Twins Trade Urshela to Angels

[Hrbowski]

Traded Gio for a minor league pitcher:

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/11/twins-trade-gio-urshela-angels.html

[stringer bell]

Wow. Not much return for a solid major league regular.

[PseudoSABR]

5 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

Wow. Not much return for a solid major league regular.

He's a good player, but not at the price they'd have to pay in arbitration.  I suspected him to be non-tendered honestly, so this is a much better outcome.  The strikeout numbers on the prospect are pretty tantalizing even if a small sample size.

[bighat]

I'm kinda surprised at all the people who are suddenly in love with Gio. Didn't he ground into a team-leading number of double plays? 

The guy's a corner infielder who hit 13 homers and drove in 64. Sure he's a nice guy and a very average MLB player, but the Twins can do better and we should be happy they're opening up a spot for a big bat. 

[ashbury]

19 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

Wow. Not much return for a solid major league regular.

Solid, and to be paid at near-market rate.  It's the salary that moves him from "what do you want for him?" to "we'll take him off your hands."  Which is no insult to him as a player, simply the reality.

[CRF]

A little surprised by this move. Wouldn't have minded keeping Gio. He sure saved us some runs at 3rd last season. Does this mean Miranda is the regular 3rd baseman? If he is, he better work on his defense. Hopefully, this is leading up to something else. 

[stringer bell]

Gio is the kind of guy who holds his job, but the team is looking for an upgrade. In today's MLB, it's really a slippery slope. On non-contenders, he's too old and highly paid and on contenders, he is a guy that they want to replace. 

[ashbury]

11 minutes ago, stringer bell said:

Gio is the kind of guy who holds his job, but the team is looking for an upgrade. In today's MLB, it's really a slippery slope. On non-contenders, he's too old and highly paid and on contenders, he is a guy that they want to replace. 

You spelled out the dilemma, or maybe paradox.  Even though in objective terms he is of value, as an average big-league player.  He can play on a WS winning team, IMO, he's just not going to lead you to one.

[Yoke]

Does this mean Miranda is the full time 3B now? Or Arraez? Heck, if they sign a SS, is Lewis going to 3B?

 

Urshela was solid, but not solid enough to hold other people back. You can get similar production from someone younger and cheaper.

[Parfigliano]

Opening a spot for a younger cheaper infielder and hopefully getting some MUCH needed pitching.

[rwilfong86]

Terrible move. 

[purplesoldier4u]

2 hours ago, bighat said:

Sure, he's a nice guy and a very average MLB player, but the Twins can do better, and we should be happy they're opening a spot for a big bat. 

C'mon, man!

[bigdave]

In the majors this season, Gio was an above average third baseman. Sure he's got a price tag, but teams on either cost can take on that contract without flinching. They should have gotten more in the trade for an established corner infielder. 

[William K Johnson]

Miranda cannot play third.   He can't even play first well.

[VivaBomboRivera!]

Surprised at how many comments are undervaluing Urshela's contribution to the club in 2022.  He is decidely _not_ average.

Why dump a guy who overperformed and retain so many players who underperformed last season?  If Correa does not stay, and is not replaced with someone of similar talent, what have the Twins just done to the left side of their infield?

Urshela is worth what he's going to be paid this year.  Shame on Twins management for not being the ones to pay him.

[jimintokyo]

As a Yankees fan, it amuses (and appalls) me to see the Twins make the same mistake.

[VivaBomboRivera!]

5 hours ago, ashbury said:

He can play on a WS winning team, IMO, he's just not going to lead you to one.

No club is built around stars at every position.  Teams need players that perform consistently, and Urshela does that.  Now he'll do it for another team. 
It is a safe bet that next year we'll see Urshela contribute to a Twins loss at least twice with a clutch hit or a whiz-bang snag for an untimely out.

[Squirrel]

39 minutes ago, jimintokyo said:

As a Yankees fan, it amuses (and appalls) me to see the Twins make the same mistake.

Same mistake? We didn’t take on Donaldson in the process

[Danchat]

I don't like this move. Urshela was absolutely worth the money as he hit quite well (.283 is fairly above average with how much offense is on the decline), seemed to have an extra gear in clutch situations, and was a solid defender at 3B. I trust that they will spend the money elsewhere, but I just don't know if they'll find as reasonable a value. I don't care much for the prospect we got.

Speaking of Urshela, I am happy we aren't paying Donaldson $24M this year!

[weitz41]

Disappointing move..Pagan gets picked up and Goi gets traded... Holding onto him to hedge against a sophomore slump by Miranda and trading Gio at the trade deadline would made more sense. 

With so few league average 3rd basemen out there in free agency you would think they could have gotten more than a lottery ticket for him...

[rwilfong86]

11 hours ago, VivaBomboRivera! said:

Surprised at how many comments are undervaluing Urshela's contribution to the club in 2022.  He is decidely _not_ average.

Why dump a guy who overperformed and retain so many players who underperformed last season?  If Correa does not stay, and is not replaced with someone of similar talent, what have the Twins just done to the left side of their infield?

Urshela is worth what he's going to be paid this year.  Shame on Twins management for not being the ones to pay him.

Completely agree with you. 

[jorgenswest]

11 hours ago, VivaBomboRivera! said:

Why dump a guy who overperformed and retain so many players who underperformed last season?

Wouldn’t you expect an over performer to regress to their mean or maybe even decline some at 31? 

[VivaBomboRivera!]

5 minutes ago, jorgenswest said:

Wouldn’t you expect an over performer to regress to their mean or maybe even decline some at 31? 

I'll take Gio Urshela's mean. And the latest season means much more than the seasons that precede it.

[jorgenswest]

1 minute ago, VivaBomboRivera! said:

I'll take Gio Urshela's mean.

Pretty reasonable. His career WRC+ Of 104 and the Fangraphs projection of 101 are pretty close. That would be a top 30 3B but probably not top 20.

[bighat]

Very on-brand for Twins fans to be upset about their team ditching a corner infielder who's been with the team 1 season, bats in the 7 hole, hit 13 homers and was 4th in baseball with 21 GIDPs last year. 

C'mon people, get real. It's 3rd base. Twenty-two eligible 3rd baseman had more homers than Gio last year - including guys you haven't heard of, like Patrick Wisdom (26 HRs), Brandon Drury (20), and Luis Urias (19). 

 

[FlyingFinn]

15 hours ago, VivaBomboRivera! said:

Surprised at how many comments are undervaluing Urshela's contribution to the club in 2022.  He is decidely _not_ average.

Why dump a guy who overperformed and retain so many players who underperformed last season?

Because the Twins don't think he will duplicate 2022 again (as you said yourself, he "overperformed") and think Miranda's offense will be far superior, plus his defense will be at least average at 3B if he plays every day there. We'll see who is correct after 2023. 

[VivaBomboRivera!]

9 hours ago, FlyingFinn said:

Because the Twins don't think he will duplicate 2022 again (as you said yourself, he "overperformed") and think Miranda's offense will be far superior, plus his defense will be at least average at 3B if he plays every day there. We'll see who is correct after 2023. 

Latest year's performance is most likely indicator [notable exception: Max Kepler, 2019], but Urshela's mean performance should still be a keeper.