Braves 5, Twins 1: David Festa Deals, but Bullpen and Bats Fold Again

[Craig Arko]

18 minutes ago, JD-TWINS said:

Is there substantiation of anyone coming back Friday - or is this just wishful thinking? I’m in Cincinnati and don’t see local stuff from Tribune or CCO.

I expect Lee and Varland will be the 27th-28th callups on Sunday.

[wabene]

13 hours ago, USAFChief said:

Festa hasn't been asked to throw a pitch in even the 6th inning ALL YEAR, yet Rocco sends him out for the SEVENTH immediately after tieing  the game

There is no path to victory for Rocco Baldelli, eh? I mean give it a rest Chief. Look at it this way, he still didn't break 90 pitches, forget about the innings or time through the lineup and nothing was different. Or just look at it anyway you want and come back to the same damn conclusion, everytime.

[D.C Twins]

Bullpen cooked.... this could get ugly

[JD-TWINS]

7 hours ago, Althebum82 said:

No matter what happens, we are stuck with Margot.   

At this stage of the season, probably Farmer as well.

And while this game he was not the fault of Thielbar, he just keeps reinforcing what an albatross he has been for this team as we diddle around with other relievers being roster cuts and additions instead of him.

Welcome to the fairly successful but still underachieving 2024 Minnesota Twins.

News about Correa and Buxton has been far from effusively positive.  I have come to expect that they will not be making contributions of any significance if they return.  Ugh.

Lee, on the other hand, is 4 for 15 in his four games in St Paul with 2 doubles and a home run.  I do hold out hope for him still, along with the dominating bullpen appearance by Varland tonight.

Eight game losing streaks are gonna happen.  But man, it sure makes it hard to find a rainbow while the rain keeps falling.

 

Assuming Lee is added Sunday with roster expansion. Won’t DFA Farmer 2 games prior to expansion. I heard Lee was 0 for 5 one game so your more broad news is uplifting.

Varland is probably a Sunday add as well……if not sooner. Pen needs a shot in the arm!!

I too am concerned about the level of contribution from Byron & Carlos upon returning. Buxton’s gotta be as good as Martin & Correa will displace Farmer/Julien with Castro back to 2B.

Need some runs!!!

[JD-TWINS]

Varland to the Pen could/should keep Alcala away from pitching consecutive days. This should be a help.

Winder can assume the traditionally medium leverage spots that Sands was used in through most of the year.

Sands - Alcala - Varland - Jax - Duran need to get it done.

Winder - Henriquez

Thielbar - Blewett - Tonkin  (one needs to go?)

Funderburk ……….no other options left.

Paddack if they get to October.

[USAFChief]

17 minutes ago, wabene said:

There is no path to victory for Rocco Baldelli, eh? I mean give it a rest Chief. Look at it this way, he still didn't break 90 pitches, forget about the inning or time through the lineup and nothing was different. Or just look at it anyway you want and come back to the same damn conclusion, everytime.

There is no path to defeat for Rocco Baldelli, eh?

Give it a rest.

I will call it as I see it. Rocco is not a good MLB manager. That's not a new position for me. 

Festa out for the 7th wasn't Rocco’s most egregious decision. Not by a long shot. But it's certainly up for debate. 

For the record, Festa hasn't broken 90 pitches all season.  That's not the defense you think it is. Last night when he went out for the 7th, he was already at a season high number of pitches. And 1+ innings past his longest outing. With 2 hard hit outs to finish the 6th.

I'm the guy saying they should be training these guys in the minors for higher workloads. 

But since they dont, don't try doing it in the middle of a MLB season.

I realize the pen is not dependable, but that can't drive rotation decisions. 

[Swing Batter-Batter]

31 minutes ago, Craig Arko said:

I expect Lee and Varland will be the 27th-28th callups on Sunday.

I hope you are right.

[CCHOF5yearstoolate]

32 minutes ago, wabene said:

There is no path to victory for Rocco Baldelli, eh? I mean give it a rest Chief. Look at it this way, he still didn't break 90 pitches, forget about the inning or time through the lineup and nothing was different. Or just look at it anyway you want and come back to the same damn conclusion, everytime.

Rocco literally cannot do anything right!! What aren't you getting?

[CCHOF5yearstoolate]

Seem to remember a certain poster being convinced that Festa was cooked after his 2nd start, and his "30 grade changeup" would never be an effective major league offering and that his stuff overall wasn't effective.

He gives up a little to much hard contact from leaving pitches too middle-middle, but Festa has been really impressive this year. He's in the 70th percentile for whiffs, and a 41.7% rate on the changeup specifically is 13th out of 140 pitchers in MLB (150+ thrown).

Since his 2nd callup on 7/24:

3.06 ERA, 3.23 FIP, 2.99 xFIP, 32.8% K rate

[tony&rodney]

Minor point ... how does the official scorer hand a double to Williams on the ball that Margot clanked. Watching the play numerous times, it is pretty clear that Margot simply misjudged, got twisted, ran over his feet, and then butchered the ball at the last second. It was actually a fairly routine catch. Players make mistakes but there is not any reason to punish Alcala by relieving Margot of his error. I'm not down on Margot, but an error is an error.

The Twins will likely bring back Lee in September. He looked tired in his last two games. Has he hit a wall? Each of his plate appearances were weak. The walk last night came on four noncompetitive pitches.  

There is still a run in this team but Correa and Buxton are needed to shore up the defense. Bat them 7th and 9th to reduce their running. I appreciate the difficulty of injuries but what a pile of missed games for those two.

Toronto still has a good team and the Twins will need to forget about the past week when they begin their series with the Blue Jays.

[Riverbrian]

1 minute ago, CCHOF5yearstoolate said:

Seem to remember a certain poster being convinced that Festa was cooked after his 2nd start, and his "30 grade changeup" would never be an effective major league offering and that his stuff overall wasn't effective.

He gives up a little to much hard contact from leaving pitches too middle-middle, but Festa has been really impressive this year. He's in the 70th percentile for whiffs, and a 41.7% rate on the changeup specifically is 13th out of 140 pitchers in MLB (150+ thrown).

Since his 2nd callup on 7/24:

3.06 ERA, 3.23 FIP, 2.99 xFIP, 32.8% K rate

I'm a big fan. The guy has as much stuff as any starter we've had in the rotation in quite some time.

I've already got him in the rotation for next year and I have high hopes to go along with that spot in the rotation. I'm comfortable with him starting in the playoffs. 

I hope the team keeps producing the young pitching. I'll take a Festa, Zebby, SWR or whoever is next over a DeSclafini, Archer or Bundy innings eater type every single time.   

Keep em coming Twins... Keep em coming. The farm is starting to produce and it's exciting.    

[David Maro]

Margot running into the out at home is on him not Watkins this time.Jeffers single was right in front of him and he went back to second to tag up.He had to see that it wasn't going to be caught and needed to run.Yes Watkins has been a bad 3rd base coach,but the runner should be able to read the ball right in front of him.

What I see is a team that is going back to the homerun or strike out mentality.Every time Lewis steps into the box all everyone wants including Lewis is a homerun.With bases loaded and no outs Miranda and Castro strike out and Vasquez hits a ball to short.This looked like the 2023 team.

[Riverbrian]

19 minutes ago, tony&rodney said:

Minor point ... how does the official scorer hand a double to Williams on the ball that Margot clanked. Watching the play numerous times, it is pretty clear that Margot simply misjudged, got twisted, ran over his feet, and then butchered the ball at the last second. It was actually a fairly routine catch. Players make mistakes but there is not any reason to punish Alcala by relieving Margot of his error. I'm not down on Margot, but an error is an error.

The Twins will likely bring back Lee in September. He looked tired in his last two games. Has he hit a wall? Each of his plate appearances were weak. The walk last night came on four noncompetitive pitches.  

There is still a run in this team but Correa and Buxton are needed to shore up the defense. Bat them 7th and 9th to reduce their running. I appreciate the difficulty of injuries but what a pile of missed games for those two.

Toronto still has a good team and the Twins will need to forget about the past week when they begin their series with the Blue Jays.

I get that it's a minor point but in my opinion it's a major point in my mind that I just have accepted because it always happens. 

I never look at error stats because the stat has no value when Margot doesn't get an error on that play. 

I would give out a lot of errors because I have higher expectations of a major league player.

I think Martin should have gotten an error on the Ozuna double in extras the night before. Tough Catch I know but a catch that a major league CF should make. He got to that ball. But then again... I'd be tougher on the errors if I was the judge of them. That way the error stat could possibly be close to meaning something. 

I wouldn't be opposed to Julien getting an error for throwing the ball home with very little chance of getting the runner but I admit that would be pretty harsh in the opposite direction.  

.   

[Road trip]

33 minutes ago, David Maro said:

Margot running into the out at home is on him not Watkins this time.Jeffers single was right in front of him and he went back to second to tag up.He had to see that it wasn't going to be caught and needed to run.Yes Watkins has been a bad 3rd base coach,but the runner should be able to read the ball right in front of him.

What I see is a team that is going back to the homerun or strike out mentality.Every time Lewis steps into the box all everyone wants including Lewis is a homerun.With bases loaded and no outs Miranda and Castro strike out and Vasquez hits a ball to short.This looked like the 2023 team.

Arguably a mistake for both.  Yes, it was in front of Margot but as a runner you are taught to trust your 3rd base coach.  I pretty much never defend Margot, but the primary blame goes to Watkins here.  Margot can't know for certain that the outfielder didn't bobble the ball, or have something else go wrong as he is supposed to be sprinting at full speed after determining the ball will land, looking ahead at Watkins (who sent him).  At this point I fear Watkins pretty much has PTSD from the mistakes of the past two days and should be replaced in-season.  Keep him on the staff in some kind of role and pull somebody else from the coaching staff for 3B duties.  I really don't know how a replacement could do worse.

And as a resident Margot critic... yes, that's an error every time on his CF drop.

I really can't imagine that Margot gets signed to anything more than a spring training invite next year...

[tony&rodney]

5 minutes ago, Riverbrian said:

I get that it's a minor point but in my opinion it's a major point in my mind that I just have accepted because it always happens. 

I never look at error stats because the stat has no value when Margot doesn't get an error on that play. 

I would give out a lot of errors because I have higher expectations of a major league player.

I think Martin should have gotten an error on the Ozuna double in extras the night before. Tough Catch I know but a catch that a major league CF should make. He got to that ball. But then again... I'd be tougher on the errors if I was the judge of them. That way the error stat could possibly be close to meaning something. 

I wouldn't be opposed to Julien getting an error for throwing the ball home with very little chance of getting the runner but I admit that would be pretty harsh in the opposite direction.  

.   

Since the manager of an amateur team is effectively the scorer I was more strict and applied the routine expected play angle. However, MLB players are totally amazing at their craft and make plays not seen below their level. The reason I mentioned the Margot play as opposed to either the Martin or Julien play, both of which could have been made, is that last night's miss was pretty much a routine play made seemingly difficult by numerous mental and physical mistakes. 

I see Delmon's name recently and we have someone below Delmon in Gabriel Gonzalez. GG will have to hit a ton to make it to The Show. Miami traded for another total iron glove when they gave away Puk. That guy can really hit but I doubt he makes it.

The scorer should be more cognizant of the effect on fair statistics for the pitcher and apply the routine play expectation on balls in play. For example, Julien should make a good throw home but we cannot assume an out and it needed to be in a narrow region for the tag. I was a little disgusted but don't write down E4 in that case. If a relay throw is wild to first when the runner would have easily been out on the back side of a double play, i give an error every time if it is a routine throw. MLB never gives an error unless the runner advances.

FWIW, MLB has changed their scoring rather dramatically over the years which largely accounts for the reduction of errors in today's game. But it's all small stuff and nothing to get worked up over.

[Riverbrian]

7 minutes ago, Road trip said:

Arguably a mistake for both.  Yes, it was in front of Margot but as a runner you are taught to trust your 3rd base coach.  I pretty much never defend Margot, but the primary blame goes to Watkins here.  Margot can't know for certain that the outfielder didn't bobble the ball, or have something else go wrong as he is supposed to be sprinting at full speed after determining the ball will land, looking ahead at Watkins (who sent him).  At this point I fear Watkins pretty much has PTSD from the mistakes of the past two days and should be replaced in-season.  Keep him on the staff in some kind of role and pull somebody else from the coaching staff for 3B duties.  I really don't know how a replacement could do worse.

And as a resident Margot critic... yes, that's an error every time on his CF drop.

I really can't imagine that Margot gets signed to anything more than a spring training invite next year...

Good Post and I agree with most of it. Not willing to replace Watkins for a couple of mistakes but I agree with the rest. 

I admit I didn't see or at least notice what Margot did on the play. However this base running mistake as described by others would be his mistake alone if Watkins didn't windmill him. 

The 3B coach needs to factor in a Margot mistake before waving his arms so I'm ok pinning it on Watkins. 

On the other hand. Context is important. Sale on the mound with the ability to strike out the side with a runner on third and nobody out should also be a factor in his decision making. 

Being out by a mile will take my other hand defense of the decision and make it worthless. 

On Kepler... No idea who screwed up and I could tell that Kepler and Watkins were having a heavy discussion about it so... I'll just assume someone screwed up and screwed up critically.  

 

 

[Craig Arko]

It’s possible for more than one person to make a mistake at the same time. In fact, more often than not, I’d wager.

[chinmusic]

1 hour ago, D.C Twins said:

Bullpen cooked.... this could get ugly

Yeah, they way they lost last night is like a blueprint for this ugliness.

But we soldier on...

[Sjoski]

It's amazing how one pitcher can face 21 batters, throw 88 pitches, and give up 2 hits....only to have the next guy entirely reverse that in 10 pitches.  
 

[S Bart]

2 hours ago, Whitey333 said:

Plain and simple truth is the Twins stink and they have stunk pretty much since the all star break.  We have two highly overpaid guys wallowing on the injured list.  They definitely do not seem very anxious to come and play.  I think it's Buxton and Correa.  Who?

For me, it is really frustrating that the two highest paid players seem to have constant injuries. If/when Buxton returns, can he play for the rest of the season without another injury? A return would certainly mean Baldelli giving him considerable time off to rest (part-time player). After having had experienced a planter fasciitis challenge, I can verify that it is very possible for the problem to return a year or two after it is "healed" which could prove to be an issue with Correa in the future. He would also be a part-time player in the future. How much can the team realistically count on the two highest paid players this year and in the future? 

 

 

 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

1 hour ago, tony&rodney said:

The reason I mentioned the Margot play as opposed to either the Martin or Julien play, both of which could have been made, is that last night's miss was pretty much a routine play made seemingly difficult by numerous mental and physical mistakes.

It looked like an “atom” ball, which are difficult to gauge, off the bat. The ones hit right at you. The higher the exit velocity, the less time to react. If Margot is standing five feet to either side, he sees the angle better and makes the catch.

[wabene]

3 hours ago, USAFChief said:

There is no path to defeat for Rocco Baldelli, eh?

I rarely express an opinion on Rocco Baldelli. I do speak up when blaming him for everything threatens to dominate every discussion probably because it just annoys me. Nothing personal. 

Not that it matters, I don't like many decisions made by Rocco, the 3rd base coach lol, the front office and or ownership.

[William K Johnson]

True story.   I had an appointment with my cardiologist this morning who stated that as a seventy-year-old with a heart condition I should avoid situations that are stressful and raise my blood pressure.   My wife then told him about my reaction to last night's game.   He said if the games caused me to get that emotional, I should consider just reading the box scores the next day.   I then asked him if I could just watch the games until we went to the bullpen.  He laughed and said to do whatever to avoid the stress.  So, from here on in, I will watch the game until the bullpen starts stirring and read later how the disaster unfolded after I quit watching.

[Sjoski]

Too funny.....this happened way back, but the story goes, some SF Giants fan actually shot up this TV after the Giants blew a game.