Souhan on Park

[gunnarthor]

http://www.startribune.com/twins-pursuit-of-park-not-about-mauer/343872772/

 

Yeah, it's Souhan but ...

 

He thinks the trade shouldn't be seen as a comment on Mauer and thinks the Twins can get Mauer, Plouffe, Sano and Park into the same lineup.

 

With Park, the Twins have some tradeable assets (Hicks/Kepler) that can help - "This dovetails with what I've been hearing from Twins insiders the last two years - they think they can win a World Series with this young core, and they're going to make a push over the next three years."  It'll be interesting to watch this push.

[BK432]

And I can't believe I'm saying this, but I think Souhan is right. And I for one think the trade the Twins potentially make involves Rosario or Hicks (maybe Kepler) instead of Plouffe.

[DaveW]

Rosario or Hicks are the best trade assets the team have since they are both true CF's and are playing out of position for the Twins (with Buxton as the future CF)

 

With that said, I would prefer not to trade either one at this stage and would like to trade Plouffe now, then once Buxton is "proven" and ready then you can trade Hicks or Rosario (or Kepler)

[Brian Kohler]

If there's any trade it should be Plouffe

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

 

http://www.startribune.com/twins-pursuit-of-park-not-about-mauer/343872772/

 

Yeah, it's Souhan but ...

 

He thinks the trade shouldn't be seen as a comment on Mauer and thinks the Twins can get Mauer, Plouffe, Sano and Park into the same lineup.

 

With Park, the Twins have some tradeable assets (Hicks/Kepler) that can help - "This dovetails with what I've been hearing from Twins insiders the last two years - they think they can win a World Series with this young core, and they're going to make a push over the next three years."  It'll be interesting to watch this push.

 

Only in Twins territory is a "young core" made up of 29-year-olds

 

 

[jsteve96]

Trading Kepler or Rosario would not be smart

[Boom Boom]

I like how Jim has Park immediately stepping into the middle of the lineup like some kind of lead-pipe cinch.

 

Also putting Sano in right field... which effectively means giving up on two of Hicks/Kepler/Rosario.

[GP830]

I'm excited to see what Park can do--but I don't know what it does to solve any of the Twins current deficiencies. Either the Twins are 100% ready to give up on Arcia and to a lesser extent Vargas- or they have a master plan for juggling a handful of players who play the same position.

[BK432]

 

Trading Kepler or Rosario would not be smart

 

I actually think trading Rosario would get the best relative return compared to future productivity. Classic sell-high. Just a hunch on my part.

[Matt Kummer]

 

I actually think trading Rosario would get the best relative return compared to future productivity. Classic sell-high. Just a hunch on my part.

 

Agree, I think the Twins get the most back for Rosario at this point. You figure either he or Kepler will have to be moved if the Twins are actually serious about putting Sano in the OF.

[jsteve96]

this sano to the 

 

Agree, I think the Twins get the most back for Rosario at this point. You figure either he or Kepler will have to be moved if the Twins are actually serious about putting Sano in the OF.

they could be serious, but maybe they only plan on him being there for a short time. maximum 2 years until plouffe is gone and he could still be dealt if he starts the year hot and builds value. definitely do not trade both. maybe hicks is all i see

[Thrylos]

 

http://www.startribune.com/twins-pursuit-of-park-not-about-mauer/343872772/

 

Yeah, it's Souhan but ...

 

He thinks the trade shouldn't be seen as a comment on Mauer and thinks the Twins can get Mauer, Plouffe, Sano and Park into the same lineup.

 

That's not just Souhan, that's Souhan being the Twins' mouthpiece, a job he has done plenty in the past (esp. regarding throwing players under the bus.)

That's exactly what Ryan said.  They cannot go out and say that they now have to trade Plouffe, because that will drop his value. 

 

So, just don't believe everything they say.   Simple.

[TheLeviathan]

Trading Kepler or Rosario for the sake of Plouffe would be the heights of stupidity.

 

This initial, aggressive move tells me the club has big picture in mind so hopefully they do the tight thing.

[Vanimal46]

That's not just Souhan, that's Souhan being the Twins' mouthpiece, a job he has done plenty in the past (esp. regarding throwing players under the bus.)

 

That's exactly what Ryan said.  They cannot go out and say that they now have to trade Plouffe, because that will drop his value. 

 

So, just don't believe everything they say.   Simple.

Agreed 100%. GM's are paid to be liars and deceive the competition. No reason to believe them now that it's hot stove season. The whole Sano to RF angle is completely blown out of proportion. He will be our starting 3B on opening day, no doubt.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Also putting Sano in right field... which effectively means giving up on two of Hicks/Kepler/Rosario.

Yes. There is no way around it. Very soon the Twins will need to trade a big piece or three.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Agreed 100%. GM's are paid to be liars and deceive the competition. No reason to believe them now that it's hot stove season. The whole Sano to RF angle is completely blown out of proportion. He will be our starting 3B on opening day, no doubt.

 

Not quite sure about No Doubt, but I highly doubt that Sano in RF is plan A.   It's probably Plan C, but could very well happen if A and B don't work out. 

[DaveW]

Trading Kepler or Rosario for the sake of Plouffe would be the heights of stupidity.

 

This initial, aggressive move tells me the club has big picture in mind so hopefully they do the tight thing.

Agreed, but if either is traded for GOOD value, I would be for it. The reality is a guy like Kepler and Rosario are better bets at getting a good young pitcher or catcher back in return then Plouffe. However they shouldn't "move em, just to move em" but I'm not worried about that, Ryan has never given up youngsters in trades for the most part (good thing)

[Shaitan]

 

I like how Jim has Park immediately stepping into the middle of the lineup like some kind of lead-pipe cinch.

Also putting Sano in right field... which effectively means giving up on two of Hicks/Kepler/Rosario.

 

At this point I view Park in Rochester for a month or two like other teams do with Cuban players to acclimate. I'm sure salary+posting fee will dictate otherwise.

[kab21]

 

Trading Kepler or Rosario for the sake of Plouffe would be the heights of stupidity.

This initial, aggressive move tells me the club has big picture in mind so hopefully they do the tight thing.

It isn't for the sake of Plouffe.  It would be because either OF is more marketable to a rebuilding team and the trade market for Plouffe is likely pretty weak.  It is also for the sake of having a really good IF defense. 

[Otto von Ballpark]

At this point I view Park in Rochester for a month or two like other teams do with Cuban players to acclimate. I'm sure salary+posting fee will dictate otherwise.

Those Cubans are usually quite young and/or have had a long layoff.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Trading Kepler or Rosario for the sake of Plouffe would be the heights of stupidity.

This initial, aggressive move tells me the club has big picture in mind so hopefully they do the tight thing.

Couldn't agree more, and I hope you are right.

[TheLeviathan]

 

It isn't for the sake of Plouffe.  It would be because either OF is more marketable to a rebuilding team and the trade market for Plouffe is likely pretty weak.  It is also for the sake of having a really good IF defense. 

 

You're right, it's 6 years of either of those guys so we can have 2 years of Plouffe.

 

The trade return would have to resemble a heist for that to be justifiable.

[DocBauer]

Effectively, Park replaces Plouffe in the lineup. (With Plouffe traded in some deal for catching or RP) Sano plays 3B, Mauer plays 1B, Park is the primary DH but also plays some 1B. My only problem is, where is the LH power still?

 

A healthy and productive Mauer could provide 30+ doubles still, possibly 12 HR. Rosario is very exciting and can definitely provide some XB power. With Parks at DH, this limits Arcia and Vargas as LH DH power options. Arcia could still play a little OF (cringe) as long as someone like Hicks is available to replace him late innings.

 

I'm not saying I dislike the move for Parks. But I am a little worried about AB's from the left side. This is where a catcher upgrade, FA or trade, young or old, who can swing solid/good from the LH side could help balance things.

[kab21]

 

You're right, it's 6 years of either of those guys so we can have 2 years of Plouffe.

 

The trade return would have to resemble a heist for that to be justifiable.

Rebuilding teams simply won't be interested in Plouffe.  If the Twins want to trade for the pieces they need then it has to be young players which of course have more value.  Of course I would rather keep Kepler but if trading him is what is needed to bring in a legit catcher or another really good player then you make that trade.

 

Plouffe for Norris is probably my first option though.  This seems to make sense for both teams but perhaps the Padres want to rebuild and only want young players in return.

[GoGonzoJournal]

It would take a hell of a return for me to move Kepler. I'm talking a sure-fire ace. For Rosario, I'd take someone like Austin Hedges, a near-MLB-ready catcher, or a left-handed bullpen arm and a prospect.

[SwainZag]

 

Only in Twins territory is a "young core" made up of 29-year-olds

 

I know you are fishing for someone to bite here but.......

 

Buxton 22

Sano 23

Rosario 24

Hicks 26

May 26

Escobar 27

Gibson 28

Not to mention Kepler 23 and Berrios 22.

 

That's your core.

[dougkoebernick]

That's a pretty darn good column - I can't say I disagree with anything in it.

 

[PseudoSABR]

 

The trade return would have to resemble a heist for that to be justifiable.

If we want something of value, we have to give up something of value.  Plouffe won't net much, if anything. (Not good enough for contenders to deal for, too expensive for rebuilders). Rosario/Kepler/Hicks would be traded NOT to make room for Plouffe, but because they could obtain a far more valuable piece in exchange. 

 

If we ever want to acquire an actual Ace, we'll have to give up valuable assets, having Plouffe in the fold enables the Twins to make such a trade without affecting the on field performance of the team in the near future. 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I know you are fishing for someone to bite here but.......

 

Buxton 22

Sano 23

Rosario 24

Hicks 26

May 26

Escobar 27

Gibson 28

 

Not to mention Kepler 23 and Berrios 22.

 

That's your core.

Not fishing, just thinking out loud.

 

Here's the math. If the Twins sign Park and keep Plouffe, then Miguel Sano is an outfielder in 2016. If Sano is an outfielder in 2016, then 3 of these 5 -- Rosario, Hicks, Arcia, Buxton, Kepler -- will not play in MLB in 2016. And 2017 presents the same logjam.

 

And to think the Twins want to sign Shane Robinson!

[Shane Wahl]

Some heavy speculation once we get beyond the obvious trade Plouffe (with prospects)-for-a-catcher idea. As Doc says above, lefty mashing is nowhere to be found unless Arcia is around. I wonder if a plan is emerging like this:

 

Sign AJ. (all Wieters talk was pretty far-fetched before, now it is over)

Trade Plouffe (AA catchers are more feasible if the plan is for 2017 to include X catcher plus Turner/Garver)

Start Buxton in AAA.

Start Arcia in right field

 

Roll out with:

Hicks

Mauer

Sano

Arcia

Park

Dozier

Rosario

AJ/Suzuki

Escobar

 

(Obviously, Arcia has to smack the ball in winter and ST. And this requires thinking clearly about Dozier in the lineup for a damn change)