to have open access to interviewing players, coaches, and front office people, rather than doing their job and writing truthfully about the greatest issues currently plaguing this franchise.  Attacking the lowest hanging fruit is in their own best interest and not in the best interest of the fans that support this franchise and depend on journalists to correctly identify and scrutinize the real problems of the day.

 

We are going to see months and months of players being attacked like this, even on a stretch of what is the most horrendous Twins baseball.  Meanwhile the real problem will continue to go unnoticed and ignored by our own media journalists.

[nicksaviking]

I don't dispute that.  But Perkins' public comments about it hardly constitute "a class act."

And his comments had their desired effect, he was viewed as a lost cause after that.

 

Just like whomever leaked this stuff to Souhan got their desired effect.

 

Both were wrong in my eyes. I would have no problem with Souhan/Twins Mole doing this if there was something more substantive than a dirty look and innuendo.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

 

And his comments had their desired effect, he was viewed as a lost cause after that.

Just like whomever leaked this stuff to Souhan got their desired effect.

Both were wrong in my eyes. I would have no problem with Souhan/Twins Moke doing this if there was something more substantive than a dirty look and innuendo.

I think the dirty looks and innuendo is just color to the story. The substance of the column would be Hughes and Perkins no longer having a competitive fire within them after signing huge contract extensions. And in Perkins case missing so much time with injury.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

 

Souhan, like most of the other sports journalists in the Minnesota and midwest area continue to miss the point, and I do believe it is deliberate.

 

Yes a lot of the players have been sucking it up in a variety of ways this year, but is this really the issue we should be focusing on and writing about?

 

A systemic 6 year (and arguably 10 year) drought of of good baseball should not be pinned on players that have only been contributing in a major way for only a few seasons.

 

Hughes, Perkins, and any of the other players you want to conjure up are symptoms, not the source of the problem.  

 

It would be nice to see some sports journalists in the area get some cajones and write about Pohlad and TR, but I can see why they don't.  They want to continue to have open access to interviewing players, coaches, and front office people, rather than doing their job and writing truthfully about the greatest issues currently plaguing this franchise.  Attacking the lowest hanging fruit is in their own best interest and not in the best interest of the fans that support this franchise and depend on journalists to correctly identify and scrutinize the real problems of the day.

 

We are going to see months and months of players being attacked like this, even on a stretch of what is the most horrendous Twins baseball.  Meanwhile the real problem will continue to go unnoticed and ignored by our own media journalists.

Dislike but agree. 

[nicksaviking]

 

I think the dirty looks and innuendo is just color to the story. The substance of the column would be Hughes and Perkins no longer having a competitive fire within them after signing huge contract extensions. And in Perkins case missing so much time with injury.

 

That would be fine if Souhan made it clear this was an Op-Ed piece but he did everything he could to make this sound like he's getting hot intel straight from players or other Target Field personnel. If he was getting information and not just reading between the lines, he should be including quotes, even if they were "unnamed".

 

I would take it much more seriously if, "Half of the players are pretty upset with Perkins and Hughes as we don't feel that they are keeping themselves in shape and none of use believe that they're actually too hurt to pitch." I was told by a player who wished to remain anonymous.

[spinowner]

Souhan may be correct about the subject matter he presents, here. Or maybe not, we don't know. But he writes "Only the player knows how much he hurts" and then turns around and implies that these two are overstating their injuries. At the risk of bringing politics into the discussion this article reminds me a little bit of how Donald Trump will make a statement and then say that even though he's not actually accusing anyone of anything it could still be true.

[Kwak]

The  ​Star and Tribune ​is the mouthpiece of the Minneapolis establishment.  Pohlad is one of the "lords" in the city.  An OP/Ed piece is generally a press release from the system.  It is expected to "come down" on veterans because the team placed their trust and a whole lot of money in these guys.  Fingers are being pointed.  The Twins (due to Pohlad's anointed position) are able to get the press to help deflect blame from management by calling out certain players.  True, the players do share in the blame--but is was the management that created "the system", set the policies, made the decisions and left themselves with little recourse but deflection of blame.  That's my interpretation of Pohlad's statement of "...total system failure...". He signed-off on everything and now reaps what his minions sowed. Things will be ugly--and in local BB politics!  If there is any changes made it will have to be done by the owner--he is responsible for "the system" and if "it failed" then he must change it. Maybe allowing the local media to do "press releases" will help sell a few more tickets this year but ultimately throwing the "Perkins and Hughes" under the bus (add as many other players as you wish) will not solve the "system problem".  That scheme can work for replacing local pols, (and some ball-players) but it won't solve the over-riding problem of "BAD SYSTEM".

[jimbo92107]

Sometimes a position player can get away with playing hurt, but if you're a pitcher whose success depends on placing high-speed pitches within inches of your target, every part of your body has to be pretty close to a hundred percent functional, if not pain-free. 

 

Personally, I think Perkins is about finished with his career. Hughes belongs in the bullpen as a middle reliever that can go five innings on occasion. Meanwhile, the Twins need to keep calling up pitchers from AAA and AA to at least give them a taste of what they'll be facing.

 

As we've all been seeing, baseball is a game mostly for guys in their mid-twenties and early thirties. Pitchers that go beyond thirty are rare; by then most are losing the velocity that made them effective. A few learn to change speeds and pick the corners, but it doesn't look like Hughes and Perkins are very good at walking that tightrope. 

[Blackjack]

Souhan, Reusse, etc. get read by writing controversial articles. Even here on TD I see lead articles and say to myself 'looks like they're throwing red meat out to the TD commentators'.  Thats one popular way for writers to get read.

[d-mac]

 

Also, isn't Perkins like really into long distance running or something? That seems to clash with the idea that his conditioning was poor.... I mean the guy is running half marathons and stuff, it's not like he was sitting on his couch all off-season or something.

 

Perkins has been a class act his whole time in Minnesota and has been a heckuva player for the Twins, it's really crappy that the org is making him out to be the scapegoat now. "Minnesota nice" indeed, "anonymous passive aggressive" comments from the front office about him. Bush league.

 

This isn't the first time Perkins was at odds with the Twins management. Didn't he file a grievance at one point?  

[DocBauer]

If a player truly shows up in poor shape, as is stated here in the article, he deserves to be called out. Especially if said player is coming of an injured or poor previous season. Many of these guys are paid millions and millions of dollars to take care of themselves and work on their craft. It doesn't mean they will always succeed or avoid injury, but to not do something as basic as show up healthy and as in shape as you can be is inexcusable.

 

I am not singling out Perkins or Hughes directly, but they are the clear targets in the article.

 

But the article itself feels as though it's being written in a very 2 faced format. It almost reads as innuendo and sensationalism. I was actually surprised there wasn't the classic "un-named source" statement somewhere.

[DaveW]

 

If a player truly shows up in poor shape, as is stated here in the article, he deserves to be called out. Especially if said player is coming of an injured or poor previous season. Many of these guys are paid millions and millions of dollars to take care of themselves and work on their craft. It doesn't mean they will always succeed or avoid injury, but to not do something as basic as show up healthy and as in shape as you can be is inexcusable.

I am not singling out Perkins or Hughes directly, but they are the clear targets in the article.

But the article itself feels as though it's being written in a very 2 faced format. It almost reads as innuendo and sensationalism. I was actually surprised there wasn't the classic "un-named source" statement somewhere.

If a player really does show up out of shape, it should be reported then and there, not 2 months into the season when the team needs a scape goat. Also Souhan even said that those reports were from 2015.

[jimmer]

Players should keep themselves in shape.  They are professional athletes and they have plenty of time off in the offseason to get in shape (not to mention, some of the best people in the world available to help them stay in good shape).

 

Players like Omar Visquel, Jeter, Hunter, etc.  These guys should be emulated in regards to conditioning. They stayed in top notch shape their whole careers. No excuse to come into spring training in anything less than 90% ready, with ST finishing out the remaining 10%. 

[ken]

 

If a player really does show up out of shape, it should be reported then and there, not 2 months into the season when the team needs a scape goat. Also Souhan even said that those reports were from 2015.

Like when Reusse called out Sano at the beginning of the year?  No wait - we were upset he did it then.  It seems there is no time a reporter can write a article critical of a player, unless it's Nolasco, then it's okay.

[Guest]

Comments ripping teammates are best kept behind closed doors.

Agree completely. Wish that the same applied, double, to management and management leaks.