4 Things We Know After the Stunning Twins-Yankees Trade

Personally I would rather not overpay for Story in $ or years - I just don't see him as a Franchise type player to be the face of the franchise with a big contract.  Since we have payroll flexibility I would rather see us swallow a bad 1 or 2 year contract in return for getting some additional players with longer term value and not surrendering any of our top prospects.   Looking like this year is about player development and evaluation and maybe we can make a better push next year.           

Scrimp on payroll, like the Marlins!!!  Should be a Double A team then!!!!!  Then, move St. Paul to Major League status, being they are equal (lower ticket prices then accordingly=duh)!

5 hours ago, Eris said:

If the Twins were unwilling to accept Donaldson’s contract why do we think they will spend even more money to sign a SS or SP.

There may be more at play than $. Age and probability of injury, obviously.

For all his mentoring skills and work ethic, who knows if there was friction between Donaldson and significant unknowns. Only speculating, but possibly a factor as well.

So we sign Donaldson (when we should have signed an ace pitcher) and now have to trade one of the top Catchers in all of baseball just to unload Donaldson.

Doing the Yankees bidding for them.

At this point swapping Donaldson for Story doesnt really look appealing, based on his dramatically poorer #'s away from Coors Field.

Spend the money on quality bullpen arms (we are.going to need them with that rotation) and bring up Miranda, Lewis & Martin and pray.

Can Sanchez learn to catch and regain his hitting acumen? Another longshot.

There are fewer top defensive and top hitting catchers in baseball than there are top Ace pitchers. There is a reason why 9 out of 10 catchers bat 8th or 9th in every teams lineup. Giving away Garver to free up money would.only be worth it if you sign the next CY Young winner. 

Sadly it seems Royce Lewis can't hit, but spending 100M on Story to find out he cant hit either is not worth it.

I’m trying to to draw as much positivity as I can from this and way off but what if the salary move is to go to San Diego take on Hosmer and in return getting a young starter like Gore for someone like Rooker or Larnach.

What I found interesting was that the Yankees had Isiah on their radar. Somehow the Twins traded Garver for him. I'm sure the Rangers would've taken Sanchez, as I don't expect Garver to play nearly as many games in seasons to come behind the plate as...Sanchez could.

Did the Yankees just drop this bigtime?

Because it allowed the Twins to grab a Yankee want, and to combine it with...Donaldson and his BIG contract. Suddenly the trade sounds alot better, a shortstop and an aging third baseman going to the Yankees, rather than the Twins basically swapping catchers with the Yankees. 

But that is basically what they did...swapped Garver for Sanchez, for some reason the Yankees wanted Rortvedt (shades of John Ryan Murphy via Drew Butera for backup strength). For dumping a salary like Donaldson's, you probably should be lucky to get a prospect or two back, but the Twins got a third baseman to replace Donaldson for the moment. Are they thinking of Gio as a shortstop? Where does that put Miranda in the scheme of things - left field or back in AAA for another season? (I still think Beckham will be the Twins starting shortstop, promised a million+ if he makes he team...only reason he signed a minor deal was because that was what was available during the lockout).

Sanchez can catch. Not the best, but he can catch. We still have the logjam of rally killing in the lineup of Sano, so I would hate to see Sanchez and Sano play on the same day. But both him and Gio, if they have decent years, could be tradebait if the Twins don't survive the spring.

But, yeah...all future points pointed towards Jeffers and Rortvedt sharing the catching duties for the next 4-6 years, with hopeful improvements from both, until the Twins draft or develop someone in the minors.

You almost wish Tomas Tellis was still around, he who made thed 26-man because of COVID bu

t didn't play. Instead we have David Banuelos (24), Steve Berman (26) and Caleb Hamilton (26) as the big three at the top levels, with Roy Morales (26) thrown in the mis as a good bat but bad plate guy. 

In the system the Twins have Jair Camargo, who has been around for a while and has some promise, but still two years away, Also Jefferson Morales and the versatile Alex Isola. Charlie Mack and Pat Winkel are promising signees. Oh, and I almost forgot Kyle Schmidt! Who seems to be the roving catcher in the system whenever someone goes down for a short stretch!

Now they are up Schitt's creek if something happens to one, elt alone both, or the guys. Makes you almost wish for Willians Astudillo as that 26th man on the roster.

Donaldson's contract wasn't a hindrance; we need to move past that notion. Even after acquiring Gray the Twins were still roughly $40M short of payroll for Opening Day last season. 

3 hours ago, bighat said:

Good grief. If the Twins would've kept him, as soon as Donaldson pulled a calf muscle this year everyone would be sitting here complaining that the Twins didn't get rid of him when they could have.

People were complaining about him last year while he was posting a 127 OPS+ too. 

1 hour ago, wavedog said:

Personally I would rather not overpay for Story in $ or years - I just don't see him as a Franchise type player to be the face of the franchise with a big contract.  Since we have payroll flexibility I would rather see us swallow a bad 1 or 2 year contract in return for getting some additional players with longer term value and not surrendering any of our top prospects.   Looking like this year is about player development and evaluation and maybe we can make a better push next year.           

Go take a look at the leaderboard on Fangraphs or B-Ref for SS since 2016. Try it since 2017. Since 2018. Since 2019. He has essentially matched Correa and Seager in WAR for any of those cumulative time periods.

The only reason he is not valued as highly this offseason is that he is older than both by roughly 2 years.

That said, Story is worth nearly the same AAV as those guys, but should get a pact that is a 2-3 years less. If he can be had for something like 150/6, that is a steal compared to those other SS who will sign for much more while bringing only slightly more value.

2 hours ago, roger said:

One cannot read any posting here and elsewhere without seeing Story's name mentioned in probably more than half of the comments.  I ask, what is the love affair with Story?  The numbers I have seen indicate he is average to mediocre away from Coors Field.  If that is true, why would the Twins want to tie themselves to a contract both bigger and longer than Donaldson's?  I just don't understand the love affair many of you have with this guy and hope like heck the Twins don't sign him.  

Why are you concerned about home/road splits?

The same has been said by fans for pretty much every hitter that left Coors over the last 15 years, while those hitters went on to produced at essentially the same level, with more players producing at a higher level than a lower level, post-Rockies career. 

I really thought this Coors splits concern voiced by fans was put to bed about 5 years ago with all the studies that have come out debunking it. It's evident that front offices have.

Four things people know after this trade.

Jim Pohlad learned his lessons well from his father. The team lost money, so a Pohlad will pinch the pennies.

Money analytics will override baseball analytics

Bill Smith trades do not look as bad in hindsight., In a couple of years the fan base will really gnash their teeth.

There will be many people who hope Yogi Berra was right. It is not over until it is over. Let the trading season be ongoing

1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

Gore hasn't been able to throw strikes for three years. I'd deal Larnach straight up for just him....but I'd not take Hosmer. No way.

Gore has had a prospect ranking lower than his age. For not being able to throw strikes an awful lot of people must be missing something that you see

1 hour ago, Minny505 said:

Why are you concerned about home/road splits?

The same has been said by fans for pretty much every hitter that left Coors over the last 15 years, while those hitters went on to produced at essentially the same level, with more players producing at a higher level than a lower level, post-Rockies career. 

I really thought this Coors splits concern voiced by fans was put to bed about 5 years ago with all the studies that have come out debunking it. It's evident that front offices have.

Michael Cuddyer:

In Minn

In Col

In NYM (granted last year in MLB) 

3 hours ago, wavedog said:

Personally I would rather not overpay for Story in $ or years - I just don't see him as a Franchise type player to be the face of the franchise with a big contract.  Since we have payroll flexibility I would rather see us swallow a bad 1 or 2 year contract in return for getting some additional players with longer term value and not surrendering any of our top prospects.   Looking like this year is about player development and evaluation and maybe we can make a better push next year.           

I agree.

I'm not sure how dropping $160 Million on a 5-year contract for a guy like Story - who is 29 years old and has played half his games in Coors Field for his entire career - helps the Twins. Even worse, maybe they give him a 7 or 8 year deal.

Sure wish they'd have spent that money on pitching, but that ship has sailed.

18 minutes ago, Original_JB said:

Michael Cuddyer:

In Minn

.272

.343

.451

.794

 

In Col

.307

.362

.525

.886

In NYM (granted last year in MLB) 

.259

.309

.391

.699

Good singular data point using a player that hangs it up after one year ?

Try these out:

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-rockies-have-their-worst-coors-field-hangover-yet/

https://www.draysbay.com/2016/1/29/10868328/coors-field-hitters-corey-dickerson-analysis

http://mets360.com/?p=41757

Now, after reading thru these studies again, I'm even more bullish. The post-Rockies career average improvement is pretty awesome. Let's get him!!

By shedding catchers, I believe the FO's vision is to give Hank Conger every opportunity to be the opening day starting catcher.

An earlier posted said "I mean no disrespect to any front office, they are all better at what they do than us mere mortals making comments about what they are doing."

At this point, I really have to disagree.  The percentage of diehard Twins fans that would call the current front office CLUELESS, it growing by the day.